The all new encompassing assassin issues in rvr thread

[Aussie-]

stay stealthed when you 1shot someone, should come back.

was only overpowered pre SC

 

[VodkaFairy]

Yea

 

[Skopti]

I'd personally like to see the str/con poison changed to a weaponskill/con debuff.

I'd personally like to see a new dual wielding specline added to SB's and LA taken away. I'd much rather have the DW/CD mechanics to LA. Though I'd imagine a lot of work is needed to implement that.

As far as RA's go, maybe replace shadowrun with another type of purge on a 30 mins timer, thereby cutting our wait to 15 mins when we have both purge and the new ra.


Difficult to be objective when you are talking about a character you've spent a lot of time on.

 

[Tranquil-]

I'd still try to look for an answer in the CS line. Make 3 lines in medium spec more valuable than 2 at max spec.

 

[belth]

11s stun in Rib Separation xD Remove all the other stuns from assassins. 80/tick bleed in Ripper too.

 

[lathonial]

give scouts offensive damge, and nerf 70% evades in fights, rediculous that a rr2 sb can take 4000hp(with ip) off a rr8 scout and lose like zilch.

 

[VodkaFairy]

Originally posted by lathonial
give scouts offensive damge, and nerf 70% evades in fights, rediculous that a rr2 sb can take 4000hp(with ip) off a rr8 scout and lose like zilch.

evade is capped to 50% ;p

 

[Driwen]

Originally posted by lathonial
give scouts offensive damge, and nerf 70% evades in fights, rediculous that a rr2 sb can take 4000hp(with ip) off a rr8 scout and lose like zilch.

evade is 50% max (seems to be 25% vs dualwielders) and sb's dont have ip so its 2000hp, unless you are talking 6 months ago.

And scouts dont get much melee offensive damage its in their class, same as hunters getting any real defense.

 

[iluvatur]

did you even read what he typed?

 

[BidAccount]

Originally posted by VodkaFairy
Exactely, infs shouldn't be able to get both those very good styles without sacraficing anything

With 2.2 x spec it would actually make them sacrafice another specline to get DF or DS. Both is just.. >.<

Reducing infils to 2.2 isn't a fix to SBs.

Plus you won't notice a huge difference on most infils.

A spec of 50th, 34cs, 15dw, 35env, 35st is easily attainable - add in 3 or levels of dw and a 60% swing rate on the offhand weapon is OK. It does make 50 th 50 dw harder to achieve without dropping envenom or stealth by a few points - so this temp becomes doable by high rr infils.

And it would be interesting to see what goodies we'd get to compensate - more hits/free 2h, or a ranged dd, or something new. But my money is on no change - mythic have got way too much on their plate to create new abilities to offset the reduction.

 

[Haldar]

i have already posted my vision on the needs of Shadowblades:

~90% of current SB disadvantages will be fixed by adding str/dex based thrust dmg weapon with 7+ second stun off evade

Other issues are rather minor. Naming them

RA imbalance.
Fix Vanish
Give a decent RA to SBs (preferably smth which increases melee dmg for a period and on a timer -- fit with the "melee realm" concept)
Remove AP from NSs, while adressing 250 hard cap for qui. And plz do not tell me that AP is needed to compensate for low-con race. luri/elf has 10 less con than sara/kobbie, 20 less than Briton, 30 less than Norse. And for Rogue, 1 pt of con equals ~3.72 hp. NSs need 30% more protection to compensate for lost 37-74-111 hp? Doh. And see below.

Ranged weapons.
Tbh i want this improved for all assasins - not to the point of being archer ofc This includes: increasing magic dmg for NSs and the ability to throw daggers while moving for SBs. Albion Xbow should get no improvements bcoz it retains its higher range and damage, and an ability to poison daggers/bolts will be unfair to NSs.

Unique assasin features
2.5 spec vs extra hp vs insta DD.
i think SB hp advantage should be upped a bit, from 5% to perhaps 7 or 8%, and NSs should get a little AF buff spell, working on timer (similar to Friar's) with lower value ofc....top being around +35 - +45 AF. It should actually work over cap - not like unspec AF buff on healer classes. And i think that lowering Infi spec pts is just plain stupid idea.

Buffbot imbalance
Cleric spec AF > Dru spec haste > Shammie end regen.
Thus i belevie that either both AF and haste should be put on range like end regen OR end regen should be made unaffected by range while reducing its power. A new line of unranged end regen with end regen 3 at 50 spec would be fair imo. But i think that Mythic will go 1st way - as they already stated that they wanna buffing classes give more utility to grp when travelling with it, not standing somewhere at safe spot.

Low LA spec hurts SB/Zerks more than low DW/CD spec hurts DW-CD classes due to variance
Simple solution - make LA WS work from main weapon skill (like CD/DW) or whichever is higher (a bit unfair imo.....tho i have never seen template with DW/CD > main wpn skill).

