News Venables in Jail again

[Raven]

Gas the lot of them! When they have finished that they can make a start on those coloured folk.

 

[Garaen]

Oh here comes the fucking hippy patrol. They commited a brutal murder, there is no question about it. They do not deserve to be a part of society, either they should be locked up for life or face the death penalty.

Alternatively, we can let them out of jail and give them a new ID to protect them and just hope they don't decide to break the law again. I mean brutally murdering a child is a mild crime right? Surely they won't do it again, and if so we can catch them and put them back in prison for another 10 years - i mean it would only be another life lost in the process but it wouldn't be their fault, it would be their parents, or perhaps the prison systems. Absolute bollocks.

The best part about that article is the judge "however, the judge said it would be "wrong" for Venables' sentence to be increased because of his previous crime." What a joke this country is. Disgusting.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

I'd guess the child porn is his only remaining access to this kind of thing.

Rather than suggesting he's downgraded his behaviour I'd suggest this is his only current outlet for his fixations. The fact he was caught doing even this suggests that he is under constant scrutiny. He's probably aware of this.

My preference would be for him not to be let loose amongst society again but he unfortunately benefits from the way the law works and the age at which he was convicted.

 

[tierk]

I'd guess the child porn is his only remaining access to this kind of thing.

Rather than suggesting he's downgraded his behaviour I'd suggest this is his only current outlet for his fixations. The fact he was caught doing even this suggests that he is under constant scrutiny. He's probably aware of this.

My preference would be for him not to be let loose amongst society again but he unfortunately benefits from the way the law works and the age at which he was convicted.

He got caught purely by chance. If he had any sense he would never have been caught.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

He got caught purely by chance. If he had any sense he would never have been caught.

Possibly.

Still, I don't believe his former behaviour is abeyance, just buried further down.

This is one of the few people I've ever read about where the threat of his nature is too great. He is capable of things that are truely terrifying.

I hope he does not return to society but realistically I know he will.

 

[tierk]

how about those evil bastards who make computer games so lifelike? lets kill them all too for encouraging bad behaviour before it gets out of hand.

you lot are fucking barbarians. lock them up for their entire lives by all means but to go around hanging, stoning and generally behaving like cavemen is not the way forward. sure it will cost a few quid but its nothing compared to how much of my income tax went to paying bank bonuses this year so frankly I dont give a shit.

I am not concerned with how they are killed, as it is not important, what i am concerned with is making sure that there is no possibilty of breeding and continuation of that gene line. I also like the idea of punishments that fit the crime - really fit the crime - and in this case it is only right that were killed.

As for the parents, they are ultimately responsible and if, as many people at the time said so, they perpetrators are /were to young to know what they were doing - and got away with the shocking sentences that they did - the parents should pay the ultimate price.

The case in question is a open and shut case of murder and there is no question of did they do it or not and therefore much easier to pass a death penalty - for the parents at the very least if not the kids or even better still, both.

It is not being a caveman or a barbarian to want to see punishments that fit the crime. Its not barbaric to want to put an end to the ability of these types of people to breed, it is i would suggest infinitely more humane for the rest of society.

As for Raven, i thought you hated the hand wringing liberal minded.....???

 

[Mabs]

you lot are fucking barbarians. lock them up for their entire lives by all means but to go around hanging, stoning and generally behaving like cavemen is not the way forward. sure it will cost a few quid but its nothing compared to how much of my income tax went to paying bank bonuses this year so frankly I dont give a shit.

im all for punishment fits the crime, personally.
but i would settle for -proper- jail terms. by which i mean

life = 30 years MINIMUM, preferably ALL OF IT
her majestys pleasure = see above

and none of this "good behaviour" shit either

i dont want people like them out and about where they can do more harm.

and while your talking about lifes ruined. how many members of the bulger family do you think had their lives ruined 1, 2? 3? 5? 10 ?

so, yes. hang them

/edit
oh i forgot to add something before someone comes up with it :

Capital punishment does NOT detere people ( i believe this to be true)
HOWEVER!
i am pretty sure there is a 100% NON RE OFFEND rate
which is higher than prisons....

 

[Raven]

As for Raven, i thought you hated the hand wringing liberal minded.....???

I do but they were children when they committed murder. There is a difference between an adult committing pre meditated murder and abused children doing it. They should really be locked up for a very long time but do you seriously agree that as children they should be sentenced to death? As far as I know Robert Thomson has not committed any crime since his release? If that is the case maybe his punishment and rehabilitation did work but some people would be quite happy to have seen him killed.

I agree in the death penalty if we had a perfect prosecution service that never makes a mistake or is never corrupted. We don't though, we have one that relies on people to tell the truth or people to have enough knowledge in their professional field.

Infanticide, rape, sexual assault on a child, murder, terrorism.

