THX god for zergs!!

[Belomar]

Lotsa QQ in you, Estat.

 

[AbPoon]

Dont take Konah's spammy slash away he'd be helpless

 

[tildson]

Originally posted by ormagaa
met LAs castergroups lately?

nope, only 2casters in it usually.

And Glottis, why dont you answer respond on my previous post?

 

[K0nah]

Originally posted by infozwerg
does that also mean no more mrs dualwield jambiyas? would make me QQ irl tbh

have no idea what ali's plans are, just imo thrust gets the edge from 1.64 on. and fyi she(he irl) has been using sabre/jam for 6weeks or more, maybe NP should grp u more? ;/

 

[K0nah]

Originally posted by AbPoon
Dont take Konah's spammy slash away he'd be helpless

i value your opinion so highly poon, you hurt me, really u do

 

[infozwerg]

and fyi she(he irl) has been using sabre/jam for 6weeks or more

makes me sad

 

[Vodor]

I'd like to apologise on behalf of my guild for forcing alb/excal to zerg emain every single day from February '02 - October '03

 

[Jiggs]

Originally posted by Vodor
I'd like to apologise on behalf of my guild for forcing alb/excal to zerg emain every single day from February '02 - October '03

thats ok, without you i'd never have discovered warcraft 3

 

[Hedek]

Originally posted by Jiggs
thats ok, without you i'd never have discovered warcraft 3

LOL

 

[hotrat]

Originally posted by sorusi
doesnt really matter if the sorcs survives or not, after he has landed the mezz if the tanks in the alb grp can assist and have propper specc/ras/ equip, they will rip down the healers 1 by 1 with sos, and there is basicly nothing the albs can do against it

if sorc land mezz + str/con debuff/d/q debuff, his work is done, its just to run around all the time, if he gets killed, well he wont get any rps that fight (big chance to get caught with sos on etc)

meanwhile the mercs rip thru the healers takeing them out in 3sec each, unless they insta heal.. this is where the clerics also run around and if they are not chased they interrupt the healers & same for minstrel, will allways be 1 cleric available for healing/interrupting (sure there are some problems with the interrupting atm due to insta spd debuff, but with a good minstrel he should be able to stun the healers etc and keep them occupied for 30sec so they cant heal that time..

basicly sos and wellplayed teamwork should be a win...


and yes, playing sorc in that group is kind of dull, because you can and should expect to die alot,as the only cloth caster in grp... they could give them abs buffs like valewalkers or something... not that it would change alot for most alb grps anyway since a sorc alive does not do much vs a midd grp, while against a hibb grp with pbaoe box its VERY important to have sorc alive..
bof gives you allmost the same ability, just that the enemy healers CAN escape, if they mercs are so gimped that they dont have pf - very unlikely tho..

now you have bof every 15min, and sos every 15min.. dont waste both at same battle. use them in a smart way instead sos = no damage taken if you are paying attention.

so basicly you can handle 3fotm grps in a row IF you have mana after that is and you play well..

and vs hibbs you can forget about useing bof, because their end regen is so gimped that you dont even have to worry about melee grps there if you play it right...

usually only MAX 3fgs "fotm" grps who can play in emain when you should need RAs...

Yes but its landing the first ae mezz which is impossible vs a pac healer running at you at ss6 with potentially 4 insta cc spells ready. Last time I fought nolby they used ae insta mezz on me, 2 secs later I had 3 NP tanks around me ready to break mezz, savage hits me, warrior slams me, I hit purge, and ae str/con debuff tried to qc ae mezz, dead before I even began casting.

Stubbe suggested not leading with the sorc which would work better in a head on situation, however it doesn't work as well when you flank other groups, also the mezz is always a little bit later cus if im not leading as soon as I see another group I unstick then try and find a target, then /face, then cast. If im leading I find a target hit /face to stop running and then cast mezz.

