Chain for sbs?

[Hatt]

Btw mirak Most infils are thrust, mid leather armor got +10% thrust resist, mid chain armor got -10% thrust resist.
You fight infils 90%~ of the time.
Therefore, you will take 1% more dmg insted of 19% less

 

[belth]

Thrust, 200 dmg, ignoring AF effects...

Abs:
10%, leather: 190
27%, chain: 173

Resists:
Min. 10%, leather: 171
Max. 36%, leather: 121
Min. -10%, chain: 190
Max. 16%, chain: 145

Interesting. AF is the only difference - if target has no additional resists.

Don't remember the formula of calculating total AF but if it was 5*displayed AF*100%*ABS%, these should be right...
561 for leather, 647 for chain?
Chain has 15% more AF, so we reduce the 200 dmg pre-abs by that, ending up at new numbers of:

Abs:
10%, leather: 190
27%, chain: 124 (!!!)

Resists:
Min. 10%, leather: 171
Max. 36%, leather: 121
Min. -10%, chain: 136
Max. 16%, chain: 104

I'm quite certain the AF part is completely wrong

 

[jetsetminer]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by Begach
I stand corrected

Point was valid though..chain on an stealther is a joke. Mincers shouldn't get it imo (or be unable to stealth while wearing it for you group mincers out there )....but thats another whine.

B.

Sure, remove chain from minstrels and make them wear leather, but don't forget to give them evade 6 like the other leather wearing stealthers

Finally a viabale thrust minstrel

 

[Begach]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by jetsetminer
Sure, remove chain from minstrels and make them wear leather, but don't forget to give them evade 6 like the other leather wearing stealthers

Finally a viabale thrust minstrel

Other stealthers don't have speed 5, ablative chant, 9 second insta stun, 2 dmg shouts and a long duration mezz to work off the 9 sec stun. Or you planning on losing those too to get your evade 6?

Btw i think you fergot about studded

B.

 

[jetsetminer]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by Begach
Other stealthers don't have speed 5, ablative chant, 9 second insta stun, 2 dmg shouts and a long duration mezz to work off the 9 sec stun. Or you planning on losing those too to get your evade 6?

Btw i think you fergot about studded

B.

Yeah, but minstrels also don't get CS, or envenom or dual wield, or 2.2/2.5 spec. So keeping songs but getting high evade seems fair to me.

 

[loxleyhood]

Originally posted by mirak_naijmi
Chain for sbs?

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHA

No, you big moron.

 

[darbey]

Think this post made the top 10 of stupid ideas.

 

[old.yaruar]

Originally posted by jox
Yeah, why not? Mincers have chain, IP, AP, CC, Speed...AND Stealth. But I would prefer plate

Yeah, but even I can solo a mincer and I'm a thane ;-)

 

[loxleyhood]

Scouts should get plate armour, 2h specs, primary stats in everything oh yeah, mez and pbt, we need mez and pbt, yeah! Pbaoe too! Why? Becuase I play a scout dammit.

 

[alme]

AJJJJJJT

 

[Begach]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by jetsetminer
Yeah, but minstrels also don't get CS, or envenom or dual wield, or 2.2/2.5 spec. So keeping songs but getting high evade seems fair to me.

Nope. Non of those things are as strong as the instrument line. And anything above evade 3 on a hybrid class has proven to be a joke (just look at the savage now).

What i'm askin for is some consistency in the game. If a mincer can wear chain and stealth why can't all stealthers. What your askin for is a nice overpowered hybrid stealth class that hits fast, for a ton and that you can't hit back.

Bard is nowhere near as strong as minstrel with regard to offensive or defensive capabilities and they have to make do with RF (studded) and evade 2. TL asked for em and they got ahem *cough* dodger *cough*. It seemed to miss thier attention that most group bards spend thier life running the fook away and therefore unless they have advanced evade dodger is totaly useless to em (lol this aint me plugging for advanced evade btw. Just pointing out the stoopidity of the decision).

B.

 

[Begach]

Or mythic can spent the next 5 patches moving the alch table round again. That works too.

B.

 

[BidAccount]

HA HA

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Chain for SBs!!

Oh dear me.

So - you have the same damage output over time as NS & INfils, same spec points as NS, more HPs than NS and infils and the same armour as NS&infils.

What part of that justifies chain armour?

Oh I forgot - Shadowzerks are so skillless and clueless that they need ridiculously unfair advantages.

 

[Blazor Meneth]

Originally posted by Herbal Remedy
sigh another 1 button mid whining bvecause his fotm char got nerfed

in summary cry my n00b

Yeah hes the typical fotm, I mean he have only played that char for about 1.5 years and do not have any other lvl 50 x(




idiot!

