Wardens...

[1Jesta]

Ive recently respecced my warden to 47 nurture , 42 regrowth, 18 blades, 6 parry.
This is good in a way because of the 483 hp heal, which has saved my grps a lot in rvr.
But I'm starting to miss the 24% resists you get at 48 and 49 nurture.
Pointless going above 18 blades imo as there isnt a use anytime style after that for a long time, and at 47 u still get 2 x 16% resists and a 24% body resist.


So.......opinions please, warden best heal or best resists?

 

[Tyka]

warden resists are the most important in game when you go to rvr, those 8% in spirit and energy will save you alot of hps. Wardens regrowth at 35 is more than enough, you can heal a bit without going oom, if u have good RAs, thats MO.

 

[Sigurd]

For my warden I was thinking of 48 nuture, 22 regrowth, 39 blades... I'd like to be able to fight pretty well... will this work?

 

[old.Xanthian]

49 Nurture (all resists)
35 Reg (2nd best heal, 2nd best end regen and 2nd best health regen)
25 Blades/Blunt
9 Parry

 

[Sigurd]

can you still fight well with a spec like that?

 

[old.Thanatlos]

I've got:
49 nurture
42 regrowth
6 blades (a taunt)
6 blunt (a detaunt)
10 parry

Advice, yeah the resist buffs make a great difference and the extra blades don't make that much of a difference on your fighting ability.

Advice: get MCL II and Raging Power! You'll quickly run out of mana otherwise .. Get TWF too if you can to get
away from that tank that decides he doesn't like you healing
Anything else should be to keep you alive as long as possible thus keeping buffs + bubble alive

 

[Sigurd]

Originally posted by old.Thanatlos
Get TWF too if you can to get
away from that tank that decides he doesn't like you healing
Anything else should be to keep you alive as long as possible thus keeping buffs + bubble alive

I thought Wardens were one of the best fighters... on parr with friars, and tanks would be no problem for them?

 

[old.Thanatlos]

Wardens are about the lowest damage dealing class in the game, yes lower than minstrels, hunters, clerics, druids and bards.. Unless they spec to full in their weaponspec in which case their secondary line which includes bubble haste and the seldomly used in RvR damage add.

According to our TL our damage is actually on par with 1h heroes OVER TIME, like 2 minutes of bashing we do more damage.. like that ever happens in RvR..

Think the most wardens can hit for in RvR on tanks with decent resists is about 120 with max weaponspec and a 100% qua hammer and luck

 

[Sigurd]

Ah.. might rethink making one then

 

[Ensceptifica]

I used to have nurture 47, blades 39, regrowth 20, rest parry. It was ok, but I wanted the higher resists and wanted to try the higher regrowth.

I tried nurture 49, blades 18, regrowth 42, rest parry on Gorre. It was terrible for me. I'm someone who likes to fight and be backup healer. With my first spec I could take on pretty much anyone in a duel (unless they had buffbots, or were an infiltrator). With this new spec I basically could not take on anyone at all in a duel. The blades damage was a LOT lower over time; like 50% less.

Back on Excalibur, I pondered long, then respecced to Nurture 49, Regrowth 33, Blades 29, rest parry. The heals were nice (380 specline), but damage output was about the same as blades 18, although I had a few more styles. The thing with weapon damage is: minimum weapon damage increases a lot when it is at least 2/3 of your level. The self haste is nice, but it can't make up for the damage loss. So I had to have blades to at least 34.

Thanks to the respec bug, I was able to respec another time. This time I specced to Nurture 49, Blades 39 (I love spectrum blade), regrowth 16 and rest in parry. I also took Mastery of Pain II to improve my damage output and Mastery of Parry II to improve my parry rate (moparry II = +12 parry equivalent). I now use baseline heals, which have been boosted slightly in the last patch. I now have the better res, and heal for 160-280 hits, which has still saved a lot of people in RvR. I'm very happy with it. I also have TWF, Serenity II and MCL, and thinking of ways to improve my dmg output further.

