News US School massacre

[sayward]

really? why? (I ask because I personally can not conceive of a reason for which I would want to own a gun)

I grew up in the country in the back of beyond. Everyone had a shotgun or something, they probably still do, even my grandparents. I just wouldn't find it anything out if the ordinary to have one in the house. I also spend a lot of time on my own and would like to have one.

 

[Aoami]

Strike up an arms agreement with an interested 3rd party like has always been the case?

 

[Tuthmes]

Trouble is Tuthmes, you're such a fucking anti-gun zealot that you can't even comprehend the fact that there are in the United States millions of perfectly law abiding gun owners who just enjoy owning / shooting guns and have a desire to protect thier homes into the bargain. Hell there are even hundreds of thousands of them in our little island. You really need to get a perspective on this.

Most of the shooters I know are very very conservative folk, who have been shooting for decades. And no doubt that suits your "leave it to the pros " stance. But how about if someone wants to take up shooting? By your theory we have no chance of doing so. You need to get this into perspective a bit, and stop foaming at the mouth.

A good friend of mine is an officer (major I think, could be even higher by now) in the US airforce and has bin for over 15 years. Gun manic aswell. Could show you pictures, but I will not. Let's just say his safe holds a big enough arsenal for a platoon (no kidding). He enjoys owning / shooting guns aswell. I dont, but we're still good friends (over 30 years and counting).

Like I said. It's fine if you like shooting, but you don't get to take your guns with you to your house (if I hade a say in it). Hunting is fine, but you need someone with a brain and skills (with you). Leaving animals half dead is bullshit. Tracking is a skill aswell. Shooting squirrels with a bazooka isnt a sport, nor needed. Etc, etc. If your society needs to hunt to get their "basic" food, something is wrong with your society and its not the gun law.

Now we can come with arguments and counter arguments and play a semantic game where we both take far end of the spectrum and keep using those examples in our arguments. (I hope this makes sense) Let's not. You call me a fucking anti-gun zealot and that I can't even comprehend some fact. I do comprehend the fact that people like shooting (in what ever way). I am (a fucking) anti-gun (zealot), there's doubt about that. Now it's time for you to comprehend that there's something wrong in the USA aswell. Examples have bin given and will be provided by the America society over and over again.

Also where do you get I am foaming at the mouth? If I would, I would use words like, fucking and zealot.

 

[mr.Blacky]

"Please sir, can I have some guns to shoot at you with?"

Stop watching Oliver Twist!

Guns have a role in society but they need to be treated special as they can kill. Nowadays no one would care if someone has a longbow in their home but if you could ask someone pre-gun era they would say the same as a gun owner would say now. It is to kill the enemy and to hunt.

 

[Scouse]

Stop watching Oliver Twist!

Glad you got it

Guns have a role in society but they need to be treated special as they can kill.

Yep. They should be in a locked metal cabinet securely attached to a wall, preferably out of sight. Ammo to be stored securely elsewhere in the home. Just like in the UK.

No problem with that.

 

[Ormorof]

Glad you got it



Yep. They should be in a locked metal cabinet securely attached to a wall, preferably out of sight. Ammo to be stored securely elsewhere in the home. Just like in the UK.

No problem with that.

Agree, seems to be no hoopla in media at all about the fact the guns were not secure in his parents house, same thing with the case earlier in the year where the one 8 year old shot and killed the other, lots of screaming about the terrible influence of TV and video games not so much about the fact the dad had left a loaded gun on a table in front of two kids and then wandered off leaving them alone with it

 

[DaGaffer]

Yep. They should be in a locked metal cabinet securely attached to a wall, preferably out of sight. Ammo to be stored securely elsewhere in the home. Just like in the UK.

No problem with that.

But enforcing that level of security is impossible in the US because of the lack of gun control rules. Saw an article in the paper today about a teenager who's been picked up for - being a nutcase basically, but the scary thing in the report was this:

the student’s parents told school officials the student may have access to weapons

. So the parents know he has access to weapons but can't stop him getting them? That sums up the problem right there; that shit shouldn't even be possible.

 

[throdgrain]

http://www.examiner.com/article/two-shot-at-texas-movie-theater-during-showing-of-the-hobbit

 

[Tuthmes]

I like your signature though throddy. It suits you. Will discuss this with my home psychologist tommorow. As I always fear my "gun" goes off premature and I leave people unsatisfied. Hope you'll think about his remark a little more aswell and what he ment by it.

 

[throdgrain]

Not bitter then

 

[TdC]

I grew up in the country in the back of beyond. Everyone had a shotgun or something, they probably still do, even my grandparents. I just wouldn't find it anything out if the ordinary to have one in the house. I also spend a lot of time on my own and would like to have one.

what did they use their guns for?
what would you use your gun for?

