Politics Scottish Independance?

[old.user4556]

It's not wrong, but it fails to show the fact the whole of Europe is in the shit.

 

[old.user4556]

Just read that the oil hub (Aberdeenshire council) is to be run by a lib dem, Tory and Independent coalition.

Howzat slugface.

 

[Jeros]

Being lured back down England with the possibility of a tech job in what is pretty much Greater London.......hmm, would rather avoid England for the rest of my life if I can....

As far as the conservatives in England go, do they even want to get reelected? Considering with the tuition fee rises middle class family's are now having to pick which kids to send to uni and which not to as the family earns "to much" for their kids to get any kind of support. Paying a fifth or more of your total family income to send your kid to uni is just not financially possible for some people.

Way to piss of your voter base torys, even more galling when the parents in question are formally poor working class people who got free education a few decades back and now can't even send there own kids to uni despite working so hard to get them to that point.

 

[throdgrain]

Being lured back down England with the possibility of a tech job in what is pretty much Greater London.......hmm, would rather avoid England for the rest of my life if I can....

As far as the conservatives in England go, do they even want to get reelected? Considering with the tuition fee rises middle class family's are now having to pick which kids to send to uni and which not to as the family earns "to much" for their kids to get any kind of support. Paying a fifth or more of your total family income to send your kid to uni is just not financially possible for some people.

Way to piss of your voter base torys, even more galling when the parents in question are formally poor working class people who got free education a few decades back and now can't even send there own kids to uni despite working so hard to get them to that point.

Sometimes it's not just about buying your votes, it's about doing the right thing for the country.

 

[Wij]

Just reminded me. I got a letter back from my MP today. Have to dig it out to see what it said...

 

[cHodAX]

Just reminded me. I got a letter back from my MP today. Have to dig it out to see what it said...

The European Court for Human Rights have rejected your appeal on the grounds that you do not qualify as human?

 

[Jeros]

Because why should we (English) have to pay for our prescriptions whilst other countries in the Union don't, Why should I/your children have to pay £9,000 for Uni, whilst Scotland still pays £3,000, Why should EMA be scrapped in England, but not in other countries in the 'Union'?

You know Scottish students pay £3,000 for uni fees, but if I go to Scotland for Uni, I have to pay more?

Union, - fo sure, control from the Capital of the Union, Equality ffs.

Scots don't pay tuition fees, only people from outside the EU or the rest of the UK do.

http://www.saas.gov.uk/faqs_fees.htm

Fine by me tho. I don't mind paying, I am a stranger to this land after all.

 

[Tom]

Being lured back down England with the possibility of a tech job in what is pretty much Greater London.......hmm, would rather avoid England for the rest of my life if I can....

As far as the conservatives in England go, do they even want to get reelected? Considering with the tuition fee rises middle class family's are now having to pick which kids to send to uni and which not to as the family earns "to much" for their kids to get any kind of support. Paying a fifth or more of your total family income to send your kid to uni is just not financially possible for some people.

Way to piss of your voter base torys, even more galling when the parents in question are formally poor working class people who got free education a few decades back and now can't even send there own kids to uni despite working so hard to get them to that point.

Oh for God's sake, anyone who doesn't understand how the new tuition fees work is far too thick to go to university, so frankly they can fuckoff and vote Labour if they want to.

The fact is that without Scotland, the Labour Party would be utterly screwed.

 

[rynnor]

Oh for God's sake, anyone who doesn't understand how the new tuition fees work is far too thick to go to university, so frankly they can fuckoff and vote Labour if they want to.

The fact is that without Scotland, the Labour Party would be utterly screwed.

Actually it costs so much to administer the loans that there's little difference between the loans and just giving them the money.

 

[Ormorof]

the parents arent paying for the loans but they will very likely be subsidising living costs (food + rent etc) as the "basic" loan is not enough to cover the cost in most places

that cost hasnt really changed that much so the change in student loan amounts shouldnt really affect their decision

 

[cHodAX]

Actually it costs so much to administer the loans that there's little difference between the loans and just giving them the money.

Finally, someone with a clue.

 

[old.user4556]

So, given that we Slugface is a fuckwit, we need a pro-union fuckwit to counteract the nationalists.

Oh look! Fuckwit Galloway steps in! This will be entertaining to say the least.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/p...ence-battle-with-alex-salmond-86908-23857735/

 

[rynnor]

So, given that we Slugface is a fuckwit, we need a pro-union fuckwit to counteract the nationalists.

Oh look! Fuckwit Galloway steps in! This will be entertaining to say the least.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/p...ence-battle-with-alex-salmond-86908-23857735/

Galloway is far worse than Slugface tbh - he used a campaign based on telling the muslim community that his main opponent was a drinker and other lies - hes completely sectarian.

I dont think you really need a single person to oppose the independance call - just people to ask all the difficult questions and then let people decide for themselves.

 

[old.user4556]

Galloway is a massive fud, but it should be highly entertaining nonetheless .

 

[Wij]

Galloway added he would even be willing to campaign alongside Scottish Labour leader Johann Lamont, whom he has described as “totally unelectable” and likened to James Bond villain Rosa Klebb.

How does he get away with just insulting people? Sure it's mildly amusing but other MPs would be hounded out of office for any mild insult that might even be a bit sexist.

 

[Hawkwind]

I really really hope it never happens - its such a nightmare mess and however you divide things up neither side will be happy.

I also dont welcome the idea of a permanent conservative govt in the rest of the uk - its just not healthy.

