Politics So...Europe then?

Raven

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Undecided, going to wait and see what pigfucker actually managed to negotiate and what he says he has negotiated.

Plenty of reasons to stay in, plenty of reasons to say up yours.
 

Scouse

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The UK will also be able to enact emergency safeguards to protect the City of London
You'll like it. Europe was going to try to fix our bent, outside-of-UK-law tax haven in the centre of our capital. Cameron's made sure that big corporations will continue to not have to pay much attention to the rest of the world.
 

Raven

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Curious? Why would I care what corporations want? How does that affect me? I realise you are contribution averse, your tax arrangements speak for themselves, but some of us believe you should only get out of something what you are willing to put in.

I am more concerned with slackers coming over and being able slack for a bit more money than slacking provides in their home country. I am also worried about piss pot countries dictating what we can and cannot do while providing jack shit to Europe.

I have stated many times that I would love to see a closer, fairer Europe where countries get back what they put in. If Europe is not willing to provide that then fuck'um.

I am a little sad that little of the recent "negotiations" addressed the giant hole of lack of democracy or accountability but it's a start.

Like it or not, along with France and Germany, the UK is the big player in Europe, without the big 3, Europe would collapse in a couple of years. If we leave then the people of France and Germany will ask for referendums, any party that wants to retain power will have to grant that or die.

I will see what comes out in the next few months before deciding.
 
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Raven

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Really? I mean, really?
Yes really, and to reiterate. How does a corporation's affairs affect me?

Feel free to point out how.

Also, not entirely sure how an American comedian, speaking about America has anything to do with the fact that the town near me gets closer every year because we have uncontrolled and uncontrollable population growth, especially in the midlands.

But go on, have a blast from your tax dodging ivory tower, see how you get on.
 

Scouse

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No point debating with someone who's deliberately obtuse.

If the starting point of debate with you means I have to describe the colour of the sea, sky and green green grass then it's not worth bothering.

Anyway, your drum shop called, it's louder than ever...


Edit:
Also, not entirely sure how an American comedian, speaking about America has anything to do with the fact that the town near me gets closer every year because we have uncontrolled and uncontrollable population growth
Because it's the exact same argument over there as over here?
 

Raven

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/yawn.

Anyway. as quite clearly stated, even easy enough for an idiot like yourself. I am undecided.

One thing I can say for sure is the likes of you will not help form my final choice, you are far too right on and frankly, stupid, to help make such an important decision.

I know you like to think of yourself as some sort of intellectual powerhouse, it's cute in its own way I suppose. All sorts of tedious crap about people being wrong but no real counter argument, just lots of bollocks, opinion formed by others.
 

Calaen

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I'm sure he'll tell us that he's delivered exactly what he promised. And the no camp will tell us he's done nothing of the sort.

Either way he'll have a cushy life.
 

Job

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I'm guessing a UK outside the EU would relax banking laws to suck in cash, pretty well a sort of pirate stock exchange off the continent, we have the connections...in fact we are one of the biggest in the world and the city makes a huge chunk of Britains wealth.
It's easy to make out of context jokes about people disliking immigration, if I lived in America it wouldn't bother me a bit, the place is immense , mostly empty and built on immigration.
England is the opposite.
 
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Moriath

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No point debating with someone who's deliberately obtuse.

If the starting point of debate with you means I have to describe the colour of the sea, sky and green green grass then it's not worth bothering.

Anyway, your drum shop called, it's louder than ever...


Edit:

Because it's the exact same argument over there as over here?
Every time you are asked to explain a position you pull the your tok dumb i cba .

I want out. Not because its better or worse but because its different and more interesting.
 

Moriath

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I'm sure he'll tell us that he's delivered exactly what he promised. And the no camp will tell us he's done nothing of the sort.

Either way he'll have a cushy life.
And ever state in the eu will claim victory. Zzzzzz
 

Bodhi

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Really? I mean, really?


Anyway, I don't know why immigration would affect you. Unless you're one of the people that Doug talks about below:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVyRwWKCtKQ
Tbh it's quite easy to show how the tax rates corporations pay will affect you. If the amount of tax they have to pay goes up, the prices we have to pay for their services will go up, and the amount benefits and salaries for the employees will go down.