I suggest that if you want to make a healing warden, go with Thanatlos' spec. He's happy with it afaik ( ; Just don't expect to do any damage. You can still hit a caster to disturb him and if invaders think they can take out the healer, they'll find you can take quite a beating. I'd suggest Serenity, MCL and Raging Power because the mana drain will be insane with bubble + heals. Improving your parry would be good too imho. Parry 10 + MoParryII works as Parry 22 which theoretically gives a 16% chance to parry ( ; Good defense against fast enemies. Avoidance of Magic is also good for any warden.

If you want to make a battle warden and don't care for the better res, you might want to consider nurture 49, regrowth 2 (instant self end chant), and spread the rest over parry and blades (keeping blades over 34).

 

[Ensceptifica]

Originally posted by the_chimera


I thought Wardens were one of the best fighters... on parr with friars, and tanks would be no problem for them?

Friar staff and evade owns any warden atm. On a lvl 50, it's not likely that a warden hits for more than 120, and it's usually a lot less. Friars hit me for 200+ usually. If they get through ( ; Warden is an incredibly fast hitter though, and I think it's a better supporter for a group than a friar (especially because most friars spec to be tanks).

Fighting things as a warden takes longgggggggggggg. You can last long, but you take long killing others too. Basically, the name 'warden' really fits it. You hit hard and often enough to do some damage over time, and can heal for just enough to keep your group alive. The specialty is the resists and the bubble, really. Take nurture to 49 no matter what.

 

[Juanita]

Originally posted by old.Thanatlos
Wardens are about the lowest damage dealing class in the game, yes lower than minstrels, hunters, clerics, druids and bards..

Yeah, Ph43r my melee lute

But on a more serious note, do you manage to keep bubble up when you have to heal a lot? I'd think you'd need serenity 2 and mcl for that. Let me know, sounds like a good template.

 

[mastade]

I got...
49 Nurture
7 regrowth
39 blunt
19 parry

i got the last resist buffs, which are very nice in rvr groups.
my regrowth are pretty much leftovers, i think my baseline heals do just fine, heal for around 200 but suck a lot of pwr, got MCL for that . 39 blunt gives you a nice move that are used after you parry, which results in a heavy attack speed reduction(great with your pbt) 19 parry, would have gotten a bit more, but i think its ok

i thougt of going...
47 nurture
2 regrowth
44 blunt
14 parry

ill miss the last resist buffs, and my parry will be lowered. But with plusses i can get my blunt to 50, but tbh, i dont think its worth it

 

[old.Thanatlos]

For a healing warden I've got MCL II and Raging Power.. used to have serenity II too but gave it up because I wanted my TWF back

But now I'm in a dilemma again.. problem is I use TWF (drop at feet and sprint) tactic a lot to get away from ppl bashing on me but lately I haven't been able to get it off due to the tremendously annoying way ground targeting works.
It might say TWF is insta cast but it is not, takes 5 seconds minimum to get it off (and that's at your feet, god forbid that you would want to aim it)
ah well.. it's fun to kill people when you're dead so I guess I'll have to live with it..

If in a battle you manage to spend the amount of mana provided by MCL II and RP and perhaps a mana crystal then you'd probably better move because you're either at a keep outnumbered or at a milegate standoff and you should be shouting at your groupmembers anyway

My current RA's:
TWF, MCL II, RP, AoM II
next up:
Purge, Aug Acuity II, Serenity II

 

[old.Verata]

Wardens used to be very strong in 1v1 situations pre 1.52. I've beaten every class in the game at duel events in the past. Friars and Infils were a pain in the ass and S/S fighters took forever (Jawz and I had a duel that lasted just over 5 minutes), but for the most part our damage output over time was good and PBT + Parry kept us alive a long time.

Since 1.52, however, Wardens melee ability has been enormously reduced by the new armour tables and the big blunt nerf. A full melee spec Warden just isn't viable anymore and Wardens find themselves healing more often than no in RvR because they make more of a difference than they do fighting.