[edit]
and making all leather same would be good imo....but i really doubt it will happen.

 

[Haldar]

and from the locked thread

donttouchpoopy
Haldar - you know better than to post 1 log and say thats evidence. Its one log in isolation with some partial context. Interesting on its own, but doesn't substantiate a case one way or another.

what u want then? a _bunch_ of logs?
[edit]
and i didnt say "this is the evidence of infis are OP"

belth
Useless log.

if u have nothing to say - stfu then.

 

[BidAccount]

Well, you wouldn't launch a piece of software and have one tester do one run through would you?

Or put a new product out and ask one person for one opinion?

One log is a start, but its like having one piece of the jigsaw puzzle. You may get a very vague idea of part of the picture, but you're buggered if you know what the whole thing is.

I'm not saying the log is invalid, but I'd like a few more pieces before making judgement.

 

[belth]

Originally posted by Haldar
belth
Useless log.

if u have nothing to say - stfu then.

NS RR7, infi RR6

NS and Infil have nearly same weapskill provided they have nearly equal weapspec.

NS was outdamaged by infi even with AP3 and af charge and won only due to lucky dot crit.

The AP3 and AF charge got offset a lot by the way the Strength relics work. Also, the NS was debuffed and had Purge down.

These 3 things make the log useless already - stfu if you don't have a useful log to add, k? There's even no idea what kind of a spec the infil has.

Provide a better log next time. Hell, even I could provide a valid log on that case if I had kept logging on when I last went to Beno with my Infil.

 

[Silenzio]

Originally posted by VodkaFairy
Exactely, infs shouldn't be able to get both those very good styles without sacraficing anything

aye... 2 very good style...

let me add


ONLY

nothing good or even usable in thust line (decent syle start on block or with detaunt Decent not good)

same for DW (as infil, merch line is way better )

 

[)nick(]

I like the idea of replacing the debuff from str/con to str/dex!

 

[Ironfoot]

Originally posted by Tranquil-
I'd still try to look for an answer in the CS line. Make 3 lines in medium spec more valuable than 2 at max spec.

while the CS line does need looking at , it is not gonna help NS or SBs as much as it will help infs

2.5x spec points 4tehwin

The only enhancement needed for this game is a good solid nerf in what ever form it comes to Infils.

 

[Haldar]

Originally posted by belth
NS and Infil have nearly same weapskill provided they have nearly equal weapspec.

The AP3 and AF charge got offset a lot by the way the Strength relics work. Also, the NS was debuffed and had Purge down.

These 3 things make the log useless already - stfu if you don't have a useful log to add, k? There's even no idea what kind of a spec the infil has.

Provide a better log next time. Hell, even I could provide a valid log on that case if I had kept logging on when I last went to Beno with my Infil.

u say that this log is useless bcoz

1) persons are almost same RR
2) u think str relics offset ap3 and af charge
3) Ns was debuffed and infi was not

/laugh
i havent seen more stupid comment here on this board yet.

I mentioned their RRs bcoz i wanted to say that both of them are high ranks - not some PLed n00bs in DF gear.

AP3 decreases dmg done by 30% (proven by NS TL tests)
af charge on any RR5+ assasin decreases dmg done by 14.6%
3 str relics increase damage for ~20% - and infi still outdamages NS.

Aye, NS is debuffed - but he is pierce, thus debuff affects him only at half power. and what the fuck does the spec have with it? looking at their high RR i'd say they both should be pretty confident with their spec, playstyle and damage. Or do u want to say that X spec infi is allowed to do this kind of damage and "Y" is not?

and tell me, what criteria do u need for log not to be useless, huh?

 

[Nazghul-]

Quit thinking in technicalities and see the reality.

 

[quinthar]

Originally posted by -RG-Jaond
:sleeping:

Gah this is why you kill me all the time, you spend far too much time sleeping

Must get more sleeeeepp

 

[old.Niljindil]

Originally posted by Silenzio
aye... 2 very good style...

let me add


ONLY

nothing good or even usable in thust line (decent syle start on block or with detaunt Decent not good)

same for DW (as infil, merch line is way better )

SO f***ing what? The "anytime" style is a positional, which makes you have access to the 2 types of good styles in everyday combat(reactionaries and positionals). What more could you possibly need?

Edit: not to mention the "small" added effect of swinging almost every time with your offhand as a bonus to that style.

 

[BidAccount]

Originally posted by Ironfoot
while the CS line does need looking at , it is not gonna help NS or SBs as much as it will help infs

2.5x spec points 4tehwin

The only enhancement needed for this game is a good solid nerf in what ever form it comes to Infils.

Now you know thats not true Ironfoot.

Go back and look at my pervious post. 2.2 spec on my infil would drop my CS from 39 to 34, and about 12 points of DW - so 6-8% off my swing chance. Virtually unnoticable - and I'd like to see what goodies I got to compensate. Or of course what mythic could do is take your extra hits away and your free 2hander, but I don't think thats what you want.

