Politics Election 2019

Who will you vote for 2019 UK GE

  • Con

    Votes: 9 37.5%
  • Lab

    Votes: 3 12.5%
  • Lib Dem

    Votes: 9 37.5%
  • Brexit

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Other

    Votes: 3 12.5%

  • Total voters
    24
  • Poll closed .

Raven

Happy Shopper Ray Mears
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I quite clearly made no comment on foreign labour as being a commodity. Read what I posted, then respond.
 

DaGaffer

Down With That Sorta Thing
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Ergo - what was the fucking point of Brexit?
There was never any point to Brexit.

Except for the obvious response that we no longer have free movement of labour that we are unable to control, we can adjust import of labour as we wish. This is a fact, not opinion on whether that is right or wrong. It is what it is. You can "like" it all you like, it won't change reality.
You always had control, the UK just chose not to use it.

The failure of your plan is the paperwork and hassle isn't worth it for low paying jobs; all those Romanians will just go to Germany or Sweden instead with no fuss. It had already started to happen before Brexit, which is one reason why non-EU immigration had shot up; those immigrants were doing paperwork no matter where they went.

And @Scouse's "train up locals and pay them more" isn't going to fly either; you might be able to pay a bit more, but not much before you create inflationary effects, and even with training and more money there are jobs Brits won't do as long as they have a hole in their arse, like picking crops.

Basically, you're fucked.
 

Raven

Happy Shopper Ray Mears
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Yeah, except who the fuck wants to go to Sweden, it's cold and people speak bollocks as a language and nobody lives there.

"they" want to come to the UK because they and we speak English, and they know people here.

It's not as dramatic and international as people like to make it.
 

DaGaffer

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Yeah, except who the fuck wants to go to Sweden, it's cold and people speak bollocks as a language and nobody lives there.

"they" want to come to the UK because they and we speak English, and they know people here.

It's not as dramatic and international as people like to make it.
You really think people like farm workers rate living ten to a house in East Anglia for a few months over doing the same thing in Malmo?

"They" came to the UK because it was easy, and no matter what happens, the UK has made it much more difficult, not to mention the active hostility of large parts of the British population.
 

Raven

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Well, yeah...because that is exactly what they have been doing for the last 20 years. And it's not because of our cuisine (despite alleged hostility).

If they didn't like it then they wouldn't have come here, all things EU being equal and all that.
 

Raven

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Look at EU unemployment. Look at UK unemployment. Look at the languages you already speak vs chewing a wasp.

Pretty simple.
 

Raven

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Great stuff, a news report from a random. That's the issue resolved then.

They will come back, because why would they bother going anywhere else? Despite all the fashionable bollocks, the EU is a shit-tip. High unemployment, low wage. It's just not attractive...sorry :(
 

DaGaffer

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Well, yeah...because that is exactly what they have been doing for the last 20 years. And it's not because of our cuisine (despite alleged hostility).

If they didn't like it then they wouldn't have come here, all things EU being equal and all that.
But that's the point "all things being equal" you would choose the UK over other EU countries, but all things aren't equal any more.
 

DaGaffer

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Great stuff, a news report from a random. That's the issue resolved then.

They will come back, because why would they bother going anywhere else? Despite all the fashionable bollocks, the EU is a shit-tip. High unemployment, low wage. It's just not attractive...sorry :(
See above. There's also a driver shortage in the EU so wages are going up, and they can do a fuckton less paperwork driving inside the EU than dealing with UK bollocks.
 

Scouse

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I love how social media can show us just how fucking stupid MPs can be. How profoundly thick do you have to be to believe this?

View: https://twitter.com/johnredwood/status/1442368904056086544
He is a knobber, indeed.

However, I've sympathy to a point (not the "learning from amazon" - driving an HGV is a whole different affair).

However, it doesn't take long to train as an HGV driver. It's not beyond the ken of most people. But British people don't want to do it - it's not an attractive job at the wages being offered and is a lifestyle that most people don't want to live with.

But it's solveable in the medium term. More money = more drivers. (and more expensive goods, but maybe that'll make people think twice about buying plastic throwaway shit and start thinking about buying quality stuff that lasts for ages).
 

Scouse

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Two funnies. One from @DaGaffer who sees the essential truth of it and the other from @Raven who dismisses it as "European talks shit, because: EU, obvs."

