Politics Coronavirus

[Deebs]

On cummings - I would have sympathy for that but there are lots of glaring holes.

EG: how did his son safely get taken north when his wife had it, cummings probably had it? Stuck in the car with both of them? Six hour drive and they didn't stop with a four year old? Didn't touch him, in an enclosed space less than a meter apart?? Or did they send him by DHL?

To be looked after by old people? The trip to Barnards Castle? The lack of clarity in the justification (for a government this had to be bob-on to support their messaging - and for a government to not be crystal clear shows they have things to hide).

Nah. Not buying it. The job was stay at home but they wanted to stay at his dad's castle rather than a flat in london. And it looks like he couldn't even stay put then.

Then himsaying "he doesn't care how it looks?" The arrogance of the cunt in the face of 40,000 deaths when he's involved in policymaking and messaging!

He may very well be amazing at his job but his lack of empathy means he's not suitable to govern.

Isn't that the same as being stuck in a house? Maybe the windows on the car were wound down? Could have stopped at the side of a road to allow the child to have a piss, I know my mum did it for us and I have done the same thing for my kids when they were young.

Not old people, he also has other relatives (younger ie I think some nieces offered to help).

Agree with your comment about his response and I did mention that in my post.

Anyway, apply the same punishment, fine him, issue him with a warning and move on to other more important and pressing matters.

 

[Deebs]

I don't understand the uproar about young kids going back to school next Monday.

Is not that young kids all over the country have been going to school under the lockdown due to being those of key workers? Are we simply not rolling that out to more kids whilst ensuring social distancing and applying what has worked for the last 3 months?

 

[Talivar]

Think the School issue is that Boris and co have listed all the measures making Schools safe and the Unions and Schools are saying these measures are not in place yet, i.e the track and trace system as one glaring example.

 

[Deebs]

Think the School issue is that Boris and co have listed all the measures making Schools safe and the Unions and Schools are saying these measures are not in place yet, i.e the track and trace system as one glaring example.

But schools have been operating since the lockdown without track and trace effectively.

As long as they employ the same measures surely it is ok as you are just expanding the circle to cover more children? Also it is not every child in the UK going back at once it is certain years and with social distancing measures in place (ie reduced class sizes so I guess some kids will still be missing out).

 

[Scouse]

I think government officials need to be held to a higher standard @Deebs - but either way your suggestion may have had merit but the second Dominic Cummings said "I don't care how it looks" he should have been sacked.

If he can't comprehend how bad it looks and treat the public with respect then he's clearly not suitable to hold that position of responsibility.

I don't understand the uproar about young kids going back to school next Monday.

1) The scientists haven't modelled the government's plan - they modelled other scenarios but the government made this up. "Following science".
2) Young kids won't socially distance. Period. So they'll mix and bring it home.
3) Apparently the evidence is weak on the timing anyway.
4) What's the rush? Wait until September.

Why such young kids? - oh yes: school as childcare to get more people back to work. So they want to start with kids so young there's no hope of distancing - kids that, in some other countries, wouldn't be attending school for a few more years anyway.

Clearly it's an urgent priority to get these back in their classrooms

Mate of mine's missus is on immunosuppresants (Crohns) - her kid will not be able to (read: won't be) attending for obvious reasons.

That in itself has a load of drawbacks.

 

[caLLous]

Anyway, apply the same punishment, fine him, issue him with a warning and move on to other more important and pressing matters.

The same punishment as Ferguson or the Scottish CMO, both of whose actions were far less reckless than that of Cummings?

 

[Deebs]

I think government officials need to be held to a higher standard @Deebs - but either way your suggestion may have had merit but the second he said "I don't care how it looks" he should have been sacked.

If he can't comprehend how bad it looks and treat the public with respect then he's clearly not suitable to hold that position of responsibility.



1) The scientists haven't modelled the government's plan - they modelled other scenarios but the government made this up. "Following science".
2) Young kids won't socially distance. Period. So they'll mix and bring it home.
3) Apparently the evidence is weak on the timing anyway.
4) What's the rush? Wait until September.

