Patch=ragnarök

[Ogrelin Blodig]

For christ sake STOP Whining!

If your bored of DAoC just stop playing! There's plenty of other games to play!

I will continue to play becouse I enyoj the game and the people I have choosen to spend my onlinetime with. I couldn't care less if they nerfed my characters....

It's quite easy, enter your subs password and cancel the renewal.....

 

[Platina]

No dmg-dealers against BoF/SoS? I think you should take casters into your group 'cause BoF doesn't work against PBAE and DD-spells.

Go and buy yourself a bit of knowledge please.

/Cathul

Yet another dumb ass.

 

[rivan]

well savage nerf as well needed imo; i think savages being so blatently overpowered in both pve and rvr, grouped and solo, had a detrimental effect on rvr for all three realms.

albs/hibs got pwned by them, and a lot of mid classes got left at mtk unable to get a group, because of them.

if i remember correctly, the last relic raid alb did on mid.exc met very, very little resistance even though there were plently of players in Svasud Faste, because they were all waiting for savages and healers to make 'fotm' groups- an unfortunate and damaging habbit a lot of mids have fallen into. [i hope everyone is mature enough to not use that comment as a new relic rant]

with regards to realm abilities, it would be nice to see something along the same lines (with respec to utility in rvr) of BAoD, BoF, GP, SoS being given to some of the more neglected mid (not really including unusual setups) rvr classes (rm/sm/bd/thane) to compete with alb/hib RAs, and have the added bonus of promoting a little more variation in groups.

savage nerf or no savage nerf, mid casters still have that long, long wait outside of mtk.

-riv

[ps: i deleted my savage a long while back]

 

[Platina]

No dmg-dealers against BoF/SoS? I think you should take casters into your group 'cause BoF doesn't work against PBAE and DD-spells.

Go and buy yourself a bit of knowledge please.

/Cathul

Ok then u tell me how the fuck are we supose to keep ouer casters alive ? whit thurgs 1 minut pets humping ouer suportclasses and a MA train whit BoF/Sos not like u can slam someone in MA train then, is hard as a warrior to try block vs dual classes as it is ? ehe.
And yes if u and ure friends like to farm cash ore Pve etc. this patch wount hit u as hard. And i dont doubt Mid will manage well in rvr maby we come up whit some new kinda setup who knows? but if we do Toa will put a End to it wery soon anyway forcing people (me) to do someting they dont like/want to do anymore.


2.Read my first post before start flaming me.

How many mids will stay and how many will leave the game after patch? as i know alot of people will quit/change realm couse of the patch. so gues albs/hibs will have fun now.

This was a way for me to try get a hint on how many that would leave between patch/toa.(noone seemed to understand that tho, agree must been my bad english)

3.Ogrelin before posting and telling me to stop whining, u play the game whit ure friends etc, so do i but we onley rvr, thats what we like about this game, and whit this patch 1 more nerfbat slaps midgård while albs gets boosted.(unusal right) and as i said in post before this one i agree on savage should get fixed!!



4.Now i CBA to read ore post more on this thread, some people seems to enojoy flaming others etc. and im fed whit it tbh.Specaly from people that dont play the game as i do/like.

5.Sycho yes im sad couse u havent rvr much last week! :wub:

6. fore all others u can my :kissit:

Removes my self from the evul forum world.

 

[GReaper]

Ok then u tell me how the fuck are we supose to keep ouer casters alive ? whit thurgs 1 minut pets humping ouer suportclasses and a MA train whit BoF/Sos not like u can slam someone in MA train then, is hard as a warrior to try block vs dual classes as it is ? ehe.

We haven't even got 1.65 quite yet and someone is already moaning about the 1 min Theurgist pets!

 

[Krissy]

arnt the pets very weak?

Dont see the issue if they are.

And btw Ive NEVER seen anyone kill my air theurgists pets when they are attacking suport classes and i spam alot of them, so ur whine seems pritty missplaced considering no one use to kill them anyway.

If u wanted no pets, u would kill the casters faster instead of watching them cast imo.

 

[Platina]

arnt the pets very weak?

Dont see the issue if they are.

And btw Ive NEVER seen anyone kill my air theurgists pets when they are attacking suport classes and i spam alot of them, so ur whine seems pritty missplaced considering no one use to kill them anyway.