Quit fixating on other classes that you mistakenly believe get a huge advantage. Focus on what you'd like - and make sure its not the usual silly suggesting like pre 1.62 LA damage, or hammer weapons.

 

[belth]

Originally posted by Haldar
u say that this log is useless bcoz

1) persons are almost same RR
2) u think str relics offset ap3 and af charge
3) Ns was debuffed and infi was not

/laugh
i havent seen more stupid comment here on this board yet.

I mentioned their RRs bcoz i wanted to say that both of them are high ranks - not some PLed n00bs in DF gear.

AP3 decreases dmg done by 30%
af charge on any RR5+ assasin decreases dmg done by 14.6%
3 str relics increase damage for ~20% - and infi still outdamages NS.

Aye, NS is debuffed - but he is pierce, thus debuff affects him only at half power.

and tell me, what criteria do u need for log to be not useless, huh?

1) No, I pointed out that they would have pretty much same weapskill t.t
2) Last time Alb had all str-relics on exca, I was doing much more than just 120% damage compared to no str-relics. Propably works the same way as Savage DPS-buff... The infil's bound to have spec AF on him also.
3) The inf's bound have more weapskill=more damage under these conditions. Also, the inf prolly has higher spec in which every specline he uses styles from.

It's a known fact that NS are at a disadvantage against (most) Infils due to armortables and Inf's having higher weapon spec, but that log is a poor attempt of trying to prove it.

Like I said, I could prove it with a much better log if I had kept logging on, but since I didn't, pretty impossible. Ofc I don't know if the NS in question was using some junk weapons and/or had very low weapspec.

 

[-RG-Jaond]

Alb leather resistant to hib thrust + cleric af buffs, damn im happy i don't play a ns

 

[BidAccount]

Originally posted by -RG-Jaond
Alb leather resistant to hib thrust + cleric af buffs, damn im happy i don't play a ns

Don't factor buffbots into this - they're an entirely separate, and I hope soon to be resolved, issue.

Besides - LA permahaste effect and conc haste means SBs can hit swing cap with slow weapons. Its a nice advantage to have.

 

[jox]

Originally posted by -RG-Jaond
Alb leather resistant to hib thrust + cleric af buffs, damn im happy i don't play a ns

Not me :/

I would rather be a slash-speced/sexy elf girl with +15 in strength and +10 in con & AP 3 than a stinky norseman with shadowrun...

 

[Ironfoot]

Originally posted by donttouchpoopy
Now you know thats not true Ironfoot.

Go back and look at my pervious post. 2.2 spec on my infil would drop my CS from 39 to 34, and about 12 points of DW - so 6-8% off my swing chance. Virtually unnoticable - and I'd like to see what goodies I got to compensate. Or of course what mythic could do is take your extra hits away and your free 2hander, but I don't think thats what you want.

Quit fixating on other classes that you mistakenly believe get a huge advantage. Focus on what you'd like - and make sure its not the usual silly suggesting like pre 1.62 LA damage, or hammer weapons.

Pre 1.62 LA wouldn't help me anyway , I am critblade speced
44axe, 44cs, 35 stealth, 30 env 19 LA, But what i do want to know is why an infil can hit me back harder with faster speed 1h weapons than I can with a big slow arse 2h axe (and thats before i even get str/con debuffed) when you can explain to me why thats allowed to carry on ?

and regardless of what you want to believe Infils still need to be brought down a peg or 2.

 

[-RG-Jaond]

Originally posted by donttouchpoopy
Don't factor buffbots into this - they're an entirely separate, and I hope soon to be resolved, issue.

Most of the infils i fight are buffed so why not?

Originally posted by donttouchpoopy
Besides - LA permahaste effect and conc haste means SBs can hit swing cap with slow weapons. Its a nice advantage to have.

Aye like it alot, and realy looking forward to 1.64 with moa

 

[BidAccount]

Originally posted by Ironfoot
Pre 1.62 LA wouldn't help me anyway , I am critblade speced
44axe, 44cs, 35 stealth, 30 env 19 LA, But what i do want to know is why an infil can hit me back harder with faster speed 1h weapons than I can with a big slow arse 2h axe (and thats before i even get str/con debuffed) when you can explain to me why thats allowed to carry on ?

and regardless of what you want to believe Infils still need to be brought down a peg or 2.

It would help if you could substantiate at least some of what you say, rather than your usual 'it is because I say so' approach.

 

[BidAccount]

Originally posted by -RG-Jaond
Aye like it alot, and realy looking forward to 1.64 with moa

Ouch - yes hadn't thought of that. You guys get Aug str 2/3 anyway, so MOA isn't an additional hardship.

Funny - the assassin class that should probably swing slowest actually swings fastest....