No "griefer" classes in Warhammer

[Golena]

Zerg v Zerg games don't always have to be boring aoe fests, they are in DAoC mainly because of the bad way they are designed for that.

People enjoy playing in 8v8 fights more than in solo fights. There's no reason that can't be extended to 40 v 40 as well.

What you need to do is get rid of the idea of realm points for killing X, leading to aload of people depsreately nuking anything that moves in order to get their quota, and instead give rewards based on completing an objective.

Remove realm points from DAoC and instead give RR's for capturing keeps/towers. You'd suddenly see much greater cooperation between players in the game, since your no longer competing with the person next to you for the 1k realm points on offer, but relying on his abilities to help you beat the opposition and get the reward. It would actually become a true realm v realm battle, not a bunch of adders trying to steal each others kills, since helping the people around you gets you all the reward.

It's probably less good for the e-peen forum wannabies, but a much better system for the casual gamers, which make up a much greater proportion of the gaming comunity than many people here would like to believe. It also greatly encourages grouping with randoms rather than the issolated pockets of communities that currently exist in DAoC and lead to many people quitting yelling LFG at the portal keeps.

 

[Golena]

He may not have intended for buffbots to become a problem, but he did next to nothing to address the problem on regular servers. So you'll have to forgive people for scoffing at your "there will be no buffbots in WAR" comment.

There may not be "buffing" classes in WAR, but i'll bet money on the fact that a combination of 2 classes is going to be more powerful than 1 class on it's own (it's called encouraging grouping). What they really need to get away from is one of those 2 classes being able to provide 98% of it's functionality without an active player at the controls.

If you look at the way DAoC is layed out at the moment, even without buffs, having a healer stuck to your tank in PvE reduces downtime by a mamoth amount, without the healer having to really be "played".

The first way to get rid of bots would be to have no where safe to park them.. Bots on camlann are much less of an issue I believe simply because they are very easy to kill. Removing the /stick command would also go a long way to making them less attractive.

 

[psyco]

Zerg v Zerg games don't always have to be boring aoe fests, they are in DAoC mainly because of the bad way they are designed for that.

People enjoy playing in 8v8 fights more than in solo fights. There's no reason that can't be extended to 40 v 40 as well.

What you need to do is get rid of the idea of realm points for killing X, leading to aload of people depsreately nuking anything that moves in order to get their quota, and instead give rewards based on completing an objective.

Remove realm points from DAoC and instead give RR's for capturing keeps/towers. You'd suddenly see much greater cooperation between players in the game, since your no longer competing with the person next to you for the 1k realm points on offer, but relying on his abilities to help you beat the opposition and get the reward. It would actually become a true realm v realm battle, not a bunch of adders trying to steal each others kills, since helping the people around you gets you all the reward.

It's probably less good for the e-peen forum wannabies, but a much better system for the casual gamers, which make up a much greater proportion of the gaming comunity than many people here would like to believe. It also greatly encourages grouping with randoms rather than the issolated pockets of communities that currently exist in DAoC and lead to many people quitting yelling LFG at the portal keeps.

you have such great idea's... shame we disagree on alot though

 

[Konah]

A good call imo. No spineless invisible pussies spoiling other peoples fun. If u wanna play warhammer you'll have to roll a visible class... OMG THE HORROR!

 

[Gahn]

you don't agree that he's more interested in marketing a forthcoming gaming and smoozing potential customers than communicating with his current paying customers?

you don't think it's hypocritical to slag off the pay for items model other companies use whilst raking in money from buffbots on regular servers?

I would also probably disagree with your opinion, but you havent bothered to post one.

shrug indeed.

That's pretty obvious u know, it's called business since Daoc is a down curve game, War has huge potential instead -.-

 

[liloe]

It's probably less good for the e-peen forum wannabies, but a much better system for the casual gamers, which make up a much greater proportion of the gaming comunity than many people here would like to believe. It also greatly encourages grouping with randoms rather than the issolated pockets of communities that currently exist in DAoC and lead to many people quitting yelling LFG at the portal keeps.

Which is wrong.

Let's make a comparision. A friend of mine at university played WoW, which might be compared cause it also involves zerging at some point etc.

So now guess what he told me. "I love all people and like to play with everybody." ? I don't think so. It was more like: "I'm not going to raid that with noobs" - "Make good groups and raid that, no people in crap equipment" etc.etc. you get the point. So even in a PvE game you have people yelling LFG and nobody cares.