Why such young kids? - oh yes: school as childcare to get more people back to work. So they want to start with kids so young there's no hope of distancing - kids that, in some other countries, wouldn't be attending school for a few more years anyway.

Clearly it's an urgent priority to get these back in their classrooms

Mate of mine's missus is on immunosuppresants (Crohns) - her kid will not be able (read: won't be) attending for obvious reasons.

See my other posts, schools have been operating in lockdown. As long as you expand the circle slowly (which they are from what I can gather) and employ the same methods which have worked under the lockdown what is the problem?

Surely it is the same as allowing certain sectors of business to slowly reopen?

 

[Deebs]

The same punishment as Ferguson or the Scottish CMO, both of whose actions were far less reckless than that of Cummings?

You could apply that to the 3 Labour MPs who also flouted the rules.

Either way to me it is not as important as people are making out. Also Cummings has always had a target on his back due to what he has achieved in the past, the Left and MSM were just waiting for him to make a mistake and behave like a pack of hyenas.

 

[Deebs]

I mean come on is this acceptable?


View: https://twitter.com/Michael_Heaver/status/1264618909400997890


I hope all these "journalists" are also called to be sacked for flouting the rules.

 

[Talivar]

@Deebs I think it will be a maths problem to begin with and just a case of making sure the number of children returning is not too many. It will not be an issue anyway as a lot of parents will just not send them. The schools will only really become a major issue if a child dies of Covid in first month or two and it is linked to catching it at School. If that happens then all will close at a guess.

 

[Deebs]

@Deebs I think it will be a maths problem to begin with and just a case of making sure the number of children returning is not too many. It will not be an issue anyway as a lot of parents will just not send them. The schools will only really become a major issue if a child dies of Covid in first month or two and it is linked to catching it at School. If that happens then all will close at a guess.

I agree and like I said they are going to enforce social distancing as they already do, so the number of kids will automatically be limited.

And yes many parents won't allow their kids to go to school but we will hit a stage where the Govt money schemes have to end as they are not sustainable. Then what? We have get the economy going so money can be earnt, taxes collected and for this to happen schools/child care must open at some point.

 

[Talivar]

What do we say to the parents of the children (if any) that die as a result? Sorry but it is for the good of the whole country?. Aslong as this fear remains then many will weigh the balance and put their child before the greater good. Ironically doesnt this tie into the Cummings saga? We are told to understand he did the best for his child and bent the rules to do so, so we should not be suprised when many parents make the same choice and defy the call to return their children to school. For many even 0.1% or whatever it is now is too much of a risk.
This is the elephant in the room that needs to be addressed, the rest of the issues are minor in comparision

 

[Embattle]

You are ignoring the other elephant in the room, a bad economy kills as well so it is a fine balancing act between the two so it can't be so absolute when it comes to child safety because quite frankly you are conceived into a risky environment.

 

[Deebs]

What do we say to the parents of the children (if any) that die as a result? Sorry but it is for the good of the whole country?. Aslong as this fear remains then many will weigh the balance and put their child before the greater good. Ironically doesnt this tie into the Cummings saga? We are told to understand he did the best for his child and bent the rules to do so, so we should not be suprised when many parents make the same choice and defy the call to return their children to school. For many even 0.1% or whatever it is now is too much of a risk.
This is the elephant in the room that needs to be addressed, the rest of the issues are minor in comparision

The parents will weigh up the risk to their own children and make their own mind up on whether to send them to school. Next week time will tell.

No country can stay on lockdown forever, it will cause more issues and deaths in the long term.

 

[Talivar]

I agree on the other dangers and damages staying closed does and being objective i can see the logic in getting things going asap. Despite all of that i would not send my own child back if she was still School age. Purely guessing but no parent or very few will place the greater good above their own childs health, but many do not really view the virus as a danger and they will be the first to send the kids back along with those who cannot cope with them anymore!

 

[Scouse]

I agree and like I said they are going to enforce social distancing as they already do, .

No chance with four year olds.

This is "fuck safety - we need childcare".

Kids'll be fine - but they'll be bringing corona home.

 

[Deebs]

No chance with four year olds.

This is "fuck safety - we need childcare".

Kids'll be fine - but they'll be bringing corona home.