If u wanted no pets, u would kill the casters faster instead of watching them cast imo.

OK this one i have to answer lol. Dont post any stupid answers if u havent read the other posts.!

 

[Platina]

No dmg-dealers against BoF/SoS? I think you should take casters into your group 'cause BoF doesn't work against PBAE and DD-spells.

Go and buy yourself a bit of knowledge please.

/Cathul

This was what he said and this is what i answerd so didnt whine on ure uggly little pets. i have no trubble usaly whit them.
Answer:
Ok then u tell me how the fuck are we supose to keep ouer casters alive ? whit thurgs 1 minut pets humping ouer suportclasses and a MA train whit BoF/Sos not like u can slam someone in MA train then, is hard as a warrior to try block vs dual classes as it is ? ehe.


Was the fact that it would be hard to play a caster group vs alb rvr groups.
big diffrence in keeping caster > tanks alive dont u agree ? people should read before posting imo. just qwote smthing from a long post and make a whine of it is just ZzZ

 

[Rookiescot]

Was the fact that it would be hard to play a caster group vs alb rvr groups.
big diffrence in keeping caster > tanks alive dont u agree ? people should read before posting imo. just qwote smthing from a long post and make a whine of it is just ZzZ

Harder to keep casters alive than tanks.
ergo....
Harder to keep cloth wearers alive than chain wearers.
ergo....
Harder to keep sorc alive than healer.
ergo....
Mid has superior CC.
ergo....
NERF MIDS MORE !!!

 

[Appendix]

Besides we get 6s stun, zerk has 2h ratmode+ap.(don't bother quoting and arguing against me i have played a 50 zerk and 50 bm too, all are very near each other's potentials of killing, light tanks are probably daoc's most balanced set of classes amongst the realms)

Yes they have similar killing potential, but the mercenry has better armor and better survivability in the field. With theurgist buffs a mercenary closes the gap to the other light tanks damage wise (or even surpasses). Giving the mercenary access to an anytime stun just sounds like icing on the cake on an already strong class. We will see how this works out in reality...

Played a zerk after nerf too...still very good class, can't see what the problem is?maybe because it doesn't hit 600+ constantly mids call it gimps?xD or because savages are so overpowered compared to them?which seems the case.

The problem with the zerker is the nerf was too heavy for many players to deal with. Most zerkers had based their strategy on pure frontload damage with no or little +qui. With the nerf they found themself being outdamaged by almost every other tank class in the game. Understandably they felt like they no longer could fulfill their role as main damagedealer, especially with savages now competeing for the same RvR-spots.

Personally I think the zerker is still one of the most important mid tanks thanks to PF and the lack of them in RvR is hurting us more than we know.

Also savages are still best tank in the game in 1.65....

Really?
Then explain why there isn't a savage group on this server that can beat the best alb melee groups? Savages may be the hardest hitting melee class in the game but they still can't touch the highly defensive abilities of alb melee groups. High defensive abilities combined with hard hitting tanks like mercenaries and armsman is far more effective in RvR than soft cushy savages with slash vulnerable armor and no PF. The savage assist group is totally gimp compared to merc assist groups in my experience. Mostly thanks to the superior alb group abilites and RAs.

And for god's sake, please stop comparing classes vs. classes. You got to look at the bigger picture and see that albs have far more utility in their groups than mids have.

 

[Ilum]

Then explain why there isn't a savage group on this server that can beat the best alb melee groups?

I can give you a few reasons...

The best Alb melee groups often run with 2 RR10 Mercenaries.

Rest of the group is often RR9-RR10 too.

It's comprised of people who have played with eachother a lot. And most of them have come a far way in mastering the abilities of their classes.

And Faderullan has been a great leader of the top Albion group for a long time. You have no equivalent of him in Midgard as far as I can tell. It makes a lot of difference to have such a person leading an RvR guild for a long period of time. Consistency.

There's also been a bit of experimenting with different classes, like the addition of the Theurgist for example.

I honestly think that the best Albion group (which would be Faderullan's group) taps a larger potential of their group than the Midgard groups.

 

[Sycho]

And for god's sake, please stop comparing classes vs. classes. You got to look at the bigger picture and see that albs have far more utility in their groups than mids have.[/QUOTE]



Complete and utter bollocks.

