Troll in Albion [Conclusion]

[cHodAX]

Originally posted by Generic Poster
No need for mass paranoia. You cannot hack someone's PC, simply by knowing their IP address. Only experienced and determined hackers would try. If all you needed was their IP address, you woudn't find them so easily in IRC and it wouldn't be attached to every email you send.

The average script-kiddie will scan all ports on a PC. Most PCs have these under control, unless File/Printer sharing is active or some other secutity hole. Most likely Kron sent Brannor a file named: laylNudez.jpg.zip.exe - Brannor executes the file and runs the trojan.


So having someone know your IP address isn't an issue. Monitoring what you download and execute, is.

No one said there was a simple way just by knowing the IP address, your average Joe isn't going to have a clue how to port scan or anything else for that matter. That said please don't say it isn't possible to anyone with a reasonable amount of expereince to do, I have seen otherwise many times. Gaining access via an open port is much easier than most people would imagine, people need to know that they MUST run firewall/viruschecker to be in anyway safe from this crime.

 

[Lochlyessa]

Originally posted by Turamber
Daft thing is without Lochy's post it would have been nothing but 'supposition' and 'rumour'.

Like I said above though, the main problem (well, apart from the criminal activity..) is with GOA's handling of the whole affair which stinks to high heaven, and is very much highlighted by Revz post.

Twoo, but considering how (obviously) respected Gideon is, would you really doubt him?.

And tbh, my posting here had nothing at all to do with how I felt about kr0n hacking Brannor's pc, which in fact I was kinda ashamed about. It was about Gideon telling everyone something he'd learnt in confidence.

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by Generic Poster
The average script-kiddie will scan all ports on a PC. Most PCs have these under control, unless File/Printer sharing is active or some other secutity hole. Most likely Kron sent Brannor a file named: laylNudez.jpg.zip.exe - Brannor executes the file and runs the trojan.

Actually I think Brannor had an open port, rather than being trojanned...

 

[Fightersuntzu]

Ack !!!

<looks speechless>...








Ack.

 

[Jonaldo]

Theres nothing to say that messing about with the game was the only thing Kr0n did here... he did kinda fuck up big time and take it about 3 steps too far by doing this, whatever his motives were.

Loch, we've always got on ok so far but you are so far wide of the mark on just about every post you've made here... Gideon done the right thing, Brannor didn't do the wrong thing but if I ever found my pc (not account but home pc!) to be hacked and I found it was someone from in game or irc then I would be the first to post their name, IP (if static) e-mail and any other details I could find of them.

If he hacked Brannor just for a game then its most likely he's hacked other pc's or whatever sometime in the past, and think about it.. wouldn't you prefer to know if there was a serial rapist living next to you? not very nice to compare the two but both crimes should bring custodial sentences so yes I would like to know who's done what and how.

The two things that do confuse me are that how is he still playing if GOA know about this, and why the hell is he still an Op on #daoc.prydwen?

I've never really had a problem with him until now but what happened here kinda sickens me. So far what we know is he played Brannors account a bit, who says he didn't look around.. maybe find some banking information, other passwords, private details that Brannor now has to change. Basically anything on that pc that is remotely connected to the security of one thing or another now needs updating or changing. It's not just the Glauthrong thing, it's the invasion of privacy that is what's in question and it's punishable the same as Burglary.

Now I've gone and typed a lot and my eyes are going funny.

Gideon = hero
Brannor = crime victim
Loch = silly
kr0n = shoulda known you were a twat for having a number in your tag. Bad boy! BAD boy!

 

[Blood]

Originally posted by Danyan

Actually I think Brannor had an open port, rather than being trojanned...

Listen up silly girl..

PC's are not like gardens, if a port is "open" it doesnt mean you can just go in and pick all the apples, then take a swim in the pool.

It does mean that there is a service running on that port that is ready for specific connections.

 

[Shike]

whatta hell

FFS kr0n! you sir are such a twat beyond imagination.... hacking someones puter and mess with his char.... may you burn in hell. Take your arrogant attitude and showe it up in your darkest place you have.

I dont care whatever your reason for this was, but _nothing_ can ever justify it.

Gideon, I am sure you knew some people would go nutters over what you did, I am glad you did it. People like kr0n should not slip away from things like these, this is the worst incident so far on Prydwen i believe and hopefully nobody will do the same again.

fookin hell, where is the world going...

that kr0n still is an @ on #daoc.prydwen is a total mystery to me. I bet I will be banned on it now, but I dont care, it aint worth it to agree to this behaviour in silence rather than clearly say NO!, this is not acceptable.

uke:

 

[Blood]

I fear the day when we will have public courtrooms on the internet, with Jury's like these people..