Not sure about that for one reason, the incomming Government spend half their tenure undoing what the previous lot did. Like the Cons having to pay off the debts Labour left behind. If we had a stable government for 20-30 years they might actually accomplish something useful.

 

[DaGaffer]

Not sure about that for one reason, the incomming Government spend half their tenure undoing what the previous lot did. Like the Cons having to pay off the debts Labour left behind. If we had a stable government for 20-30 years they might actually accomplish something useful.

All the evidence suggests the contrary. Power corrupts etc. It happened to the Tories in the John Major years (and late Thatcher years), and it happened to Labour as well. In the Tories' case it was sleaze and back handers, in Labours' it was state control and Nanny everything that wasn't nailed down. Evidence from other countries suggests its a common pattern; look at Fianna Fail in Ireland for a particularly stark example, but you see it all over the place; Berlusconi would be another good example, Putin another.

 

[throdgrain]

All the evidence suggests the contrary. Power corrupts etc. It happened to the Tories in the John Major years (and late Thatcher years), and it happened to Labour as well. In the Tories' case it was sleaze and back handers, in Labours' it was state control and Nanny everything that wasn't nailed down. Evidence from other countries suggests its a common pattern; look at Fianna Fail in Ireland for a particularly stark example, but you see it all over the place; Berlusconi would be another good example, Putin another.

Hate to say it, but much as I'd like a right wing government forever, I like as not agree with this.

 

[Hawkwind]

All the evidence suggests the contrary. Power corrupts etc. It happened to the Tories in the John Major years (and late Thatcher years), and it happened to Labour as well. In the Tories' case it was sleaze and back handers, in Labours' it was state control and Nanny everything that wasn't nailed down. Evidence from other countries suggests its a common pattern; look at Fianna Fail in Ireland for a particularly stark example, but you see it all over the place; Berlusconi would be another good example, Putin another.

Take a look at the tiger economies with long standing governments they seem to do very well. Like I said each Government spends half their time rewriting the previous lots major changes. Basically means you don't move forward. I can see your point though, the cons got to the point where they were doing more harm than good. What followed it though, was a complete bloody disaster for the UK's fortunes.

 

[DaGaffer]

Problem is those Tiger economies aren't, in the main, democracies. They look like democracies, but they're not. Personal freedoms aren't high on their list of priorities, and their wealth distribution is even more imbalanced than our own. They can be attractive to an expat who has no particular interest or stake in the country, but they ain't so great for the locals.

 

[Hawkwind]

Fair enough, Singapore is a good example of that. Very controlled society that looks fine from the outside.

 

[Poag]

And so it begins....
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-18162832


Theres also another cool article....
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-18104012

"We talked about the fact that we hadn't had a British warship built in a foreign country for the last 50 years, so we wouldn't necessarily start that in the future should Scotland become independent."
The Scottish government accused UK ministers of "scaremongering" over the future of Scottish shipbuilding.

 

[rynnor]

The thing that should worry all sensible folk is that there's no unequivocal figures for independance and many basic questions are currently un-answered.

It seems pretty strange to ask people to make a very important decision based on extremely incomplete information?

 

[Raven]

Isn't that what his entire campaign is built on though?

Oh and a bit of a man crush on Mel Gibson's Braveheart.

 

[Chilly]

I've yet to see an article which lays out the basic economics of the situation. Which direction does the net flow of money go? Is there a net flow? Why would an English military build it's ships in a foreign country? Quite right we strip them of the contracts, bring them to hull or liverpool or southampton or whatever.

 

[Poag]

I dont think any really knows the economics as its all tied up in various UK budgets. But the general consensus is money flows into Scotland, not from it. So they'd have to make up that inflow from somewhere else, and the world can only drink so much Whiskey.

The withdrawal of the Navy ship building and bases also represents a significant drop in money "in". I'd expect those ship builders to move to where the work is tho, so probably northern England somewhere.

 

[rynnor]

Oh and a bit of a man crush on Mel Gibson's Braveheart.

Is that why they launched the Yes campaign in a cinema? Nationalistic rhetoric eh - if he starts talking about a master race it's time to get outta there

 

[Tom]

I have this mental image of Robert the Bruce on a horse, about to accept his kingship. Except Angus Macfadyen's face has been replaced by Salmond. And instead of saying "You have bled with Wallace, now bleed with me", he says "You have fed with Wallace, now feed with me". Then they all run to a table filled with deep-fried Mars bars and munchyboxes, and trough their faces.

 

[opticle]

Sometimes it's not just about buying your votes, it's about doing the right thing for the country.

I think the right thing would be not encouraging every adolescent in the country to go to university to study fuck all for 3 years in some random location that shouldn't even have a university.

In the past you could do a lot without a degree. Now you're pretty shafted for a lot of things unless you can afford to be hugely in debt.

There is no reason for so many degrees out there. My friends have studied most of them.

That's a key reason why fees are going up (anecdotal)- after Tony's "Education, Education, Education" and drive for everyone to have a degree. But no one can back track on that now because they'd lose so many votes.

Was this thread about Scotland ? I like Scottish people. I just wish they liked me more

 

[DaGaffer]

I've yet to see an article which lays out the basic economics of the situation. Which direction does the net flow of money go? Is there a net flow? Why would an English military build it's ships in a foreign country? Quite right we strip them of the contracts, bring them to hull or liverpool or southampton or whatever.

Depends how you account for the oil. And since Shetland and Orkney (thanks G) could claim some of that, then the books look pretty shaky. Without the oil, definitely an inflow of money from England, but Salmond seems to think renewables will make up for the decline of oil revenue, but that's a load of bollocks.