Read my other post on my view of all 3 realms, yes that's from playing experience not from one realm's point of view or from some twat who says this and that is overpowered without even playing the realm at lv50 and in rvr.

You do not need PF, get a good shaman and it's like a free PF and besides add insane damage to that...

 

[Whisperess]

And for god's sake, please stop comparing classes vs. classes. You got to look at the bigger picture and see that albs have far more utility in their groups than mids have.

I found this one really funny

Albion utility is spread out on many more classes than it is for Midgard, thus making it harder to fit that into 1fg while still retaining decent damage output / survivability. ( Mainly thanks to Healer/Shaman for being very high utility classes that also fit great into any group setup. )

Not saying that 1fg is the only way to play, but perhaps you should reconsider your group setup if you find Midgard lacking utility in a group?

I agree with the "stop comparing classes vs classes" part though. That's only really viable for stealther classes.

 

[Appendix]

I can give you a few reasons...

The best Alb melee groups often run with 2 RR10 Mercenaries.
Rest of the group is often RR9-RR10 too.

And the best savage groups are RR8-10 or so... (EL)
They still can't beat alb melee.

It's comprised of people who have played with eachother a lot. And most of them have come a far way in mastering the abilities of their classes.

And Faderullan has been a great leader of the top Albion group for a long time. You have no equivalent of him in Midgard as far as I can tell. It makes a lot of difference to have such a person leading an RvR guild for a long period of time. Consistency.

Yes of course alb success is thanks to skill, mid success is thanks to savages being overpowered. BS, there is plenty of RvR knowledge in midgard in several guilds so thats not the issue here.

There's also been a bit of experimenting with different classes, like the addition of the Theurgist for example.

This is what I'm saying, the alb group has so much utility they can even afford to replace one tank with a caster and still increase their RvR efficiency. The theurgist adds more to the group than a 3rd merc or armsman would.

I honestly think that the best Albion group (which would be Faderullan's group) taps a larger potential of their group than the Midgard groups.

I agree, faderullan's group have 4 people following assist as well as having 2 casters in the group. No mid melee group can come close to the potential damage output that group has, including savage groups. Even without 2xBof and SoS that group would be a tough match for even the best mids. With all those RA's they are more or less unbeatable as it stands now.

The biggest drawback mids are facing atm is no real anti-CC ability. Albs have SoS and Hibs GP. That's also one of the reason you hardly see any mid casters in RvR.

Our group has been struggling to find a good RvR group for some time now and have finally opted for a caster group just for the fun of it. We know we won't be able to beat the best alb or hib groups though unless we're very lucky.

 

[Ilum]

And the best savage groups are RR8-10 or so... (EL)
They still can't beat alb melee.

They dont have RR10 Savages. Do they even have RR9 Savages?

Yes of course alb success is thanks to skill, mid success is thanks to savages being overpowered. BS, there is plenty of RvR knowledge in midgard in several guilds so thats not the issue here.

Of course Mids know a lot about RvR too. But my point is Fader has had a consistent top notch group for a long period of time, and you dont have anyone like that.

Although sometimes I'm quite shocked to see the level of incompetence in some Mid groups (hint: Arid video ;p)

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Don't think I've heard a single Mid try to argue that savages don't need a nerf yet to hear Albs whine you'd think that Mid consisted of only one class.

Same old same old. You can get 100 people on a keep raid and if there's 1 savage in it Albs lost the keep because of overpowered savages.

Its also true of Alb that they have classes that are stronger than they should possibly be with some crackerjack RAs on top yet they clutch them to their breasts and defend like kids with their favourite toy engine.

The Mids that are leaving are not leaving because of just 1.65 but because the perception is of a series of changes to the character mechanics which continually shift the game not just to balance Alb but to favour it. This is readily apparent on the US servers where Mid is the underdog for the most part now.

In truth, all realms have strengths and weaknesses which is what it should be. The problem that Mids have is that their strengths are being eroded and Alb weaknesses gradually removed with very little apparent compensation.

For every Mid complaint I'm sure there is a counter argument because most people just take it as class comparisons rather than comparing the realm over all - and what generally happens is that they just pick random strengths from other realms that bug them, rather than actually being reasonable about it.

