Werewolf WW2 Theme Game 3.0

[Calaen]

Sydrik Rubric, he done some dodgy things yesterday. Awfully quiet today too.

They could have spoken about this last night coming up with some story about how they're this and that. Ch3t would be the one to tell Opticle about it, him being fresh doesn't really count. I think we should off them both, one of them is going to be bad and making these stories up.

vote: Opticle

Agree, I believe we'll get a hit on atleast one of them. And that for me is good odds!

 

[itcheh]

After another perilous night I hoped for some clarity this morning ... but alas confusion deafens us with ever increasing crescendo

I ask that all good Germans read between the lines and look at the facts.

Here is my reading of the situation:

1. The poisoning and stabbing of Cerb suggests that we have two groups of 'bad people' on the boat
2. There's nothing to suggest that these groups are either individuals or that they have multiple members - so we're looking for (greater than / equal to) 2 people
---
3. If Opti is bad and is lying (or purposely misunderstanding) about Ch3t ... then his ridiculously early revelation is bordering on stupidity.
3a. If Opti is bad ... we lynch Ch3t ... and we are proven wrong, then Opti is dead next
3b. If Opti is good ... then the remaining 'bad' people will surely kill him next (i.e. he's a dead man anyway)
3c. If Opti searched Ch3t's quarters last night then he certainly didn't have time to kill Cerb ... which suggests that having a Gestapo Agent on board is not the threat Ch3t claims it to be.

I do not believe Opti is stupid, I believe he is potentially sacrificing himself to give us a tactical advantage. I believe statistically it would be a ridiculous move for a 'bad guy' to offer himself up so soon - surely they would wait a bit longer until the voting pushed them into a corner or the numbers of good/bad were more even.

Ch3t is certainly very good at spinning a story, a cunning and sage strategy ... you are a credit to your British masters.

I find it even stranger that Calaen is voting for Opti despite him coming forward with this information. As you may have seen from the previous day, this crew seem paralysed and refuse to act - so claiming that Opti could guide the conversation which would surely only lead to further inaction and lead us closer to ruin?

There is only one clear choice

Vote: Ch3tan

 

[old.Tohtori]

Before hopping on the vote-wagon either way, i do have to as/guess what the reprocussions are;

- We kill opti, opti is bad, rejoice and we know that ch3t is probably not evil (or it's a very ballsy move to endanger both like that). Still no idea of accomplish, but new info is new.
- We kill opti, opti is infact a seer type, we get ch3t tomorrow as per info?
- Same with ch3t above, just roles reversed.

In either case, we won't know the accomplish i'm assuming, and we'll get a baddie kill today or tomorrow?

Can we stop a night kill by just blocking one person of the two? I'm thinking not, but not sure. Can't remember what the spy rules of engagement are(cough mod cough).

Because then if we do hang the wrong one, we can block the other anyway.

 

[old.Tohtori]

What i really dislike is opti coming out with this, if he is the seer, because he could've atleast waited if we get a ch3tan bandwagon going anyway. As itcheh said, in his oh so social manner, he's pretty much a dead man now in either case.

 

[Calaen]

After another perilous night I hoped for some clarity this morning ... but alas confusion deafens us with ever increasing crescendo

I ask that all good Germans read between the lines and look at the facts.

Here is my reading of the situation:

1. The poisoning and stabbing of Cerb suggests that we have two groups of 'bad people' on the boat
2. There's nothing to suggest that these groups are either individuals or that they have multiple members - so we're looking for (greater than / equal to) 2 people
---
3. If Opti is bad and is lying (or purposely misunderstanding) about Ch3t ... then his ridiculously early revelation is bordering on stupidity.
3a. If Opti is bad ... we lynch Ch3t ... and we are proven wrong, then Opti is dead next
3b. If Opti is good ... then the remaining 'bad' people will surely kill him next (i.e. he's a dead man anyway)
3c. If Opti searched Ch3t's quarters last night then he certainly didn't have time to kill Cerb ... which suggests that having a Gestapo Agent on board is not the threat Ch3t claims it to be.

I do not believe Opti is stupid, I believe he is potentially sacrificing himself to give us a tactical advantage. I believe statistically it would be a ridiculous move for a 'bad guy' to offer himself up so soon - surely they would wait a bit longer until the voting pushed them into a corner or the numbers of good/bad were more even.

Ch3t is certainly very good at spinning a story, a cunning and sage strategy ... you are a credit to your British masters.

I find it even stranger that Calaen is voting for Opti despite him coming forward with this information. As you may have seen from the previous day, this crew seem paralysed and refuse to act - so claiming that Opti could guide the conversation which would surely only lead to further inaction and lead us closer to ruin?