 

[DaGaffer]

http://www.examiner.com/article/two-shot-at-texas-movie-theater-during-showing-of-the-hobbit

Aaaand...your point is?

 

[Poag]

Aaaand...your point is?

USA is mental.

 

[Tuthmes]

Not bitter then

No, why would I be? I respect your opinion even though i find it dumb. Such is the way of teh FH.

 

[rynnor]

Aaaand...your point is?

Armed guard averted a massacre.

 

[dysfunction]

So his point is that you need more armed police....in the U.S.

 

[caLLous]

Jeeeesus, the CEO of the NRA is a fucking loon.

 

[Tuthmes]

Armed guard averted a massacre.

A massacre that would have bin commited with a gun('s) in the first place. Armed guard =/= armed civilians. Etc. We've to have the right to defend ourselfs against people that want to hurt us (with guns). The argument is getting old and it's selfsustaining. Once pointed at, the hunting and hobbies argument turns up. Also already debated.

 

[rynnor]

A massacre that would have bin commited with a gun('s) in the first place. Armed guard =/= armed civilians. Etc. We've to have the right to defend ourselfs against people that want to hurt us (with guns). The argument is getting old and it's selfsustaining. Once pointed at, the hunting and hobbies argument turns up. Also already debated.

Massacres occur when one side is armed to a far higher degree than the other.

Unless you can somehow remove weapons from all criminals (which is impossible even here in the UK) then you need to arm the other side.

 

[Scouse]

Aaaand...your point is?

Did you not read the article?

He was prevented from entering the theater by an off duty sheriff's deputy working theater security. The deputy shot him once, abruptly ending his shooting spree.

 

[DaGaffer]

Did you not read the article?

And in a sane society the assailant wouldn't have had access to a gun so the off duty cop wouldn't have had to shoot him. So I repeat. . . Your point is?

 

[throdgrain]

And that's going to happen when exactly ?

 

[Exioce]

So, what do you do when revolution breaks out and you need to depose your government?

Do you ask them for your weapons back? "Please sir, can I have some guns to shoot at you with?"

If this is really a primary concern...

"The U.S. constitution's second amendment is intended in part to maintain "the security of a free State" by ensuring that the government doesn't have a monopoly on force. Though it's worth considering another police state here: Tunisia, which had the lowest firearm ownership rate in the world (one gun per thousand citizens, compared to America's 890) when its people toppled a brutal, 24-year dictatorship and sparked the Arab Spring."

http://www.theatlantic.com/internat...-virtually-eliminated-shooting-deaths/260189/

 

[Jeros]

Yanks get me with things like

"None of my kids have access to my guns"

In a later argument

"Everyone in my house, even my kids, know how to access and operate at least one of our firearms in case of home invasion"

 

[rynnor]

If this is really a primary concern...

"The U.S. constitution's second amendment is intended in part to maintain "the security of a free State" by ensuring that the government doesn't have a monopoly on force. Though it's worth considering another police state here: Tunisia, which had the lowest firearm ownership rate in the world (one gun per thousand citizens

If you look that gun ownership rate touted for Tunisia is just an estimate.

Personally I think it might be low in the cities but out in the desert there are lots of guns.

 

[Mabs]

holy shit, this is so fucking novel and original
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/121234-U-S-Senator-Takes-Pro-NRA-Anti-GTA-Stance

 

[Scouse]

If this is really a primary concern...

It's THE primary concern.

As previously evidenced in this thread David Cameron is going to start shipping weapons to Syrian rebels because they haven't sufficient arms to overthrow the Assad regime.


As far as I'm concerned, unless anyone can prove otherwise, that's the argument done.

 

[Tuthmes]

Massacres occur when one side is armed to a far higher degree than the other.

Unless you can somehow remove weapons from all criminals (which is impossible even here in the UK) then you need to arm the other side.

Massacres occur when one side has (easy) access to weapons and the intention to hurt people. No matter if the other side is armed or not. It's a shite argument and always will be. I suppose now everyone should carry assault riffles even childeren. Cause waving your hand vs an assault riffle doesnt cut mustard and childeren have a right to defend themselfs.

So how come one side is armed to a far higher degree then the other? Correct, they have easy access to firearms. How about the rights of the people that want a gun free society. Or just dont want to carry firearms?

 

[rynnor]

Massacres occur when one side has (easy) access to weapons and the intention to hurt people.

If that were true they wouldnt happen here where we have some of the toughest gun laws but they do.

 

[rynnor]

How about the rights of the people that want a gun free society.

People can wish for all sorts of impossible things - it doesnt make them feasible.