After trying out countless new specs while we had the respec bug (including one with 40 parry ) I eventually settled on:

49 Nurture
26 Regrowth
34 Blunt
10 Parry

That gives all resists, a 300 heal and enough in weapon to be able to do reasonable damage when I run out of mana. For RA's I've gone MCL2 (PBT still hurts with such a small mana pool) and FA2/IP for those annoying tanks who don't like me healing.

In the end, our role has changed from a class who, specced properly, could fight up front with tanks, to one that is a jack of all trades and master of none. I guess that's the way Mythic designed us. Even the official description has changed from "formidable fighter" to having the ability to "specialize in some weapons".

A lot of people complain that Wardens don't have any fixed role in a group (PBT doesn't count as a role). I think I've figured it out. Our role is to help who shouts at us the loudest...

 

[spankya]

Originally posted by old.Xanthian
49 Nurture (all resists)
35 Reg (2nd best heal, 2nd best end regen and 2nd best health regen)
25 Blades/Blunt
9 Parry

This is probably what I would go for to make a warden. Dont think wardens need a high weapon spec as they are pretty crap at fighting from my experience of playing them.

 

[old.NorME]

I like the parry tho so I have a little different spec:

Nurture 46
Regrowth 26
Blades 30
Parry 25

RA's: Mcl 1, MoParry 2, AoM 2, Serenity 2, aug dex 2, aug aucuity 2, lifter 1, thoughness 1, aug con 1, regeneration 1.

I have mana enough for most. And thats what i do in rvr anyway, heal and some disturbing of casters.
If the melee patch is good i might respec for more Nurture instead of the parry.

Edit: My parry is 25 + 11 + MoParry 2

 

[old.Xanthian]

I dont see why Wardens insist on trying to play a tank role in rvr.
This is what lets us down, in rvr and why we die 1v1.

***
1FG Hib v 1FG Alb/Mid

Warden runs in to smack a caster,
Warden gets nuked,
Warden dies,
Group is left with no pbt,
Group dies from melee damage.
***

Wardens are a support class!!!!!!

Seriously if you wanna fight make a tank

 

[<Harle>]

Having the same spec as Verata (just with blades instead of blunts) i think it's one of the most usefull and balanced specs ( especially with the 34 blade-style, which is nice for chasing down enemies).
Just remember that the warden is a group-class. Your group relys on your pbt and your baseline buffs, so your main goal should be to stay alive as long as you can. This also means that purge is imo a must-have RA, since pbt wont work when you are mezzed. And even though you can take a bit of a beating it sometimes is smarter to run away from those enemy tanks then trying to take them on your own.
To summarize that: a good spec alone doesn't make a good warden - it's how you play him/her


btw: Anyone ever noticed that when you speak about warden-specs almost everyone will agree that you need the 6-sec-group-bubble and the group-resist-buffs, and so you should drop melee-spec and parry a bit, but if you go to a druid and suggest dropping nature a bit to favor buffs and resists every 2nd druid will get offended ?

 

[Balrog]

Group warden

There's two types of wardens: fighter warden&group/healer warden.
i see myself as a group warden, with the spec 49 nurt (3 best resists)
34 blades(here u get Revenging blade, which is a back-style. i use this when chasing a mage etc.)
26 regrowth(3rd best heal, with a baseline of 3xx+) <- just fyi, 42 regrowth is a waste of points, when you gotta cast self-haste/reduced end regen, and 3 resists, every 10 min. , cuz this drains like 60% of your mana, and you will be oom fast with such heals. If u wan't 42 regrowth, get MCL2 and raging power
10 parry(left-over points)

I'm grp warden, but not with crazy heals,
As a grp warden, in rvr, i concentrate on keeping my grp alive, stay in range for the pbt, and interrupt the mages, who aren't mezzed. <- sometimes i have to keep 2-3 mages interrupted (use the ½/§ button&mouse so u can look to sides/behind etc.)
and just pray till tyka will 1-shoot them
A grp warden shouldn't charge alone, as you do crap dmg compared to a lw/spear hero etc, or a mage.
Also another thing, let's say u come with 1fg and meet 1fg albs.
The bard mezzes them all. In this case, sometimes i stand infront/on a nuker, so he can pick the albs 1 by 1, and they will get difficult targetting the nuker, cuz a big fat firby is standing infront of him

anyways i'm rr6l6 and my RA's are:
Aug. Con II
Aug. Str II
Aug. Dex II
Aug. Acuity II
Serenity II
Toughness II
Long Wind I
ADoM II
Lifter I (can carry complete siege ram with this)
FA 2
IP
MCL I
This is almost all the RA's a warden should have, but if i were a fighter warden i would prolly have had MoPain, MoParrying & purge etc.