But then you get these, which if we did have the death penalty for such crimes would have been executed for crimes that they did not commit.

Sally Clark - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Guildford Four and Maguire Seven - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Paul Blackburn (UK) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

etc etc

 

[Mabs]

depends on the severity of the case and evidence

in this case it was horrific, and no doubt they did it : open and shut

in other cases, use the american system: 3 strikes and your out.

wouldnt have to be a yes/no thing, could be a sliding scale.

 

[Ch3tan]

I am not concerned with how they are killed, as it is not important, what i am concerned with is making sure that there is no possibilty of breeding and continuation of that gene line.

LOL. Wow. Gene line. Let me guess, they must have a gene that makes them psychopaths?

Only Krazeh, Chilly and Raven have talked any sense so far. Lock them up by all means, I think the sentance was too short. But society neeeds to take some responsibility here. They weren't killers at 12 because they had evil genes.

 

[SawTooTH]

Nice to see this place is full of reasonable balanced individuals.

I'll come back in a year or two to see if things have got better .

cyas

 

[Aoami]

Deport them. There is still a lot of space left in Australia.

 

[tierk]

LOL. Wow. Gene line. Let me guess, they must have a gene that makes them psychopaths?

Only Krazeh, Chilly and Raven have talked any sense so far. Lock them up by all means, I think the sentance was too short. But society neeeds to take some responsibility here. They weren't killers at 12 because they had evil genes.

The problem is that they have not been locked up for anywhere near what would be deemed a reasonable amount of time (try like 35 years). Also with all the bullshit thrown about them being kids and not knowing* what they were doing - which btw i think is a heap of BS - nobody was truly held responsible and they have gotten away with it.

If it is as some are saying because of untold abuse heaped on them by parents relatives, then why have we not seen them brought to book?

Just to make it really clear for you regards the gene issue. I dont know if it is genetic or not but quite frankly i dont think they i would take chances on those fuckers having kids, seeing as so many other illness's and diseases are herditary, mental illness included. Do them and the rest of the world a favour.

So should that line of genes be denied the opportunity to continue? HELL YES!

It doesnt mean we automatically do this for every criminal but when a case as bad as this one comes up drastic measures are called for. There are no issues of the wrong people being incriminated or uncertainty about anything in this case.

They did it and if we are not going to execute them, nor jail them properly, they should not be allowed to hide or be given anonymity by the state. Let them live with the possibilty of getting maimed, attacked and /or killed for the rest of their lives.

* They new what they were doing and clearly understood that it was wrong, hence why they tried to hide all the damage they had done to the kid by placing him on a rail line in the hope that it would cover up what they did.

 

[Krazeh]

The problem is that they have not been locked up for anywhere near what would be deemed a reasonable amount of time (try like 35 years). Also with all the bullshit thrown about them being kids and not knowing* what they were doing - which btw i think is a heap of BS - nobody was truly held responsible and they have gotten away with it.

* They new what they were doing and clearly understood that it was wrong, hence why they tried to hide all the damage they had done to the kid by placing him on a rail line in the hope that it would cover up what they did.

Well there we have it, tierk obviously being an expert in child development and psychology has cleared up that whole issue about responsibility for us and we can happily send them off to the hangman with no moral issues. As for what constitutes a "reasonable" time for them to be locked up, that's not upto the public who are for the most part utterly uninterested in justice and rehabilition and simply want retribution and revenge.

If it is as some are saying because of untold abuse heaped on them by parents relatives, then why have we not seen them brought to book?

Because society would rather not look at the difficult questions of how 2 10 year old children get turned into murderers and finds it much easier to simply demonise/villify them to the point where they have no hope of ever being able to reintegrate into society.

Just to make it really clear for you regards the gene issue. I dont know if it is genetic or not but quite frankly i dont think they i would take chances on those fuckers having kids, seeing as so many other illness's and diseases are herditary, mental illness included. Do them and the rest of the world a favour.

So should that line of genes be denied the opportunity to continue? HELL YES!

So we should just start genetically engineering society? Where do you draw the line? Do you stop people with dangerous mental illnesses but who have never commited a crime from breeding? What about those people with genes that give them a disease which while not dangerous is a drain on society to deal with?

They did it and if we are not going to execute them, nor jail them properly, they should not be allowed to hide or be given anonymity by the state. Let them live with the possibilty of getting maimed, attacked and /or killed for the rest of their lives.

And thank you for proving my earlier point about what the public are generally interested in. You aren't interested in justice, you simply want retribution and revenge on what were two 10 year old children at the time they commited their crime.

 

[Ch3tan]

I'm really, really glad you have nothing to do with setting laws in this country tierk.

Your view points are scary. Fuck me it's almost hitler like. Lets breed a perfect race.

 

[Tom]

How many people here read The Sun?

FFS.

