solo moc sheer shammies

[Vladamir]

Shammys get STORMLORD!!!!!!! that's unfair

No they don't?

 

[censi]

it is a unfair advantage by definition...
why is that so hard to comprehend?
if you have a buffbot, you have a significant edge over someone who cant afford/cant run a second account.
Last i checked it wasn't a pre-requisite to buy 2 accounts to play daoc
Just because alot of people have buffbots doesnt make it any less of a unfair advantage over people who cant afford/run a second account. The fact of the matter is the majority of the playerbase dont have one, meaning it is not the norm

you dont have to have a buffbot to get buffs mate. The fact that about 1/3 of players have them and you can buff 3 people on one bot should give you a rough idea of how many people are actually running without them!!

Or your seeing something I aint? because I cant remeber the last unbuffed opponent I fought in like years. Its a non-point. Like I say go with the "I pay my subs meight" arguement instead chronic.

 

[Chronictank]

you dont have to have a buffbot to get buffs mate. The fact that about 1/3 of players have them and you can buff 3 people on one bot should give you a rough idea of how many people are actually running without them!!

Or your seeing something I aint? because I cant remeber the last unbuffed opponent I fought in like years. Its a non-point. Like I say go with the "I pay my subs meight" arguement instead chronic.

why would they be? you can get buffs in cl lines now, and ae buffs ableit(sp?)timered will still come up as "x has lost x", when they die.
Another thing you fail to bring into the argument that most people in fact dont buff others, the vast majority ignore the bot completely when playing their main
I cant speak for hib, but on mid and alb i rarely see anyone aside from friends buffing each other.

You also dont seem to grasp the fact that most people without buffs will run in a zerg because they cant compete with buffed opponents, who can blame them to be very honest. its no fun being killed repeatedly against oponents you have no chance to beat.

Once again a argument you havent really thought through and trying to legitimise with pathetic insults rather than a argument with some content, now try acting your age and having a civilised debate if ofc you have some argument to put forward

 

[Asha]

like I say everyone has buffs now. Its not an unfair advantage. If you have any aspirations of playing this game solo you need buffs. Thats just a fact of daoc (right or wrong). Again your missing my point, I cba to keep spelling it out. next time just reply "he pays his subs meight" or summin.

It's you missing the point. If you have any aspirations of playing this game solo as a buffer then you need to buff shear your enemy.

It doesn't matter if we use a bbot or not... we're still at a disadvantage to EVERY other class who can get buffs for free. We have to spec for those buffs - you DONT. If we don't spec for buffs and use a bbot and spec in the 3rd line, then we don't have buff shears. If we do have buff shears then we SPECCED for them and don't have either damage/cc or healing. Can't you see that either way we're down a line to every other class?

Buff shears are mythic's attempt to balance bbots without removing them. Also, it makes playing these classes MUCH more interesting in FG vs. FG. Making it some stupid timer would not be the same as someone pointed out, a good druid/shammie/cleric will rebuff as soon as someone is sheared in a fight.

Basically, you think clerics/druids/shamen shouldn't even try to solo because you might have to rebuff - selfish much? uke:

 

[-Freezingwiz-]

No they don't?

hmm I was sure that was there 2nd thing they could pick my mistake after checking

but they get Convoker !!!!! overpowered !!!! ML9 Zo pets !!!

 

[censi]

yer asha ive said a couple of times your arguement is valid. but also Ive said several times that im talking about players that have no intenstion of fighting back just buff sheer and sit etc (after a couple of /laughs).

thats what i said in the original post. And chronic is going balistic about buffbots and their fairness, while refusing to acknowledge the point im making.

 

[Nate]

Well ofc, it isn't just one realm that does this censi...theres some firby with bot in his name that runs around dc buff shearing people then running away..the few people that do it aren't that much of a bother though, do you often run in to solo moc shammies that play just to shear you? I don't think there is that many that do, and it definately isn't worth changing the game for the few.

 

[Asha]

But you're not making a point
People do things that ruin others fun all the time.
I almost never have a solo fight with my cleric, I've given up on the idea. Stealthers just always have to add, from one realm or another.
It doesn't mean you should remove something from the game.

You're trying to say that everyone can have buffs, even if they don't have a bot. I am trying to point out to you that for a buffing specced class it doesn't matter if you get buffs from a bot. Your argument makes 0 sense.

 

[Kagato]

Personally I think buff shears should not remove a buff but make it invalid for 1 minute/longer. Just make it red out like your immunity time, so your buffs will be ineffective until the duration has worn off and you cannot be rebuffed either as technically you still have the effect its just waiting to come back.

This way it will still offer the same effect, still stack with debuffs, still be good in FG rvr if not stronger because you cannot be rebuffed until the timer is up but it wont ruin the winners game or the soloers life because after the battle the buff will eventually come back again.

