Football The (bacon) General Forum Football Thread.

[Scouse]

You know what really stood out?

Owen is by far a bigger threat than Berbatov. When he came on I was shitting myself. Valencia hit the crossbar (their best chance) and it was down to Owen...

Capello's a wanker for not selecting him. And I rarely say shit like that.

 

[Embattle]

Certainly an interesting day, 8 reds with Liverpool managing 2.

 

[Scouse]

Yep. Ref was wrong for both as well

 

[Lethul]

Yep. Ref was wrong for both as well

Hehe, I'd say the Carra one was quite clear. Degen was well wrong tho

 

[Wazzerphuk]

Lol, defending the Carra red card. A new low.

 

[Scouse]

Lol, defending the Carra red card. A new low.

Watched the repeat about five times. Got the ball. Even my manc-loving scum mate said so - which is why LFC are appealing both

 

[Ch3tan]

He got the ball after fouling Zamora, or did you miss the bit where he grabbed him and pulled him back. Good luck on those appeals; you will need it.

 

[Lethul]

He got the ball after fouling Zamora, or did you miss the bit where he grabbed him and pulled him back. Good luck on those appeals; you will need it.

I think the Degen appeal will go through tho. Whatever that means

 

[Wazzerphuk]

Getting the ball makes no difference if you've already held on, pulled back and prevented a run.

It's just cynical defending. Zamora had the advantage (gained fairly, by anticipating better, by being quicker and by having a better position on the pitch), and Carra climbed all over the back of him, clearly held him back with two arms and pulled, then went for the ball.

How shit do you have to be to be shown up by Zamora?

 

[Scouse]

We'll agree to disagree

As for the spending. If you can really be arsed. This post details all movements in and out of Liverpool under Benitez.

An average net spend of £16.6million per year (with only £10,000 being spent this summer break) - and a year-on-year improvement.

City have spent double rafa's 5-year net spend this summer alone. Benitez is going nowhere

 

[Calaen]

In fairness to hughes though, he has spent on well established players.

 

[Scouse]

In fairness to hughes though, he has spent on well established players.

In fairness to Benitez, when he's had the cash (once) he's spent on quality too...

 

[Hawkwind]

However, minimum quotas for the number of English players in a side, anyone?

Youth policy bringing in local talent, anyone? Seems to me that a lot of clubs spend way too much on established players rather than looking to build a squad from youth team and other talented youngsters.

As for the topic, I was absolutely shocked to witness the Fat Controller taking off Torrres/Yossi on Saturday. By far their best players. The game was there for the taking at 1-1. In the end they fully deserved to loose. I know Torres is carrying a groin injury but even he seems bemused by the replacement. Yossi's reaction was worse.

Torres likely to be out for 2 months if he goes for the groin Op will leave Liverpool very underpowered up front. I think they will struggle hard for 4th place this season.

 

[DaGaffer]

I think they will struggle hard for 4th place this season.

If they carry on like this they'll struggle for 10th.

 

[Ch3tan]

It's Gerrard carrying the groin injury, or does Torres have the same problem?

 

[Trem]

It's Gerrard carrying the groin injury, or does Torres have the same problem?

Yep Torres has dodgy bollock area as well.

 

[Turamber]

Youth policy bringing in local talent, anyone? Seems to me that a lot of clubs spend way too much on established players rather than looking to build a squad from youth team and other talented youngsters.

Can't help but feel you are promoting the Arsenal model here. I think you'll find that Liverpool, like all the other top teams, bring in plenty of young kids from all over the world.

But Arsenal started doing it first, and so are reaping the rewards first.

It seems very sad to me that both Manchester United and Liverpool who had a track record of bringing through lots of very talented British youngsters over the years now no longer do so.

An English Premier League where 90% of the players are from overseas just seems silly to me, and short term-ism in its worst form.

As for Benitez, he is dead man walking. An exit from the Champions League and a few more domestic losses and he'll be gone.

 

[DaGaffer]

It seems very sad to me that both Manchester United and Liverpool who had a track record of bringing through lots of very talented British youngsters over the years now no longer do so.

United currently have 24 British and Irish players under 24 on their books. A number are on loan, but I wouldn't say that's a lack of commitment to local development. They also routinely have more British players in their first team than any of the other big teams; only Spurs have a similar record in the top 7-8 teams.

 

[Turamber]

And do those young British players routinely establish themselves in the first team? Or do they find themselves sold off to the Boro's and Albions of the world, whilst they continue to buy in foreign players?