Without 0 evidence kr0n have been tried and found guilty.

However kr0n have had plenty of time and oppertunity to come out and say that he didnt do it, and speak up for himself. Neglecting to do so he have brougth much of this on himself.

 

[cHodAX]

Blood, it sounds like there is evidence. GOA must have had some to instigate the ban against k0rn/Layl but also he/she had confessed to a number of people. That would convict anyone of any crime anywhere in the world. If GOA had no evidence then they broke European law by acting against the named above by banning them, I seriously doubt they would do that whithout what could be termed as 'proper evidence'.

 

[SFXman]

Layl is known to have at least one more account

Uh? I never knew this
I think I would have known about this if someone.

Anyway I for one am not going to even bother to begin commenting on the posts made in this thread...
Imho the punishment of deleting kr0n's account and the two L50 characters along with a L37 scout is already quite much

A person who gets hold of someones account could just delete all characters while they are at it or drop all equipment on the ground or whatever... and how come this wasn't done?
A crime can be assessed to be less serious in this sense, yes... it can.

Plus I mean he lost a 6 month subsciption, that's like... some bit of money for a person his age imho, considering I am the same age and I guess I would know then.

Doubt this will happen again if you ask me.

 

[andrilyn]

Originally posted by old.Blood|Prydwen


Listen up silly girl..

PC's are not like gardens, if a port is "open" it doesnt mean you can just go in and pick all the apples, then take a swim in the pool.

It does mean that there is a service running on that port that is ready for specific connections.

With the right tools you can Blood...
And you can "block" your IP from IRC just simply by a shell account which you can access from telnet etc.

Bit strange actually that Brannor didnt notice that Kr0n had send a trojan since subseven trojan is the most used in the whole world and like 99% of all virus scanners can detect it before you open it, also subseven is just lame and requires no skill.

 

[old.Patrick-S]

sfx from the sound of it, it was done to get brannor in trouble he returned him to where he was before he used his account... and losing 2 level 50 characters and a level 37 is nasty but noway has he been overpunished... anyway its over now brannor doesnt seem too bothered its a shame he has a black mark and all but flaming kron, gideon or whoever isnt gunna change much...

 

[old.Revz]

I can prove it. The best proof you could ask for though is all the people who immediately started attacking me as soon as I said it was Layl. They didn't stop to think that I might not be believed but that isn't my problem any more since they implicated him very effectively without me needing to do anything.

The reason I told Brannor? In his place I would have wanted to know immediately what happend, who did it and most importantly how. This is after all something Brannor can take up with the police since it was a criminal act.

The reason I mentioned it in this thread? Well firstly I think the handling of it was pretty poor from GOA. Secondly if you don't want an issue to come into the open you should stop skirting so closely to it all the time. Thirdly the fact that Layl seems to have a new account and has joined Nolby Pride on the PvP server just makes a mockery of things really. I don't read the forums very often now but I get there in the end.

What gives me the right? Do I need to answer that based on what you know of me from these forums?

As for this being a betryal of confidence don't make me laugh. Layl was deliberately deceptive with myself as much as anyone right up until the point where he had nothing further to lose because his account had been deleted. I wouldn't say telling the truth after the fact is something to admire.

 

[Solid]

Lol @ SFXman, standing up for his mate, your argument is more pathetic than Lochy's.

"But Your Honour I know he was trying to kill him, but he only managed to blind, cripple and mutilate him, can you give him 500 hours community service and we call it evens? huh please sir can you huh huh yeah please yeah?"

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by old.Blood|Prydwen
Listen up silly girl..

PC's are not like gardens, if a port is "open" it doesnt mean you can just go in and pick all the apples, then take a swim in the pool.

It does mean that there is a service running on that port that is ready for specific connections.

I'm well aware of the ins and outs of port scanning and hacking services running on open ports. I didn't feel the need to get into an internet security discussion here though as it adds little to the discussion. I was merely pointing out that afaik Brannor wasn't trojanned, kr0n exploited an open port to gain access.
If you want a real analagy, an open port is like a locked door - with a little effort you can unlock it and go in to "pick all the apples, then take a swim in the pool."
Happy now Blood, or do you want to jump to more false conclusions?

