To restore balance...

[hotrat]

They are with respect to a typical rvr group and how they effect that group.

Now tell me why?

 

[old.anubis]

Originally posted by hotrat
Anubis you noob quote the whole thing not just part of it

so, buffline of shaman = healer = cleric = friar = warden = bard = druid, right?
if bb can buff ya then make smite clerics and you will get defensive spell against pets etc, the thing you whine about

 

[hotrat]

No if buffbot provides buffs you need aug for the resist buffs(specifically body resist), which is the only reason so spec high aug/enh for a cleric/healer.
As a mid you have to use a buffbot as well cus one shaman cant do end and all specs.

 

[Rollie]

Originally posted by hotrat
Why? (given that you have 2 shaman buffbots at mpk)

Also going on this logic, would you have 2 bb clerics at atk and run 2 reju/smite clerics?

you usually have one 37 aug healer per group, only for the resists as they offer nothing else, like i said play one at 50, spec him aug and then come back and tell me how much they rock.

 

[hotrat]

Originally posted by Rollie
Also going on this logic, would you have 2 bb clerics at atk and run 2 reju/smite clerics?

I would have one buffbot cleric, one enh/rej cleric for resist buffs and another rej/smite. But I would never spec a cleric rej/smite unless it was a dedicated rvr group setup that always played together.

 

[Pandemic]

Originally posted by old.Gobarnachta
Isolate Midgard off the game

Well to be honest it would be nice to have some RvR fields where only albs and hibs can port in to...same ofcourse to have it equal 2 more of those where in other hibs are excluded and other albs.

http://www.duskwave.com/daoc/guildrank.php?server=Excalibur&realm=&order=lastweek

top-5 is not too pretty sight nor is top-10 of single players lastweek rps...

This is flame and whine and once again pointless thread. Like Mythic would ever do this and even if it would that patch would land here in year 3k.

-G

Now that middies have had upperhand in every patch we can only wonder what new toy they'll acquire next so happy waiting for next patch all...disappointed Elf out.

mm last time i looked at this a week or so ago hibs were top 3 in the guilds (there was no midgard guild in the top 5) and hibs dominated the single player earned last week lists so ur saying that a week ago Hibernia should have been isolated off the game ?
although as a warrior i gotta agree that the patches are pretty sweet 4 me as i never get nerfed only improved. despite what our TL seems to want

 

[kirennia]

as I've said before:

would ANY mids want to swap all their savages for either armsmen/reavers/mercs

would ANY mids want to swap all their shamans for friars? Cause we all know how good friars are at healing during combat

would ANY mids want to swap all their healers for clerics and sorcs?

The only class in a typical mid FOtM group that is not better then albs equivalents are the skalds and minstrel comparison, but then again, neither are overpowered for fg vs. fg warfare.

Anyone who can't see that or would swap them for RvR is just plain dumb...

 

[old.Gobarnachta]

http://www.duskwave.com/daoc/characterrank.php?server=Excalibur&realm=&order=lastweek

Tankard is not overpowered



And finally those who say I am whiner: See my BW rank...have had this account quite long...when I say something it's usually something that matters and this is my last post on this thread now unless u make more remarks about me that are utter bollocks

-G

 

[Pandemic]

Originally posted by kirennia
as I've said before:

would ANY mids want to swap all their savages for either armsmen/reavers/mercs

would ANY mids want to swap all their shamans for friars? Cause we all know how good friars are at healing during combat

would ANY mids want to swap all their healers for clerics and sorcs?

The only class in a typical mid FOtM group that is not better then albs equivalents are the skalds and minstrel comparison, but then again, neither are overpowered for fg vs. fg warfare.

Anyone who can't see that or would swap them for RvR is just plain dumb...

i'd cheerfully swap all of our savages for thin air

shamans dont heal during combat

yes i'd love to have clerics for healers if u want to chuck in sorcs as well thats such an added bonus but not needed

and neither are warriors overpowered for rvr unless ur saying armsmen r 2 ?

 

[kirennia]

Originally posted by Pandemic
i'd cheerfully swap all of our savages for thin air

shamans dont heal during combat

yes i'd love to have clerics for healers if u want to chuck in sorcs as well thats such an added bonus but not needed

and neither are warriors overpowered for rvr unless ur saying armsmen r 2 ?

hmmm, well didnt quite answer my question


I said sap savages for one of our classes so give another realm a completely overpowered tank.

And you'd swap healers for clerics? lol, ok so you would be happy without any major form of CC in your realm? fine by me.

Didnt mention warriors but ofc, warriors = armsmen atm, cant really see why people woyuld feel the need to want to swap between either of these.

 

[kirennia]

hmmm, well didnt quite answer my question


I said swap savages for one of our tank classes so give albs a completely overpowered tank.