But 4 year olds have been at school since the lockdown started or have you forgotten that key worker children have been at school for months?

 

[Scouse]

But 4 year olds have been at school since the lockdown started or have you forgotten that key worker children have been at school for months?

Maybe that's why our R rate is trending flat rather than dropping like in other countries?

 

[Deebs]

Maybe that's why our R rate is trending flat rather than dropping like in other countries?

Maybe it is the people flouting rules and going to beaches, The Range, parks and not enforcing social distancing rules?

 

[Bodhi]

Maybe it is the people flouting rules and going to beaches, The Range, parks and not enforcing social distancing rules?

From what I can tell the only reason R is high in some parts of the country is due to care homes, there is little community transmission of this any more. So little, Oxford are struggling to find infected people to test the vaccine on....

Coronavirus 'disappearing' so fast Oxford vaccine has 'only 50% chance of working'

Also bear in mind R can only be worked out retrospectively, typically 3 weeks in arrears.

As far as the Cummings stuff goes - crap optics, but from what I can tell he didn't actually do anything wrong. Jenny Harries mentioned in the presser on the 24th of March (iirc) that if both parents were ill then sorting childcare would be an exceptional circumstance - and it's strongly rumored on social meeja that his son is autistic. Makes the throngs outside his house and that screen Led By Donkeys magically found yesterday all the more excessive, but media gotta media I guess.

Either way, before the weekend most of the UK population were scared to go outside in case the nasty virus got them. Today social media is full of people going to see their families. Considering the story was sat on for at least a month, one can't help think - nudge, nudge.

 

[Wij]

As far as the Cummings stuff goes - crap optics, but from what I can tell he didn't actually do anything wrong. Jenny Harries mentioned in the presser on the 24th of March (iirc) that if both parents were ill then sorting childcare would be an exceptional circumstance - and it's strongly rumored on social meeja that his son is autistic.

He specifically said he didn't receive any childcare when in Durham.

He broke the rules. Everyone knows it and yet they still choose to lie rather than just say sorry.

 

[Deebs]

He specifically said he didn't receive any childcare when in Durham.

He broke the rules. Everyone knows it and yet they still choose to lie rather than just say sorry.

Maybe he went there as a, you know, a precautionary measure in case both he and his wife fell too ill to provide effective parenting/care to their child?

I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt if I was in that position I would have done the same as a parent.

 

[Deebs]

He specifically said he didn't receive any childcare when in Durham.

He broke the rules. Everyone knows it and yet they still choose to lie rather than just say sorry.

Also to add on March 13th (10 days before lockdown) I went to Boots to get my daughter milk for her newborn (they were down to their last few bottles worth and could not leave the house due to high risk) and then delivered it to her.

I would have done the exact same thing in lockdown, it's natural to protect your own family no matter what.

 

[Bodhi]

He specifically said he didn't receive any childcare when in Durham.

He broke the rules. Everyone knows it and yet they still choose to lie rather than just say sorry.

Which specific law did he break?

 

[Wij]

Which specific law did he break?

I didn’t say law.

 

[Bodhi]

I didn’t say law.

You said rules, which in this case means the law. So which law did he break?

 

[Wij]

Do not leave the house for any reason if self-isolating.

Do not go to second homes.

Do not visit family.

Etc...

 

[Wij]

“Essential travel does not include visits to second homes, campsites, caravan parks or similar, whether for isolation purposes or holidays. People must remain in their primary residence. Not taking these steps puts additional pressure on communities and services that are already at risk.”

 

[Deebs]

“Essential travel does not include visits to second homes, campsites, caravan parks or similar, whether for isolation purposes or holidays. People must remain in their primary residence. Not taking these steps puts additional pressure on communities and services that are already at risk.”

Yet on March 24th Dr Jenny Harris said at a presser:

“Clearly if you have adults who are unable to look after a small child, that is an exceptional circumstance."

 

[Deebs]

Yet on March 24th Dr Jenny Harris said at a presser:

“Clearly if you have adults who are unable to look after a small child, that is an exceptional circumstance."

I know at the time they were both able to look after their child but like I said above as a precautionary measure I would have done the same.