 

[SFXman]

Hmm, I wouldn't say standing up for a mate but that is just my opinion and I am just stating it.
As for your example, I wouldn't quite put it that way. If a person robs a store but doesn't hurt anyone, I wouldn't say that it is as serious as a person robbing a store and killing the person behind the counter.
In you example the person attempted to kill the person but failed to do so... in this case the person managed to do what they intended, but they didn't go as far as they could have.
Just my opinion.

 

[old.Atrox]

I do agree with Loch....

What kr0n did were wrong.
I dont know what information GOA provided Brannor with if any.
All information they could've gotten is that some other IP/mac-address used the account and the same ip/mac-address are common on an other account. IMO they should've told Brannor the IP/Mac-address so that he could trace the hacking.
Gideon told Brannor who it was that did it, fine that I do agree with, since it could've help brannor with the security issue.
If Brannor wanned to name'n'shame fine, I wouldnt disagreed ( I would've done it myself ), but Gideon posting Information on a Official forum and name kr0n was not his business.

and what I think Loch meant about trust was the Guild privat forums can be posted onto official forums. And in this issue I agree with her.

Before you start the flames:
I dont support kr0ns actions.
It's not proved that kr0n did the hacking.
GOA could only see that kr0n used the account (and IMO did wrong in not shareing this information with Brannor).
Im not against Name'n'Shame, but it was not Gideons business.
IMO gideon should've left that choice to Brannor.

And since the "hacking" part still remains unsolved(unproved), there's no point in the "Knowing your neighbour" argument, if you still want to use the "it's a crime" argument aswell.

anyway my point,
Gideon did right in nameing kr0n to Brannor, but he should've stoped there and let Brannor decide.



Flame away

 

[Meatballs]

Originally posted by Danyan

I was merely pointing out that afaik Brannor wasn't trojanned, kr0n exploited an open port to gain access.

In the original thread brannor said his camelot.exe was picked up by his virus scanner as infected with the subseven trojan.

 

[Brannor McThife]

Meatballs said something neutral! A little more effort and you'll say something good!

Anyway:

1) Layl/kr0n/Kornhead sent a pop-up message to me saying my Win XP key was invalid, I ignored this; probably had the trojan attached.

Application popup: Messenger Service : Message from KORNHEAD to XXXXXXXXXX on 20/10/2002 20:36:48

Your version of Microsoft Windows XP is an illegal copy. You have been notified to authorities and you will be contacted.

Notice the bad english...

2) Camelot.exe was infected by a trojan after I logged out of my Mid account on the Sunday night.
3) My anti-virus killed it - too late.
4) I kicked off a firewall and reported it to GOA on Sunday night.
5) I changed my passwords on Monday.
6) Wednesday night I got home from Work and was confronted with the thread by Kemor, who then implemented a suspension on my account, to take effect as soon as I logged out that night.
7) kr0n acted all offended after I asked him for his IP address on Wednesday night. Shame, you poor baby.
8) GOA has never, and never will, give me any information on who it was, suffice to report that they had dealt with it.

I dare you kr0n, I utterly dare you, break the CoC one more time...

-G

 

[kr0n]

Originally posted by old.Blood|Prydwen
I fear the day when we will have public courtrooms on the internet, with Jury's like these people..

Without 0 evidence kr0n have been tried and found guilty.

However kr0n have had plenty of time and oppertunity to come out and say that he didnt do it, and speak up for himself. Neglecting to do so he have brougth much of this on himself.

Found guilty by the authorities in this game is enough. Couldnt care a flying fuck what people (read: non-friends) think 'bout it. There's no absolute proof that I did it. No. If there was someone standing behind me and watching me do it, then there would be. Please, spare the bullshit.

Lol @ SFXman, standing up for his mate, your argument is more pathetic than Lochy's.

Try family instead of mate.

Layl is known to have at least one more account, people on these forums know the names of his/her alts on other servers so if GOA find out the details do they ban those too?

And? They cant prove I (IRL) did it. They only proved it was the same IP that did it. Thus they banned the account the IP uses. They didnt ban me for hacking anything, they banned me for several reasons. Such as accountsharing, spying (which wasnt true tho) and bug exploiting. So basically they couldnt get anything solid so they took all the "minor" offenses, which they normally dont bother to deal with to judge me. If they did, they'd have to ban loads of people.

GOAs point of view, everything done in this game is done through accounts. Accounts get the punishment, no matter what. Persons behind em are no way linked in this.

loool

@ Gideon.

PS. So all beware of me now, Im teh skriptm0nstah, harrassing people around the globe with my l337 t00lz... People taking this way more seriously than I am.

