Help Single Parents

[old.Tohtori]

Thanks, was buried in the pages somewhere.

On one hand, the kids aren't gonna be worse for wear really. They're life will build up on single parent(or visiting mother) scenario, and as such if the relationship isn't working, it's a personal choice of the couple to either life unhappy "for the children" or split up now while the emotional trouble of the kids is(generally) minimal.

Then again a whole family would be nice, but it's not worth two people living in constant misfortune.

 

[Scouse]

The soppy old romantic in me hopes that he can and does for the good of his kiddies.

I think the soppy old romantic in you is responsible for most of your post m8

I disagree with the sentiment.

 

[MYstIC G]

I'm not even talking about finances here. We're talking the balanced and safe upbringing of his two daughters.

Those two items aren't mutually exclusive.

Frankly I don't know nor care why she's doing what she's doing that isn't the point here. The point is Cal wants advice for his mate.

In my opinion she is going to leave, saddle him with the debt, leave him with the kids, set herself up somewhere else and get her situation stable. This poses two negatives (ignoring emotional responses) for Cal's mate being:

1. Why should he be burdened with the sole responsibility for their debt?
2. If she gets herself stable and is better off than him because there is no debt on her, she may be able to wangle the kids away if she chooses to in the future.

People never do what they should at the right time and suffer for it later. He should seek independent legal advice. If he's entitled to money for the kids benefit then the kids should get it. If he can ensure she can't dump him with the debt then he should do it.

Unfortunately he'll probably "feel bad for her" not bother and get screwed over down the line.

 

[Scouse]

 

[russell]

/allays fears

However, I did expect a woman to jump to this woman's defence tho.




For a start "it's not the same as being the dad" is bullshit russ.

These two have been together since they were 17, so the bloke himself has "never lived" and now has the stress of a failing relationship, massive debt, the kids she's leaving and no way out.

For years women have bemoaned men for doing exactly what this woman's doing - skipping out on kids with no thought of her financial responsibilty.

Who cares if she's "never lived" - it doesn't come into the argument when men skip out on their kids - so it shouldn't with women.

Welcome to "equality"

She may well be all the things some of you are insinuating in the remarks in this thread, but she may not. Only a couple of you seem to actually know her. I just didn't like all the detrimental comments and the tone tbh.

AND its not 'bullshit', from experience, the responsibility of being a mum is NO WAY the same as being the Dad, unless he is the sole carer -which sadly this guy soon will be. There is a world of difference, and even with the best husband/ partner/ boyfriend who is the 'Daddy'. It is not the same kind of relentless pressure at all! You clearly have NO IDEA-ask the majority of Dads on here -yes they have added pressure of a different kind, but not the same continual 24/7 toll except in rare circumstances.

I dont agree with lumping all 'men who leave kids are evil' either. Every instance is different. My Dad left my mum with me when I was 3 and never paid a penny -I dont hold it against him -he had his reasons.

All I wanted to comment on is that there are 2 sides, yes it's shit -but she may have her reasons and not be the total selfish cow most of you were making her out to be.

Your view of equality is strange Scouse -surely the reasons for wanting to leave your kids should be considered regardless of your gender?

There is alot of good advice in this thread, peppered with insults to woman and mothers .

 

[Scouse]

Your view of equality is strange Scouse -surely the reasons for wanting to leave your kids should be considered regardless of your gender?

Honestly Russ, I don't really care why she's leaving. All I care about is that she pays her way.

Men don't get an ounce of sympathy when they leave their kids - they get CSA'd and vilified in the press. They have to pay - and rightly so.

I guess, aside from all the fluff, all I'm saying is:

A) In my experience women don't leave their kids unless something else is on the go, and;

B) Regardless of that, she's got money she owes...





As for the responsibility of mums/dads thing. My experience is obviously very different from yours.

 

[MYstIC G]

AND its not 'bullshit', from experience, the responsibility of being a mum is NO WAY the same as being the Dad

You don't like the tone but despite that you're being just as opinionated since you're also being sexist? Fucking lol.

Stick to the point (this includes those going "bitch" btw). Cal came here for advice for his mate. The advice from everyone should be geared towards how best his mate can protect himself and the children. Battle of the sexes isn't advice.

 

[Pfy]

She may well be all the things some of you are insinuating in the remarks in this thread, but she may not. Only a couple of you seem to actually know her. I just didn't like all the detrimental comments and the tone tbh.

