Sorry to sound an ignorant n00b...

[old.user4556]

But can a Marvel / comic / Batman expert explain the difference between the original Michael Keaton Batman with The Joker and The Dark Knight with Christian Bale and The Joker?

Is one based on the comic and the other based on a Hollywood excuse for a film that bears no relation to the comics? Or is one a pre-something? Are they both loosely based on the "original" story? Which one is the "proper" one?

Cheers

 

[DaGaffer]

But can a Marvel / comic / Batman expert explain the difference between the original Michael Keaton Batman with The Joker and The Dark Knight with Christian Bale and The Joker?

Is one based on the comic and the other based on a Hollywood excuse for a film that bears no relation to the comics? Or is one a pre-something? Are they both loosely based on the "original" story? Which one is the "proper" one?

Cheers

Neither are "canon" with the original comics. In the original comics the Joker wasn't responsible for Bruce Wayne's parents' death (the Jack Nickleson character pre-Joker), it was a bloke called Joe Chill, although Bruce Wayne's parents' death has been retold a few times in the comics (but always with Chill as the killer). The whole vat of acid thing was based on the Joker origin in the comics.

I'm not sure about the new movie, but the Heath Ledger Joker looks more like the psychotic Joker from the Dark Knight Returns than anything else, but I'm pretty sure they're not connecting him with Bruce Wayne's parents in this one.

*edit* I am not a nerd. Honest.

 

[ford prefect]

*edit* I am not a nerd. Honest.

Yes, yes you are.

 

[nath]

Batman Begins (as far as I know) was based on a comic by Frank Miller called Batman Year One. I've read that and it's very similar to the film.

It should be known that this the only comic book I've ever read. I too, am not a comic book nerd.

 

[JingleBells]

Neither are "canon" with the original comics. In the original comics the Joker wasn't responsible for Bruce Wayne's parents' death (the Jack Nickleson character pre-Joker), it was a bloke called Joe Chill, although Bruce Wayne's parents' death has been retold a few times in the comics (but always with Chill as the killer). The whole vat of acid thing was based on the Joker origin in the comics.

I'm not sure about the new movie, but the Heath Ledger Joker looks more like the psychotic Joker from the Dark Knight Returns than anything else, but I'm pretty sure they're not connecting him with Bruce Wayne's parents in this one.

*edit* I am not a nerd. Honest.

Seeing as Joe Chill was in Batman Begins (Bruce takes a gun with him to the courthouse where Chill is being sentenced for something, but decides against shooting him), I doubt they'll link Joker to his parents death.

Anyway, aren't they actually "Graphic Novels" not comics

 

[DaGaffer]

Batman Begins (as far as I know) was based on a comic by Frank Miller called Batman Year One. I've read that and it's very similar to the film.

It should be known that this the only comic book I've ever read. I too, am not a comic book nerd.

Very superficially. Its got a young Jim Gordon in it, a couple of the same characters, and the very end is very similar, but Batman Begins' plot is very different; no Scarecrow or R'as-Al-Ghul in Year One.

*Alright, I am a nerd.

 

[DaGaffer]

Seeing as Joe Chill was in Batman Begins (Bruce takes a gun with him to the courthouse where Chill is being sentenced for something, but decides against shooting him), I doubt they'll link Joker to his parents death.

Anyway, aren't they actually "Graphic Novels" not comics

Oh yeah, I forgot that bit

* loses nerd points

 

[Dukat]

?

Cheers

Ones a film, this new one is likely to be a film too!

!!!

 

[Sparx]

yeah batman begins its mentioned it was some random and indeed not Joker

 

[Rubric]

So the new series of batman films are the proper ones and more close to the story line?

Effectively they are now remaking batman as it should have been in the first place?