The only thing that Mid really has compared to the other two realms now is a couple of classes with higher utility than other realms because we have fewer classes to spread them out amongst and a single class that is damn hard to kill 1v1 but isn't too good at anything else. I'm afraid thats pretty much it.

Whether Albs and Hibs choose to accept it or not, the damage has been done and many Mids will leave. Its not all qqfotmnerf - when you put a lot of time and effort into a class and you see it on the nerf-boost rollercoaster it is annoying to see it weakened. And btw, not everyone who made a savage wanted to be uber, some people actually just like the way it plays as it is a light tank with a lot of options and ways to do stuff.

I know people will pick and choose individual sentences or comments here so they can ignore the larger argument. It is after all, the way of these forums.

But spare a thought for the Mids that simply liked the way their classes played and have watched what they can do get eroded/screwed or changed beyond recognition over time.

 

[Ilum]

All in all, Faderullan's group got the current advantages that you have to take into consideration.

1) Highest realm rank group on Prydwen
2) 20% melee bonus from strength relics
3) People that have grouped longer and more with eachother than other guilds
4) Psychological upper hand

Agree with that atleast?

 

[Evina|Andy]

You forgot to mention Rambo group
High RRs, peeps play in LAN, using BBs etc.
:wub:

 

[XeffoInfil]

Wait to 1.68 and Albs will leave when TS/SH/IP/FH and much more gets taken of game....Scouts it´s time to retire the Bow same With hunters/Rangers who uses TS/sh!

And minnys loose the SoS to...u happy

WTF?!

 

[Loch]

Don't think I've heard a single Mid try to argue that savages don't need a nerf yet to hear Albs whine you'd think that Mid consisted of only one class.
Same old same old. You can get 100 people on a keep raid and if there's 1 savage in it Albs lost the keep because of overpowered savages.

If you failed to take a keep with 100 people tbh, then there's something seriously wrong ;o

Its also true of Alb that they have classes that are stronger than they should possibly be with some crackerjack RAs on top yet they clutch them to their breasts and defend like kids with their favourite toy engine.

Aye, all alb classes are much better then their mid counterparts. OH WAIT! No offence but mebbe you need to rvr to actually see the imbalance between a 'FotM' mid group, and an alb group of the same genre. 2-3 savages can kill Septina(sorc) and Sami(theurg) even with BoF up and me chain healing. Balanced? if you say so.

The Mids that are leaving are not leaving because of just 1.65 but because the perception is of a series of changes to the character mechanics which continually shift the game not just to balance Alb but to favour it. This is readily apparent on the US servers where Mid is the underdog for the most part now.

In other words, Waaaa! I lost my toy! I quit :< Considering this is a RvR discussion, comparing current EU trends to the US is laughable, as the US run around with their 'leet' gank groups of 3 lw heros, and haven't heard of guard yet :<

In truth, all realms have strengths and weaknesses which is what it should be. The problem that Mids have is that their strengths are being eroded and Alb weaknesses gradually removed with very little apparent compensation.

Aye, like insta-pbaoe disease, insta mez(no matter how much you slag it off, it still provides a small advantage if you get the jump on a group.. lasts ~11-15 secs on me, thats enough to kill 3 support if no one has purge up. Insta stun, skald with insta snare.. OLOL etc, I mentioned skalds, shoot me :< However it's stil good for snaring targets that the assist train needs to kill, since savages thankfully dont get pf. I'd go on but this paragraph is getting too long

For every Mid complaint I'm sure there is a counter argument because most people just take it as class comparisons rather than comparing the realm over all - and what generally happens is that they just pick random strengths from other realms that bug them, rather than actually being reasonable about it.

There's always a counter argument because most of the time, mids on pryd whine about the smallest thing when they lose.. admittedly BoF and SoS aren't exactly small things, but we can easily beat most mid guilds without them. Alb is uber? Not really, just the mids don't play well.

The only thing that Mid really has compared to the other two realms now is a couple of classes with higher utility than other realms because we have fewer classes to spread them out amongst and a single class that is damn hard to kill 1v1 but isn't too good at anything else. I'm afraid thats pretty much it.

Best tank in the game(savage, still unarguably the best even post nerf. Tried playing one? Or are you just commenting on general whine?) Best CC defense in the game( insta heals, chain, healing ability, all 3 cc types, etc etc, all on a class which you normally have 3 of. Overpowered? Not really, just exceedingly useful, 'specially when combined with PR every 30 mins. Best class for kiting in fg fights (shaman, nuff said.) Oh look, those 3 combine 7/8 places in an 'opted' mid group! Shock!

