The whole 1.62 LA nerf is blown way out of proportion...

[Trinilim]

WARNING: This is not a whine or flame thread, please keep all whines and/or flames on another thread, discuss here .



It's not gonna be devastating.

It's not gonna ruin the class.

It's not gonna throw midgard way out of balance.

Imho there's really nothing all that bad about it. In fact, if you actually read up on it, the TL says the damage has been reduced by around 30%.

<GASP>, you might say, a near 1/3 of the damage GONE??

Well, if you take into consideration what kind of damage zerkers were doing before and actually use the brain god gave you (not an insult ofc, to those who get offended easy ), you'd discover the following:

It all started when zerkers began 2-shotting plate-wearing classes. That's over 1k damage a hit.

Now, in order to do at least 1,000 damage, a zerker must be in zerk mode, and hit the person for 500 with a 100% crit (500 damage), doing a grand total of 1,000.

Now based on this (and yes I realize that the chances of a 100% crit are near nothing, but I'll use this as an example as it'll show the lowest amount of damage a zerk will do post-1.62), you take 500 damage, and take away 30% from it.

You get 350 damage.

It's my educated guess that the zerker nerf has been blown way out of proportion, and it's definitely nowhere near as bad as people seem to be making it out to be. The TL claims that it's ruined the class, but tbh, I've always found the zerker TL to be full of it .

Now, let's take a more likely damage estimate.

For the same grand total of damage (1,000), let's say you pulled off 600 damage with a 400 damage crit. Again take 30% away from the 600 and you get 420 damage. And that's without a crit.

In conclusion, zerkers will still be a very viable class that will be able to hit like a ton of bricks, instead of like a freight train.

Comments? Opinions?

 

[fl3a]

the deal is that the class that used LA yet didnt do 1000 damage a swing will get hit by the bat too hard.

 

[Gahldir]

Originally posted by Trinilim
The TL claims that it's ruined the class, but tbh, I've always found the zerker TL to be full of it .

I read in one of his TLs (1.60 or so) that he wanteda speed-increase in vendo since everyone tryed to outsprint the zerker when he went vendo

 

[Gahldir]

I agree, zerkers wont be a destroyed class. with the nerf they start to play in the same league as all the other dmg-dealing classes (cept some savage-scums maybe). wont be supriced if they would be in the top of that league. as it is now, I think they play in thier own division.

but only time can tell.

 

[old.Niljindil]

Actually, the damage dropped wont be as much as people think, at least for troll zerkers.

That is because the 300 cap is removed, and with full buffs a troll will get around 370ish str. THAT hurts with or without the nerf.

 

[old.Niljindil]

Oh and if the TL claims the class is ruined, then he can go **** himself. The growth rates are higher than most other lines, so the damage will STILL be hihger than everyone else. Just not by 958739859843

 

[Gahldir]

Originally posted by old.Niljindil
The growth rates are higher than most other lines, so the damage will STILL be hihger than everyone else. Just not by 958739859843

isn't that = ruined class?

edit: yes, spam to ding Earther

 

[old.Emma]

You obviously spent lots of time working this out. all that time and effort i put into seeing just how bad the nurf has affected the "average" player was all for nothing.

Wish my norse zerker could hit for 1k+ even with a decent crit ive only ever capped at 648 dmg. Yet ive been hit by CS hero`s and Polearms several times with crits for over 700 dmg.

Noticed NP are starting to use savages instead of zerkers alot now. Prolly cos Zerkers just do the damage needed now.

Just as a comparison though

Doublefrost Cap using a 4.1 spd Bastard Sword on a troll with 35 qui.

Caps at 380 dmg post 1.62
Caps at 528 dmg pre 1.62

Amethyst Slash Cap using a 4.1 spd Bastard Sword on a Highlander with 50 qui.

Caps at 396 dmg

Diamond Slash caps at 467 dmg

Now you see why zerkers become rare next patch ?

The problem is mythic has stated that Zerkers are supposed to be the only lighttank post 1.62 that should be able to go head to head vs a heavy tank and win. Problem is they can't. The only positional style they have is rear, snowsquall and rear styles have had there arch nurfed by 33% also making those styles alot harder to get off unless you are literally right behind your target.

 

[old.anubis]

who cares
now every1 and his mom has 50 lvl savage
by the time 1.62 hits EU these savages will have basic set of RAs
_the only_ thing which will be good about zerks in 1.62+ is prevent flight RA
so basically you will need only 1 zerk, and 2 savages will assist him

 

[Bellona]

50% crit is max in rvr

 

[StormriderX]

Bellona - vendo mode crit has not cap.

Also zerks really should stop whining just cause you don't do insane damage anymore. Adapt and play better instead of spamming doublefrost etc.

Old.Emma - about the hero hitting you back harder - ever considered the fact he also hits a lot slower than you and is probably using a 5.7spd spear? What makes you think you should outdamage him per hit, whilst hitting faster?

