tank groups

[Helme]

fom rawkz, stfu

And we dont got 3 retarded zerks :/

Nah only 1

(just kidding ofcourse)

 

[Garbannoch]

Funny thing is that if midgard is so uber how come that they are the least played realm on many servers, especially US.


/Gashemi

best for gank groups but sucks in PvE hence less attractive for casual players which make out the biggest percentage of the population
mayhaps

 

[Dumle]

Or it may be that mids are usually forgotten/screwed over in patch after patch and ppl get tired of playing a neglected realm?

But yes, I do agree that the troubles with PvE such as MLs and things is most likely a major reason.

 

[Chrstffr]

Get 243 as Briton without qui cap

then u got 15qui from creation

 

[majik]

All you keep stating its the players who make the grp.. ofc it is, but mids still have advantages compared to other realms, and imo much of it comes from their support. But I dont wanna discuss it with you since you seem to be the one who published the "Ultimate Strategy Guide of Good RvR".

Have a good day.

Midgard the realm of no disadvantages, try not to break your neck when you fall off the bandwagon.

 

[Bracken]

then u got 15qui from creation

Actually think it was 10 quick, along with 10 dex, 5 str and 5 con. Was the first week of release

 

[Ulkez]

230 -> 250 qui = ~0.1 spd = wasted

why not drop quick entirely if its wasted ?

 

[Bracken]

Hmm just checked... +10 on creation with +5 quick cap on scalars = 243 for Britons

 

[Fille^]

Midgard the realm of no disadvantages, try not to break your neck when you fall off the bandwagon.

I have no idea about where you wanna go with that statement.. a person asks about what realm have the best tank grps and that for sure should be mid if you look at the util you have in such grp.. if you cant see that you should try and look into what util the classes of your realm have.

And could you please explain me why you dont wanna run with aug healer in your setup? the resits you get besides the celerity has no interest for you?

Instead of attending to be someone who knows all kinda stuff about what a tank grp is you should try and give a reason for your statements.. one thing I can agree with you is that the players make a good grp.. but if you go back to basics you should be able to see that a mid tank grp got the best util to make the grp..

 

[majik]

And could you please explain me why you dont wanna run with aug healer in your setup? the resits you get besides the celerity has no interest for you?

I don't want to go anywhere with that because the above statement just proves how much you know.

Let me clarify for you: I AM THE AUG HEALER IN OUR SETUP.

 

[Farek]

why not drop quick entirely if its wasted ?

qui cap is more or less, way better to cap str, con, hits, af.. imo
but if you can make a 100 str, 100 con, 100 qui, 400 hits, 50 af template thats gr8

 

[Fille^]

I don't want to go anywhere with that because the above statement just proves how much you know.

Let me clarify for you: I AM THE AUG HEALER IN OUR SETUP.

so that I dont know who you are proves how much I know about a tank grp setup? You stated in a post earlier that someone didnt play ind a tank grp and I took that for being an aug healer and asked you why you didnt had one in setup.. that I didnt know you was an aug healer doesnt change the fact that you're just loading of bs instead of looking at what I write... and if you still cant see that the mid as realm should have the best tank grp then I guess there is no point in replaying to you since you're so narrow minded when it comes to this..

but I just took for granted that you had something behind your words, but for every reply you make it all seems to be bs and in that way there wont come anything usefull out of the post and the person who started the topic wont really get anything usefull out of it, so I'd rather take this argument in private if you still wanna take it...

So mayby we should stop the post farming? and you could state to me what your pointless statements point are?

 

[majik]

so that I dont know who you are proves how much I know about a tank grp setup?

It proves how much you know about our set group and I never said that we didn't want to use an aug healer and the only comment I made about aug healer not being as important in our group was this:

Kani doesn't play in a tank group so celerity isn't the highest priority.

So why you said this:

You stated in a post earlier that someone didnt play ind a tank grp and I took that for being an aug healer and asked you why you didnt had one in setup..

I don't know, unless you believe that caster groups don't use aug healers in which case I don't even know why I'm bothering replying to you.

And the narrow minded thing is very hypocritical, you can see the advantages of celerity but can't imagine a situation in RvR where the side style stun of a blademaster or the behind style snare would be more effect than simply faster attack speed? Which ties in about what I was saying:

Midgard the realm of no disadvantages, try not to break your neck when you fall off the bandwagon.

