Politics Scottish Independance?

[Raven]

The man is an absolute bellend but spot on there.

 

[Gwadien]

These are issues that are brewing under the skin ready to explode, the Welsh were the last lot to speak up about it.

This is the thing about the whole campaign - we cannot get to the bottom of the actual reality of what independence in Scotland would mean for a) Scotland and b) the rest of the UK. Nobody knows, it's all "maybe this" or "maybe that" with the negotiations to start *after* the SNP secure a Yes outcome. We're voting blindly, and anyone who speaks up against it is either told they're "scaremongering" or they get shouted down on live TV. The SNP hate opposition and anything deemed to be against their manifesto. George Galloway, love him or hate him, summed it up nicely:


View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAGGxgrR4qo

The white haired womans response is brilliant..

Fool.

 

[old.user4556]

She set herself up to get owned, and got owned.

 

[Wij]

I feel dirty, agreeing with George Galloway

 

[DaGaffer]

I feel dirty, agreeing with George Galloway

It annoying isn't it? Especially as while he's right, his own agenda is being served.

Bottom line though, no "nationalist" party of any stripe should ever be in a position of power; they're discriminatory by definition. Sinn Fein are exactly the same over here, although they hide it a bit better than the SNP.

 

[rynnor]

Bottom line though, no "nationalist" party of any stripe should ever be in a position of power; they're discriminatory by definition. Sinn Fein are exactly the same over here, although they hide it a bit better than the SNP.

Yes - nationalists by their very definition are xenophobic and tend to be a 'movement' rather than a properly democratic party.

In our modern world of outward facing international trade and migration tribal nationalist parties are a throwback.

On the plus side they tend to do best in a recession so if we really are in recovery they may have already peaked.

 

[Job]

Scottish people are most racist people in Europe, they don't even like each other.

 

[throdgrain]

These are issues that are brewing under the skin ready to explode, the Welsh were the last lot to speak up about it.

This is the thing about the whole campaign - we cannot get to the bottom of the actual reality of what independence in Scotland would mean for a) Scotland and b) the rest of the UK. Nobody knows, it's all "maybe this" or "maybe that" with the negotiations to start *after* the SNP secure a Yes outcome. We're voting blindly, and anyone who speaks up against it is either told they're "scaremongering" or they get shouted down on live TV. The SNP hate opposition and anything deemed to be against their manifesto. George Galloway, love him or hate him, summed it up nicely:


View:
View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAGGxgrR4qo
[/quote]

Can't abide George Galloway but on this occasion how can you disagree with him? The SNP are retards, like some of their supporters.

 

[Raven]

I was speaking to a full kilt wearing Scottish mate the other day about independance and he wants it, however he is voting no simply because of all the nationalistic bollocks.

 

[Olgaline]

Summs it up preaty nicely dosent it ?
The Scotts I know, all more or less share that sentiment = Would be nice, but really not all that important, hence would rather stick it to the nationalists.

 

[rynnor]

Summs it up preaty nicely dosent it ?
The Scotts I know, all more or less share that sentiment = Would be nice, but really not all that important, hence would rather stick it to the nationalists.

Its just a leap into the unknown - most people just want small improvements not radical change.

Assuming the people vote no I wonder what the future looks like for Scotland? Devo max or will the Westminster Govt be less likely to grant concessions after the rejection of independance?

 

[DaGaffer]

Its just a leap into the unknown - most people just want small improvements not radical change.

Assuming the people vote no I wonder what the future looks like for Scotland? Devo max or will the Westminster Govt be less likely to grant concessions after the rejection of independance?

Devo max is actually on the ballot isn't it?

 

[Embattle]

To me there is already too much doubling up of functions and they waste just as much money as what they already had in Westminster...I mean look at Holyrood.

 

[Job]

I think the Mash summed it up with the headline..Scotland to experiment with how poor they are.

 

[rynnor]

Devo max is actually on the ballot isn't it?

Nah - they had to make it a straight question about independance.

 

[soze]

I personally want to see how long it takes America to invade Scotland. They can't let them keep nuclear power stations as a rogue nation

 

[old.user4556]

I was speaking to a full kilt wearing Scottish mate the other day about independance and he wants it, however he is voting no simply because of all the nationalistic bollocks.

Summs it up preaty nicely dosent it ?
The Scotts I know, all more or less share that sentiment = Would be nice, but really not all that important, hence would rather stick it to the nationalists.