All the shit zerk players who rolled one cause it was a fotm will quit, whine and bitch. The good ones will stay.

 

[old.Nol]

The real issue is going to be the fact that it will be possible to stop the endurance battery in this patch. Shamans are going to be sucking all the healers power, while classes bombard and assist on it. Without endless endurance and crazy styles, all groups become manageable.

 

[jakobi]

Yes the LA nerf was in order etc. But ppl are forgetting something very important imo too. The shadowblades, I never heard much whine about them outdmg'ing tanks or anything. I fear SB pop in Emain is gonna very scarce after 1.62. Which means we will have less ppl telling us where enemies roam. Offcourse there is still critblade, but as someone said:
SB in 1.62 will be like PA, CD, /release

You might have a chance with purge up as a SB, else you are really fucked imo. soo woohoo, 1 kill every 30 mins, soudns good to me (If I played a NS or inf)

I do believe that the good zerks will stay and adapt, but my main concern is not zerkers, it's the sb's.

just my 2 cents

 

[Trinilim]

Emma -

okies, I'll work another one out with the damage you gave

380 damage + vendo + 60% crit.

That's 608 damage.

That's defintely not bad .

My friar used to hit for around 250-350 per hit, zerkers are being brought down to that level imo.

And I know all you mids have had at least 1 aggrivating experience with a friar


Bellona -

That's why I said while in berserk mode. While you're berserked, you can do up to 100% crits.


Jak -

While it's true that shadowblades will suffer more than zerkers, considerably so, they should still be able to hold their own as long as they discontinue the infamous DF spam.

This leaves the question open to them as to what anytime style they should use?

Well, 95% of the infils out there use Garrote and/or the tranq-wyv combo.

Consider speccing a SB as axe/LA or whatever, something with dual welding , somewhat like an infil. High CS, low/mid LA.

After working with the character builder I've come up with the following spec, which looks like a good assassin spec. Definitely not a "always win" spec, but then again I suppose nothing is really. And this is with autotrained stealth to 40

35 stealth
39 CS
7 LA
50 sword
34 poison

With +11 to all of these you'll get 46 stealth (which will be raised with realm rank), very nice damage on CS styles, very high weapon skill with sword + ragnarok (the most damaging style in the game, +damage wise), and the 2nd to last poison. Within realm rank 3 you'll get the last con/str debuff which is the most important.

So I think shadowblades will be able to compensate , but as stormriderx said, all the FOTMs will quit and roll a new overpowered char, but all the people true to their class will stay

 

[Driwen]

problem is with LA that your mainhand damage is penalised for dual wielding. Your always swinging offhand should make up for that damage, BUT it is an unstyled attack. So it hits less than your mainhand. So you want to spec in LA to increase your mainhand damage (+offhand damage) and you might want to go LA 39 to get a stun style from an evade? But then again you dont want to go high in LA as the styles arent really useful.

 

[Glottis_Xanadu]

Originally posted by jakobi
Yes the LA nerf was in order etc. But ppl are forgetting something very important imo too. The shadowblades, I never heard much whine about them outdmg'ing tanks or anything. I fear SB pop in Emain is gonna very scarce after 1.62. Which means we will have less ppl telling us where enemies roam. Offcourse there is still critblade, but as someone said:
SB in 1.62 will be like PA, CD, /release

You might have a chance with purge up as a SB, else you are really fucked imo. soo woohoo, 1 kill every 30 mins, soudns good to me (If I played a NS or inf)

I do believe that the good zerks will stay and adapt, but my main concern is not zerkers, it's the sb's.

just my 2 cents

Umm, I think most classes playing are also happy SB's might actually have to use PA/CD to beat over a tank in straight melee.
It might make sense and all, that an SB cannot run up unstealthed to a tank and start hitting double frost nonstop to beat the tank even with IP... Cause that is how a lot of SB have played...
Regards, Glottis

 

[old.anubis]

Originally posted by Glottis_Xanadu
Umm, I think most classes playing are also happy SB's might actually have to use PA/CD to beat over a tank in straight melee.
It might make sense and all, that an SB cannot run up unstealthed to a tank and start hitting double frost nonstop to beat the tank even with IP... Cause that is how a lot of SB have played...
Regards, Glottis

lol
full end bar = 5 doublefrosts
average tank (unbuffed) 1600 hps
so with ip (you say sb can df tank with ip) tank will have 3k hps
divide it by 5 doublefrosts and you will get 600 per hit
i wish i could hit like that

 

[old.anubis]

Originally posted by old.Nol
The real issue is going to be the fact that it will be possible to stop the endurance battery in this patch. Shamans are going to be sucking all the healers power, while classes bombard and assist on it. Without endless endurance and crazy styles, all groups become manageable.

yea, and now you dont attack shamans because it doesnt make sence for you?
i doubt something will change, shaman will die one of the last as usual
and if you are hitting shaman instead of healer, i would tell too bad for you

 

[Khefru]

I personally can't wait for 1.62

edit - thats with 29% slash resist (celts bonus)

 

[old.anubis]

didnt your mum tell you not to turn your back to troll zerker in vendo?
you gotta be raped

 

[Qte Eth]

only time will show
and vendo zerks rape neone in any positions.