Whether Albs and Hibs choose to accept it or not, the damage has been done and many Mids will leave. Its not all qqfotmnerf - when you put a lot of time and effort into a class and you see it on the nerf-boost rollercoaster it is annoying to see it weakened. And btw, not everyone who made a savage wanted to be uber, some people actually just like the way it plays as it is a light tank with a lot of options and ways to do stuff.

No, I really think most of these mid posters are 'qqing' because they can't wander around and randomly 2-3 shot anything their f8 buttons tells them too. If you notice, most of them played sbs, some played zerks, and all whine about savages being 'nerfed' when in fact it's a small fix compared to the general awesome damage output of the class. I'm speaking from experience btw, having both faced and killed on pryd by them and playing one on mid/excal, which is in a considerably better state then you make out all midgard realms on all servers are.

I know people will pick and choose individual sentences or comments here so they can ignore the larger argument. It is after all, the way of these forums.

But spare a thought for the Mids that simply liked the way their classes played and have watched what they can do get eroded/screwed or changed beyond recognition over time.[/QUOTE]

I imagine smite clerics liked the way they played, I imagine spirit cabalists, mana chanters loved the way their classed played, I imagine that infils love the way they play atm. BUT SHOCK, not many other people do. So you'd prefer for all realms to have blatantly overpowered classes, just because you enjoy playing one? Eheh.

Anyway, thats my 2 cents, if anyone thinks up a decent reply I'll be happy to read it.

 

[Sycho]

When i saw JH or NP on excal i never seen a mid guild played so good in a long time(since warders and MM), seriously if a mid guild runs their best tanks, all high rr's like PE and everyone knows what they doing they can wipe the floor with albs and will give PE a good fight for sure.(this is NOT my way of suggesting how every mid should play it's just a comparison to the previous post)

I haven't been in a guild group in ages, but when i join a group lately the best savage groups are tough due to maybe the things ilum stated(not that high rrs, different people each time etc).

One person doesn't change a group, all eight players do.
Buffs do not make a group win always.
Classes doesn't always show a person's skill, playing different ones and still doing good maybe does. Oo

In the end, guild groups beat 90% of groups with ease.

 

[sami]

waddel

stop spamming loch x<

 

[Zil]

funny how mids whine on pryd about albs owning them
and albs whineing on excal about mids owning them

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Loch...

If you failed to take a keep with 100 people tbh, then there's something seriously wrong ;o

Not if its defended

Aye, all alb classes are much better then their mid counterparts. OH WAIT! No offence but mebbe you need to rvr to actually see the imbalance between a 'FotM' mid group, and an alb group of the same genre. 2-3 savages can kill Septina(sorc) and Sami(theurg) even with BoF up and me chain healing. Balanced? if you say so.

lol... 2-3 savages asissting on a sorc can kill it... er, I should bloody hope so: its a low hp caster class - healing and pbt aren't meant to be invulnerability

In other words, Waaaa! I lost my toy! I quit :< Considering this is a RvR discussion, comparing current EU trends to the US is laughable, as the US run around with their 'leet' gank groups of 3 lw heros, and haven't heard of guard yet :<

I don't see any relevence in this comment.

Aye, like insta-pbaoe disease, insta mez(no matter how much you slag it off, it still provides a small advantage if you get the jump on a group.. lasts ~11-15 secs on me, thats enough to kill 3 support if no one has purge up. Insta stun, skald with insta snare.. OLOL etc, I mentioned skalds, shoot me :< However it's stil good for snaring targets that the assist train needs to kill, since savages thankfully dont get pf. I'd go on but this paragraph is getting too long

Here we go again. Picking a few random things that Mids have that is good. Its a tired old argument: the various mezzes of each realm are good in different situations. The whine gets generated because people want their mez to be uber in all situations. Shammies have the insta pbae disease because its the only escape spell they have: unlike other support or caster classes they have nothing to give them a chance to get away except for this.

There's always a counter argument because most of the time, mids on pryd whine about the smallest thing when they lose.. admittedly BoF and SoS aren't exactly small things, but we can easily beat most mid guilds without them. Alb is uber? Not really, just the mids don't play well.