AND its not 'bullshit', from experience, the responsibility of being a mum is NO WAY the same as being the Dad, unless he is the sole carer -which sadly this guy soon will be. There is a world of difference, and even with the best husband/ partner/ boyfriend who is the 'Daddy'. It is not the same kind of relentless pressure at all! You clearly have NO IDEA-ask the majority of Dads on here -yes they have added pressure of a different kind, but not the same continual 24/7 toll except in rare circumstances.

I dont agree with lumping all 'men who leave kids are evil' either. Every instance is different. My Dad left my mum with me when I was 3 and never paid a penny -I dont hold it against him -he had his reasons.

All I wanted to comment on is that there are 2 sides, yes it's shit -but she may have her reasons and not be the total selfish cow most of you were making her out to be.

Your view of equality is strange Scouse -surely the reasons for wanting to leave your kids should be considered regardless of your gender?

There is alot of good advice in this thread, peppered with insults to woman and mothers .

I work 36.5hrs a week. I get up every morning at 6am(ish) and feed my 2 kids breakfast, bath them, iron their clothes/uniform, help them get ready for school (little one goes to nursery once a week), put a wash in the washing machine, sometimes hang a wash out, take my eldest to school then come home tidy the house, do more washing, wash up the dishes from the night before do anything else that needs done (work around the house etc) and look after the 3 year old until the Mrs is back at 3ish. Then I get ready for work and go to work, getting home at upto 01:30 in the morning. On my Days off work (if during the week) I still do all of the above and never REALLY get a day off. I also put my children down 95% of the time I'm home making sure they're all set and then read them their stories and sing them a lullaby.

Personally I resent the fact that you're saying that "the responsibility of being a mum is NO WAY the same as being the Dad". It's always the same old tripe.

Anyway, back on topic.

Yes, your friend needs as much professional advice as they can get. Even more important will be support from those that care for him. He's bound to make bad choices in what to do from now on (re: the mrs), but they are his bad choices to make.

From what I can see he at least has people that care and can help him to pick up the pieces/rebuild if things get worse than they already are in the future.

 

[rynnor]

Book an appointment for him at the local Citizens Advice would be a good starting point.

 

[Wazzerphuk]

You don't like the tone but despite that you're being just as opinionated since you're also being sexist? Fucking lol.

Stick to the point (this includes those going "bitch" btw). Cal came here for advice for his mate. The advice from everyone should be geared towards how best his mate can protect himself and the children. Battle of the sexes isn't advice.

Personally I resent the fact that you're saying that "the responsibility of being a mum is NO WAY the same as being the Dad". It's always the same old tripe.

Couldn't be more to the point, these statements. It's hilarious the way some women feel the need to big themselves up beyond realism, like they're some kind of special goddess. You're just a person, just like anyone else. Responsibilities sometimes vary, are sometimes different, and sometimes are not shared equally. This does not mean you're more responsible, more valuable, or a better parent or person.

 

[Chilly]

to be fair, though, most kids are brought up mainly by their mum for the first few months at least, the ratio equalising as the sprog gets older.

 

[Scouse]

to be fair, though, most kids are brought up mainly by their mum for the first few months at least, the ratio equalising as the sprog gets older.

In my experience all the dad's I've known have pretty much done nothing but be slave for the first few months, prefering to let the mum lie down and get some much-needed rest.

But then I know pretty responsible people

 

[russell]

AND its not 'bullshit', from experience, the responsibility of being a mum is NO WAY the same as being the Dad, unless he is the sole carer .

There is always exception to the rule. I should have said it in the context of being the primary carer and not genderized it -you were also right Scouse and I am sorry to have offended you Pfy. But in no way was I trying to do what Wazzer is on about just trying to add a different pov. Ouch.

 

[Scouse]

I still don't buy it even he's not the sole carer russ. A mother's responsibility in no way outweighs that of the father. Period.


Only if one or the other parent is shit does it become inequal.

 

[russell]

How many kids do you have Scouse?

 

[Scouse]

None.

I guess my experience of being one for years, growing up with kids and parents, having nieces and nephews, being a godparent, you know - being human - counts for nowt.

Or you're just sexist and think women are special when it comes to kids?

 

[russell]

Not at all.
I just thought it would all be equal, before it happened to me and sometimes it is, sometimes he does more than me, but bottom line it falls to me to initiate care. My husband is very hands on and into it. But all of the people I know with kids would say, even in this modern world it is still more predominantly the female's (with exception of male primary carers) responsibility.
I am not at all of the belief that women are better. I know some great Dad's who are the primary carer's who have to struggle with all the sterotypes on top of the kidstuff, but it still seems to be an over- arching cultural thing.
Maybe I am wrong. I am really not up myself about this at all, just curious now.