In every game you have average people just doing stuff and having fun with it and you have high-end gamers (who also have fun with that) just that the high-end gamers get called pricks as general when one of them is behaving like an idiot. Then again there're also average gamers who behave like that, yet nobody says average gamers are pricks (I exclude the high-end idiots here).

People are being total hypocrits when saying that they're so good and accept the "way the game is meant to be played", yet totally ignore the fact that others might just want to play it differently for their fun.

What if people started accepting that there is more than one way to play a game and that people can have fun with each? And I do mean everyone here, from every type of player. Just cause people run "fg" they're not pricks and just cause people zerg they're not mindless.

If you look at the way DAoC is layed out at the moment, even without buffs, having a healer stuck to your tank in PvE reduces downtime by a mamoth amount, without the healer having to really be "played".

Removing the /stick command would also go a long way to making them less attractive.

An a long way to piss people off when having to travel a longer time.....

And why shouldn't a healer stuck to your ass make PvE easier? What else does a healer do in PvE? Buff up and then cast healing spells, lol. The point is, you catch aggro and then you just heal with your 2nd comp, job done. You can do that cause mobs are just AI and act after a scheme. You cannot do that in real RvR, so I don't see the problem in PvE. I generally agree on bots though, but only as long as the balance remains (please no stat buffs, thx).

 

[Zede]

Daoc from the very start was supposed to be a war - big fights with lots of people. The community especially on pryd decided this was not to be the case, and 8 vs 8 was born.

Absolutely no reason why this cannot be the case on Warhammer. Its the people that make a game - and if entire guilds / grps of people from DaoC form guilds on WAR who have extensive 8 vs 8 knowledge...well

 

[Castus]

Which would you prefer, 100 Horners and Scarlatinas? 100 Denarius, Thorneas and Grimsters? 100 Porkbellys Kilsimbas and Chelseafc's?

LMFAO /REP

 

[Matriarch|Sneakers]

Why don't mythic and EA just get done with it. And just release a game where everyone is an OP caster that can 1 shot anyone else. So it is all a matter of who clicks the f8 and 1111 first. Then while we at it, why not just take away all nice gfx, scenary and stuff since tbh whats the point having all that when they force players to rvr at docks and bridges? Make one big white cube, where ppl can instant port every 15 seconds and instant kill eachother.

Atleast you know what you don't get when you don't buy it.

 

[Raven]

regardless stealthers are not the griefers, the true solo ones who put time and effort into their toon hit hard and give good fights, the zerging adding stealthers are free RPs.

the true griefers are the idiot casters with DI bots

 

[Matriarch|Sneakers]

Regarding the BB issue



How difficult would it have been to fix this BB issue after like the 2nd or 3rd patch 4 years ago???

Do you think it would have messed up the game then or summin?? (which wasnt designed to be played with buffbots, self buff lines on classes etc wasted)

They didnt "fix" BB's because it generated a lot of revenue (and still does) introducing a classic server like 4 years into the game (when they have already started developing their new game isnt the solution).

I do agree this is like only a spokesman quoting his boss type of thing (and to be honest the spokesman can accross as a right tit, to me anyway) but I dont buy that this guy is interested in anything other than money.

Haha you remb when they introduced the "you can only buff 20 ppl even if u still got conc" patch =)?

I'm sure that HELPED alot to fix the BB problem ;o

 

[Samaroon|Terracotta]

Why don't mythic and EA just get done with it. And just release a game where everyone is an OP caster that can 1 shot anyone else. So it is all a matter of who clicks the f8 and 1111 first. Then while we at it, why not just take away all nice gfx, scenary and stuff since tbh whats the point having all that when they force players to rvr at docks and bridges? Make one big white cube, where ppl can instant port every 15 seconds and instant kill eachother.

Atleast you know what you don't get when you don't buy it.

Maybe we'll get lucky and tanks in WoW will be like they were at the start of Daoc, big STRONG MEN with SHINY ARMOR etc ^^

 

[Sollac]

from what i have seen and read about warhammer online its gonna be more warhammer fantasy battle than fantasy role play. but hints of both will exist.

yes level your character, and then fight the enemy.

I thought blizzard was on the right tracks with the skill learning program, ie each character will be individual and unique.

looks like mythic are going the DAOC route ( obviously ), to make it your a dwarf you can only be choice a b or c.