I'd say in fact, that if you think it's possible to tax those evil corporations you really don't have a clue what you're talking about. Companies don't pay tax, just the people involved with them do. So the customers and the employees. Ie the little people our socialist friends are so keen to protect.
 

Ormorof

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I think its a hugely missed opportunity

Rather than addressing the major flaws in the EU he has gone in on immigration as his biggest issue, despite the fact it is a negligible cost to the UK

Demanding reform of the EU money wasting departments would have gotten supprt from most eu nations (the 6 month flip from Brussels to Strasbourg as an example)

Im a little worried that if the UK does leave the EU will be vindictive and slap a "leaving levy" on all uk goods and services

France especially doesn't want the uk to be seen to get a good deal out of leaving EU on an immigration issue as it will give Le Pen & co more ammunition
 

Embattle

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Looking for more detail, even then it stands a chance of being unpicked by MEPs or the court.
 

DaGaffer

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I think its a hugely missed opportunity

Rather than addressing the major flaws in the EU he has gone in on immigration as his biggest issue, despite the fact it is a negligible cost to the UK

Demanding reform of the EU money wasting departments would have gotten supprt from most eu nations (the 6 month flip from Brussels to Strasbourg as an example)

Im a little worried that if the UK does leave the EU will be vindictive and slap a "leaving levy" on all uk goods and services

France especially doesn't want the uk to be seen to get a good deal out of leaving EU on an immigration issue as it will give Le Pen & co more ammunition
He concentrated on stuff he had the slightest chance of actually getting. "Reform" in the context the out camp want is essentially the dismantling of 90% of the EU's political structure anyway, so anything short of that would be pointless, and even if the EU turned around tomorrow and said "you know what Britain? You're absolutely right, we're going to be a free trade area and nothing else", the out camp would still demand we leave. At this point the debate has absolutely nothing to do with reality.
 

Raven

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I am not sure about the deeper integration thing, I kind of think we either go balls deep or not at all. If it goes ahead and if we choose to stay in Europe then I get the feeling we will have less of a say and would be in a worse situation than we are now.
 

Gwadien

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Frankly, my gut notion that Cameron has gone to the EU and aimed for things that are 'easy' and the things that I don't really care about (such as immigration) makes me want to reactionary vote out.

But then I think I'm just voting for THOSE reasons, IE I'm voting with the IMURGRUNTZ TAKERN MEAH JOERBZ.

I just wish someone would step up and say, look, sure we'll reform for now, but we'll remain in the EU and try to reform it from the inside, and cut down on bureaucratic waste and to ensure that the EU laws are practiced across Europe, not just particular countries.
 

Raven

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It appears that Gove is going to campaign for an exit. Makes me lean towards staying in tbh. If he thinks it's a good idea to be out then its bound to mean its the wrong choice. Just need Hunt to campaign for an exit and my choice is cemented.
 

Scouse

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I'd say in fact, that if you think it's possible to tax those evil corporations you really don't have a clue what you're talking about.
So, you honestly hold the position that tax on profits is unrealistic and unachieveable?


Edit: BTW - you're the one calling them evil, not me.
 

Raven

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Tax on profits is the only real option in the real world. Asking for (presumably) a tax on turnover would be retarded.
 

caLLous

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It appears that Gove is going to campaign for an exit. Makes me lean towards staying in tbh. If he thinks it's a good idea to be out then its bound to mean its the wrong choice. Just need Hunt to campaign for an exit and my choice is cemented.
Gove has been anti-Europe since forever.
 

Embattle

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So as predicted the vote will be on 23rd June, I suspect one of the most important votes most of us will ever of voted in.
 

Job

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Listening to his speech..
Why did he say if we vote to leave , he will do his best to deliver it.
Wtf does that mean.
 

Embattle

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Why do these cunts always talk about punching above our weight when talking about staying in the EU, I'm beginning to loathe this phrase.
 

Job

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Why are we asking for special treatment, we have no right to this, in the club..abide by the rules...don't like it ..leave.
We are voting to leave not make them treat us differently
 

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