Politics Scottish Independance.....Thoughts?

[Gwadien]

The cut, split, chop-up and allocation of assets and liabilities is still up for negotiation. I do not see how iScot can walk away from it's share of the debt personally.

I don't understand how the 'share' will be worked out, shirley it won't be based on population?

 

[Hawkwind]

IF they moved it they won't move it to England anyway - they'd move it to the City.

Who gives a fuck anyway? It's just not *that* big a deal in the scheme of things when you consider what else is going on...

True, just one getting a lot of media attention this morning. Reading today about a Scottish GP's comments on organ donor issues once they split from UK NHS. From what I could gather they are expecting to have access removed from the UK register. Severely limiting the prospects of those Scots who need such an Op.

 

[Hawkwind]

I don't understand how the 'share' will be worked out, shirley it won't be based on population?

But that is exactly how iSalmond wants the debt issue handled 8.3%. Although, reportedly he more recently said he wouldn't pay at all and what would the UK do about it, invade!

 

[old.user4556]

I don't understand how the 'share' will be worked out, shirley it won't be based on population?

But that is exactly how iSalmond wants the debt issue handled 8.3%. Although, reportedly he more recently said he wouldn't pay at all and what would the UK do about it, invade!

That's correct, it's to be split based on population as Hawkwind says.

He's only refusing to get his way with a currency union. That seems like staring into a huge, black abyss to me.

Remember - negotiations still need to take place. I could see the SNP doing a u-turn on Trident and saying "well, we'll keep your nuclear deterrent if you let us keep the pound".

 

[Scouse]

Reading today about a Scottish GP's comments on organ donor issues once they split from UK NHS. From what I could gather they are expecting to have access removed from the UK register. Severely limiting the prospects of those Scots who need such an Op.

It's just scaremongering. There's no way that donor lists would be affected - it'd be pretty simple to say business as usual there:

"you can continue to use our dead people's corneas if we can use yours"...

"no"

"why?"

"Because David Cameron is trying to fuck the Scots over and make life hard for Salmond"

"what a cunt eh"

"yeah, bet you lot are glad you voted for independence eh? We're stuck with the twat and his cronies "

"ha-ha! Yeah! We'll do a liver-sharing deal with Norway and Iceland instead"

"Bastard. They're going to start charging us for our transplants too..."

"I know, that's why we left..."

 

[Hawkwind]

So you're saying the UK people would not allow RBS / Lloyds to operate in iScot, yet they already have offices around the globe including RoE? Why would rUK say "you can operate out of Dublin, but we're not letting you operate out of Edinburgh" other than sheer spite that Scotland declared independence?

If you believe this will be sorted out in a practical business manner I think you're in for a shock. Bring the politics and public opinion in to this and an election next year, it is going to be a very acrimonious. iScot is saying a big FU to the UK and I would expect the UK would back anyone with a manifesto willing to play hardball on the major issues.

Do you also believe that the MOD will continue to allow BAe to build ships on the Clyde? Or keep the current 55000 jobs going in an iScot?

Wind Farms were mentioned earlier built with mainly UK taxpayers money, does that mean they will still own 91.7% of those when they are running? Of course not, but it is going to be bloody messy sorting this shit out.

 

[Gwadien]

That's correct, it's to be split based on population as Hawkwind says.

He's only refusing to get his way with a currency union. That seems like staring into a huge, black abyss to me.

Remember - negotiations still need to take place. I could see the SNP doing a u-turn on Trident and saying "well, we'll keep your nuclear deterrent if you let us keep the pound".

Why would the UK allow Trident to stay in Scotland too?

Surely that's jobs for people in the UK?

 

[old.user4556]

If you believe this will be sorted out in a practical business manner I think you're in for a shock. Bring the politics and public opinion in to this and an election next year, it is going to be a very acrimonious. iScot is saying a big FU to the UK and I would expect the UK would back anyone with a manifesto willing to play hardball on the major issues.

Do you also believe that the MOD will continue to allow BAe to build ships on the Clyde? Or keep the current 55000 jobs going in an iScot?

Wind Farms were mentioned earlier built with mainly UK taxpayers money, does that mean they will still own 91.7% of those when they are running? Of course not, but it is going to be bloody messy sorting this shit out.

I'm under no illusion that this will be an amicable business deal!

BAE have stated that it'll be "bleak" for the MOD in iScot.

Re Wind Farms paid with UK tax payers money, that's a much more complex discussion, because you've got the tax take from oil and gas going straight to Westminster. You're right though, where do you start and stop drawing lines for "who paid for what, and who gets it?"

Why would the UK allow Trident to stay in Scotland too?

Surely that's jobs for people in the UK?

Believe me, you can take Trident, good riddance to it. The problem is that if iScot declares independence, then they need to be out by 2020 - that's an aggressive timescale at best, not to mention the multi billion pound cost to rUK to set up an equivalent in rUK somewhere.

As a resident of rUK, would you be happy with the £100 billion to renew Trident and then the multi billion pound cost to house it somewhere? Can you see now why Yes is so appealing? Just think what we could achieve without that unnecessary cost.

 

[Job]

For the love of God - guys, why would they throw iScot under a bus when:

View attachment 20026

That is a global map of where RBS group operates both in markets and in services. Why would an independent Scotland make RBS say "fuck this, LETS MOVE TO ENGLAND" when a) they're already there! b) they're an international company dealing in many currencies c) it wouldn't make a fucking difference considering the already established foreign operations?