 

[Tom]

* They new what they were doing and clearly understood that it was wrong, hence why they tried to hide all the damage they had done to the kid by placing him on a rail line in the hope that it would cover up what they did.

There's a difference between knowing something is wrong, and caring if something is wrong.

You being an expert child psychologist though, you'd know that.

 

[Pfy]

How many people here read The Sun?

FFS.

Me?

We should kill the pair of them and the destroy the north west incase they've infected the local population with their evil.

Then cut the southeast free from the rest of england and we'll take it in turns to paddle to a different part of the world where there's no evil.

Simples.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

There's a difference between knowing something is wrong, and caring if something is wrong.

You being an expert child psychologist though, you'd know that.

Hehe yeh. If memory serves its one of the defining differences between a sociopath and a psychopath.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Seems there's only three choices in punishment, when the majority of this place comes to play;

Kill. (big crime)
Lock up for good. (smaller)
No punishment. (none)

And the same people dare call muslim countries backwatered and barbaric.

No one seems to believe in "done the crime, did the time" anymore.

Also comforting to see WHO exactly have judged me for opinions, mean fuck all it seems.

 

[nath]

Also comforting to see WHO exactly have judged me for opinions, mean fuck all it seems.

To be fair, a great deal of sensible folk have judged your opinions too.

 

[old.Tohtori]

To be fair, a great deal of sensible folk have judged your opinions too.

The baiting is getting old you know, especially since you've only come to the thread to post that stuff with no comment on the topic(people can look it up).

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

To be fair, a great deal of sensible folk have judged your opinions too.

In every single post you've made on this thread so far you've contributed precisely nothing to the discussion, only continually baited Toh.

Even if people disagree with what Toh posts, at least he has offered something that is on topic. Thats more that can be said for your trolling.

EDIT: Heh, just spotted Toh's above post as I posted

 

[nath]

The baiting is getting old you know, especially since you've only come to the thread to post that stuff with no comment on the topic(people can look it up).

The forum Gods will be most displeased that I've not stuck to the topic. Good thing I'm an atheist.

I decided I don't want to get involved with the main thrust of this discussion as it appears that the majority here want incredibly disturbed children strung up. That doesn't sit right with me and it doesn't seem like a dialogue will take it anywhere.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

The forum Gods will be most displeased that I've not stuck to the topic. Good thing I'm an atheist.

I decided I don't want to get involved with the main thrust of this discussion as it appears that the majority here want incredibly disturbed children strung up. That doesn't sit right with me and it doesn't seem like a dialogue will take it anywhere.

This faux logic doesn't even withstand a cursory inspection.

If you feel too threatened by other points of view then perhaps FH is not a place for someone as gentle as yourself, making this a good point for you to withdraw to somewhere more suitable.

 

[nath]

This faux logic doesn't even withstand a cursory inspection.

If you feel too threatened by other points of view then perhaps FH is not a place for someone as gentle as yourself, making this a good point for you to withdraw to somewhere more suitable.

First sentence accuses me of faux logic, the second you employ it yourself.

I'm not threatened by other points of view, far from it. I did, however, feel that getting in to this sort of discussion given the points already made, would be tiresome and repetitive. The fact of the matter is, some attitudes are not conducive to a reasonable chat.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Then mind me asking why you decided that trying to bait me into some form of argument was a way to go, especially since lately i've tried to avoid things getting out of hand? Where's the infallible logic in that?

 

[nath]

Then mind me asking why you decided that trying to bait me into some form of argument was a way to go, especially since lately i've tried to avoid things getting out of hand? Where's the infallible logic in that?

You often come out with comments that you claim are common sense/logical and are so far from it that it's absurd. Your comment on this thread that the kid "went from brutal murder to perverse computer pictures" got to me and I decided to pick you up on it.

 

[throdgrain]

You do talk some arse Toht.


Anyway, my point is this, in a sensible free thinking country those kids may have been executed. The crime they committed is absolutely unimaginable and beyond anything that anyone can really forgive.

But, I do accept that they were kids, and our logical written-down laws make allowances for that, rightly or wrongly, that is the case. But to let them out after such a short time, and for one of them to reoffend speaks volumes to me. Particularly as to the nature of the second crime. I would have though that was enough for any judge to say right, this person is a danger to the public and lock him away permanantly.

But no, they give him two years.

I dont understand it.

 

[old.Tohtori]

You do talk some arse Toht.

I can accept that it seems like arse, i may have a different viewpoint, different outlook etc, but it's just a personal opinion. Not like i'm telling others that they are wrong

You often come out with comments that you claim are common sense/logical and are so far from it that it's absurd. Your comment on this thread that the kid "went from brutal murder to perverse computer pictures" got to me and I decided to pick you up on it.

In the future, do it without some generic mewmew and you might get that discussion you want. FYI; it's not often, you simply see those cases and connect them to previous ones.

NS, dropping this.