Thing is stealth in the warhammer world was not invisibility, its was how undetecable you where whilst moving, slower you moves the less detectable you where. so the no stealther thing works.

hopefully they will use the revised warhammer magic system, which means spells will be levelled but also have a percentage change of blowing u up too ( like spell crafting in daoc) would love to see sorcs and bainshees blow them sleves up now and again.

main thing is warhammer spells of all kinds are ranged....so no buffbots locked in a keep.....

i hope they have the world right, easiest way i see warhammer world is a cross between the following films:

the princess bride, lord of the rings, and split second.

its a dark miserable world with a lot of nastiness out there, but peoples character is what makes the world what it is...

my views.

 

[Matriarch|Sneakers]

Maybe we'll get lucky and tanks in WoW will be like they were at the start of Daoc, big STRONG MEN with SHINY ARMOR etc ^^

They obviously havn't learnt their lesson. They are just as clueless to making balanced comp games as they were 5 years ago.

Mythic made the same misstake blizzard made in Diablo II expansion, you up the damage and change the existing balance, and while at it fucking everything up beyond repairable. I'm stunned that a multi-million dollar company like that can make such a grand fuck-up. It is as stupid as during a period of inflation to just print more money. Laughable tbh.

I mean when you make a game you need 1) a story 2) classes 3) balance.

Either you make a rock>scissor>bag>rock game or you make a game where its 100% balance and any class can if played correctly gain an upper hand in a fight vs any other class. Or you just do as mythic start off with the rock>scissor>bag>rock system then you introduce anthrax, nukes and napalm without any consern of the old system and what happend to the old classes.

I'm seriously stunned, and honestly wounder what was going on in the minds of the ppl that spawned that idea. The amount of fuck-ups during DAoC is beyond any resonable ammount when it comes to the choice of class balance and expansions.

Can't make up one single reason for why I should try out WAR at this current time.

 

[prodical]

great news tbh, i played my ns for abit and got zerg by ppl like shewsbury. i have a real passion against stealthers for this reason. means that ppl like shewsbury and dickheads like him will have too get skills and play visuals, altho these ppl may run 2fg's on stick aleast u can see em comming and maybe leg it the other way

 

[Dracus]

no more adding, leaching emoting retards woot.

You wont be playing??

/Dracus

 

[Golena]

Which is wrong.

Let's make a comparision. A friend of mine at university played WoW, which might be compared cause it also involves zerging at some point etc.

So now guess what he told me. "I love all people and like to play with everybody." ? I don't think so. It was more like: "I'm not going to raid that with noobs" - "Make good groups and raid that, no people in crap equipment" etc.etc. you get the point. So even in a PvE game you have people yelling LFG and nobody cares.

Yes there's people that won't want to play with other people, that's always going to happen. Your comparison was slightly flawed in that in WoW when people raided there was a set amount of loot to lotto out at the end I believe. This means that taking someone along who wasn't benefitting you reduced your chances of winning it, and so you didn't take them.

Look at ML raids on DAoC. Everyone gets credit when the mob dies, and people for the most part therefore work together with whoever turns up and does /bg join at the start. I've never seen someone kicked from a public BG ML raid because they didn't have a fully templated character. Now apply the same principles over to RvR and casuals can actually join in.

Sure there will be your 5 man team of RL friends who won't let people join in on their scroll farming plans, but that's not overly important because there's a 100 person BG they can join instead. It's not about making the l33t play wth the casuals.. it's about giving the casuals something to do together other than run about with rp numbers over their head for the l33t players to farm the way it is at the moment. The way RvR in DAoC is at the moment the BG type encounters don't really happen, mythic tried to do it with the realm missions and in the early days Alb actually did them as BG's and everyone got to be involved. They never made the realm points enough to actually sustain that type of RvR as viable however, along with the fact that seiging in DAoC is very poorly designed.. All you need to do is look at 50% of chars jobs during seige encounters and realise that a naked level 20 could perform the same job.. i.e. clicking FIRE every 15 seconds on their treb.

Look at the early relic raid days in DAoC.. everyone from a realm down to the level 40 characters were involved, and even if you made no difference as a level 40, people didn't shun you for it, in fact alliances called for EVERYONE to come defend or help take.. Make daily RvR follow those kind of rules and you have a proper mass war game. leet groups can go off from the zerg to avoid the noobs sure, but they can do so in a way that helps complete an objective.. stop people arriving from direction X for example, rather than just running about cursing the fact that it's not just them playing the game.