 

[kr0n]

Originally posted by Brannor McThife

I dare you kr0n, I utterly dare you, break the CoC one more time...

-G

Laff... You're even more funnier now...

Besides, current account doesnt have any warnings on it... So

 

[ImLestat]

This is pretty pathetic. Stop to at all take any side of this lame ass kr0n. You might discuss if it is "right" to name and shame him. Is it "right"? Perhaps not in a moral sence. Does he deserve what is coming to him? Hell yes!! He deserves even more. Have you read his posts lately? He is sitting there LAUGHING at all this, and you still take his side. Oh, and he hides behind the fact that "it can't be proven". Goa banned his ass because of this and he still doesn't admit anything. Damn coward. But the worst thing is still that he sits there laughing. Come on people, stop defending him. I wouldn't defend him even if he was my best friend. Someone in this thread said that friends should stick up for each other no matter what. I don't care to look up who it was, but I can tell you that it isn't NO MATTER WHAT. Should you stick up for a friend that breaks into peoples houses and steals? Definitely no, and this case is just as bad. If kr0n had been my friend I would have let him have quite a piece of my mind. Just pathetic..........

 

[old.Atrox]

Originally posted by old.ImLestat
This is pretty pathetic. Stop to at all take any side of this lame ass kr0n. You might discuss if it is "right" to name and shame him. Is it "right"? Perhaps not in a moral sence. Does he deserve what is coming to him? Hell yes!! He deserves even more. Have you read his posts lately? He is sitting there LAUGHING at all this, and you still take his side. Oh, and he hides behind the fact that "it can't be proven". Goa banned his ass because of this and he still doesn't admit anything. Damn coward. But the worst thing is still that he sits there laughing. Come on people, stop defending him. I wouldn't defend him even if he was my best friend. Someone in this thread said that friends should stick up for each other no matter what. I don't care to look up who it was, but I can tell you that it isn't NO MATTER WHAT. Should you stick up for a friend that breaks into peoples houses and steals? Definitely no, and this case is just as bad. If kr0n had been my friend I would have let him have quite a piece of my mind. Just pathetic..........

I dont think the question is if it right to name'n'Shame, rather was it right of Gideon to Name'n'Shame ? IMO no

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by old.Atrox
... Gideon posting Information on a Official forum and name kr0n was not his business.

This isn't an official forum though. And as for his business or not, Gideon was involved by association as kr0n was a member of sotl at the time and Gid was gm of sotl, hence it became his business then.

Originally posted by Brannor McThife
1) Layl/kr0n/Kornhead sent a pop-up message to me saying my Win XP key was invalid, I ignored this; probably had the trojan attached

Well, you can't actually attach things to windows popup messages, so the source of the trojan was elsewhere. My original statement about the open port etc was taken from kr0n's account of events, whether he used a trojan or not I couldn't say for certain (as I wasn't standing there looking over his shoulder).

Originally posted by old.Atrox
I dont think the question is if it right to name'n'Shame, rather was it right of Gideon to Name'n'Shame

IMO, yes

 

[Taggart]

I totally agree with what Gideon has done, he's showed more sense then most people, its his duty as GM of Sotl to do this. I think its sad like someone said, that Layl is still able to play the game, i think he should of been kicked out of daoc all together(dunno how that would work though).

 

[Gabrial]

Originally posted by kr0n


PS. So all beware of me now, Im teh skriptm0nstah, harrassing people around the globe with my l337 t00lz... People taking this way more seriously than I am.

Am I the only one who doesnt understand what is being said here?

Originally posted by kr0n


Laff... You're even more funnier now...

Besides, current account doesnt have any warnings on it... So

Why is he (ahem) 'more funnier'?

 

[kr0n]

Originally posted by Gabrial


Am I the only one who doesnt understand what is being said here?




Why is he (ahem) 'more funnier'?

Sarcasm.

He's always been funny, with his attitude, actions and text i see coming from his keyboard.

 

[Gabrial]

And this one?

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by kr0n


PS. So all beware of me now, Im teh skriptm0nstah, harrassing people around the globe with my l337 t00lz... People taking this way more seriously than I am.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[kr0n]

Originally posted by kr0n


Sarcasm. <----

 

[Gabrial]

Doh! <slaps head>

I get it now. I thought you were saying that you ARE a hacker who intends to do it again.

I know people say that there are tools out there but I've 'worked in computing' for a few years now and I never had the need to figure out how to hack, nor have i come accross it. To be honest, I wouldnt know where to start. You can understand why people are commenting the way they are?