And you'd swap healers for clerics and not have sorcs too in your groups? lol, ok so you would be happy without any major form of CC in your realm? fine by me.

shamens dont heal in combat? ok, on par with friars then in that respect...then do less to the enemy group then a friar would? i doubt it...disease + Dots r gr8 for interupting support, especially on a class with more then just cloth armour

Didnt mention warriors but ofc, warriors = armsmen atm, cant really see why people woyuld feel the need to want to swap between either of these.

 

[old.anubis]

if i was playing albion i would be a cleric
and i wouldnt cry like a baby that my class is underpowered
but 2 years ago i've started on mid (ja-ja, kill me, i'm guilty)
so what's your point i cant understand?
that healer + healer > cleric + sorc?
i think every man with a bit of brain knows it, so what?

 

[kirennia]

Originally posted by old.anubis
if i was playing albion i would be a cleric
and i wouldnt cry like a baby that my class is underpowered
but 2 years ago i've started on mid (ja-ja, kill me, i'm guilty)
so what's your point i cant understand?
that healer + healer > cleric + sorc?
i think every man with a bit of brain knows it, so what?

Savages > Alb tanks

Healers > Alb healing/CC

Shaman = or > frair

Skald = mincer

So mids have better CC/healing and offence.......and a lot of mids are saying they are the underdogs and the brunt of all Mythics nerf batting.

Do I really need to say anymore? :/

 

[old.anubis]

Originally posted by kirennia
Savages > Alb tanks

Healers > Alb healing/CC

Shaman = or > frair

Skald = mincer

So mids have better CC/healing and offence.......and a lot of mids are saying they are the underdogs and the brunt of all Mythics nerf batting.

Do I really need to say anymore? :/

well, they will get nerfed, are you happy?

healer mend = cleric rejuv
healer mezz < sorc mezz (range, radius, delve, everything is worse on mid)

why do you compare shaman with friar ffs???
you say shaman > friar, i say shaman < cleric, so?
imo friar is the second class in teh game to be nerfed (after chanter)

mincer > skald (ablative chant, insta 9 sec stun, sos, kkthxbye)

 

[hotrat]

sorc mezz should be better, we wear cloth armor

In fact healer mezz is way too strong and SM mezz should be made better (equal to a sorc) but mythic had to vary things by putting (what used to be) the most poweful spell in the game on a chain wearer for mid and on cloth for an alb

However I will agree that QC almost makes up for it IF determination got nerfed to det 3 at most. Atm I can qc mezz tanks on me but whats the point when it lasts 8 seconds. Better to qc disease and kite them these days

 

[Driwen]

kirennia about the mincer = skald part.

small comparence between different abilities between minstrell and skald (might have missed one or two im sorry for that then wasnt on purpose).

skald: ************************* minstrell:
5% more wpnskill ***************** confuse
2hander ************************ 5% more base evade
29 s insta mezz (vs 3sec castable) **** stealth
insta snare *********************** insta stun
resist songs *********************** AE mezz
gains con as tertiar attirbuty ********* cure mezz
******************************** charm song
******************************** ablative
******************************** has dex as secondary attribute (but str as tertiar)

now resist songs of skald look nice, but you can only play one and with twisting you might be able to play speed along with it, but twisting isnt that easy. Now insta mezz of the skald kinda makes up for the fact that minstrell can mezz from stealth (or atleast be unknown where he is till he starts mezzing) and both single target mezzes last 29 sec before resists.
Midgard twohander is also only 15% extra damage, so minstrell gets 5% more evade +using shield for skalds 2hander+5% more wpnskill. Skald will get slightly more hp in 1.65 aswell, but I would still say the advantage is for minstrell.

 

[Garnet]

Augmentation line on healer sucks ass, I know i used to have 37 aug. Enhance line on cleric > Augmentation at the moment. To make augmentation more attractive would be to increase the celeritys range to 1500 or so AND/OR turn it into a instant cast instead of a 2 - 3 second cast.

Basicly augmentation is a self support line for the healer which hardly has any use in rvr except resists and the odd celerity, even though i heard celerity nerfs tanks damage per hit.

 

[iluvatur]

the real difference is .. a badly played minstrel = bad minstrel..

a well played minstrel = a good minstrel

i wish all classes were like this ((

( ps all supp BD suck .... and kudos to any differently specced BD's out there )

 

[Trubble]

Originally posted by poppamies
So what would u want to nerf on the healer ?
The Insta ae mezz ? that lass for 5 sec on tanks ? or the insta ae stunn that lasts 2 sec on tanks ?

Just remove the AE stun from the healers and they will be fine.

 

[Rollie]

Originally posted by Trubble
Just remove the AE stun from the healers and they will be fine.