 

[-Freezingwiz-]

Originally posted by mirak_naijmi
Since its obviously so bad with their damage nerf why not give sbs chain? That will give them an increase of 19% absorbation which means;

-Better group compability which is a major issue mythic has tried to solve. For all assasins thou but hey sbs is a start.

-If we lost 40% of the la bonus and therefore like 20-30% damage why not compensate that with 19% less damage?

-We survive dragonfang! Infils are happy since they can keep their 9sec stun and NS is happy cause then they are back as the absolutely worst assasin in the game again. But what the hell, why dont give them x1,5 realmpoints specc so they can get higher AP? Infs have 2,5 specc so why shouldnt NS get 1,5 rp?

Or i had another idea how to counter dragonfang and also give more group compability. Give sb 2,5 specc points and shield specc. Then they can specc 42 shield(as the infils 44 CS) and 50 weapon(as infs) skip LA(as infs skips DW) and rest in stealth env(just like infs). Its gives them an insta win button(just like infs just a tiny bit better than the infs but cmon...)

Could this work or should we rather stay to the give infs 2,2 specc and nerf dragonfang to 6sec?

Whine ? gimp SB´s did ahve there UBER days now they have a hard time like meny other classes....


oh btw... why not give them 3x spec pts ? and a parry spec aswell when they have shield aswell....

 

[Vasconcelos]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by Begach

Mincers shouldn't get it imo (or be unable to stealth while wearing it for you group mincers out there )

Hummm might be a nice idea for all stealth classes to be more group friendly.
Let em be able to also wear chain but drop his stealth ability and high evade (maybe leave it at 2 or 3).

 

[Silenzio]

name n number ov ur pusher pls

 

[Crashtje]

Nerf Dragonfang!!!!!

oh


and savages

 

[BidAccount]

Nerf Alexie.

becuse he's a tit.

 

[-Freezingwiz-]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by Begach
Nope. Non of those things are as strong as the instrument line. And anything above evade 3 on a hybrid class has proven to be a joke (just look at the savage now).

What i'm askin for is some consistency in the game. If a mincer can wear chain and stealth why can't all stealthers. What your askin for is a nice overpowered hybrid stealth class that hits fast, for a ton and that you can't hit back.

Bard is nowhere near as strong as minstrel with regard to offensive or defensive capabilities and they have to make do with RF (studded) and evade 2. TL asked for em and they got ahem *cough* dodger *cough*. It seemed to miss thier attention that most group bards spend thier life running the fook away and therefore unless they have advanced evade dodger is totaly useless to em (lol this aint me plugging for advanced evade btw. Just pointing out the stoopidity of the decision).

B.

yea... mincers are i rough template -> rough HP.... Bards can heal, Bards are main CC, bards got instant AE mezz.... in other words they are not the same.

1 of them are roughs
1 of them are healer / main CC


Instruments are a good line yes, I agree but a mincers dmg out put is below everyone els in melee only !

 

[NP_Finster]

And get ' WTFpWned to H3ll aNd back' by infiltrator thrusting weapons.

You ve got to be kidding me. Even if i was offered the option i d maximally use it pve, because wearing chain is the best way to offer nightshades and infiltrators a free victory.

Think before you post,

regards, Fin

PS: @Freezingwiz: it s called a 'Rogue' (speak as "r00-g' ")

 

[old.Nol]

Originally posted by mirak_naijmi
BLAH BLAH BLAH!

 

[-Freezingwiz-]

Originally posted by NP_Finster

PS: @Freezingwiz: it s called a 'Rogue' (speak as "r00-g' ")

My Uber spelling

 

[nightsorrow]

lolz, gonna get a icecream downstairs k

 

[jetsetminer]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by Begach
Nope. Non of those things are as strong as the instrument line. And anything above evade 3 on a hybrid class has proven to be a joke (just look at the savage now).

What i'm askin for is some consistency in the game. If a mincer can wear chain and stealth why can't all stealthers. What your askin for is a nice overpowered hybrid stealth class that hits fast, for a ton and that you can't hit back.

Bard is nowhere near as strong as minstrel with regard to offensive or defensive capabilities and they have to make do with RF (studded) and evade 2. TL asked for em and they got ahem *cough* dodger *cough*. It seemed to miss thier attention that most group bards spend thier life running the fook away and therefore unless they have advanced evade dodger is totaly useless to em (lol this aint me plugging for advanced evade btw. Just pointing out the stoopidity of the decision).

B.

