The Conspiracy

[Slytale]

So i've been thinking ...

What is the role that stealthers play in daoc ... and tbh .. i came up with a few answers :

1) To annoy FG vs fights
2) To camp towers and add from a distance
3) Stealthwars VS
4) Generally just being the "pests" on the server

Looking back from the early days and seeing the changes that Mythic has made to the assasin / archer classes i can't help but wonder...

It would seem that they are trying to exterminate the classes by making it nearly impossible have ANY utility in normal RVR.

Let's take a look at the class changes:

The very first major impact was the " 1shot unstealth" : Any target that was oneshotted never used to make the assasin unstealth.. that was soon changed because of people like Creep pharming 80k RPS at amg emain killing resting casters with his strong CS spec. Like taking candy from a baby !!

THEN the MAJOR nerf to all assasins was Spellcrafting : Classes now had proper resists and it was nearly impossible to 2 or even 3shot casters ...

The the very beloved - SEE HIDDEN ! the RA that ended alot of archers careers. Assasins could take this 5pt RA and now see other classes from CLIPPING RANGE ? gg ! That really made sense.

Time passes - TOA came to play ... different specs were nerfed badly .. some weren't / LA / Dragonfang etc ...

Still stealthers didn't really have any purpouse ingame ( except for minstrels which seem to get more love each patch )

now im not quite sure ... but after TOA things REALLY started going south.

Presciene Nodes !!! Stealth Lore !! Mastery of Stealth...

One the one side they balance out with normal classes that are still getting harder to kill. .. and on the other side they are making it MUCH harder for assasins / archers to be useful. Altho .. there seems to be a tendency to have archers feel more useful / powerful than assasins.

It would seem to me that Mythic is trying to make it so useless for stealthers to play .. that most of them will leave ... They don't WANT stealther .. at all.

Look at a tower siege ... this could last for hours .. what are stealthers supposed to do ? craft ?

NO Climbpoins on Towers ? that really makes sense ! And if there are like in mainkeeps ... Assasin NPCs uncover you from across the way ..

Even when you vanish you still get hit and die by NPC guards .. so i duno.. working as intended i guess , just like PhaseShit - use it .. /dance at a firewize .. he just bolts you to death ... i thought you're immune for hte duration ?

anyways ... even if you get past the assasin NPCs , Stealthlore , Mastery of Stealth , Prescience Nodes , Stealth Zergs of low RR chars.... the caster would just shrug off your attack and you would probably take fall damage and die ( suprises me that they havent removed that yet )

So why play and assasin ? What's the point ? Mythic wants stealthers gone.


In summary - i think stealthers need a boost and some fixes:

Add tower climb points
Remove Prescience nodes
Fix MOS - MOS 3 vs MOS 3 = normal stealth - MO4 gains advantage over MOS 3 etc .. or make mos only work when stationary for 2 seconds
Remove Assasin NPCs
Fix Vanish
Fix PhaseShit
Remove stealth/ climb walls / safe fall from Minstrels
Non-stealthers cannot use stealthlore - SL should compliment the stealth line spec . not boost non-stealthers.
Fix SB and Inf RR5 abils .. they suck.
Have Mezz poison on s shorter timer OR allow me to stock up - if i saw up 10 and log .. i lose em all. - re-use is 30 mins ..

I still belive all stealthers should have some or other useful group ability - making them more desireable in groups... look at minstrels.


The consipracy still stands tho .. Mythic wants to remove stealthers .. Instead of fixing existing problems ... they spend their time making more o/p classes ..

 

[Raven]

some interesting points, but you arent the only class type getting screwed over by myhtic if you arent a light tank or a caster they dont want to know.

 

[Sauruman]

some interesting points, but you arent the only class type getting screwed over by myhtic if you arent a light tank or a caster they dont want to know.

word :\ Regarding Phaseshift it always worked for me, never had or even heard before of a problem with it. Regarding sieges, completly agree. Assassins at sieges can't do much, since theres PN's everywhere, npc's that uncover you, the random lamme mos5 archer ^^ Ofc, other classes suffer from the same problem (heavy tanks), tho the point here is stealthers =)

PS: Givf 2min timer FZ!! Give melee wub to scouts =)

 

[washington]

one major drawback of smoking too much weed over a long period of time is PARANOIA..

 

[Valgyr]

Remove stealth/ climb walls / safe fall from Minstrels

why? if so give free /lvl 50 ml 10 full toa status i ONLY play my minstrel in stealth solo or duo, i dont want to run in fgs even if rps would be better, and sly tbh u have no problem what so ever killing same rr mincers

 

[Eeben]

Remove stealth/ climb walls / safe fall from Minstrels

I still belive all stealthers should have some or other useful group ability - making them more desireable in groups... look at minstrels.

if they remove stealth from mincers what can we do then?

You ever tryet getting a good grp with a mincer after nf/toa????

 

[mixal]

Add tower climb points
Remove Prescience nodes
Fix MOS - MOS 3 vs MOS 3 = normal stealth - MO4 gains advantage over MOS 3 etc .. or make mos only work when stationary for 2 seconds
Remove Assasin NPCs
Fix Vanish
Fix PhaseShit
Remove stealth/ climb walls / safe fall from Minstrels
Non-stealthers cannot use stealthlore - SL should compliment the stealth line spec . not boost non-stealthers.
Fix SB and Inf RR5 abils .. they suck.
Have Mezz poison on s shorter timer OR allow me to stock up - if i saw up 10 and log .. i lose em all. - re-use is 30 mins ..

