News Strikes

[Raven]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15953806

I am wondering who will even notice? Still, saves phoning in sick for most of them!

 

[rynnor]

Some of the rhetoric has been silly - saying that you cant expect 'frail old people of 67' to teach kids - surely this kind of age discrimination is illegal now?

My childrens school has some of the retired teachers coming back to teach classes - its not like they have to physically restrain them or something? You shouldnt be doing hard physical labour at 67 (unless you want to) but teaching seems viable to me?

 

[Tom]

Whinging fuckwits. Try getting a pay rise in the private sector. I haven't been able to increase my rates with inflation in five years.

 

[Kronic]

Most of them probably want the day off to do some Christmas shopping

 

[Shagrat]

well I'm off to break through the pickets to get to work, wish me luck

Although living in rural rutland theres probably 5 people and a dog picketing atm haha

 

[Scouse]

Whinging fuckwits. Try getting a pay rise in the private sector. I haven't been able to increase my rates with inflation in five years.

I agree with your second part. I've not increased my rates in line with inflation in about ten years. I've had to move job type to achieve the same take home.

However, I disagree vehemently with the first part. Just because we're having it bad doesn't mean that I want other people to have it bad too. I'm not that jealous.

Personally, I reserve my anger for the powerfully rich. Mervyn King says "it's going to be tough". It is. Just not for him.


Support the strikers* - they're like us. Fight the powerful rich - they don't give a shit, not really.



*I also support people like Shagrat. If you want to break the pickets then fine. Freedom of choice n' all that.

 

[Calaen]

Took the day off work to spend it with my Daughter.

Don't mind the strikes at all really, at the end of the day these people are the ones trying to shape our kids and the future of our country, They get a lot of fucking shit for doing it as well. They either get higher wages and lower pensions or the wages they are on and a higher pension. Same with Nurses, for the shit they put up with they get paid fuck all.


yesterday summed it all up, another speech by the chancellor, expecting me to beleive he's doing things the right way and that we have to trust his numbers about the deficit, 20 minutes after discovering that everything he's been doing so far is falling massively short of what he expected in the first place. The blokes a douchebag.

 

[russell]

Striking is a last resort due to the Government refusing a proper negotiation. They love us striking as they can blame us and save loads of money on all of our salaries for the day.

Surely it is right to make a stand when things are just wrong... too much apathy around nowadays.

We well know that the country has gone to the dogs and there is no money left in the pot for pensions -because the government has spent it, and we appreciate that the private sector have had their pensions reduced.

Teachers salaries have been frozen for 5 years - increase with inflation -Ha!
And before you all start with the holidays and 9-3... teachers do fuck all... rah... rah... I work a 60 hour week and I think my job is quite important to society -along with nurses, ambulance drivers etc. I care about the kids and do my best to help them on their way. What I dont appreciate is being walked all over and having my rights stripped away.

I am striking because:

• The proposed increase is pretty much immediate
• The proposed increase is too much for me to sustain (almost double what I pay now)
• With childcare costs, increased pension and minimal salary - I will be forced to opt out of the pension scheme or even teaching
• Lots of people are in my position and if they opt out the pension scheme will be at risk of collapse, so the teachers who have paid in for 25 years to a promised 'safe pot' will be out of pocket
• Thousands of teachers put up with minimal salary and children abusing them daily - as one of our published benefits is a good pension.
• We are striking for a more reasonable staggered increase, and proper open negotiations, not no increase at all
• Teacher drop out of the profession at an alarming rate already -this unrealistic increase in pension will lead to more going, more having to be trained and employed -more needless money being used again.

I know it is a pain for parents. I am a parent too,
Go ahead slate me -just wanted to give my POV

 

[Raven]

You should replace " -because the government has spent it" to "because the previous government has spent it"

Fair enough though. The thing is, we are all in the same boat, private and public, money is tight for everyone. However, it is the private sector that pays for the public sector through taxes, we don't get cushy pensions as standard and we have the prospect of our places of work going under and thus facing redundancy, or staff cut backs to stay afloat. Money doesn't grow on trees, the public sector should just accept that, yes, they too have to tighten their belts.

 

[russell]

Some of the rhetoric has been silly - saying that you cant expect 'frail old people of 67' to teach kids - surely this kind of age discrimination is illegal now?

My childrens school has some of the retired teachers coming back to teach classes - its not like they have to physically restrain them or something? You shouldnt be doing hard physical labour at 67 (unless you want to) but teaching seems viable to me?

The best teacher I know is 54. And some teachers do get called back from retirement for short periods of time.
However, whilst not being a very physical job (we do have to physically restrain pupils at times), teaching is mentally draining and I struggle somedays at 37 to remember all I should be doing.
Its a mentally fast pace. Also, if you miss a trick once, just for a nano second -they have you!!! And your life is a misery at school.
I'm sure you can all remember the teacher that everyone bullied because they had no control.