Agreed, those RAs are not small things. The thing Mids complain about is that there isn't anything approaching any of the group RAs given to Alb and Hib.
I didn't say Alb is uber. I said that its strengths were being strengthened over time and its weaknesses removed, while Mid only has strengths removed for the most part and all but insignificant improvements here and there.

Best tank in the game(savage, still unarguably the best even post nerf. Tried playing one? Or are you just commenting on general whine?) Best CC defense in the game( insta heals, chain, healing ability, all 3 cc types, etc etc, all on a class which you normally have 3 of. Overpowered? Not really, just exceedingly useful, 'specially when combined with PR every 30 mins. Best class for kiting in fg fights (shaman, nuff said.) Oh look, those 3 combine 7/8 places in an 'opted' mid group! Shock!

I was actually referring to bonedancers when I was talking about a class that was hard to kill 1v1. I say hard rather than impossible because most enemies don't have the wit to think it through before fighting because they are used to F8, stick, thwack, thwack which doesn't work on Bonedancers.

Regarding insta heals, druids also have these. You saying Alb's primary healing class doesn't have these as well as spread heals? The reason you need 3 healers in a group is that they all must be different spec for full effectiveness. Albs just see 3 of the same class and whine OVERPOWERED not understanding that the different spec completely changes the function of the class with very weak crossover into the other specs.

No, I really think most of these mid posters are 'qqing' because they can't wander around and randomly 2-3 shot anything their f8 buttons tells them too. If you notice, most of them played sbs, some played zerks, and all whine about savages being 'nerfed' when in fact it's a small fix compared to the general awesome damage output of the class. I'm speaking from experience btw, having both faced and killed on pryd by them and playing one on mid/excal, which is in a considerably better state then you make out all midgard realms on all servers are.

That sounds like your average inf, not your average Mid tbh.

I imagine smite clerics liked the way they played, I imagine spirit cabalists, mana chanters loved the way their classed played, I imagine that infils love the way they play atm. BUT SHOCK, not many other people do.

Even Albs agreed smite clerics were way overpowered and were basically wizards in chain. Mana chanters for RvR are unchanged except for heat debuff which is one of the things that, again, everybody pretty much agreed made them overpowered. At no point do I say that each realm should be populated by only overpowered classes.

So you'd prefer for all realms to have blatantly overpowered classes, just because you enjoy playing one? Eheh.

rofl Dark SM overpowered. I'd imagine most Mids are pissing themselves laughing at that comment

 

[Ilum]

lol... 2-3 savages asissting on a sorc can kill it... er, I should bloody hope so: its a low hp caster class - healing and pbt aren't meant to be invulnerability

Loch was referring to when BOF was up, kinda important part of the statement.

rofl Dark SM overpowered. I'd imagine most Mids are pissing themselves laughing at that comment

And Loch wasnt talking about your class, she was talking about other overpowered classes.

 

[harm]

Now THIS is entertaining

 

[p0x]

That sounds like your average inf, not your average Mid tbh.

Please, even Deadly Shadows plays better than any current mid/pry guild :<
Seeing people like JH kill everything without even trying... You all really, REALLY suck.

And so does this thread.

 

[Whisperess]

funny how mids whine on pryd about albs owning them
and albs whineing on excal about mids owning them

Spot on accurate

 

[Loch]

Please, even Deadly Shadows plays better than any current mid/pry guild :<
Seeing people like JH kill everything without even trying... You all really, REALLY suck.

This was my point, only more polite

 

[Pudzy]

Havent read the whole of this thread, first 2 pages or so.. savage does have ananytime behind stun of abotu 1.5secs? and a side chain also, but the class did need a nerf, I'm not saying this cos I'm an alb, I've said it since I played one, and I was one of the first to 50, dueling Divine to test damage etc. Anyways, if like Aldrick suggested, savages made to combat Ra's like Sos/BoF etc, whats gona happen soon.. since aLL RA's are being scrapped and redone, its been confirmed, I just hope Determination is nerfed personally, rediculus Ra, throughout all the realms. Anyways, I wouldn't worry about savages, they're still belting out more damage than people can heal for in MA groups , the mid RA's are utter bollocks, PR is only decent thing imo they ended up with as a unique RA and thats not exactly great.