People like you are to blame for the stereotype of thinking everything midgard has is better than any realm, as I've said before celerity is a nice advantage to mids, however their lack of decent effects on positional styles can be a very bad disadvantage.

If zerkers have charge down and the person being attacked by the zerkers simply runs out of their range, all the celerity spam in the world would do no good, however being able to use a behind snare style would almost definately have any caster killed.

And quit the I'm ruining the thread b/s. I simply told the poster that a melee group can work well for all 3 realms, I didn't state a preference of realm because its entirely situational as I have said numerous times, yet you seem to think I'm narrow minded when infact the only person who hasn't discussed the case fully by comparing midgards advantages to their disadvantages is you. I take it you know what narrow-minded means, so use it sparingly if you have a tendancy to be a hypocrite.

 

[Eemma]

People like you are to blame for the stereotype of thinking everything midgard has is better than any realm

But they are... Best healer, I win bottom caster, intercept pets + lifedraining nuke, bd..., and zerker prolly the best light tanks out of the 3 realms, Warrior > Hero (donno with arms) and im sure shaman is OP in someway but hell, I'd rather have all that than qc stun...

 

[rvn]

merc>bm>zerk light tank wise imo (thanks to zerks not haveing any decent positonal exept back (hi strafe?).

hero=hero=warrior (well heros get best styles of them all, warriors have to choose between crap tohit on back pos, or no utitility at all on styles, armsmen can get great styles but no 1h dmg/heros dont get 1h dmg either, but why use 1h anyway nowdays exept for slamming, or when why need slam when you got an back pos 9sec stun with highest tohit in the game that never misses.)

but YEAH warriors make so much better tanks......... just because of testudo, ot the 1h dmg (that you never use exept in pve).

ah yeah it could be that you think warriors >hero/arms, because warriors get 5% unstyled damage from their aditional WS, wich ofcourse results in less damage, as they get crappier growth rate (or less utility and same GR ragna= annihl dmg, but totally crap atck spd debuff).

 

[Osri]

qui cap is more or less, way better to cap str, con, hits, af.. imo
but if you can make a 100 str, 100 con, 100 qui, 400 hits, 50 af template thats gr8

For light tank I prefer str, qui before other stats since you der for damage. As paladin diffrent story

 

[Osri]

merc>bm>zerk light tank wise imo (thanks to zerks not haveing any decent positonal exept back (hi strafe?).

I would put em pretty much on same bar...all just have diffrent good sides. Played all light tanks with high rr, just imo.

Warr > other heavy tanks.

 

[Bracken]

merc>bm>zerk light tank wise imo (thanks to zerks not haveing any decent positonal exept back (hi strafe?).

hero=hero=warrior (well heros get best styles of them all, warriors have to choose between crap tohit on back pos, or no utitility at all on styles, armsmen can get great styles but no 1h dmg/heros dont get 1h dmg either, but why use 1h anyway nowdays exept for slamming, or when why need slam when you got an back pos 9sec stun with highest tohit in the game that never misses.)

but YEAH warriors make so much better tanks......... just because of testudo, ot the 1h dmg (that you never use exept in pve).

ah yeah it could be that you think warriors >hero/arms, because warriors get 5% unstyled damage from their aditional WS, wich ofcourse results in less damage, as they get crappier growth rate (or less utility and same GR ragna= annihl dmg, but totally crap atck spd debuff).

The 1h damage isn't the issue. Much higher 1h ws = much higher chance to get through defence for slam. And yes slam is still a significant tool - positional style stuns are much less useful (hi strafe?), not to mention (in an armsman's case) in a chain. Also warriors suffer lower damage variance when going 2H than armsmen (either pure or hybrid) due to double speccing being gimped.

 

[rvn]

when you have an opener with snare, landing #2 style isnt a problem even if they are strafeing, wich is the case for armsmen 2h specc.

only class that perma evades slam's in the back is savage. rest of the classes are "easy" slammed even with 1 main weapon specc.

 

[Bracken]

when you have an opener with snare, landing #2 style isnt a problem even if they are strafeing, wich is the case for armsmen 2h specc.

only class that perma evades slam's in the back is savage. rest of the classes are "easy" slammed even with 1 main weapon specc.

You still have to get the first positional in first with the follow up delay (and that's with 2H). That's assuming both land. Much better to have easier slamming off the bat. But hey, if you keep repeating that warriors are no better than armsman often enough it might become true... I'm just waiting for the "but armsmen have plate!" line. Always enjoy that one Only real advantage we used to have was being the only class able to get Soldiers Barricade, but they gave that to other heavy tanks too.