Not as strong as the instruments line? The instrument line gives very little damage advantage a couple of small dd's and a one use stun because u can't chain stun anymore. A good stealther can sneak up and 1 shot a caster - try doing that with a minstrel, I don't think so. You can't even mezz from stealth because a minstrel un-stealths the instant they start "casting" the mezz.

CS, DW, and envenom give insane damage output if you get your styles off. With a good crit a stealther can take out a tank, minstrels on the other hand have very little chance surviving a one on one with a tank despite their chain armour.

As for bards having less offensive abilties, they have heals and as such suffer offensive if they want to spec in healing, just like all other classes with heals. Also bards CC is much better than a minstrels, mincer aoe mezz has a 5 second cast time!

In summary, minstrels are just fine, they don't do anywhere near as much damage as a true stealther (not even close) but have slightly more survivability with chain and low evade (but not much due to rogue hit points). Also as has been pointed out minstrels loose out big time when attacked by other stealthers as chain is thrust vunerable.

 

[VodkaFairy]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by jetsetminer
Not as strong as the instruments line? The instrument line gives very little damage advantage a couple of small dd's and a one use stun because u can't chain stun anymore. A good stealther can sneak up and 1 shot a caster - try doing that with a minstrel, I don't think so. You can't even mezz from stealth because a minstrel un-stealths the instant they start "casting" the mezz.

CS, DW, and envenom give insane damage output if you get your styles off. With a good crit a stealther can take out a tank, minstrels on the other hand have very little chance surviving a one on one with a tank despite their chain armour.

As for bards having less offensive abilties, they have heals and as such suffer offensive if they want to spec in healing, just like all other classes with heals. Also bards CC is much better than a minstrels, mincer aoe mezz has a 5 second cast time!

In summary, minstrels are just fine, they don't do anywhere near as much damage as a true stealther (not even close) but have slightly more survivability with chain and low evade (but not much due to rogue hit points). Also as has been pointed out minstrels loose out big time when attacked by other stealthers as chain is thrust vunerable.

Dunno when you last played an assassin but the days of 1 shotting casters is kinda over. Casters can easily get ~1400 hp buffed and my PA cap is around 750. With the spec AF buffs albs get a PA on caster won't even be close to that cap. If you count a max crit, offhand + crit, procs and poison I still can't one shot a caster. A well played minstrel won't lose against someone in a one-on-one granted he knows who to avoid (very few classes tho). Just look at Alpha, Voskos, etc.

Playing an assassin mostly means running into other assassins, archers (and minstrels), I don't see many solo tanks and casters

 

[Arnor]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by jetsetminer
Not as strong as the instruments line? The instrument line gives very little damage advantage a couple of small dd's and a one use stun because u can't chain stun anymore. A good stealther can sneak up and 1 shot a caster - try doing that with a minstrel, I don't think so. You can't even mezz from stealth because a minstrel un-stealths the instant they start "casting" the mezz.

CS, DW, and envenom give insane damage output if you get your styles off. With a good crit a stealther can take out a tank, minstrels on the other hand have very little chance surviving a one on one with a tank despite their chain armour.

As for bards having less offensive abilties, they have heals and as such suffer offensive if they want to spec in healing, just like all other classes with heals. Also bards CC is much better than a minstrels, mincer aoe mezz has a 5 second cast time!

In summary, minstrels are just fine, they don't do anywhere near as much damage as a true stealther (not even close) but have slightly more survivability with chain and low evade (but not much due to rogue hit points). Also as has been pointed out minstrels loose out big time when attacked by other stealthers as chain is thrust vunerable.

says the rr3 cleric

 

[zmurf]

27% - 10% = 17%
10% + 10% = 20%

vs infill leather is actually better than chain, since infill's r mainly specced thrust

 

[Begach]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by -Freezingwiz-
yea... mincers are i rough template -> rough HP.... Bards can heal, Bards are main CC, bards got instant AE mezz.... in other words they are not the same.

1 of them are roughs
1 of them are healer / main CC


Instruments are a good line yes, I agree but a mincers dmg out put is below everyone els in melee only !

No they both have the ability to spec a weapon and a spell line that makes them both hybrids. Just one was given shite armour/defence and put on a shite dmg table so they could never (without considerable effort) fullfill the offensive role. The fact mincer started at a rouge trainer and can stealth does not change what he is.

And newsflash......any bard who has strong heals either has no reliable AoE mezzes or shite songs. OR you expecting him to spec everything mid lvl and be crap at everything? Typically a bard is either a strong mezzer or strong healer.......rarely both.

LOL and about the dmg output. You played a warden lately?

B.

 

[jetsetminer]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chain for sbs?

Originally posted by Arnor
says the rr3 cleric

edit:

*sigh*

wish I could do /ignore on BW