 

[-Nuked-]

Originally posted by old.Emma
Wish my norse zerker could hit for 1k+ even with a decent crit ive only ever capped at 648 dmg. Yet ive been hit by CS hero`s and Polearms several times with crits for over 700 dmg.

didnt need to bring caster in here but i will if my caster could hit a tank RR2+ for 648 without debuff i would be very pleased. i know caster dmg is down to resists etc but you should be happy with 400dmg let alone 600+ on a tank. higher AF higher HP faster hits and no interuption. you still have it very easy untill casters are back to what they should be which is damage dealers. i would prefer 40% nerf and bring BMs and merc's inline with that dmg nerf.

GO casters GO

 

[old.Nol]

Originally posted by old.anubis
yea, and now you dont attack shamans because it doesnt make sence for you?
i doubt something will change, shaman will die one of the last as usual
and if you are hitting shaman instead of healer, i would tell too bad for you

No, you don't attack the shamans because they don't necesarily have to be grouped to give you a buff, in 1.62 it is conc based and ranged, but, I'll leave it to you to figure out.

 

[old.anubis]

Originally posted by old.Nol
No, you don't attack the shamans because they don't necesarily have to be grouped to give you a buff, in 1.62 it is conc based and ranged, but, I'll leave it to you to figure out.

i know how it works now and how it will work in 1.62
if you dont attack shamans now you wont attack them after patch
that's what i say

shaman is one of the key persons in good rvr group
root rox (few month ago i realised how good is root, and put it on my 1st quickbar)
disease rox (halfed heals anyone? like one of two clerics/druids is dead), especially insta on 8 seconds timer
dot on casters (together with disease) makes them panic and do funny things
ichor is very nice ra (among other midgard crap)

so if you dont realise impotance of shaman, you wont realise it after patch

edit:
and btw, shaman root is matter, in general druids dont make it more than 8%, in comparison with 24% body from warden it makes shaman root even better than healer mezz

 

[AbPoon]

To the peep whos never hit over 640 of his zerk then your doing something really wrong

Also the person who said you dont wanna spec high LA as the styles arnt really that usfull, know whats at 44 LA ? yuz ^^

Yes Zerkers needed a nerf and 30% sounds about right, one shotting support classes was never really fair, I'll mainly be playing Pwyd to get away from all the lame zerg shit on Excal once but i'll play my zerker as usual from time to time because i like the class and i made the class along time before zerkers became fotm.

To all the whining FOTM zerkers then i hope you enjoy the zerker nerf because basicly you causED it, when i made my zerk he was outnumbered by the thanes and the warriors and i always hated the fact that every nub decided to roll a zerker and therefore making my class a laughing stock.

Anyway FOTM peeps just roll a savage


edit: And no i dont think the sb's should get a 30% nerf its gonna totally kill the class

 

[katt!]

Originally posted by old.Niljindil
The growth rates are higher than most other lines

thats because base dmg = 75-80% :X

they NEED higher growth rate to compensate.

 

[Sluge Ulv]

Just 1 question...

I autotrained my SB to lvl 44... now I have to respec him.. will I lose my autotrain pts... if so it realy suck... then I have to role a new SB in order to get him as good as he is now ( with old roles )
+ I have to farm all the RPs again... if thats the case Goa must bee smoking alot of pot doing pigs and donkeys at the office

 

[Sluge Ulv]

Just 1 question...

I autotrained my SB to lvl 44... now I have to respec him.. will I lose my autotrain pts... if so it realy suck... then I have to role a new SB in order to get him as good as he is now ( with old roles )
+ I have to farm all the RPs again... if thats the case Goa must bee smoking alot of pot doing pigs and donkeys at the office

 

[tirinerfed]

i got a 5 specc SB and i get hit hard with this so called nerf bat

and when i bought this game and i made my sb i did it because of
what he stand fore so did all the zergers,

is like saying your to good a player, sry but we nerf you so you must quit or build a hunter or savage.
untill we neerf them also then you can build a bone dancer
hes a new char we nerf him a little later....

and while we nerf you we try make albs hit hard even though
the are not a mele realm but we got my acconts on the alb realm.

goa sould never have played around with any of the char
they where all good, and no body whined untill that day
when they made there first change to a char,
then we got alot
of players to whine my char sucks or hes to strong.....

Tiri the soon to retire sz

btw i am roleing a hunter cant nerf the good players of mid

 

[Arnor]

comment: wait till we get to try it ourselves, then whine/rejoice/party/whatever