Opera cancelled in anticipation of islam reactions

[tris-]

you can´t simply sell it as art...4 chopped off heads of religious figures - c´mon dude, this is weird and very insulting.

unless wikipedia is lieing to me, this opera was finished/performed first in 1781.

and unless mozart has some undocumented hatred towards islam and muslims, im pretty sure it WAS done for art.

does the fact that it is 4 heads (not just the head of the oh so mighty and fantastic allah) not tell you he is not directly showing hate to one group of people? that is, ofc, if its to even show hatred at all.

could you imagine the buddhists making a fuss over this? no, exactly.

Edit - i would also like to add something that has been bugging me latley. to any religious people here, answer me this -

for your day to life is it easier to a)forget what people think of you (because really, it doesnt matter) or b)be offended, waste energy moaning and cause your self health problems from the stress it causes.

why do you care so fucking much about peoples oppinions on your beliefs? we have to listen day in day out to bloudy christians preaching their shit at us non believers but i dont go burn a church down because it offends my moral beliefs. i believe its fine to spill my seed on the ground or even in some sluts face, but you will tell me thats wrong. and that is offensive to my moral beliefs, correct?

 

[Eeben]

why, who or what is competely irrelevant
What is relevant is you are censoring one thing because it offends one set of people, but not censoring the other because even tho it offends another set.
The content were talking about has no relevance to the argument, how can it be fair if double standards are being implemented,, the answer is it quite simply cant

because its 2 differnt things.. Its like saying it okay sending pr0n 8 in the morning on a channel for kids ..

 

[Mojo]

no, religion is the basis for many people´s life. in my opinion there is a fine line between art, trying desperatly to get attention and simply insult people in one way or another. i got a problem when people make jokes about my christian believe cause that is what i believe in. if people don´t believe...fine for them, but they should not start to insult other people´s opinion and attitude.

you can´t simply sell it as art...4 chopped off heads of religious figures - c´mon dude, this is weird and very insulting.

So wierd people make a joke about your belifs in an Opera, one could argue that a good christian would be of strong enough in character and faith not to be offended. But they are, just like Muslims and Jews you say anything and they start QQ'ing.

What a bunch of pussies!

 

[old.Tohtori]

um.. yes?
why?

Oh no reaon, purely interested

'cause you seem so...brittish and all i was just curious.

 

[Chronictank]

unless wikipedia is lieing to me, this opera was finished/performed first in 1781.

and unless mozart has some undocumented hatred towards islam and muslims, im pretty sure it WAS done for art.

does the fact that it is 4 heads (not just the head of the oh so mighty and fantastic allah) not tell you he is not directly showing hate to one group of people? that is, ofc, if its to even show hatred at all.

So how is it Muslim's fault that they were singled out by the producers of the show? The media have portrayed them in a particular light thats why and the posts in this thread alone should more then reinforce how much people are slaves to the media

Edit - i would also like to add something that has been bugging me latley. to any religious people here, answer me this -

for your day to life is it easier to a)forget what people think of you (because really, it doesnt matter) or b)be offended, waste energy moaning and cause your self health problems from the stress it causes.

why do you care so fucking much about peoples oppinions on your beliefs? we have to listen day in day out to bloudy christians preaching their shit at us non believers but i dont go burn a church down because it offends my moral beliefs.

If someone took a picture of you and claimed you were a paedophile as a "joke", and put it in every major paper would you not be offended ?
If you report that person it is possible to get a court order to silence them if they say it in public like the dude with the loudspeaker,
Edit: and the preacher with a hook on one hand got deported for saying his opinions.

because its 2 differnt things.. Its like saying it okay sending pr0n 8 in the morning on a channel for kids ..

Thats actually a different issue, some channels do have porn at 8 in the morning such as subscription channels showing you can do it. Most people dont do it out of descency which people who come up with things to purposfully offend x group obviously lack. Doesnt change the fact that they can show it if they so wish

 

[Eeben]

If someone took a picture of you and claimed you were a paedophile as a "joke", and put it in every major paper would you not be offended ?

So saying some made up person are paedophile is the same as saying a real person is?

i still belive if muslims starting to act more civilised there would not be so many jokes an shit about them..

 

[old.Tohtori]

could you imagine the buddhists making a fuss over this? no, exactly.

Editfor your day to life is it easier to a)forget what people think of you (because really, it doesnt matter) or b)be offended, waste energy moaning and cause your self health problems from the stress it causes.

Actually buddhists wouldn't 'cause they don't have a god of any sort So there's reslly nothing to impale onstage.