After a sorc has cast mezz and ae str/con dex/qui they must then (assuming he is not under attack) try and protect their clerics using root. Mezz will only last around 8 secs on det 5, but a root just as the mezz breaks can hold them off another 5 seconds ! (det5 is so balanced ). You may say the paladin should guard the clerics but the paladin must provide end regen to the tanks, who are no doubt sprinting all the time trying to catch the mid support who have no doubt diseased them (not hard with 8 sec insta pbae disease).
After casting root and finding a target for your pet then the sorc should just kite tanks as much as possible, unless nobody is on him (very unlikely) then just assist the MA and lifetap.

While SoS is on clerics are highly unlikely to be able to interupt support, they should be getting a good position and staying well away from enemy tanks. The minstrel and sorc pet should do all the interupting you need.

SoS is every 30 min fyi, should be every 15 though but thats kinda unfair to hib tank groups.

Vs hib tank groups its usually get first mezz, hibs GP, 3 or 4 BM's running at me, run away, get rooted by a druid, or insta mezz by bard. BM hits me with their snare style and the stun style, cleric hits bof, I ae root, run away a bit tanks on me again a few secs later, clerics heal me loads, eventually all hib support is dead and the BM's die from my tanks. Yes hibs have a big issue with end regen

Anyway my original point was mid fotm groups are impossible without SoS and you basically agreed with me, you just said you shouldn't need bof as well which is true except if the mids start to PR their healers then SoS runs out and the fight quickly starts to turn.

The problems are: asd, savages, Det 5 being way too strong (albs rely on cc a lot more than mids, mids can fall back on disease), albs main cc class being so useless after they cast ae mezz, and mids being able to run ss6 (if roaming speed was reduced to caster speed a sorc would have such an advantage).

instamezz on a sorc? lasts for how long again?

Long enough for the mid MA to pick me as target and kill me in 2 seconds

hint: try running away before they reach you. dont try any funky qc mezz tricks on det5 tanks that are prolly mezzimmune anyways.

I often do prefer to run rather than to cc a tank chasing me (if they are out of melee range). However I can't run out of end regen or heal range, I will get caught if im hit by skald snare or insta mezz or shaman root or any of the healers single mezz's. If you watched my video in the first fight (vs BC) I quite succesfully kite 2 tanks, vs NP though the skald would have been assisting those 2 tanks and I would have been snared.

anyways, if i were main cc (in fact, i am ^^) id invest in some better hardware. cant have ppl appear out of nowwhere when you want to stop a zerg, like the hibs in your video.

Can't afford it atm and yes it plays a big dis-advantage to me that I get 1 or 2 sec fps lag everytime I meet another group

 

[old.Filip]

SAME !! i wanna say the SAME !!!

good walkthough hotrats

 

[ingrid]

Originally posted by old.Nol
Not really, see we only want classes balanced, which would mean giving thanes and hunters better abilities. There is no place for savages in their current form, and no place for aoe stun.

amusing to read, but tbh hunters are among the best stealthers in the game, theres no place for Shadowblades <-- more truth in that.

thanes me and everyone else will agree on
but honestly albs aint gimped. id love to make a balanced FG alb... but i cba to lvl...

as it is with hib, sure u can make a good melee grp aswell, abit lacking in BM's but otherwice fine. just look at BAF, sure Savages ARE supperior to BM's but if hib lands the CC they honestly has the upper hand to a savage grp. and another thing, a bard is a supperior CC to healer so why nerf healer? and about the stunn? ok its uber in spiritmaster grps, but they aint that common yet, so why whine on the AE stunn even before its here?

 

[Belomar]

Originally posted by ingrid
a bard is a supperior CC to healer so why nerf healer? and about the stunn? ok its uber in spiritmaster grps, but they aint that common yet, so why whine on the AE stunn even before its here?

Oh, and again you talk shit. What advantage do bards have over healers when it comes to CC in the context of hib vs mid groups, pray tell? (Pac)Healers have AoE mezz, ST mezz, insta AoE mezz, insta ST mezz, AoE stun, ST stun, insta AoE stun, insta ST stun, ST root; bards have half that CC.