:worthy: :worthy: :worthy: :worthy:
These all true and all stealthers worried about these problems.
Thank you Sly , good point.

 

[mixal]

if they remove stealth from mincers what can we do then?

You ever tryet getting a good grp with a mincer after nf/toa????

Not only with mincer gettin group is hard but with all classses. Its not about mincers group char or not m8ey.

 

[Eeben]

Not only with mincer gettin group is hard but with all classses. Its not about mincers group char or not m8ey.

If he post things about a mincer it would get this has something to do with mincers... Before nf/toa mincer was a must have in any grp now nobody wants them (can you blaim them) so if you remove stealth from them it would fuck the class even more up.. btw you know mincers dont get mos?

 

[- English -]

i kinda agree a bit etc... but stealthers have been in groups in the past.... arcthic the scout ran with FC a few times etc

 

[mixal]

i was an alb player 1 years ago ; rr4L2 mincer , rr4L5 infil
i played mincer and it was good with group but solo sux imo( without toa)
so didnt know that they have no mos. Mincers were worst at old times but alpha was ownin all stealthers , its about skills and playin style imo.

 

[Adari]

fix castspeed too

 

[Raven]

as people say, make it so the faster you cast the less damage you do per spell. but thats ot, this is stealther whine

 

[Adari]

im a whining stealther

 

[Slytale]

fix castspeed too

actually make castspeed QUICK based and cap at 250 quick same as melee.

 

[Olvoair]

If he post things about a mincer it would get this has something to do with mincers... Before nf/toa mincer was a must have in any grp now nobody wants them (can you blaim them) so if you remove stealth from them it would fuck the class even more up.. btw you know mincers dont get mos?

well there is a cap of 101 abilities, MoS would been the 102:nd so mythic couldnt fit it to mincers

 

[Duzic]

actually make castspeed QUICK based and cap at 250 quick same as melee.

then give melee resist buffs aswell

 

[Dukat]

Record of archer/scout nerfs


yes it stopped at 1.50 so it might be a little outdated, the point is there though - a long history of nerfs, a few nice updates to be sure, but still a long, long history of nerf after nerf.

 

[Glorien]

The consipracy still stands tho .. Mythic wants to remove stealthers .. Instead of fixing existing problems ... they spend their time making more o/p classes ..

I may have missed the point here but why would it be in the interests of Mythic to remove stealthers? Surely that would just lead to losing customers?

 

[Shafu]

Yea, prescience nodes, brittle guards, mastery of stealth etc were the reasons I stopped playing my critblade. Even without all these things a critblade is not very powerful (overall), but when you add all these things it's just rediculous.

It's just another example of Mythic ruining the things that made this game so great. They should encourage sneaking around. They should encourage positional stealth attacks. They should encourage scouting for enemies. They should encourage participation in keep fights (and no, I dont mean from range 2000+).

A critblade used to be one of the most exciting solo chars to play.

<insert rant about Mythic here>

 

[Lethul]

agree, delete stealthers

 

[noaim]

as people say, make it so the faster you cast the less damage you do per spell. but thats ot, this is stealther whine

When they add styledamage to nukes, and makes them stun people if you nuke em from difference positions.

 

[Chronictank]

stealthers should never be able to kill a normal light/heavy tank since they are assasins based on killing support.. but they do


casters have become a problem for all melee classes since NF with the various nerfs to abilities otherwise useful not just stealthers.
But its not as if they are unkillable, they are casters who can be interupted (without using moc ofc) and wear cloth. The only thing i would like removed is those bloody ml9 pets

 

[Eemma]

When they add styledamage to nukes, and makes them stun people if you nuke em from difference positions.

Add spells that stuns target for x amount of time but has cool down and takes awhile to cast :q (but ofcourse with immune timer)

 

[Raven]

When they add styledamage to nukes, and makes them stun people if you nuke em from difference positions.

who needs style damage when you can do 4/5/600 damage every second.

 

[Javai]

The issue with stealthers and other unloved classes is not so much their abilities but the desire for rvr groups to run the optimal set-up all the time.

I quite often have a scout, minstrel or infiltrator in a group and there are many useful things they can do - in fact nothing I like better than seeing a Inf pop and PA a mezzed target

Now you can blame Mythic for making some classes less than optimal, but you can also blame the player base for how they choose to use those classes.

 

[noaim]

who needs style damage when you can do 4/5/600 damage every second.

Wasnt your whole point that you would NOT do 4/5/600 damage every second?

 

[Kagato]

Theres classes doing far worse then stealthers out there at the moment, and they don't get to be choosey about their fights.

 

[Twinky]

give the us the possiblity to choose the Ra IP plz and remove remedy, and ill be fine.. and make us climb towers

and yes kagato... havent played warrior in years now..

 

[Neffneff]

as people say, make it so the faster you cast the less damage you do per spell.

yer can do that to my chanter when i get to wear scale armour, have 2000+ HPs and cant be interupted ^^