About your question, i personally live by my beliefs that include the lovely phrase: I don't care what others do or say as long as they leave me alone.

 

[fettoken]

Its about time we stopped tip-toeing around these over-sensitive, bomb-making terrorists, their sympathisers, and jihad proclaimers. Fuck political correctness. Come anywhere near me with that bollocks, and I'll move you closer to your maker. We ain't gonna put Shariah law in force. If you don't like the country, bugger off.

/end of rant

YEAH, thats right!!!!! *Picks up his ak47 and waves it in the air*

 

[Chronictank]

So saying some made up person are paedophile is the same as saying a real person is?

i have no idea what you are getting at here :<
Muhammed isnt made up, neither is Jesus : s

i still belive if muslims starting to act more civilised there would not be so many jokes an shit about them..

You mean like the millions of muslims around the world who you dont read about in the papers?

 

[Zaffa]

hmm i found this old article.. hmm
Every group of people got there own loonies, but you shoundnt jugde the whole group by these extremists, that would be like saying all americans are as crazy as george bush, maybe ½ of them are, since they voted for him, but not all of them. This one is a pretty fucked american though.
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/1016-01.htm

 

[Eeben]

i have no idea what you are getting at here :<
Muhammed isnt made up, neither is Jesus : s

my bad was thinking about alah ..

 

[Mojo]

Muhammed isnt made up, neither is Jesus : s

Edit /so they were just 2 stoners having a really weird trip, seeing shit n stuff?

 

[Eeben]

I still think the world would be a better place with out religion

 

[tris-]

If someone took a picture of you and claimed you were a paedophile as a "joke", and put it in every major paper would you not be offended ?

come on dude thats a totally different thing lol. having someone tell the whole nation that you are a peadophile would endanger you and your families life.

if someone put a picture and said "tris is a **** and wanks 200 times a day" i couldnt care less.

my question was to the religious people here only and i am interested to hear the answers.

Edit /so they were just 2 stoners having a really weird trip, seeing shit n stuff?

some ceremonial oil from the ye old jesus days was made with oil extracted from cannabis. so it wouldnt suprise me in the slighest if that is what really happend.

So how is it Muslim's fault that they were singled out by the producers of the show? The media have portrayed them in a particular light thats why and the posts in this thread alone should more then reinforce how much people are slaves to the media

i cant see how they were singled out. maybe you read what i said wrong, but i didnt say thats what id thought either

muslims are singling them selves out by making a big fus everytime someone shouts "allah sucked donkey penis for figs".

 

[Mojo]

I still think the world would be a better place with out religion

Then who would i have to point an laugh at?

 

[Collateral]

Yes, you can. That´s a fundamental (no pun intended) part of our society. I can express my opinion that - for example - I think GW Bush is an idiot. Or that Jesus was a whiny muppet. Or that Linux is better than Windows.
It´s everybodys right to do that. You may not like it, but nobody is forcing you to listen to it. Just like nobody is forcing me to listen to the "you all go to hell if you don´t do this or that" crap they´re trying to tell me in the church.
I agree, that there is a point somewhere, where stating an opinion slowly morphs into just dissing the other side and the sole purpose of the argument is to insult. But please... for ..um.. may I say Gods? better now.. so for fooks sake, four chopped off heads in a theater.. what the heck? If you´re THAT easily offended, then you´re not an inch better than the muppets who started burning flags because some artist made a cartoon of their religious leader. Ridiculous.

P.S. Since you´ve got the chucknorrisfacts.com link in your sig.. did you ever think about that all this ridiculing of Chuck Norris might be insulting for Chuck Norris? Or hurting his feelings? No? hm....

my goodness...how old are you btw? Oo

you want to compare a religion to chuck norris? have you actually been on the website? you get GW Bush into this discussion about religion? do you actually know what religion is?
me as a christian not better then those guys burning flags on the streets?

this whole post is pure immaturity. people like you are a good example for the culture clash problem, because you don´t give a shit about anything. no sensitivity at all....with the result, why muslims start to freak out worldwide.

@mojo
just by putting the muslim believe and christianity on one level, you showed, you got no clue at all. you find jokes about christianity everywhere. people actually got used to it (as sad as it sounds) and the nature of this religion prohibits to "burn flags" or start to blow up stuff. same for budhism..
the muslims are different though, and i think noone of you ever dares to tell this crap you are posting here right into his face....or ever visit an arab country cause the west fucked it up.

@ tris
trying to compare your moral believe with religion? kkthxbye


getting to complicated and to time consuming for me to discuss these matters. just by reading the reactions, the use of vocab and the insight in this topic....just not worth it.