No idea what i should get next, but prolly purge, though i never see the use for it.

 

[old.Glendower]

missing developments

One thing to keep in mind is the changes that future patches will bring, while trying to survive the stupid and short-sighted nerfs (such as the armor table BS) in the meantime.

In the next patch or two, parry will work a LOT better. Right now, with 25+13 parry and MOP2, combined with the 8 sec bubble, I almost never get hit and can solo orange MOBs at 49 with my wife's buffs. I can tell you that if parry worked at that rate in RvR I would stomp a lot of folk into the ground...crappy damage or no, what with procs and all. I also went to Enhanced Str 3 (which boosted my str by 18 and thus weapon skill a lot) so I could get Mastery of Arms...this gives a 3% weapon speed boost per level, so for 1 RA point I got nearly the same boost as going from 38 to 47 in Nurture, and with 3 more RA points, my weapon speed buff will do 40%. The nurture line for wardens is so full of holes (although not nearly as bad as the joke that is our regrowth line!), that I didnt feel it was worth going over 38 spec, so I have 43 in blunt (and I will get to 44 at 50 so as to have the chain style from BackCrush), and 16 in regrowth for the nice res and the 4pt/tic regen (whoopeee). In addition to the other skills I have mentioned, I have Serenity2, MOPain2(10% additional crit hits), Longwind1, Enhanced Con1, Toughness1, Mastery of the Arcane1 (worthless crap), Avoidance of Magic1, and the requisites for these things.

Wardens are so overwhelmingly unbalanced, particualarly now, that they are sure to see some improvement by Mythic now that SI has been launched and they can focus on the game a bit more.

My advice would be to skip making one until they get around to making them a bit more complete.

 

[Ensceptifica]

Re: missing developments

Originally posted by old.Glendower

Wardens are so overwhelmingly unbalanced, particualarly now, that they are sure to see some improvement by Mythic now that SI has been launched and they can focus on the game a bit more.

My advice would be to skip making one until they get around to making them a bit more complete.

I think a warden can be played in a lot of different ways, more than most other classes. I also think they shouldn't excel in healing or fighting, because they were made to be this way. The only thing that they specialise in is the resist buffs and the bubble, which is for me reason enough to take nurture to 49. I think the regrowth spec would become a lot more interesting if bubble wouldn't eat so much mana though.

Originally posted by Xanthian
I dont see why Wardens insist on trying to play a tank role in rvr.
This is what lets us down, in rvr and why we die 1v1.

***
1FG Hib v 1FG Alb/Mid

Warden runs in to smack a caster,
Warden gets nuked,
Warden dies,
Group is left with no pbt,
Group dies from melee damage.
***

Wardens are a support class!!!!!!

Seriously if you wanna fight make a tank

I have this problem because I'm one of the few people who wants to lead a group into battle. As a result I'm usually the first to be targetted. That means I either get nuked or mezzed, and usually both, and both mean group is left without bubble.

In a good group, other group members spread out at the sight of an enemy and overtake me as I slow down (or they let the bard lead). I run after one of the tanks but stay a bit back to keep an overview. If there's someone taking a lot of damage I heal, but more often I go for one of the enemies who is roaming free, especially when it's a caster, mezzer or stealther. I only fight pure tanks if they have a slow weapon and they are attacking the bard, druid, or one of our own casters, in the hope to get their attention. I never chase someone running off, because that would leave my group without bubble. If the bard dies or aoe mez fails for another reason, I use TWF to disturb casters.