Fact is, it's not really a problem in the EU as freedom of movement is solving their logistical problems by allowing workforce flexibility.
 

Scouse

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Can you get into the jeans you were wearing when you were 21?

If no, then you're officially "too fat for your own body", says science.


Which means that although I'm (on the cusp of) the correct BMI I've a couple of stone to go.

To be fair - the last time I felt physically great - from my joints, ankles, knees - to my internals (guts and all) was when I was 12.5 stone @ 6'2".

Although my brother in law did start calling me belson boy :eek:
 

Raven

Happy Shopper Ray Mears
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Two funnies. One from @DaGaffer who sees the essential truth of it and the other from @Raven who dismisses it as "European talks shit, because: EU, obvs."

Fact is, it's not really a problem in the EU as freedom of movement is solving their logistical problems by allowing workforce flexibility.
It's part of the problem, not the problem. The moment we realise that, the sooner we can do something about it. Waaaah, it's brexit is a fallacy. Unless ofc the UK exit from the EU is causing driver shortages in the EU too, that is. Who knows with frothy mouthed remainers.

Also, there was/is no problem with fuel, there never was. The problem was the media telling everyone there was, now everyone has a full car for the next 3 weeks it will be fine.
 

Raven

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Anyway, we were promised the end of days by now, and that was without the Rona. I realise that is disappointing to many, but oh well...
 

Scouse

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Anyway, we were promised the end of days by now,
On your driver point - the EU has shortages but freedom of movement means they can manage them. We no longer can, clearly.

As for "end of days" - nope - that's what brexiteers heard when sticking their fingers in their ears about the downsides of brexit. The people pointing out the actual problems - staff shortages, tarrifs, a race-to-the-bottom on legislative and environmental standards?

Well they're ALL here. Businesses shut because they cant get the staff (even near me in holiday-central at the busiest time ever known one of the local pubs is *shut* - despute queues of customers waiting up to an hour to get in other pubs - because he can't get staff.

And don't get me started on the shitshow of environmental legislation.

Basically the lie is the "end of days" la-la-la-la-la distraction. Remainers said a lot of things would get worse.

Well - they measurably have.
 

Gwadien

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Love it how people are blaming the people for the fuel thing, not the Government.
 

Raven

Happy Shopper Ray Mears
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No they can't, not without importing external workers. The whole of the EU is facing shortages.

As for the rest of it, nothing has actually changed. People still get up, go to work, buy what they like, when they like, do what they like. The only difference being, our number of people not doing that is getting smaller and better paid, the EU, not so much.
 

Raven

Happy Shopper Ray Mears
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Love it how people are blaming the people for the fuel thing, not the Government.
We didn't have a shortage of fuel drivers.
Fuel wasn't running out.
The government told everyone the above.

The Media: "Fuel shortage causes desperate scramble at the fuel court"
Everyone "Oh noes, better get some fuel"

Fuel companies: thanks for the extra cash, nice one.

The media started a story out of thin air and have been feeding off it for days now. Little effort, public panic, increased net traffic revenue, sales.
 
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Raven

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Effects of Covid aside and Tories being Tories (they were the same in the EU) ...what has actually happened?
 

Raven

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It's Brexit's fault that the DVLA don't have enough pencils.
 

DaGaffer

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Anyway, we were promised the end of days by now, and that was without the Rona. I realise that is disappointing to many, but oh well...
Ah, from memory that's stage 4 denial; "well at least its not as bad as it could be".

1. "Let's do something really bad and stupid"
2. "Let's now make the bad and stupid thing the worst possible version of the bad and stupid thing it could be"
3. "Let's now give the people who sold us the bad and stupid thing the power to "manage" the bad and stupid thing even though we all know they are also bad and stupid and actually evil"
4. "Mustn't grumble, it could be worse after all".
 

Bodhi

Once agreed with Scouse and a LibDem at same time
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Ah, from memory that's stage 4 denial; "well at least its not as bad as it could be".

1. "Let's do something really bad and stupid"
2. "Let's now make the bad and stupid thing the worst possible version of the bad and stupid thing it could be"
3. "Let's now give the people who sold us the bad and stupid thing the power to "manage" the bad and stupid thing even though we all know they are also bad and stupid and actually evil"
4. "Mustn't grumble, it could be worse after all".
No, having dealt with the DVLA before they're pretty bad, and shutting them down for 18 months along with the rest of society is now starting to look like a really stupid idea.
 

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