[RANT] BW are balanced!

[00dave]

Good point. I think destruction has several mirror classes that are stronger in compariosn with the order mirror class. Yet they cry about the BW.

I will only listen to a BW nerf when the destructionplayers crying for it suggest a nerf on one of their own classses.

I think everyone on the order side can agree with that.

 

[pikeh]

Heh, think it helps if you actually tell us what Destro classes are 'Overpowered', and exactly what mirror pairings do Destro beat Order at?
Marauders from what I have seen are pretty powerful.

 

[00dave]

Heh, think it helps if you actually tell us what Destro classes are 'Overpowered', and exactly what mirror pairings do Destro beat Order at?
Marauders from what I have seen are pretty powerful.

Yeah Marauders seem to have a lot of armour compared to the dps they can do. Destro tanks seem to piss over order tanks, but we all know about that problem. The DoK is the mirror of the WP unless I'm mistaken and seems to do a lot more dps. WEs get a lot of their abilities a long time before WH and they seems to be better. And Zealots seem to be able to out heal any damage being done to them no matter how much, 2 of them can keep a tank and themselves up during a full on zerg.

All my opinion btw

 

[klasa]

Heh, think it helps if you actually tell us what Destro classes are 'Overpowered', and exactly what mirror pairings do Destro beat Order at?
Marauders from what I have seen are pretty powerful.

On my server the win loss ratio is pretty even between destro and order. If you only nerf brightwizzards do you think that the relation will remain the same?

As i see it, to keep the overall balance, if you nerf the bright wizzard you might need to tone down maruders and witchelves.

Can you see my point?

 

[Tallen]

Yeah Marauders seem to have a lot of armour compared to the dps they can do. Destro tanks seem to piss over order tanks, but we all know about that problem. The DoK is the mirror of the WP unless I'm mistaken and seems to do a lot more dps. WEs get a lot of their abilities a long time before WH and they seems to be better. And Zealots seem to be able to out heal any damage being done to them no matter how much, 2 of them can keep a tank and themselves up during a full on zerg.

All my opinion btw

Zealot and Rune Priest are almost identical in terms of ability.

WE>WH i would agree and Marauder>WL as well, but only because the destro versions are a bit easier to play than their order counterparts. Destro melee classes seem to be easily playable by 2-3 button mashers, whereas order seem to be 3-4

 

[Turamber]

WE>WH i would agree and Marauder>WL as well, but only because the destro versions are a bit easier to play than their order counterparts. Destro melee classes seem to be easily playable by 2-3 button mashers, whereas order seem to be 3-4

Also DoK > WP -- DoK's procs go off a lot because of the duel wield and the amount of DPS they do for a healer class is somewhat OTT. They spank a WP 1 on 1 too.

And Chosen > Swordmaster. Swordmaster needs a lot of work. Originally a melee DPS class it was reworked to fill the gap left by the pulling KOTBS at release. And, much as I like my baby one, it certainly shows.

Shaman > Archmage. Archmage really suffers from lack of AP regen (so I am reliably informed by the horde of archmages in my guild!)

 

[klasa]

So we can conclude that us playing order can without a problem agree on BW's being toned down to perform on par with sorcerers IF destruction classes like DoK, Chosen, Shamans and Maruders are toned down to perfrom on par with their respective mirror class

 

[Lubbock]

So we can conclude that us playing order can without a problem agree on BW's being toned down to perform on par with sorcerers IF destruction classes like DoK, Chosen, Shamans and Maruders are toned down to perfrom on par with their respective mirror class

YAY Finally someone claiming Shamans are Overpowered, been waiting since lauch for this statement, please let me know how im overpowered
So Happy

But yes plenty of classes needing to get balanced

 

[klasa]

YAY Finally someone claiming Shamans are Overpowered, been waiting since lauch for this statement, please let me know how im overpowered
So Happy

But yes plenty of classes needing to get balanced

Did I say Archmages were OP? I said Shamans performing on par with Archmages.

 

[Lubbock]

Well if you want us to be downtoned, it must mean we are too powerfull, dont take the moment away from me

 

[klasa]

Well if you want us to be downtoned, it must mean we are too powerfull, dont take the moment away from me

you are OP

 

[Lubbock]

you are OP

Thanks made my day

 

[00dave]

Just think destro guys every time you are beaten by your mirror class that means you officially suck

 

[klasa]

Have you noticed how quiet the destro guys have become lately....

Guess they want BW's to be toned down so they can win every scenario cause they have the l33t skilz...

 

[Lubbock]

Just think destro guys every time you are beaten by your mirror class that means you officially suck

hehe well only class that dosnt beat me up badly is Shadowwarrior, so guess they need some loving if they get beat up by gobbo shaman

 

[pikeh]

Have you noticed how quiet the destro guys have become lately....

Guess they want BW's to be toned down so they can win every scenario cause they have the l33t skilz...

Kinda stopped listening when you said Chosen > IB, DoK > WP

No way there will ever be an agreement imo.

 

[klasa]

Well if you want us to be downtoned, it must mean we are too powerfull, dont take the moment away from me

Kinda stopped listening when you said Chosen > IB, DoK > WP

No way there will ever be an agreement imo.

Thought it was Chosen > Swordmaster

Get facts straight, and I'm not saying that brightwizards shouldn't be toned down. Just tell us how balance should be achieved, is that to much?