There is only one clear choice

Vote: Ch3tan

You seem to be completely ignoring the fact that we know we have a doctor and an Psychologist on board our little boat. I believe Opti is doing nothing more than fish for the identity of our real Pyschologist.

Assasins/Spys have their own personal preference with regards to how they kill. it does not mean they are not working together!

I also like how you try and incriminate myself because I voted for Opticle, despite others doing so as well. That gut feeling you have about me is going to get you killed sooner or later! Itcheh is still on my list for potential bad guys!

 

[Calaen]

What i really dislike is opti coming out with this, if he is the seer, because he could've atleast waited if we get a ch3tan bandwagon going anyway. As itcheh said, in his oh so social manner, he's pretty much a dead man now in either case.

Exactly he could have used this knowledge to set a trap as such and then uncover his plan and p a possible link between the person he is accusing and their accomplice!

For someone in such a high position, I expected a far more calm and calculated person!!

 

[itcheh]

If Opti is bad and is lying (or purposely misunderstanding) about Ch3t ... then his ridiculously early revelation is bordering on stupidity.

I do not believe Opti is stupid

 

[old.Tohtori]

HEre's an idea by the way, we could let the bad ones do the work for us.

We don't vote on either opti or ch3t, then either ch3t or opti gets taken out during night(as the bad ones don't have another choice when they have a chance to take out a special) and we can then take out the remaining liar.

There's probably an issue with that that i'm not seeing, but first thoughts and all.

 

[Calaen]

The problem I see with that is that if they are the bad guys they are safe and could potentially get 2 more kills during the night leaving us with the same dilemma tomorrow, untill we kill them both we'll never know.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Yeah true, if they are both bad and this is one of the most devious tactics i've ever seen in warfare, we'd be royally subbed.

 

[old.Tohtori]

I'm at a somewhat pickle though as it's clear we have two choices now;

At one hand i want to believe opti, but the claim of being a gestapo officer when we have a nazi approved psychologist on board is a bit off.
Also itcheh, i have my issues with him as seen before, but i shouldn't let that interfere with voting.
Ch3tan could also have a blanket lie on the whole thing, but he could also be forced to reveal his role for "saving mah butt" purposes.
Opt's reveal wasn't forced at all, so that's a negative for opti.
Both parties take a bit of negative from their previous arguments, which could be seen as a cahoots thing.

I'll wait and see whaat Rubric replies, and on other people, then make my choice. I just don't want to rush this as in either case, we're killing either a good special, or a baddie.

 

[Calaen]

How is it bordering on stupid?, the numbers work out fairly decent for the spies if we carry out opticles desires to kill Ch3t.

Unless someone comes out and contradicts what Opticle says i'm leaning towards the finger pointer first.

 

[old.Tohtori]

I didn't say anything was stupid

Could you iterate which part you mean? As it seems if either one is evil, they both win if we believe them. If both are evil, it also works, but only if the real seer comes out(otherwise it IS stupid to focus so much attention on both with no real gain).

 

[Calaen]

I'm at a somewhat pickle though as it's clear we have two choices now;

At one hand i want to believe opti, but the claim of being a gestapo officer when we have a nazi approved psychologist on board is a bit off.
Also itcheh, i have my issues with him as seen before, but i shouldn't let that interfere with voting.
Ch3tan could also have a blanket lie on the whole thing, but he could also be forced to reveal his role for "saving mah butt" purposes.
Opt's reveal wasn't forced at all, so that's a negative for opti.
Both parties take a bit of negative from their previous arguments, which could be seen as a cahoots thing.

I'll wait and see whaat Rubric replies, and on other people, then make my choice. I just don't want to rush this as in either case, we're killing either a good special, or a baddie.

Yes it is very tricky indeed.

 

[Calaen]

I didn't say anything was stupid

Could you iterate which part you mean? As it seems if either one is evil, they both win if we believe them. If both are evil, it also works, but only if the real seer comes out(otherwise it IS stupid to focus so much attention on both with no real gain).

Sorry I thought I had quoted Itcheh's comments when he simply quote himself.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Ah ok, nevermind

 

[old.Tohtori]

And yes it looks suspicious that me and calaen are agreeing on almost everything, but we're the only ones who are seemingly up at this ungodly hour

 

[Calaen]

Why of course the ones that talk are always the dangerous ones!!!

 

[Uara]

Okaaaaaaay. It seems like there has been some serious revelations occuring whilst i've been busy doing some submarine work.
Now Opticle as others have said has put himself in a rather dangerous situation if he is the gestapo officer on board this sub as he is now target number one for the evil that we are up against. If he's not its a damn ballsy move and one done incredibly quickly on only the second day. It just means all attention is drawn to him following the events of the day with the possibility of leading to him being executed which im sure is not what they want so early on.