 

[ingrid]

Originally posted by Belomar
Oh, and again you talk shit. What advantage do bards have over healers when it comes to CC in the context of hib vs mid groups, pray tell? (Pac)Healers have AoE mezz, ST mezz, insta AoE mezz, insta ST mezz, AoE stun, ST stun, insta AoE stun, insta ST stun, ST root; bards have half that CC.

kk and then we take the bard, they have 10 sek timer insta amnesia Area, 5 sek insta amnesia singel, insta DD insta singel Target Mezz Insta Area mezz

personaly in most battles i dont come to use the insta singel CC's mainly use the ASD to win the mezz battles, as the others are time dependent and normaly used, so take the amnesia insta's compared to the ASD theyre not gonna be nerfed, the ASD doesnt work if the mezz is 50% on its way, and then they have 2

and to come in to the part with insta AE stunn, it fucks up slam, sure it may be worth it, it may be not. i tend to not overuse it.
as a bard on the other hand u can use the insta singel mezz on pac healer and then cast endregen/continue interrupt him during whole fight. sure the healer can do this 2, but the healer cant interrupt more then 1 target at teh time whilst kiting.

and the insta AE mezz is afterall quite useless... so countv it as another cast interrupter when fight is already in progress...

but i dont know most healers maybe wastes the insta stunn as soon as battle is on its way, personaly i do not. and if u dont, the bard is supperior in CC aggree?

then id like to know what a healer should do VS a Sorc that starts casting at 1875 range... i still havnt worked that out yet... so i stand by my previous statement that the bard is supperior in CC

 

[ingrid]

Originally posted by old.Filip
Bahhh you know notthing ... i inventet that way of playing minser, waaayyyyy back when i was RvRing at lvl 45..

i think if you seached on my name you would find the first comment's on BW about useing minser as interrupter coming from me

nice, but last time i saw u in rvr, i popped up as hunter and started killing u off, altho i did die but u just rushed to me and started melee, think i killed u 3 times over but died in the end cuz u got healed 2 times to full hp (clerics were interrupted the heals were Insta's). so if you invented the interrupting, why not use it? =)

naa im not gonna be hard on you, i just hope ul do better next time we meet, as u had alot more important issues in that battle then to seek me out =)

 

[Belomar]

Originally posted by ingrid
but i dont know most healers maybe wastes the insta stunn as soon as battle is on its way, personaly i do not. and if u dont, the bard is supperior in CC aggree?

No! I don't agree. You're saying that because of amnesia, bard CC > healer CC? Amnesia doesn't interrupt (i.e. invokes the interrupt timer), it just stops you from casting -- there is nothing preventing you from casting directly again. Yes, you may lose the mezz battle that way, but your ASD interrupts. Amnesia doesn't. Perhaps the amnesia will be more vital when ASD gets nerfed, but atm, healer CC >> bard CC. In fact, I know of few who would dispute this.

When I come across bards, I usually interrupt their mezz with my own ASD. 9 times out of 10, the bard counters with an insta mezz. Yes, this is a (small) victory, since insta mezz is very short duration, but it still means they won the mezz battle.

then id like to know what a healer should do VS a Sorc that starts casting at 1875 range... i still havnt worked that out yet... so i stand by my previous statement that the bard is supperior in CC

And sorc CC has what exactly to do with bard having superior CC than healers? Oh, and Magmatic already showed that insta mezz > bolt range mez, even with 330+ dex and MotArt3. Besides, very few RvR battles start out at maximum range.

 

[Freppe^^]

zergs bring joy to the game!!!!!!!11111111111

 

[infozwerg]

However I can't run out of end regen or heal range, I will get caught if im hit by skald snare or insta mezz or shaman root or any of the healers single mezz's.

are you using speed or anti-mezz chant?