 

[tris-]

@ tris
trying to compare your moral believe with religion? kkthxbye

thats cool. but maybe instead of making things up in your head that you think i wrote, how about actually reading it?

i swear, when you read things that are really there, it all makes a whole lot more sense.

just for you i will even write it again and make it directed at just you instead of making it so damn broad as i did last time -

as a christian is it easier to a)forget what people think about you and your religion (in the end, it doesnt matter shit what anyone thinks of you in that way) or b) moan, whine and get stressed that someone disagreed/said your religion is just a big ol pile of sillyness.

getting to complicated and to time consuming for me to discuss these matters. just by reading the reactions, the use of vocab and the insight in this topic....just not worth it.

ah here we go. slag off peoples written english skills instead of discussing the matters at hand. well done.

so is it ok for me to say that its plain stupid for you to believe in an imaginary icon? considering you want to take this thing down the path of slagging people off.

oh wait no, because you cant bad mouth religion. let me go sit in a dark room and say 10,000 hail marys so you will forgive me.

 

[Chronictank]

and the nature of this religion prohibits to "burn flags" or start to blow up stuff. same for budhism..

Its the same for islam, but that actually shows how much you actually know about other faiths.
You are no better than he is, posting for the sake of posting without any contribution whatsoever

Edit: oops rest of my reply seems to of gone, will retype later.
Lunch time <o/

 

[Mojo]

.
@mojo
just by putting the muslim believe and christianity on one level, you showed, you got no clue at all. you find jokes about christianity everywhere. people actually got used to it (as sad as it sounds) and the nature of this religion prohibits to "burn flags" or start to blow up stuff. same for budhism..
the muslims are different though, and i think noone of you ever dares to tell this crap you are posting here right into his face....or ever visit an arab country cause the west fucked it up.

Why wouldn't i put them on one level? they are all a joke and no Gods exist, wtf do u expect someone who doesn't beleive in religion to say? oh that's right, you expect some who deosn't beleive in gods or relegion to go study books written by all the various demented delusional people in the world to get a better understading of how their delusions differ?

Been to 4 Muslim countries (they exist outside the middle east u know) and yes I do tell my crap to the faces of theose who I speak about.

Excuse me while I wet myself!

 

[Mojo]

Getting to complicated and to time consuming for me to discuss these matters. just by reading the reactions, the use of vocab and the insight in this topic....just not worth it.

Say your peice and run away eh.........come back ya wimp!!!

 

[Thorwyn]

you want to compare a religion to chuck norris? have you actually been on the website? you get GW Bush into this discussion about religion? do you actually know what religion is?

Are you thick?

I`m trying to demonstrate the effects of democracy and freedom of speech to you. I´m allowed to say "bush sucks" as much as I´m allowed to say "your religion sucks". That´s the same thing, regardless what it is... be it politics, religion or your whatever. Religion is not a no-go area. That´s my point and if you´re unable to comprehend this, then you got a serious problem.

Same with the Chuck Norris jokes. YOU are the one who´s constantly babbling about how this opera might have hurt the feelings of religious people and what not... yet you don´t seem to have a problem with making fun of this guy, which might be just as insulting for him as the religious jokes of some people. You´re a prime example for hipocrisy, expecting people to respect you and your ideals, but not even remotely showing the same respect to others.

 

[Collateral]

as i said...not the slightest sensitivity.
well, do what you want is best. no mature discussion possible (wtf, it´s a gaming forum).
Just remember what you said, concerning making fun about religions and your "i don´t give a shit about religion" attitude, when the next underground station blows up or some freaks decides to fly a plane into a tower.

just think for a minute...

 

[old.Tohtori]

which might be just as insulting for him as the religious jokes of some people.

Actually MORE so since it's personal, direct and not aimed at a larger group of people.

Religion jokes can be opposed by millions, but there's only one chuck norris.

EDIT:

Oh by the by...why do us other religion believers/practisers have to suffer the consequences of this Islam vs Christians war? Don't the islamic care for others, innocent bystanders who don't believe one way or the other about it? Don't the christians love their "fellow man" no matter what the religion?

Why do the buddhists, vikings, hindu etc have to pay the price too?