 

[pikeh]

Thought it was Chosen > Swordmaster

Get facts straight, and I'm not saying that brightwizards shouldn't be toned down. Just tell us how balance should be achieved, is that to much?

I said before and I agree on your point that there does need to be a compromise.
Yes my mistake, forgot about the Blorc. But I still don't see how a chosen is any better than a SM. Even if it was, it still dosen't have the gamebreaking, scenario fucking effect a group of 5 BW's has.
Yes, 5 of any high dmg dealing class will have an effect on outcomes; but the amount of instant damage BW's pump out is just sick.

From what I've seen of them and heard Orders whines, Marauders > WL. Toning down Mara's dmg might have some effect, a lot of people play them.
Either that or give SH's 4 or 5 insta Dots that tick for 1k each. Might help!

 

[klasa]

I said before and I agree on your point that there does need to be a compromise.
Yes my mistake, forgot about the Blorc. But I still don't see how a chosen is any better than a SM. Even if it was, it still dosen't have the gamebreaking, scenario fucking effect a group of 5 BW's has.
Yes, 5 of any high dmg dealing class will have an effect on outcomes; but the amount of instant damage BW's pump out is just sick.

From what I've seen of them and heard Orders whines, Marauders > WL. Toning down Mara's dmg might have some effect, a lot of people play them.

Good, now we are getting somewhere. First to get one thing straight, my main is a swordmaster and I have not rolled a brightwizard as an alt.

To give you an idea how it is to play order. If we have 0 (zero bright wizzards) in a scenario where there is few line of sight issues i would say that order has a very slim chance on winning.

If you enter a T3 scenario like "temple of ishia" you need a tank strong group due line of sight issues. BW's don't cut it and my general experience is that destruction has an edge in that scenario.

So my point is, nerf bright wizzards but then you have to do something about destruction or game balance will break

The only thing I'm asking for is that you come up with a balanced proposition to sort it all out.

If you only cry for a BW nerf it's not really constructive

 

[pikeh]

It's interesting, I chose not to use the word 'Scenario' in my post, simply because for me, ORvR is the endgame, and therefore where all should be balanced. If you chuck certain classes into certain small environments, there will of course be classes that shine, and have distinct advantages and other classes that get fucked over.
Open RvR is less predictable, imho.

It's hard to say what Destro class would need to be 'bought in line' because I play destro. I havn't faced what you have faced.

 

[Ayam Ganbatte]

What would make me laugh till I cry is if the 6 Bright Wizards that won a Serpent's Passage scenario say "GG" and "WD" to each other at the end. That would be hilarious. I can't name a bright wizard that struck me as having "skills" on our server yet, but that's more a fault of them having overpowered tools. Also, you'll only really be playing the scenarios that Bright Wizards have the environmental (ie LOS) advantages in. I want the freedom to fight in the Skaven Caverns and other scenarios, but not as long as the republican red brighties hold a monopoly (read: dictatorship) on scenario choice.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

I approve of any post where Bright Wizards are referred to as overpowered tools.

 

[Lubbock]

Dont forget Roo we alau approve of all thread saying Magus and Shaman is overpowered

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Yeh it was a bit naughty. I tried to resist but in...er... Tzeench made me do it. Yes.

 

[00dave]

DoK > WP

No way there will ever be an agreement imo.

Wow you seriously don't see that DoK > WP? What game have you been playing. Seriously a WP has hardly any dps at all and as the heals are all HoT based 1vs1 you cannot outheal any decent amount of dps. Bottom line, DoKs can solo, WP cannot.

Basically what us order boys are saying to the destro girls is that IF BW are op then as our only reasonably balanced class it should stay that way until the rest of the classes are improved.

 

[Ctuchik]

Have you noticed how quiet the destro guys have become lately....

Guess they want BW's to be toned down so they can win every scenario cause they have the l33t skilz...

so just because you lose in the scenarios means you should have overpowered classes to make up for it?

 

[Xandax]

so just because you lose in the scenarios means you should have overpowered classes to make up for it?

Well - Destruction does.

 

[pikeh]

Wow you seriously don't see that DoK > WP? What game have you been playing. Seriously a WP has hardly any dps at all and as the heals are all HoT based 1vs1 you cannot outheal any decent amount of dps. Bottom line, DoKs can solo, WP cannot.

Basically what us order boys are saying to the destro girls is that IF BW are op then as our only reasonably balanced class it should stay that way until the rest of the classes are improved.

Which is fine for DoK's if warhammer was a fecking solo game yeh?
Have you played to tier 3/4? DoK's dps drops right through after you hit T3, it dosent scale well at all.

 

[klasa]

so just because you lose in the scenarios means you should have overpowered classes to make up for it?

We all know the you belive the game is unbalanced until you are on the winning side every time

 

[Hawkwind]

Which is fine for DoK's if warhammer was a fecking solo game yeh?
Have you played to tier 3/4? DoK's dps drops right through after you hit T3, it dosent scale well at all.

Totally agree, T2 & T3 rocked for my DoK and damage was great. Now in T4 its not so great and comparable to WL. I still luv the class though and not being so uber hasn't put me off at all. Just have to adjust playstyle.

It's funny people asking for BW's not to be nerfed unless a load of destro classes are as well. Can you guys seriously not see how they change scenes/rvr with those silly Insta cast dots hitting for 1K+. Plus being able to cast them on the run. I'm sure if sorc's had the same ability instead of 3s plus medium range AoE you'd be complaining.