I'm not sure if its been raised...but what if they're both telling the truth. Ch3t is indeed a returning german spy and Opti is a gestapo officer. I know that means there can't be many normal crew members left but it is still a possibility no? We are assuming the psych has the ability to find out who is a spy amongst us but what if thats not exactly their role in this macabre situation we're in.

Rubric's sudden return to sanity is slightly suspicious to me. Rant and raving yesterday and suddenly coming out with arguments this morning. Maybe the doctor or psychologist has been to see him or maybe when he saw some suspicions being raised towards him he realised he needs to try and dig himself out of a hole.

 

[old.Tohtori]

They could both be telling the truth, that is true. Weird, but true.

Thing about Rubric that bothered me is that he wanted, after the revelations, us to vote for people who voted for opti or ch3t. Still haven't heard an answer on why.

 

[opticle]

Here is my reading of the situation:

1. The poisoning and stabbing of Cerb suggests that we have two groups of 'bad people' on the boat
2. There's nothing to suggest that these groups are either individuals or that they have multiple members - so we're looking for (greater than / equal to) 2 people
---
3. If Opti is bad and is lying (or purposely misunderstanding) about Ch3t ... then his ridiculously early revelation is bordering on stupidity.
3a. If Opti is bad ... we lynch Ch3t ... and we are proven wrong, then Opti is dead next
3b. If Opti is good ... then the remaining 'bad' people will surely kill him next (i.e. he's a dead man anyway)
3c. If Opti searched Ch3t's quarters last night then he certainly didn't have time to kill Cerb ... which suggests that having a Gestapo Agent on board is not the threat Ch3t claims it to be.

I do not believe Opti is stupid, I believe he is potentially sacrificing himself to give us a tactical advantage. I believe statistically it would be a ridiculous move for a 'bad guy' to offer himself up so soon - surely they would wait a bit longer until the voting pushed them into a corner or the numbers of good/bad were more even.

Ch3t is certainly very good at spinning a story, a cunning and sage strategy ... you are a credit to your British masters.

Vote: Ch3tan

Pretty much what Itcheh said.

As I understand my role, unless there is a lot more going on here than I am aware of (and there are 2 good guys that are neither psychologist nor doctor ??), I am not wrong. Ch3tan IS a spy.

He is making a backstory story claim, rather than accusing me of being a traitor, which increases my suspicion (what are the chances of me hitting the mystery good character?) whilst it also contributes to confusion for us all. If I am telling the truth and he is bad, however, his claim is likely to be much more successful and buy him more time than "No I'm not a traitor, you are!". If I'm honest, I didn't anticipate him being that devious, but looking back I'm not surprised.

The fact that he is supporting the facts that I have revealed with a believable back-story surely demonstrates that there must be at least some truth to what I say ?? Now, he is either telling the truth - we are both good - or he is a traitor and he is making a last-ditch gamble to confuse us some more, which has definitely worked. Or I suppose I could be a special bad character of some sort to get the information I have that he agrees with - but as people have pointed out many times, if I am one of the two/three enemies, this is an unbelievably stupid move this early on in the game - particularly when I know how hard it will be given the accusations yesterday. As I understand it doing this when numbers are lower would work much better, doing it on Day 2 is surely f***ing retarded ?? Why not just kill everyone off over the next few days one by one ? That makes so much more sense than this. I think ?

I don't believe we're both secret "good" characters - if we're both good and you kill one of us, then the other is surely dead as a result of an innocent death and everything is screwed. That's too complicated for me.

Why did I reveal immediately ?
1) Because from watching the last day alone, I think people appear to listen Ch3t and are much more likely to do what he says without necessarily having a lot to back it up other than a lot of bluster and aggressive wordplay.
2) I think there's much more chance a vote would be on someone else today and turning votes on to him would be very difficult, then we'd be at a greater disadvantage the following day.
3) I wanted to get this information out ASAP because I think it's a significant advantage for us all this early on and before there's a chance I die overnight or get a vote on me - because that looked very possible and I think there's no chance anyone would believe me at that stage if I were "forced".
4) I was going to wait until later in the day (cough Weds), but when I saw what had happened in the morning, I thought I had a pretty good gamble to make and decided nothing would really change between now and then - other than more of the same random gabbling that you can't believe one way or another - and there'd be less time to make a decision.

As Itcheh said, I am risking sacrificing myself as I see getting a positive hit on such an influential character this early on in the game as a huge advantage for our mission. You don't have to believe me, that was a risk I knew I was taking, but I've always been one to take risks and I figured it was worth it. Besides, it makes life more exciting

I think I am right - I believe the information I was told when I took on this mission and that I am not wrong, Ch3tan is a traitor. We kill him, then we can track down the others and we surely can't lose.