 

[tris-]

as i said...not the slightest sensitivity.
well, do what you want is best. no mature discussion possible (wtf, it´s a gaming forum).
Just remember what you said, concerning making fun about religions and your "i don´t give a shit about religion" attitude, when the next underground station blows up or some freaks decides to fly a plane into a tower.

just think for a minute...

you really have got a skill in making things up in your mind and thinking they are real. why the hell have you even said the above thing when it has no relevance to anything here. no mature discussion? i think it is. but the problem here is you are either too lazy/stupid/cant make a counter argument/all of them to even bother discussing it propley.

why the hell should i be sensitive towards your choice to believe in an imaginary being and live your life according to a set of rules that are 2000 years old. YOU MADE THE CHOICE TO BELIEVE THIS. if you make a choice, i can mock it all i want.

could you please just stop posting here in this thread? it was all going fine untill you started posting things you just made up and claimed other people said.

 

[Gorbachioo]

as i said...not the slightest sensitivity.
well, do what you want is best. no mature discussion possible (wtf, it´s a gaming forum).
Just remember what you said, concerning making fun about religions and your "i don´t give a shit about religion" attitude, when the next underground station blows up or some freaks decides to fly a plane into a tower.

just think for a minute...

I think you're dumb.



And not only because you believe in god...

 

[Collateral]

why the hell should i be sensitive towards your choice to believe in an imaginary being and live your life according to a set of rules that are 2000 years old. YOU MADE THE CHOICE TO BELIEVE THIS. if you make a choice, i can mock it all i want.

could you please just stop posting here in this thread? it was all going fine untill you started posting things you just made up and claimed other people said.

it is your thing, what you believe. i just understand why they stopped showing the performance in berlin. this opera doesn´t contribute to the current discussion about muslimsin germany. i think we all agree that there is a tense relationship between the west and muslims and almost every country in the western world. in germany, it is a quite big one...and a chopped off head of a muslim figure in a theatre does not help at all. there haven´t been any major muslim terrorist attacks in germany, unlike many other countries...and in germany people have a certain sensitivity to keep it that way...also because of our history.

you don´t feel offended?...fine. but other people do. so, it is right to not going public with those kind of art. many other things are prohibited. why not to make fun of religion?

 

[tris-]

and still, you havent answerd my question why does it matter what others think about religion?

i think christianity is a load of shit. jesus was a stoner and god was the schizophrenic by product of all the people who contributed to the bible.

do you really care i think that?

 

[Collateral]

i really don´t care, what you think or others think. but telling the public what you think, like this: christianity is a load of shit....this is insulting.

are you that retarded not to understand this??

 

[Darzil]

From theglobeandmail.com :

"After its premiere in 2003, the production by Hans Neuenfels drew widespread criticism over a scene in which King Idomeneo presents the severed heads not only of the Greek god of the sea, Poseidon, but also of Mohammed, Jesus and Buddha.

The disputed scene is not part of Mozart's original staging of the 225-year-old opera, but was an addition of Mr. Neuenfels's production, which was last performed by the company in March, 2004."

Sounds to me like the director just wanted to court controversy to get more people talking about it and going. Unfortunately the risk hasn't paid off. Why else would he add three religious figures into a play that has naff all to do with them.

Darzil

 

[tris-]

i really don´t care, what you think or others think. but telling the public what you think, like this: christianity is a load of shit....this is insulting.

are you that retarded not to understand this??

not being able to understand it and being retarded is two different things.

firstly, no i dont understand why it is insulting. people choose to believe what they believe, therfore they should be able to accept not everyone will agree. making a personal choice comes with people disagreeing with that choice. dont you understand that? if i choose to believe that i have a man who lives under my bed and he telepathically puts thoughts into my mind, people would find that absurd. and i would be locked up for showing signs of schizophrenia. yet people can claim to have had messages sent to them by god, messages and thoughts they didnt think up but were instantly supplied to them. but fuck me they are allowed to walk around in public. why dont you explain to me why its insulting that i think god is made up and a load of shit?

if you could put your brain into gear for a moment youd realise religion was probably the main way to control people, both physically and financially. it was also used to explain things that happend when there was no rational explanation for things like we have today (science, for example. is a rational way to explain things. fish being magically created and given to people and that event being explained by a god is not rational.)

secondly, being retarded would imply i have some kind of mental retardation. if that was the case, i probably wouldnt have the train of thought to ask this question.

even through this so called mental retardness i obviously seem to suffer i can have a full discussion and even use something else to help that. for example, lets go back to the ancient egyptians. they had multiple gods. they used gods to explain things that happend. like the sun rising for example. yet they also used religious practices to make money. everyone had the right to mumification, but if you were poor it wasnt done fully. if you were rich you could get the full treatment. what does this control over people and their money remind you of? clue: name one religion still practiced today....