 

[liloe]

Not 100% correct either =) Sure you can do an ML raid with lots of people, but if you take less people with better equipment you can do the same thing. A smaller number with better stuff will always win over a bigger amount of people in crap gear and nothing can change that =)

 

[Olvoair]

regardless stealthers are not the griefers, the true solo ones who put time and effort into their toon hit hard and give good fights, the zerging adding stealthers are free RPs.

the true griefers are the idiot casters with DI bots

Do not agree, the sorc w a DI bb on stick is an annoyance but you can at least see it, or chose not to go close to his tower.

A RR11 mincer mezzing / or insta stun u, for his RR10 butt boi to PA when soloing on a visible, thats griefing. You cant see it, and you can not do a lot about it.

 

[Tallen]

regardless stealthers are not the griefers, the true solo ones who put time and effort into their toon hit hard and give good fights, the zerging adding stealthers are free RPs.

the true griefers are the idiot casters with DI bots

Unfortunately this is a bit of a generalisation and isn't always true, quite often i'll catch a known group-stealther on his own and it'll be a good close fight and the guy will stand his ground, also at times i have met so-called "soloers" and been very disappointed at how easily they die and how much they rely on bullcrap tactics like lag-dragging other players off bridge heads, los hiding above then below the water line and at times they are the ones who will run when they are losing....often in the direction of the nearest keep or zerg.

This is not another generalisation and obviously doesnt apply to all stealthers and may only apply to certain players one time out of a hundred, it just happens this way sometimes.

 

[Hauwyth]

Apparently Marc Jacobs thinks all stealthers are greifers and doesnt want that type of leet "FPS player" in warhammer. So no stealthers in warhammer.

Now if they also say there will be no buffbots, 99% of the DAoC community wont be playing WAR

 

[BloodOmen]

Well i for one couldn't care less.. i'm glad theres no leet kiddie class in the game... and if i'm not mistaken (Correct me if i am) warhammer is more about huge open field wars and such zerg like comings (EX albs will be so good at that)?

 

[Arethir]

I'm to druikn to undertsand anything someone please ecplaun!

 

[Arethir]

Or maybe i simply shoudln't read FH after i had something to drink, though things aer more ufnnoy now!

 

[Muylaetrix]

did that lad just say that stealhers are griefers ?

omg, warhammer sounds boring.

 

[Tallen]

Well i for one couldn't care less.. i'm glad theres no leet kiddie class in the game... and if i'm not mistaken (Correct me if i am) warhammer is more about huge open field wars and such zerg like comings (EX albs will be so good at that)?

Exactly, Warhammer is about faction combat and racial hatred, not much place for orcs and elves running around hand-in-hand hugging and kissing each other with the formidable battle cry "Don't add!"

 

[kivik]

Then you need to learn to pan
According to your statement Hibs would always win the CC war as they are the only ones with mach5 being present always in any group setup.

I always pan, not like it helps much when I have 0 speed. I don't understand why you drag CC war into the subject, had nothing to do with it. My point is that, like you can't see stealthers nor prevent them from attacking you, I sure as hell can't prevent FGs from attacking me or see them before it's way too late.

 

[kivik]

Exactly, Warhammer is about faction combat and racial hatred, not much place for orcs and elves running around hand-in-hand hugging and kissing each other with the formidable battle cry "Don't add!"

Think DAoC is about the same thing, more or less. Again, it's the players that choose how to play the game.

 

[Wazkyr]

Daoc from the very start was supposed to be a war - big fights with lots of people. The community especially on pryd decided this was not to be the case, and 8 vs 8 was born.

Absolutely no reason why this cannot be the case on Warhammer. Its the people that make a game - and if entire guilds / grps of people from DaoC form guilds on WAR who have extensive 8 vs 8 knowledge...well

If just we get all the nice daoc ppl on the same War server it would be alot easyer . All the zerglings could go where they wanted, and all the ppl prefering 8vs8 and 1on1 ect. could join the same server, and respect each other. Ofc other ppl who never played daoc would come to the server, but they would just get steam rolled as they interupted all the fair fights....
/dream off.

 

[Vipr]

Who cares about stealthing in WO......


I want this Bear killing skill hes rambling on about....