 

[DaGaffer]

And do those young British players routinely establish themselves in the first team? Or do they find themselves sold off to the Boro's and Albions of the world, whilst they continue to buy in foreign players?

Bottom line is they have to be good enough, but the number of players shows a willingness to develop talent. It maybe that only Johnny Evans and Danny Welbeck make it from the current crop, but that's probably always been the way; how many didn't make it from the "kids" squad of '95?

 

[cHodAX]

It seems very sad to me that both Manchester United and Liverpool who had a track record of bringing through lots of very talented British youngsters over the years now no longer do so.

What? You mean like Danny Welbeck, Darron Gibson, Danny Simpson, Corry Evans, Jonny Evans, Craig Cathcart to name but a few?

 

[soze]

What? You mean like Danny Welbeck, Darron Gibson, Danny Simpson, Corry Evans, Jonny Evans, Craig Cathcart to name but a few?

I have no doubt you have good English kids but you can't deny you policy of spending big even on kids who just it in the reserves must be harming the chances of them ever getting a shot at the first team. That said if you can afford it why not have the best squad possible.

We were bad for it but know he has had a chance to bring a group of English kids up his way our reserve / youth team can have 5 or 6 English lads playing. 2 of which Wilshire and Gibbs are strong England prospects the rest are wait and see.

 

[cHodAX]

I have no doubt you have good English kids but you can't deny you policy of spending big even on kids who just it in the reserves must be harming the chances of them ever getting a shot at the first team. That said if you can afford it why not have the best squad possible.

We were bad for it but know he has had a chance to bring a group of English kids up his way our reserve / youth team can have 5 or 6 English lads playing. 2 of which Wilshire and Gibbs are strong England prospects the rest are wait and see.

Welbeck, Gibson and Evans have all had more starts than any of those Arsenal lads you mentioned. Gibson and Evans are on the verge of the full Ireland squad and Welbeck is a regular U21 for England, all 3 have some exposure to CL football already as well. United have spent big at times and bought quality, that quality is what is setting the bar so high for these young lads but as we have seen in the last year some of those boys have played a good amount of football and won games (Macheda against Villa for example). We do give a our youth a chance but they have to be at a level where they can step into the first team and be effective when the opportunity comes, if they can't do that then I imagine they are probably never going to make it anyway.

 

[Trem]

Irish ain't English though, they don't count as homegrown.

 

[Ch3tan]

Irish ain't English though, they don't count as homegrown.

Actually the rules state homegrown British players, and that is what Turamber asked about. think the rules cover players from NI, Scotland and wales as well as England.

 

[Wazzerphuk]

Ability > Passport.

© Wenger.

 

[Embattle]

As Wazzer says, the simple fact is they need to work harder.

 

[cHodAX]

Irish ain't English though, they don't count as homegrown.

Only due to a stupid change in the rules, until less than a decade ago they counted as homegrown because of the special arrangements that have been inplace between Britain and the Republic since Ireland gained indepenence. Regardless, Eagles has gone onto to play for Burnley and Everton are looking at him. Shawcross is playing at Stoke and a number of top teams are reported to be interested. United brought those players through, they didn't become first teamers but lets be realistic, they were trying to break into a side that were national and European champions which is no easy task.

 

[Trem]

Actually the rules state homegrown British players, and that is what Turamber asked about. think the rules cover players from NI, Scotland and wales as well as England.

Aren't the players mentioned Irish though, Ireland is not part of Britain.

Only due to a stupid change in the rules, until less than a decade ago they counted as homegrown because of the special arrangements that have been inplace between Britain and the Republic since Ireland gained indepenence. Regardless, Eagles has gone onto to play for Burnley and Everton are looking at him. Shawcross is playing at Stoke and a number of top teams are reported to be interested. United brought those players through, they didn't become first teamers but lets be realistic, they were trying to break into a side that were national and European champions which is no easy task.

Yes the rules are stupid but it gives jobs to furry old men in their offices (Shawcross is by far and away Stokes best player btw, he is special and won't be there long imo).

 

[Scouse]

It seems very sad to me that both Manchester United and Liverpool who had a track record of bringing through lots of very talented British youngsters over the years now no longer do so.

It's 'cause there's fuck all in the way of talented British youngsters nowadays. We're all too fat and lazy and playing games/posting on forums to obsess over football the way you need to.

Why do you think Brazil and Argentina produce such quality? Because they're poor - and the kids play football constantly.

I bet half the kids who want to go out on cold winter nights after school and play footie aren't allowed to 'cause all the parents nowadays are in a fucked up panic over a possible paedo invasion...