Can't afford it atm and yes it plays a big dis-advantage to me that I get 1 or 2 sec fps lag everytime I meet another group

512 mb samsung ddr ram is 114 EUR at the store i bought it ^^

 

[ingrid]

Originally posted by Belomar
No! I don't agree. You're saying that because of amnesia, bard CC > healer CC? Amnesia doesn't interrupt (i.e. invokes the interrupt timer), it just stops you from casting -- there is nothing preventing you from casting directly again. Yes, you may lose the mezz battle that way, but your ASD interrupts. Amnesia doesn't. Perhaps the amnesia will be more vital when ASD gets nerfed, but atm, healer CC >> bard CC. In fact, I know of few who would dispute this.

and yet again you are right, the amnesia doesnt interrupt it clears ur mind for the spell, but the time u seeked out to win is there, even if u cast it in the endphase of the spell, as the healer has to get its ASD in in the beginning of the spell, so as the CC battle is fought in a realy early state and in matter of seconds in the fight its not realy important if it interrupts or just blanks ur mind, the time u seeked out to gain is won either way, and as the bard has a followup for the second spell u try it has about the same effect, and another win on the bard, healer doesnt have AE ASD, and doesnt have to be as precise on targeting as the healer has 2...

Originally posted by Belomar
Oh, and Magmatic already showed that insta mezz > bolt range mez, even with 330+ dex and MotArt3. Besides, very few RvR battles start out at maximum range.

ok im willing to agree semily on this one, but as the bard has countermeasures even at openground battles VS a sorc and healer doesnt that is an advantage agree? not saying o got problems with Sorcs, im just saying there are moments im rendered helpless against it (not often) and a bard aint

id like to try a bard to see if im just out on my bicycle again or if im realy right, but til then this is my beliefs =)


what i realy like with the bard is its kiting abilities, as a healer normaly spends 50% of its time kiting =) but then again a bard aint got spreadheal =)

 

[old.Nol]

Originally posted by ingrid
and yet again you are right, the amnesia doesnt interrupt it clears ur mind for the spell, but the time u seeked out to win is there, even if u cast it in the endphase of the spell, as the healer has to get its ASD in in the beginning of the spell, so as the CC battle is fought in a realy early state and in matter of seconds in the fight its not realy important if it interrupts or just blanks ur mind, the time u seeked out to gain is won either way, and as the bard has a followup for the second spell u try it has about the same effect, and another win on the bard, healer doesnt have AE ASD, and doesnt have to be as precise on targeting as the healer has 2...

ok im willing to agree semily on this one, but as the bard has countermeasures even at openground battles VS a sorc and healer doesnt that is an advantage agree? not saying o got problems with Sorcs, im just saying there are moments im rendered helpless against it (not often) and a bard aint

id like to try a bard to see if im just out on my bicycle again or if im realy right, but til then this is my beliefs =)


what i realy like with the bard is its kiting abilities, as a healer normaly spends 50% of its time kiting =) but then again a bard aint got spreadheal =)

yeah bards just own cc wars, must be that second form cc they have...uber

 

[hotrat]

Originally posted by infozwerg
are you using speed or anti-mezz chant?



512 mb samsung ddr ram is 114 EUR at the store i bought it ^^

I use speed but it doesn't work if my pet is in combat, its more for the benefit of my clerics/tanks. If i really want speed I can put my pet on passive as well, which I usually do if i wanna use mcl.

I got 512mb ram, its the graphics card and processor which are letting me down

and the insta AE mezz is afterall quite useless... so countv it as another cast interrupter when fight is already in progress...

As I said before

Last time I fought nolby they used ae insta mezz on me, 2 secs later I had 3 NP tanks around me ready to break mezz, savage hits me, warrior slams me, I hit purge, and ae str/con debuff tried to qc ae mezz, dead before I even began casting.

Now with sorc dead they know they cant get mezzed if they interupt the clerics, which they did with asd.
So its now 8 vs 7 and neither side can use mezz as albs are immune, mids of course pull out disease though and win easily.
Had SoS been up I would have lived and we would have the advantage.