Yes bit not of those countries are facing an unregulated currency with no lender of last resort to back it up..who the living fuk is going to invest in Scotland...they are obviously banking on England giving in because we can't let Scotland fail.

 

[Hawkwind]

stuff about NHS."

I hope so, but fearing the worse. The iScot approach seems to be we will keep hold of the good bits we want, like access to UK Organ Donor List and blood banks etc. but for issues that have big costs associated its a big FU! I can see the politicians using this to whip up some nationalism votes. Because if Salmond gets away with half of what he saying the UK will be out of pocket massively on a very one-sided deal. Political suicide for anyone signing that on the UK side.

 

[Hawkwind]

As a resident of rUK, would you be happy with the £100 billion to renew Trident and then the multi billion pound cost to house it somewhere? Can you see now why Yes is so appealing? Just think what we could achieve without that unnecessary cost.

Just for interest:
https://www.rusi.org/downloads/assets/201408_OP_Relocation_Relocation_Relocation.pdf

Recent reports suggest moving the Tridents to two locations would be a lot cheaper than first thought. The Renewal program has to happen regardless.

 

[DaGaffer]

That's mostly down to the fact that the result actually matters, I would expect a similar figure from a European referendum. In a general election it doesn't really matter who you vote for, the result is the same.

If voting was mandatory then parties would be created to suit what people want, or parties would set policy to what people want.

Australia has compulsory voting; politics is still shit over there.

 

[Scouse]

lender of last resort

You mean a made up bank that makes up money?

It's easy. They open a building, paint "central bank of scotland" on it, and hey-presto! Central bank made.

 

[Tom]

A lot of these threats to move to England sound like Paul Daniels circa 1997.

 

[Scouse]

This makes for interesting reading, including @Raven's point about "meet the new boss"...

the large political parties on both side have got it wrong, ignoring Britain's past experience and misrepresenting the future. The Scottish Nationalist Party alongside Labour, Conservatives and Liberal Democrats have all promised to defend the interests of oil companies. For 30 years, the UK's North Sea model has functioned as a form of corporate welfare, delivering massive profits to multinationals and minimal public benefit. With the second weakest tax system in the world, the UK collected only $21.50 per barrel of oil in 2008, compared to Norway's $48.50 - less than half

 

[Gwadien]

Believe me, you can take Trident, good riddance to it. The problem is that if iScot declares independence, then they need to be out by 2020 - that's an aggressive timescale at best, not to mention the multi billion pound cost to rUK to set up an equivalent in rUK somewhere.

As a resident of rUK, would you be happy with the £100 billion to renew Trident and then the multi billion pound cost to house it somewhere? Can you see now why Yes is so appealing? Just think what we could achieve without that unnecessary cost.

Nope, I'd love to see Trident scrapped, but it seems we 'need' it for some other bullshit reason, and what I'm saying is, I can't see our Government letting it stay in Scotland, especially with the amount of jobs that go with it.

 

[Raven]

It wont stay in Scotland even if GB wanted it to, The Scots want to get rid of it and the thousands of jobs secured by it. Which included all the ship yards dependant on it. It wont be profitable for them to stay there without the navy.

 

[old.user4556]

Expect defence (land, air and sea) to get filleted and thrown out if it's a Yes vote.

 

[Hawkwind]

Isn't iSalmonds plan for UK to basicaly rent a jointly run airbase and navalbase in iScot. Also that the UK basically gifts iScot 5 typhoons and some frigates? Sure I read that somewhere recently.

 

[old.user4556]

As I said above, a share of assets and liabilities will be split on negotiation after a Yes vote.

 

[Job]

That stupid fat wanker riding on the back of armchair fake kilt wearing braveheart idiots will fuck it up and then slope off when the shit hits...Scotland is allready a divided nation and this is going to make it about a hundred times worse.

 

[old.user4556]

Every nation is a divided nation one way or another.

 

[ECA]

I don't see the yes winning as much as I'd like to see it happen.
Although seeing Salmonds face when he gets the result would be literally the greatest thing I think I could see for a few weeks.

 

[Scouse]

I don't see the yes winning as much as I'd like to see it happen.

Yeah. Shame. Need to shake the politicians out of their slumber.

No wins = more of the same for the next 100 years.

 

[Hawkwind]

Heavy price to pay to slap the political systems arse Scouse.

 

[Ormorof]

Or endless referendums until they vote yes like Lisbon treaty in ireland

 

[Scouse]

Heavy price to pay to slap the political systems arse Scouse.

Cheap. Because it doesn't involve revolution, the military or police getting in people's faces or epic levels of death.

 

[Hawkwind]

Ok Wolfie!

 

[Embattle]

Actually they say it won't stay exactly the same if Scotland gets more powers then there has to be changes in England.

 

[MYstIC G]

RBS aren't really a Scottish bank per se, they are (Currently) a British bank where most of their customers are in England (or at least public customers) and are majority owned by the British government. Scotland would probably get a share of the bank on independence or they will likely sell the shares in it beforehand.

Either way it would probably make sense for them to move South of the border post independence as with any other bank. (not that they have said so yet)

Why would they get a share of fuck all if there's no agreement on debt? The other one that cracked me up was the gold reserves. Yeah you can have something of large value and stick everyone else with the bar tab. If Scotland was a person they'd be the cunt nobody invited who still turned up anyway.