 

[Vladamir]

Personally I think buff shears should not remove a buff but make it invalid for 1 minute/longer. Just make it red out like your immunity time, so your buffs will be ineffective until the duration has worn off and you cannot be rebuffed either as technically you still have the effect its just waiting to come back.

This way it will still offer the same effect, still stack with debuffs, still be good in FG rvr if not stronger because you cannot be rebuffed until the timer is up but it wont ruin the winners game or the soloers life because after the battle the buff will eventually come back again.

No fun when i mocshear zergers then

 

[Chronictank]

No fun when i mocshear zergers then

actually mate you underestimate its effect,
timered buff shearing means you can shear more than once, if it worked like a champion debuff something like a s/c shear will take away their con and they dont get the health back soon as they are no longer "sheared" do it again :X
you could shear someone to death!
the only problem would be that all the whine would result in immunity timers, making shears pretty useless after the first cast going back to pre-shear shammys for example which quite frankly were boring to play

 

[Congax]

No fun when i mocshear zergers then

Update your sig, you slag!

 

[Vladamir]

actually mate you underestimate its effect,
timered buff shearing means you can shear more than once, if it worked like a champion debuff something like a s/c shear will take away their con and they dont get the health back soon as they are no longer "sheared" do it again :X
you could shear someone to death!
the only problem would be that all the whine would result in immunity timers, making shears pretty useless after the first cast going back to pre-shear shammys for example which quite frankly were boring to play

True but theres no fun in shearing a soloer after they've boated to a zone knowing they'll just get them back

Attack a support class and you should pay tbh!

 

[Eregion]

Personally I think buff shears should not remove a buff but make it invalid for 1 minute/longer. Just make it red out like your immunity time, so your buffs will be ineffective until the duration has worn off and you cannot be rebuffed either as technically you still have the effect its just waiting to come back.

This way it will still offer the same effect, still stack with debuffs, still be good in FG rvr if not stronger because you cannot be rebuffed until the timer is up but it wont ruin the winners game or the soloers life because after the battle the buff will eventually come back again.

It would make it really ridicolous(sp?) in fg fights. Wouldn't be so bad though if you were able to rebuff it during that 1 minute timer.

 

[Asha]

Personally I think buff shears should not remove a buff but make it invalid for 1 minute/longer. Just make it red out like your immunity time, so your buffs will be ineffective until the duration has worn off and you cannot be rebuffed either as technically you still have the effect its just waiting to come back.

No. It's not the same. It's totally different. The point is that clerics who are buff specced can rebuff in combat. It's part of your spec. It's not like there are loads of soloing de-buffers anyhow. You all whine too much, seriously.

 

[Cadelin]

yer asha ive said a couple of times your arguement is valid. but also Ive said several times that im talking about players that have no intenstion of fighting back just buff sheer and sit etc (after a couple of /laughs).

I don't see what the problem is tbh. You get free rp. Surely you have to go back to your buffbot every 10 minutes to get your resist buffs back? It can't be far away either because if it was you would be out of range of DI. Also don't you need to wait 15 minutes between each fight to get all your arti charges/realm abilities/ML abilities back?

I pay my subs and I do what I like which is to play on a classic server. I might re-activate my buffbot account just to go buffsheer a few people though, it sounds fun.

 

[ebenezer]

Personally I think buff shears should not remove a buff but make it invalid for 1 minute/longer. Just make it red out like your immunity time, so your buffs will be ineffective until the duration has worn off and you cannot be rebuffed either as technically you still have the effect its just waiting to come back.

This way it will still offer the same effect, still stack with debuffs, still be good in FG rvr if not stronger because you cannot be rebuffed until the timer is up but it wont ruin the winners game or the soloers life because after the battle the buff will eventually come back again.

I think this is a really good idea tbh

 

[Vodkafairy]

I think this is a really good idea tbh

i don't, because the people who spec for buffshears are also those who rebuff. shearing and rebuffing people midfight is a vital element of grp rvr and it would be stupid to remove it.

i do agree with buffshears being 'temporary' though - but it should be on a very long timer, like 5 minutes - with the ability to be rebuffed.

 

[Kagato]

No. It's not the same. It's totally different. The point is that clerics who are buff specced can rebuff in combat. It's part of your spec. It's not like there are loads of soloing de-buffers anyhow. You all whine too much, seriously.

Of cause its the same, if your buff spec'd your spec'd for shearing too and your advantage and utility here comes from being able to shear the enemies buffs.

The only differance with my idea is that you will be even more powerful in FG because they cannot get their buffs back until the timers up.

However the buffs are not completely lost because they timer will even eventually and they will become active again, every body wins.

You just have your personal vendetta against BB's and wont accept anything else.

 

[Vladamir]

Of cause its the same, if your buff spec'd your spec'd for shearing too and your advantage and utility here comes from being able to shear the enemies buffs.

The only differance with my idea is that you will be even more powerful in FG because they cannot get their buffs back until the timers up.

However the buffs are not completely lost because they timer will even eventually and they will become active again, every body wins.

You just have your personal vendetta against BB's and wont accept anything else.