 

[Belomar]

Originally posted by ingrid
the amnesia doesnt interrupt it clears ur mind for the spell, but the time u seeked out to win is there, even if u cast it in the endphase of the spell, as the healer has to get its ASD in in the beginning of the spell

True.

what i realy like with the bard is its kiting abilities, as a healer normaly spends 50% of its time kiting =) but then again a bard aint got spreadheal =)

I don't really see how end song is better than end regen buffs. Sure, for a bard, you're in control of your own end chant, so you don't run the risk of running outside the range of the shaman. However, a bard has to get the song running, and

Mids currently have the easiest time running at speed 6. Hibs have to either have 2 bards, or have the bard twist songs (something which will take precious brain cycles from a bard who needs to stay alert for inc). The paladin needs to twist, or be cracked (admittedly not too hard ).

But then, I don't play a healer or a bard (or indeed a sorc!), so these are just things I picked up.

 

[Grandpeck]

Albs zerg a lot, and as such when they are in smaller groups 1-2 fgs they get owned BEACAUSE they are SO used to zerging tatics (f8 stick/cast etc).All realms do zerg but albs take the biscuit and cake for being the masters at it.

I know this doesnt apply to ALL albs as some albs do play very well and so dont need to run in massive zergs

Savages are overpowered atm and i find it hard to believe that Mythic would make the same mistake twice after doing it with zerkers.

Problem is with this game is that there are so many whining feck-tarts that dont like dying,want to pown EVERYthing in sight and kill everything in 1-2 hits.

 

[old.Filip]

look below

 

[old.Filip]

LOL @ ingrid .. he PM me with this..

i hope ul do better play better and learn to arrange grps

sigh you know notthing mate

btw friars aint that gimped abit tad down due to no determination, but the resists are useful, maybe not vs mid...

ask ppl who played friar ... like jiggs ... (why do you think he stopped playing the friar ??) they got a shitload more experince than you

but theurg grps + debuff = horror even VS fotm mids

So you think the answer to kill savage groups 1fg vs 1fg is to group a theug ????? so wrong again ...

learn the effect of early kiting get debuff in and start pet abusing all support, as u know a aka perfect mid grp doesnt have confusion... and alb has the best interrupter of all times (theurg) put a pet or 2 on each seer in grp, start assist nuking seers from 1-4 and kite with the target the MA chooses, (should be the cleric if im not mistaken) kite before PF kicks in and ul be all but fine and will slay the fotm grp...

OUiiiiii .... you think we are stupid ????? or you consider finding this out such a big acomplishment that you need to share it with us ?? ... sry mate .. this is common knowledge .... why it dont work in 1fg vs 1fg is something you must be able to figure out ..

im against everything above 1 FG, but when i play in a fotm grp i dont have any hard feelings to face 2 FG or possibly 3... overpower is something i along with the rest has gone tierd of, but then again when the overpower turns, albs will still zerg and its not because they have 2, its because they never learned to play the game.

Sigh you really think we only played alb's ?? try look up some of the post's Hedek made... it will learn you a lot ...

with your comments you make your self look like a guy with a small horizon ...

About the battle you comment on ... get your fact and overview of the battle straight ...

first of all i do make mistakes .... we all do .. but in this battle you over look some facts .. here is it from my side of the fence..

When you pop we are allrdy loosing ... mids are more than us and we lost some ppl allrdy ..

i see you the sec you pop up and want you to get mezzed .. i have no intention of figthing you .. i start to mezz you while moving toward you .. gets interuptet by your fireing ... i DD/stun you to make an opening to mezz you ... BUT .... i get interrupts from the healer drof + 1 other hunter ... so the mezz gets interruptet all the time... at this point your nicely savage army has killed all but 3 members in the group ... so i pick what seems the easiest target to kill before i die ... you ...

get your facts straigth mate......