It takes alot to stay ahead of the game -I can only see myself lasting 20 years, if I am lucky -mind you the constant pressure to be 'outstanding' and Ofsted breathing down your neck, the rate the Government changes everything overnight- Ill be lucky if I make it another year -most teachers give up in the first 4 years, as the reality of what you have to do sinks in.

 

[Chilly]

Well I had a 30% pay rise this year. Private sector all day.

I should point out that's because I got promoted twice, not because I'm a total cunt

However, I have loads of sympathy for certain public sector workers. Teachers and NHS staff, mostly. The reality of the situation is that various private sectors have exploded in pay and benefits over the last couple of decades whilst the public sector has barely struggled along at inflation. The result is that the average cost of living has gone up a ton and it's very difficult for the lower paid public sector workers to survive.

 

[DaGaffer]

Pissed off with this because my mum was supposed to go in for an op tomorrow and it has to be cancelled.

I'm viewing this from afar but as I understand the biggest driver of the strike is the move away from Final Salary pensions? Sorry public sector workers, but boo fucking hoo, we're almost all of us in the same boat, and if you didn't know this was coming, you've not been paying attention for, ooh, the last 10 years or so? Final Salary pensions are unsustainable with an ageing population, end of story. The biggest scandal is that Labour knew this day was coming and put off a showdown with the public sector all the way through their 13 years in office.

 

[Scouse]

You should replace " -because the government has spent it" to "because the previous government has spent it"

And you should replace that with - this is a systemic adjustment of capitalism and the super-rich who are involved with managing this won't feel a single thing.

The workers, on the other hand, are dying. Y'know. Actual death has increased because of this financial "crisis"...



Gaff - I disagree with your above post. There wouldn't be this so-called financial crisis if we rounded up the 1000 richest people in the UK, took their shit off them and gave them ten million quid each in compensation (ample, don't you think?)

But that's not on the cards. Even when lives are on the line...

 

[DaGaffer]

Gaff - I disagree with your above post. There wouldn't be this so-called financial crisis if we rounded up the 1000 richest people in the UK, took their shit off them and gave them ten million quid each in compensation (ample, don't you think?)

But that's not on the cards. Even when lives are on the line...

Lets be clear here; the financial crisis has nothing directly to do with the affordability of final salary pensions. The crisis has made the situation more acute, but its demographics that's wrecking the pensions model, not the current fecklessness of the banks. This is what I was referring to earlier; Labour should have grasped the nettle during the good times, but were too scared of losing the public sector vote. The Tories don't have the public sector vote anyway, so they get to play bad guy, again.

 

[Scouse]

It's not that there isn't enough money* for it. It's just that there isn't enough money for that and the super-rich.

So the poor lose out.


*if our money system wasn't bent then we wouldn't have this problem

 

[DaGaffer]

It's not that there isn't enough money* for it. It's just that there isn't enough money for that and the super-rich.

So the poor lose out.


*if our money system wasn't bent then we wouldn't have this problem

No, there isn't enough money because the working population is shrinking while the retired population is growing. Taking all the money off the super-rich won't solve that.

I don't disagree about the money system being bent, but even if you had a fairer system, you're still going to end up with a minority paying for the retirement income of a majority in the long run, which isn't fair either.

 

[Raven]

It's not that there isn't enough money* for it. It's just that there isn't enough money for that and the super-rich.

So the poor lose out.


*if our money system wasn't bent then we wouldn't have this problem

I suppose you give away much of your salary to homeless charities and whatnot?

 

[Scouse]

I suppose you give away much of your salary to homeless charities and whatnot?

If I have to say systemic change one more time I'll, erm, be even more sick of saying it?

Systemic change.

There. Have IQ's suddenly dropped around here?

 

[Raven]

Come up with something other than "I don't like it but I will just moan about it and do nothing but hope for others to change it" and maybe you can stop saying it.

Like I have said. Nothing will change until people lead the change. Revolution does not happen through whining, it happens through action.

 

[Scouse]

I'm not having the same argument with you that I had with Tom.

I support systemic change as it's the only change that would make any difference in the long run. All other action is ultimately futile.


If I'm not "allowed" to talk about it with other people how the fuck are different ideas supposed to be aired? Am I only allowed to say "this is shit" if I've the complete solution? Get real.

 

[Moriath]

I can see how losing a better pension for a lesser one is not making people happy. I am glad for them they are in a union and they can make their voices known.

However it happened to us we lost our final salary scheme and didnt have any way to say anything about it. The company just said we are doing this because we cant afford it any more and are moving to a maintainable system.

They can strike if they want to show they dont like it.