There seems to be two camps:

1) Those that love Scotland and all the shortbread tin and kilt wearing pomp that comes with it, but aren't blinded by jingoistic xenophobia and can see that Scotland have a pretty fucking sweet deal.
2) Those that want independence regardless of what it means, even if it was for the absolute worse. Those nationalists are hoodwinked by an anti-English / anti-Westminster / anti-Tory / anti-Cameron (delete as appropriate) agenda.

The latter seem to think that Scottish independence is a panacea for all of the UK's woes and I do not believe that to be true. I always challenge my fellow Scots that even if they get independence then the Queen (a.k.a "your fucking Queen, not ours") will still be the head of state. In addition, if we have a currency union and keep the pound, then Scotland's interest rates will still be decided by Westminster. Even a deaf, blind retard can see that's not independence. Furthermore, if we didn't have a currency union and ended up joining the Euro, then we're on a fast track to becoming another Greece / Spain / Portugal. For me, independence is a non-starter.

As I said though, none of these things matter in the face of brainwashed England haters.

There are some aspects of independence that do appeal - no nuclear weapons and the ability to downsize armed forces for a start, not to mention the ability to opt out of wars we shouldn't be getting involved in.

 

[rynnor]

Grangemouth looks set to close tbh - perhaps the Scottish Govt should Nationalise it?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-24618760

It's actually an example of where Scottish and English interests run together since the site supplies a lot of Northern England.

 

[old.user4556]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand it's closed.

 

[Raven]

Sounds like the unions thought they owned the place and the owners said fuck you. Pretty sure there is far more to it than that though.

 

[Wij]

American shale oil pricing it out of the market.

 

[old.user4556]

Yep, too expensive to run it.

It's a real kick in the pro-independence testicles in my opinion. When the chips were down, when it really mattered, the SNP were strangely quiet given that the refinery that serves the North Sea oil fields is under serious threat.

Are you listening Fat Alex? I don't want my petrol-on-tap and super fast unicorn to be jeopardised.

 

[Gwadien]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-24647843
So wait, what's going on here is;

Union wanted something changing, Company said no, Union persisted, Company shuts down Grangemouth, Union gives up and agrees?

 

[Hawkwind]

From I read, Union refused contract changes and also changes to the employee pension schemes. Might be a final salary pension that the owners are trying to change. Not enough details in the article. If it is a case of econimics of profitability if the contracts are not changed fair enough. But, if this is a case of the company wanted more profit and screwing the employees then fuck em.

 

[soze]

Company wanted to freeze wages and take away the last working year pension. Union said no way. Company said fine we are not going to run at a loss you are all redundant. Union is now ready to talk.

 

[Gwadien]

So this is the Scottish Governments first challenge really?

 

[old.user4556]

So this is the Scottish Governments first challenge really?

Yes, and it was a fucking fail.

So much of the SNP's argument hinges on oil, and they couldn't even help avoid an imminent closure of the only refinery (granted, only the petrochemical part - for now...) that services the North Sea. It's as if we were asleep at the wheel.

 

[Gwadien]

Yes, and it was a fucking fail.

So much of the SNP's argument hinges on oil, and they couldn't even help avoid an imminent closure of the only refinery (granted, only the petrochemical part - for now...) that services the North Sea. It's as if we were asleep at the wheel.

I suppose if you're anti-Independance, then it's sort of a good thing.

Could say martyrdom.

 

[old.user4556]

I suppose if you're anti-Independance, then it's sort of a good thing.

Could say martyrdom.

The nationalists were spraying complete bullshit on Twitter yesterday - they bypassed the fact that we have our own government and parliament and directly accused Cameron and Westminster for failing to act. There were also suggestions that this wouldn't have happened in an independence Scotland.

Probably some of the most inaccurate fallacies I've ever read.

 

[DaGaffer]

The nationalists were spraying complete bullshit on Twitter yesterday - they bypassed the fact that we have our own government and parliament and directly accused Cameron and Westminster for failing to act. There were also suggestions that this wouldn't have happened in an independence Scotland.

Probably some of the most inaccurate fallacies I've ever read.

Wow. Just...wow. Because an independent Socialist Republik of Scotland is going to be sooo business-friendly. What's the betting that if England Scotland does get independence, Westminster will still be the subject of complaints about dark plots to undermine Scotland. Without the Auld Enemy these fucktards won't know what to do with themselves.