That totally defeats its use though against solo fights as a shammy. You shear your opponent, whether you win or lose they're down on buffs. Theres no fun in it if they get them back after a minute. Would also make kiting take even longer

 

[Asha]

You just have your personal vendetta against BB's and wont accept anything else.

Yes I have a vendetta against bbots
Funny that I've been using them alot longer than you and iirc you used to complain about them aswell. I don't have a problem with bbots. I have a problem with everyone constantly whining about everything. :touch:

What you're suggesting doesn't work. Buff shearing adds another dimension to the game for buffing classes. This includes rebuffing mid-fight. That makes the buffer important to have in the group. It makes people want to group them and since it's very difficult for them to solo, this is important.

I don't think a class should be nerfed to suit those who choose to run solo with the bonuses of a bot. I think people should be encouranged to play with "group classes" not given more ways to avoid them. I think if you want your buffbot buffs instead of playing with a real player, then you should have the consequence of running back to your bot if you get sheared by a real player. If that constitutes a vendetta, whoop-de-do-da.

 

[Kagato]

Yes I have a vendetta against bbots
Funny that I've been using them alot longer than you and iirc you used to complain about them aswell. I don't have a problem with bbots. I have a problem with everyone constantly whining about everything. :touch:

What you're suggesting doesn't work. Buff shearing adds another dimension to the game for buffing classes. This includes rebuffing mid-fight. That makes the buffer important to have in the group. It makes people want to group them and since it's very difficult for them to solo, this is important.

I don't think a class should be nerfed to suit those who choose to run solo with the bonuses of a bot. I think people should be encouranged to play with "group classes" not given more ways to avoid them. I think if you want your buffbot buffs instead of playing with a real player, then you should have the consequence of running back to your bot if you get sheared by a real player. If that constitutes a vendetta, whoop-de-do-da.

Your wrong, I never complained about buffs, I said I enjoyed killing people who were buffed before I had a BB myself, as it felt good, just like killing higher level players before I was 50. Back then this was possible before perfect templates and spellcrafting.

And my suggestion is not a nerf, it actually makes buff shearing more powerful for the actual fight, therefore making the buff-shear classes more important. However theres also no longterm penalty for the sheared player after the fight is over.

 

[Vodkafairy]

And my suggestion is not a nerf, it actually makes buff shearing more powerful for the actual fight, therefore making the buff-shear classes more important. However theres also no longterm penalty for the sheared player after the fight is over.

the thing you suggest is to take away skill from fights, yeah, good plan!

...or maybe not

 

[Kagato]

the thing you suggest is to take away skill from fights, yeah, good plan!

...or maybe not

errrrr...wtf?

 

[Congax]

errrrr...wtf?

Fast rebuffing is a vital part in fg rvr, one who can rebuff faster, has more advantage. Not being able to rebuff kinda sucks then.

 

[Asha]

Your wrong, I never complained about buffs, I said I enjoyed killing people who were buffed before I had a BB myself, as it felt good, just like killing higher level players before I was 50. Back then this was possible before perfect templates and spellcrafting.

Then why don't you enjoy killing people when you're buff sheared one or two buffs ha.

And I do remember it but you're lucky bw is gone

 

[Andrilyn]

So basically it comes down to Censi attacking a solo support character, killing it but losing a few buffs in the process, therefor shearing is lame but attacking a solo support character which can't fight back other than MoC1 shearing is "cool".

 

[TheBinarySurfer]

Kagato, just a note and i dunno if you can be arsed to do it of course, but your siege guide could do with an update with towers being repairable now etc

Its a good little beginners guide and i keep pointing some of the less experienced and the odd rare new (!) players who ask me NF questions at it, but it's slightly dated now.

 

[TheBinarySurfer]

So basically it comes down to Censi attacking a solo support character, killing it but losing a few buffs in the process, therefor shearing is lame but attacking a solo support character which can't fight back other than MoC1 shearing is "cool".

TBH i find it hilarious - especially if youre goign to be really harsh and slap a stun on them from the minstrel while they get totally sheared by the cleric, then mezzed by the sorc, then we run off again.

Irritates the shit out of me when it happens to me but don't stop me doing it

 

[Muylaetrix]

Getting slightly annoyed by the goold-old 'You're a stealther you can pick your fights so its fine!'. Probably the most stupid argument ever.

i dunno, some factors descide whether you can pick fights or not.

speed, CC, stealh are about the most important of those i guess

I think the good old argument of `you have stealth, learn to pick fights you can win` is one of the most valid ones in the game.

A class without CC, speed, stealth has no way of avoding a fight that is incomming.

If you can`t outfight it, outrun or avoid it.

Unless a stealther gets uncoverd by someone, he dies cause he fucked up, err miscalculated the odds, or got plain unlucky

that`s probably why chars like ice wizards fears the open field like a vampire fears the sun.

If you can`t choose your fight, at least move yourself into a position where you have 1 advantage.