 

[panzer]

Same specs as enscept here

49 nurt - best resists
39 blades - nice attack speed debuff on 39 style
16 regrowth - 181 spec heal or around 200-280 base heal
12 parry....

Aug Dex 1
FA2
IP
MCL

I tried a healing warden but tbh i went OOP so quick with the bubble running, i found it a bit pointless, even with MCL and serenity 2.

So respecced to a more offensive warden, and while it is ok, i still find in RvR you dont make a huge impact.

However, i have found, if solo, i can comfortably take on 2 opponents and win - the trick is to keep moving - let the bubble refresh then come back into melee. Its just a pity this ability doesnt translate well into large scale RvR.

The most useful tactics i have found so far, is to heal until OOP, then go for casters. I can take quite a pounding before i die, and i figure if i can keep a caster or 2 occupied, then im potentially saving the lives of some of my group.

But......

while i stil enjoy my warden and it will remain my main, i rolled a light chanter (currently 41) so that when i want to kill quick i can, and from the limited rvr time i have on him, it is just soooo much more fun!

 

[Ensceptifica]

Originally posted by panzer
Same specs as enscept here

49 nurt - best resists
39 blades - nice attack speed debuff on 39 style
16 regrowth - 181 spec heal or around 200-280 base heal
12 parry....

Aug Dex 1
FA2
IP
MCL

I never could save enough to spend 23 points to get IP, so I don't have that. Still thinking of dropping TWF to get purge instead, or maybe even save up to IP.... but when my hits start dropping, it's usually because the rest of my group is already dead and there's 3 tanks and 2 mages on me, making IP useless anyway. I don't solo a lot with my warden, and with every solo enemy having a buffbot and IP, having IP of my own wouldn't make that much of a difference.... purge on the other hand is quite useful to get rid of mez/stun/paralyse, so I could keep my bubble up... think that'll be my next investment.

 

[panzer]

Had TWF for quite a long time and while some wardens swear by it, i really didnt find it that useful, and quite expensive at 14 points for what it did in open RvR - ie break mez :/

Then i respecced to master of pain and parry 2 - which again i didnt find that overwelming - i cant say i seemed to parry that much more and tbh getting an additional 30 points of damage on a crit didnt overwhelm!

Now IP i find very useful - between IP and FA2, it saves my life frequently and therefore keeps my bubble up longer, and also allows you to reach those mages with normally full health. Whether i keep it after the future FA nerfs im not sure - 23 points for IP alone is very expensive.

However, now that i got it im tryng to get back mopain/parry. Cant see myself ever going back to TWF tho.

 

[Tyka]

mastery of pain as a warden, haha.

 

[Ensceptifica]

Originally posted by Tyka
mastery of pain as a warden, haha.

I have MoPain II, I love it. 20% chance to do 100-150 dmg per swing instead of 50-80. With the warden attack speed, that's quite nice. It's also one of the few available ways to increase dmg output for a warden. You've played a champ and a light eld, have you any idea how frustrating it can be to have so few means of doing damage? ( :

Mastery of Pain is great. I don't consider it worth the rps getting it to level 3 though.

 

[Tyka]

It sure is worth the points up to level 2 if u got all the other nescessary RAs for being a GROUP CHAR. I dont care what mythic says in their manual, if you want to be a good warden, you are a healing warden

 

[ilaya]

Yeah! The mighty Tyka has spoken, everyone change at once!..

/ignore Tyka

Do what you want guys, and have fun

Ilaya Daquirrelslayer 50 Lurichamp (GM Hearts of Fire)
Poppy Power 18 (non healer specced and never gonna be) Warden

(heard so many people say things about this previous post and have had to hold back that i thought i'd check it out.. )

 

[old.Glendower]

hehehehhe

Tyka is good for many things, but playing a warden is perhaps not one of them

I set my character up as an experiment and to have some fun.

If he wants a support warden specced as he chooses, he can buy another account =)

What would you call that? A wardenbot?

Base heals are plenty good. At level 49 my base heal does almost 300pts and only takes 2 sec to cast. Group heal is about 100pts and takes 3 sec. If you need better heals than that, you need a druid!