 

[Sparx]

all directors take snippets from the story and use it to create their own

The Joker only killed Wayne's parents in the Burton movie, not in other continuities. These are loose prequels at best, just as Superman returns is a loose sequel to the first two Donner films, so Nolan has some freedom to break from the story told in Batman. Burton made the Joker the killer to make the story more personal, and to add symmetry and the circle of revenge, the whole "you made me" sequence. Odds are good given that card at the end that we'll be seeing Nolan's take on the character. Directors pick and choose from source material to tell a cohesive story that anyone can see without having read decades of comics like hardcore fans. For example, in the comics Ra's al Ghul never trained Batman, but Nolan crafted that connection just as Burton crafted the Joker one.

Probably best to consider these films a new series entirely rather than call them prequels.

 

[Rubric]

all directors take snippets from the story and use it to create their own

New movies, not prequels. Got it. Makes sense.

 

[DaGaffer]

So the new series of batman films are the proper ones and more close to the story line?

Effectively they are now remaking batman as it should have been in the first place?

Broadly, yes. Unlike the new Superman film(s) which are based on Superman: The Motion Picture continuity (sort of - they've erased Superman III & IV from history), not the comics, which rebooted Superman (and all the DC characters) after Crisis On Infinite Earths.

*My God, I need to get a life. I've not bought a comic for over a year, but this shit is stuck in my head.

 

[Rubric]

While we are on the subject of this whole comic book film malarkey it annoyed me greatly in the new spiderman films that he could shoot web from his wrists when in fact he should have made web shooters that took cartridges.

 

[Ch3tan]

While we are on the subject of this whole comic book film malarkey it annoyed me greatly in the new spiderman films that he could shoot web from his wrists when in fact he should have made web shooters that took cartridges.

It actually makes more sense that he can produce the web himself though.

 

[Rubric]

It actually makes more sense that he can produce the web himself though.

but its not right.

 

[Ch3tan]

Yes it is, the original comic book writers simply got it wrong.

 

[rynnor]

Have we not had enough Batman films yet?

Its sad how the film industry is so cowardly it just rakes over old titles instead of concentrating on new things.

Look at the top ten (by cash earned) films in the UK last year :

1. Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (£49,420,484)
2. Pirates Of The Caribbean: At World's End (£42,237,960)
3. Shrek the Third (£38,620,659)
4. The Simpsons Movie (£38,544,114)
5. Spider-Man 3 (£33,547,946)
6. Ratatouille (£24,716,887)
7. The Bourne Ultimatum (£23,703,150)
8. Transformers (£22,863,864)
9. Mr Bean's Holiday (£22,142,332)
10. Hot Fuzz (£21,005,064)

Thats just 2 out of 10 not remakes or part of a series- wow - the viewing public must be idiots!

 

[Ch3tan]

The remake of batman is a good film though. Why does it matter if there have been other batman movies before?

 

[Guest]

well, didn't he get bit by a spider..........

 

[Rubric]

well, didn't he get bit by a spider..........

Well i prefer the original spiderman films, much better.

 

[PLightstar]

Have we not had enough Batman films yet?

Its sad how the film industry is so cowardly it just rakes over old titles instead of concentrating on new things.

Look at the top ten (by cash earned) films in the UK last year :

1. Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (£49,420,484)
2. Pirates Of The Caribbean: At World's End (£42,237,960)
3. Shrek the Third (£38,620,659)
4. The Simpsons Movie (£38,544,114)
5. Spider-Man 3 (£33,547,946)
6. Ratatouille (£24,716,887)
7. The Bourne Ultimatum (£23,703,150)
8. Transformers (£22,863,864)
9. Mr Bean's Holiday (£22,142,332)
10. Hot Fuzz (£21,005,064)

Thats just 2 out of 10 not remakes or part of a series- wow - the viewing public must be idiots!

OMG Really those were the ten, only Hot Fuzz is worth watching out of that lot and its number 10.

 

[dysfunction]

OMG Really those were the ten, only Hot Fuzz is worth watching out of that lot and its number 10.

no Ratatouille was really good!

 

[Ch3tan]

Bourne ultimatum was great as well.

 

[nath]

Its sad how the film industry is so cowardly it just rakes over old titles instead of concentrating on new things.

While I agree with the sentiment, Batman Begins really does set itself apart from the other dross with an exceptional cast and director. The sequel looks fantastic too.