 

[MYstIC G]

No. Parental responsibility is parental responsibility. It's not apportioned by gender or any other factor. Can we please now put this thread back on topic and as mentioned before if people want to have a battle of the sexes, elsewhere is the place.

 

[Tilda]

I'm sorry to echo what people are saying, but get a lawyer involved.

he needs to protect his assets from any divorce claim - ie the house, make sure its back to his parents.

Also needs to protect the children, speak to family lawyer, get make a witness statement. Get him to write whats happened down, its all evidence against mum when she decides she does want the kids.

Also, speak to CSA, get them involved, even if she pays what she pays now, it'll be official, rather than having to prove everything further down the line.
CSA also gives him a stronger claim should her income suddenly increase.

imo, if she can afford holidays and weekends away, she should be paying more to him to support the children.

Finally, assuming they are married, have they made wills? If so, he should make a new one, leaving things directly to children perhaps to be held on trust by his parents for them. He should also ensure he states he wants parents as guardians (ie to look after kids) rather than mum, who would normally have that right.

Change the locks.

 

[Scouse]

I see how it differs, unless he's the sort of dad who spends every weekend watching football, constant weekends away, always out with his mates more than the woman does.

 

[russell]

Also inform the school/pre-school/ nursery that the children should only be released to him/other named adult.
Otherwise she could just come back in a years time and take them.
The teacher of the 5 year old should also be made aware to help them through it- kids get affected more than you think and can say wierd stuff or get very upset during circle time and PHSE.

 

[Chilly]

what's circle time?

 

[russell]

Most primary schools have it a couple of times a week. They sit in a circle and discuss things with a social, or emotional context. Teaches them how to deal with emotions they might feel throughout their life.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Scouse, can't help but notice as usual you just go for a personal attack when someone challenges you in a way that makes you uncomfortable.

None.

I guess my experience of being one for years, growing up with kids and parents, having nieces and nephews, being a godparent, you know - being human - counts for nowt.

Or you're just sexist and think women are special when it comes to kids?

It doesn't count for nothing but if you haven't been a parent you aren't really in a position to fully understand the way so much changes once you have the responsibility.

 

[Chilly]

Most primary schools have it a couple of times a week. They sit in a circle and discuss things with a social, or emotional context. Teaches them how to deal with emotions they might feel throughout their life.

Wish they'd done that when I was in primary school - might have stopped me turning into a nutter!

 

[Scouse]

Scouse, can't help but notice as usual you just go for a personal attack when someone challenges you in a way that makes you uncomfortable.

It's not a personal attack. I think Russ is being sexist.

If I think someone's being sexist then I have to imply/call/tell them so...


I also disagree with you totally that you have to have your own kids to understand family dynamics.

 

[Scouse]

Most primary schools have it a couple of times a week. They sit in a circle and discuss things with a social, or emotional context. Teaches them how to deal with emotions they might feel throughout their life.

They could do with that throughout school, never mind just primary school.

 

[russell]

It's not a personal attack. I think Russ is being sexist.

If I think someone's being sexist then I have to imply/call/tell them so...


I also disagree with you totally that you have to have your own kids to understand family dynamics.

WRONG
and
WRONG

I resent being called sexist. That is just insulting. I NEVER said that women are BETTER than men, as I dont believe this. My point is that MOST women have the lion's share of child care hands-on reponsibility when the children are young, and that can cause melt down and abandoment of children (see massive increase in post-natal depression and suicide figures of women with babies and small children- I guess this could also happen to the few men that may also be in this situation, but is not as prevelant)

Back to business...
Cal - of course she should pay for the children -has she said she wont? And the school will also have services and information to help your friend. They could also put him in touch with other single Dads.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

I also disagree with you totally that you have to have your own kids to understand family dynamics.

There's a certain amount a person can learn. Without the experience, such 'expertise' will always lack depth and will have gaps.

Oh. Like pretty much every other job/role/subject then.

 

[Legaen]

Being a parent is an equal responsibility but unfortuantly it is usually the fathers (not in all cases!) who have to go and earn the income to support the family (even if seperated) so therefore the main child care factor falls with the mother. I for example would do almost anything to spend quality time with my son of 3 years but it's near enough impossible with providing the income.

Single parenting is obviously alot tougher, not speaking from experience but I have friends who are. Time should be equally split and both parents of that child or children should come to an agreement to do what is BEST for the child when it comes to living arrangements/child care and financial support.