But at the end of the day the country can only afford what we can afford. We voted the governments in etc etc and they decide how they spend the countries taxes.

they decided we cant afford the pension debt with everything else.

so something has to give. the previous gov used public sector jobs to make the country less unemployed .. during a ressession less taxes means we can afford less public servants. So some need to go it is reality.

 

[chipper]

Come up with something other than "I don't like it but I will just moan about it and do nothing but hope for others to change it" and maybe you can stop saying it.

Like I have said. Nothing will change until people lead the change. Revolution does not happen through whining, it happens through action.

am sure thousands of miners agree with you.. not only did they get shit on by the government but in the end the unions crumbled too.

am not very happy about the strikes kids have yet another day off school and its not like they dont have enough as it is (sorry russell but it seems they have an inset day or a holiday every couple of weeks or so). i work in the private sector so naturally i am looking in from the outside, but from my point of view this is just another pointless day of disruptions that will solve nothing. all the working force public and private have took hits ive had to start paying more into my company pension just to make it viable again, ive not moaned about it ive just seen the way the tide is turning and trying to make the most of it.

the country is in a mess saying we should just tax the rich is idealistic and misguided its not going to happen and if it did they would just up sticks and move there fortune and buisnesses elsewhere. the concerns are real and i understand them i just think now is not the time to vent them we are on the verge of dipping back into a recession get the country back in a better state not only will the government be in a tigher position to listen and grant demands as the funds will be there but you will probably find that the majority of the private sector backs you too.

 

[Tom]

If I have to say systemic change one more time I'll, erm, be even more sick of saying it?

Systemic change.

There. Have IQ's suddenly dropped around here?

Polly Toynbee, darling of the movement for equality, said pretty much the same thing to Richard Littlejohn when he pointed out the fact that she had a holiday home in Tuscany. He didn't get around to highlighting just how easily The Guardian (her employer) avoids paying mucho tax.

In other words, you don't have the courage of your convictions, and would rather let other people feel the pain.

 

[Aoami]

Nothing will be achieved under the current unions. Full of incompetenty to the last.

 

[Tom]

Bob Crow (RMT) - £79,564 in salary, £26,115 in pension contributions, £13,013 expenses
John Hannett (USDAW) - £81,742 salary, £16,389 pension contributions
Billy Hayes (CWU) - £83,530 salary, £14,190 pension contributions
Sally Hunt (UCU) - £63,743 salary, £7,612 pension contributions, £2705 car benefit (start of June 2006 to end of May 2007)
Paul Kenny (GMB) - £81,000 salary, £21,000 superannuation (pension contributions), £8,000 car
Dave Prentis (Unison) - £92,187 salary, £23,603 pension contributions, £11,646 expenses and car benefit
Derek Simpson (Unite-Amicus) - £62,673 salary, £16,156 pension contributions, £13,333 car allowance, £26,181 housing benefit
Mark Serwotka (PCS) - £82,094 salary, £26,104 pensions contributions, £2,245 additional housing cost allowance and additional housing cost supplement
Steve Sinnott (NUT) - £99,846 salary, £23,963 pension contributions
Tony Woodley (Unite-TGWU) - £59,333 salary, £9,552 pension contributions, car fuel £3,360
Matt Wrack (FBU) - £66,389 salary, £44,281 pension contributions, £5,134 car

From this source:

​

http://www.workersliberty.org/story/2009/01/15/while-millions-take-pay-cuts-union-leaders-rake-it​

I had the misfortune of listening to Brendan Barbour on R5Live while out today. The man has never had a private sector job, ever.

 

[DaGaffer]

I'm amused that the NUT guy is on the highest salary. I wouldn't call any of them high earners though.

 

[Himse]

They're still in the top 10% i'd assume..

That's a bloody nice wage, I bet the members of their Unions wish they got that much.

 

[Scouse]

In other words, you don't have the courage of your convictions, and would rather let other people feel the pain.

You know nothing about how I live my life, Tom.

I'm not arguing this point again until you can show me something new that perhaps I've missed.


All I will say is that the post about (peanuts) salaries you've just made about Union wages - makes my point about systemic change - not yours.

 

[Tom]

I know enough Scouse to understand that you pay only lip-service to your ideals, while criticising those who disagree with them.

 

[DaGaffer]

They're still in the top 10% i'd assume..

That's a bloody nice wage, I bet the members of their Unions wish they got that much.

Yeah but put those wages in context; the average FTSE top 350 CEO in the UK gets about £450K basic and a bucketload of bonuses, shares and expenses, taking the average up to about £1.2M. That's what I call a high earner. Those union chiefs are paid Head of Department type salaries. (NB. I'm no particular fan of the Unions, but if Tom posted those salaries to show they were highly paid "fat cats" or the like, it didn't have that effect on me).