 

[Hedek]

But it's funny replace, the 2 clerics + the sorc in any Alb perfect group (all RR5+ chars) by 3 Healers and this group all of a sudden becomes uber

Savages are the most overpowered tanks/meleers in the game. But Healers are no doubt the most overpowered class in the game, and as funny as it may seem they're the only class in the game with no dmg dealing tools (clerics have smite, druids dot, bard dd, etc).

Savages aren't really the problem, nerf or no nerf we'll see a huge amounts of 2h warriors instead who can switch to shield and slam anytime... as long as RvR will be as it is now, Midgard will have the upperhand because in just 2 support classes (shamans and healers) a grank group has all it needs. Except speed which is easily provided by a 50 weapon 43 chant skald who's also EXCELLENT at assisting with any slow 2h weapon.

Remove spells from shamans and healers and give em to spiritmasters, runemasters (in a line other than pbt) or thanes and Midgard will be f***** up deep. But nerfing savages won't change anything to Midgard being more powerful. Actually I'm quite convinced 4 assisting warriors are more deadly than 4 assisting savages because they can stop chasing, slam the tank on them and resume assisting... But this another issue.

Many Albion players are whiners because they haven't played midgard chars in RvR and therefore don't see where is the real problem.
Many Midgard chars are whiners because the fail to see the reality : that they are more powerful than other realms in the Emain type of RvR.

And I emphazise on "Emain type of RvR" because if RvR was to evolve into more keep taking / defending Albion and Hibernia would be close for number 1 realm in RvR and Midgard far behind with all tanks rerolling a spiritmaster, runemaster or thane (thanes being the best keep defending/taking class in the game as they can hit doors like any tank and cast ranged aoe spells or pbaoe spells too).

 

[Belomar]

Originally posted by ingrid:
put a pet or 2 on each seer in grp, start assist nuking seers from 1-4 and kite with the target the MA chooses, (should be the cleric if im not mistaken) kite before PF kicks in and ul be all but fine and will slay the fotm grp...

If by this you mean you think clerics have a spirit debuff, you are mistaken.

Anyway, bring on tomorrow, going to try a caster RvR setup then.

 

[infozwerg]

But it's funny replace, the 2 clerics + the sorc in any Alb perfect group (all RR5+ chars) by 3 Healers and this group all of a sudden becomes uber

so you think loosing spec buffs, 2xbof, ae root, boltrange on mezz, quickcast on cc and 1 pet makes a group uber because you get 1xccinstas, haste buff, 3xpr, 1xlvl30 spreadheal and 1xchain armor ?

i dont think so.

@filip: pm stands for personal message, not public message.

@belomar: go to daoc.4players.de and dl the "black is beautiful" movie.

 

[Glottis_Xanadu]

Originally posted by infozwerg
so you think loosing spec buffs, 2xbof, ae root, boltrange on mezz, quickcast on cc and 1 pet makes a group uber because you get 1xccinstas, haste buff, 3xpr, 1xlvl30 spreadheal and 1xchain armor ?
i dont think so.
@filip: pm stands for personal message, not public message.
@belomar: go to daoc.4players.de and dl the "black is beautiful" movie.

Buffs hardly matter, pure rvr guilds will have those standing save at the teleportkeep.
Bof is nice, but we are talking a 30min RA here, not some allways on Alb RA. CC is useless on the 3 savages running at speed 6 towards the sorc, cause of det5, and speed 6 will even prevent sorc from casting, cause the 1500 range with speed 6 owns the qc mezz from bolt range (horrible stuff, but imagine actually to have to stop to cast...)
Add to that that your CC has 2k+hp, wear chain, instead of 1500hp max cloth...
But keep on thinking the reason you beat a fg Albs in a 1 vs 1 is skill, and not overpowered classes.
Makes it even sadder that all Mids do nowadays is roam emain in 2fg or more.
Regards, Glottis

 

[infozwerg]

im not talking to you glottis, go bark on vn or stuff