Sure remove it, its useless in rvr anyhows, give us something useful instead, id happily do that

 

[Trubble]

Originally posted by Rollie
Sure remove it, its useless in rvr anyhows, give us something useful instead, id happily do that

I said remove it, not replace it with something.

Healers are great allready, they dont need AE stun.

 

[old.Nol]

Originally posted by old.anubis
healer mezz < sorc mezz (range, radius, delve, everything is worse on mid)

The healer is far superior to both bard and and sorceror in the CC stakes it's not even funny. Focussing on one spell does not change that, it's the complete package that makes the difference, and as a complete CC package, Healer kicks.

 

[Rollie]

Originally posted by Trubble
I said remove it, not replace it with something.

Healers are great allready, they dont need AE stun.

ahh so another take take take and no give post :great:

 

[Gahldir]

Re: Re: To restore balance...

Originally posted by Pin
A couple of weeks ago it was all hibs at the top of that list (VGN, CF, LA...). With Hibs taking most of the individual places aswell.

Swings and Roundabouts.


(Though I do prefer fighting against Hibs atm )

I have noticed a funny thing.

as soon as both NP and/or JH(tbh, the only 2 mid guilds who actually plays fotm groups succesfully on this server, cuz they they have alot better win:lose ratio then anyone else on this server) plays actively for most of the week Midgard dominates emain and last weeks RPs(fewer mids killed and more albs/hibs killed by mids).

The horror if a few more ppl in mid learnt how to play like NP/JH(healers and shamans mainly imo), wich wouldn't actually be to hard.

 

[Gahldir]

Originally posted by Rollie
[Get over the 4 insta cc, no one actually uses them offensively, well very rarely at most. Id swop 4 insta cc for mez reduction+bolt range mezz

LOL

if you only knew how often I get insta mezzed by normal mid groups and insta stuned followed by cast mezz from the better ones.

Tho they still like to deny it.

 

[Gahldir]

Originally posted by Jiggs
imo:

healers haste debuff getting nerfed in next pach is gonna make a bigger difference to rvr than alot of ppl realise

 

[Rollie]

Originally posted by Gahldir
LOL

if you only knew how often I get insta mezzed by normal mid groups and insta stuned followed by cast mezz from the better ones.

Tho they still like to deny it.

tbh if my pac healer used insta mezz ona group id quit the group cause its just asking to die fast, as for insta stun, 44 pac, 30 mend spec gives 150 radius insta stun which will last full effect on 1 person, and effect 2-3 max. They are both useless tbh, i would trade bolt range mezz and mezz reduction over them anyday of the week.

Also the ones that do insta mezz you i bet die

 

[Gahldir]

Originally posted by Rollie

No, fixing savages and determination will even out 8v8 rvr some more as thats where one of the many problems lie.

have you played support in albion or hibernia?

imo, healers and also shammans are the real power behind the savages.

Zerkergroups would prolly still be better then any hib/alb group. And wasn't it for the fact that savages dps is much better then zerkers you'd prolly see it aswell.

 

[Rollie]

Originally posted by Gahldir
have you played support in albion or hibernia?

imo, healers and also shammans are the real power behind the savages.

Zerkergroups would prolly still be better then any hib/alb group. And wasn't it for the fact that savages dps is much better then zerkers you'd prolly see it aswell.

yes i have thx, why dont you run with 3 droods and a bard? that gives you equal healing power to a middy group, and you also get 4 det tanks which mid groups cant have if they have 3 healers.

Anyhows bards get insta mezz as well, and tbh id love it if they used it more than the casted one as i said most healers specc 44 pac which gives a 150 radius insta mezz/stun, if yoiu die to that you need help.

 

[parzi]

Re: Re: Re: To restore balance...

Originally posted by Gahldir
I have noticed a funny thing.

as soon as both NP and/or JH(tbh, the only 2 mid guilds who actually plays fotm groups succesfully on this server, cuz they they have alot better win:lose ratio then anyone else on this server) plays actively for most of the week Midgard dominates emain and last weeks RPs(fewer mids killed and more albs/hibs killed by mids).

The horror if a few more ppl in mid learnt how to play like NP/JH(healers and shamans mainly imo), wich wouldn't actually be to hard.

mid lacks of actively played shamans, and even lacks more of GOOD shamans
the role of the shammie is so much underestimated imo. noticed that as we got no active guild shaman atm. if the shaman plays shitte, well, he dies fast = tanks no end, enemys not diseased but own tanks diseased = the tanks wont be able to kill shit.
also np plays fotm grps ? as far as i have seen it was ~1 savage most of the time. can hardly call that a fotm grp imo.
anyway giv more good shamans. with 2 active guild shamans we pharmed ~4,5 mil rp in a week now its 1,5 ;(

so my respect goes out to all good shammies out there \o/ they are much more than endurance buffers , imo almost as important as a good pac healer or even more since disease is the best cc atm imo vs tank grps.