Please think about my motives, if I'm bad then I'm retarded. If I'm good, then I might be a bit retarded when it comes to self-preservation, but with the information I have about how this mission is supposed to unfold and how I understand it, I think by taking this chance I give the best chance for good-guy success in the end, whatever the outcome.

Edit: If we are both good, I'm pretty sure the bad guys would have jumped at the chance to push for a kill on either of us by now ? Because they have nothing to lose and everything to gain ? But I don't think they have really done that

Whatever the outcome, I think you could probably learn a fair amount from people's reactions here in retrospect.

 

[Sydrik]

Cripes sailors a lot seems to have occurred whilst I was below deck working (read as working away IRL) I'll have to peruse the ships log and see what I can make of these conversations. Its bloody lucky we write everything down....although a bit odd....

 

[Nate]

I fear the day we run out of pencils.

 

[Ch3tan]

As I understand my role, unless there is a lot more going on here than I am aware of (and there are 2 good guys that are neither psychologist nor doctor ??), I am not wrong. Ch3tan IS a spy.

The fact that he is supporting the facts that I have revealed with a believable back-story surely demonstrates that there must be at least some truth to what I say ?? Now, he is either telling the truth - we are both good - or he is a traitor and he is making a last-ditch gamble to confuse us some more, which has definitely worked. Or I suppose I could be a special bad character of some sort to get the information I have that he agrees with - but as people have pointed out many times, if I am one of the two/three enemies, this is an unbelievably stupid move this early on in the game - particularly when I know how hard it will be given the accusations yesterday. As I understand it doing this when numbers are lower would work much better, doing it on Day 2 is surely f***ing retarded ?? Why not just kill everyone off over the next few days one by one ? That makes so much more sense than this. I think ?

I haven't supported the facts about any role you claim yet, other than you forcing my hand. Cerb nearly did it on day 1, but he accepted that I was just story telling when I said there were 2 English spies. I haven't said you've got a good role, nor have I said it's bad. What I have hinted at is that I don't believe a Gestapo officer who interrogates the truth will always get the truth. I also fully believe we have another seer on board, so I am very dubious about your role.

You can believe what you want, you kill me and you'll still have two spies to worry about and you'll have to wonder about what the Gestapo will turn up next.

The very annoying thing right now is that I cannot really speak my mind on anyone else for fear of a reprisal vote. I'd vote Opti, but that would just be petty.

 

[Olgaline]

Ch3tan: 2 votes
Opticle: 2 votes

6 for majority
10 alive
6 undecided

 

[Rubric]

I believe they are both telling the truth. And that gives me hope that we will get through this. However if one of them is lying I reckon it would be ch3tan. Calean then falls into my line of suspicion for how he has voted today.

I am happy to go with the majority, but we seem to be split at the moment which means we do not know who to trust, that could ve because we should trust both of them.

If they are both innocent if people voted for them on day one there would be a good chance that atleast one of those people is guilty?

My clarity comes from now seeing some light at the end of the tunnel.

For now vote calean

 

[Ch3tan]

Hmm... not to split the vote, but I'm going

vote rubric

Nothing but bullshit on day 1, then on day 2 he panders to both me and opti, straight away and comes out with this

Opticle sir, please accept my apologies for ny aggression towards you yesterday. Am I the only humble sailor here. Wtf. If I believe all what's has been said, we have two bad guys and two good guys. Both stories sound believable so I guess a good place to start would be voting for someone who voted for either opti or chet. but arsenic and a knife, is there a third person here with their own agenda.

I feel a bit safer knowing there are two people looking out for our interests.

So you are accepting both our stories on face value and then trying to shift the blame to another? Dodgy behaviour in my eyes.

 

[opticle]

I was sent by the Furher to infiltrate m16, I'm on my way back to the fatherland via the only route available to me. I know there are two m16 agents on board and I can intercept all of their comms and choose whether to interfere or allow them to continue, I can only interfere once by changing the message that is communicated between them. My mission is to return with the encryption codes I have stolen from m16 and return them to Germany.

I don't really understand your role nor how exactly you can interfere with the enemy's communications seeing as they communicate directly? (don't they ?). If you were telling the truth, I would have been made aware of you by my superiors in the Gestapo who sent me here.. Who sent you ??

Edit: And if you were good, haven't you shafted yourself now by revealing your special role when you didn't have to ?? Why would you do that ?

 

[Ch3tan]

that looks really bad after Rubric's thoughts, but I was writing it as he posted. Looks like a revenge vote for the cal vote, but I hadn't seen that when I posted.

 

[Nate]

If you're the third spy Ch3t, does that mean you poisoned or backstabbed Cerb?