 

[majik]

But they are... Best healer, I win bottom caster, intercept pets + lifedraining nuke, bd..., and zerker prolly the best light tanks out of the 3 realms, Warrior > Hero (donno with arms) and im sure shaman is OP in someway but hell, I'd rather have all that than qc stun...

Zerker with ineffective positional styles are not the best. Zerk mode is nice but it isn't enough to make them better than BM's.

Best caster is bullshit, cabalist is a far more effective caster than a SM as it can debuff for itself and use its baseline lifetap with a 90% immunity to cc on its pet if rr5 is up, SM rr5 doesn't even work.

Warrior is not better than a paladin in any way, shape or form. This isn't even worth discussing.

Midgard support having 3 x demezz is baseline is very efficient but it is not signifcantly more overpowered than that of hibernia.

Shaman being able to use moc1 and buffshear because they aren't a main healing class is quite OP.

Bonedancer is overpowered, but we like it that way.

So basically midgard is only a little better than any other realm fg vs fg wise and the main part of why people consider them to be overpowered is the bonedancer being king of interupts with pd5. If bd's were toned down midgard would in my opinion be balanced, but then again the alb and hib easycrew would whine about 3 x demezz then, so its really no use.

 

[Bracken]

Warrior is not better than a paladin in any way, shape or form. This isn't even worth discussing.

It was warriors compared to armsmen being discussed . Though you're right in that it's paladins who get groups rather than armsmen, so even that is pointless discussing

 

[Lethul]

only class that perma evades slam's in the back is savage. rest of the classes are "easy" slammed even with 1 main weapon specc.

still having nightmares about our duel?

oh and i have to agree, to me armsman looks way better on paper than warrior. havent played any of them but the only reason arsmans aint getting groups is cause of paladins (imo), warrior wouldnt get groups in albion either. if i had the choice of warr - arms in midgård i would most likely go for armsman

 

[majik]

It was warriors compared to armsmen being discussed . Though you're right in that it's paladins who get groups rather than armsmen, so even that is pointless discussing

Warriors, heros, armsmen and paladins share the same purpose.

 

[Lethul]

Best caster is bullshit, cabalist is a far more effective caster than a SM as it can debuff for itself and use its baseline lifetap with a 90% immunity to cc on its pet if rr5 is up, SM rr5 doesn't even work.

only point that you were wrong at

 

[majik]

only point that you were wrong at

Not really, to effectively run a SM as a caster group you need cold debuff from rc rm. So you need SM and a runemaster fitted into your group setup. In alb a sorceror is compulsory and if there is to be a hybrid or caster group setup, a cabalist really should be included. A cabalist can debuff for itself and the sorc can assist it just as the rm and sm in mid group assist each other.

 

[Lethul]

Not really, to effectively run a SM as a caster group you need cold debuff from rc rm. So you need SM and a runemaster fitted into your group setup. In alb a sorceror is compulsory and if there is to be a hybrid or caster group setup, a cabalist really should be included. A cabalist can debuff for itself and the sorc can assist it just as the rm and sm in mid group assist each other.

you dont need a debuffer, 2 sms > 1 debuffer 1 sm.

they got higest undebuffed dps in the game, and two of them assisting drops targets with resist buffs fast aswell. not to mention next to melee immune

edit: but i agree, sorc/caba combo is great if they are alive/uninterupted

 

[Bracken]

to me armsman looks way better on paper than warrior.

The basic trade off is WS (and damage variance) against plate armour. Used to be RAs too (when only armsmen had SoB it helped), though that's been equalised (rr5 abilities aside) . Imho plate just doesn't do it compared to the WS difference (2h or 1h). There isn't that much between them over all, but the gap is there. But like you say, armsmen's main problem in group terms is paladins

Anyway, this one's been done to death countless times so I better go do some work...

 

[majik]

you dont need a debuffer, 2 sms > 1 debuffer 1 sm.

Perhaps, not tried it though, but if you use a RM with a split spec you can get some utility through nearsight instead of just pure damage, but either would work pretty well

 

[rvn]

It was warriors compared to armsmen being discussed . Though you're right in that it's paladins who get groups rather than armsmen, so even that is pointless discussing

so only because warriors get free 1h (wich benefits very little in rvr) they are superior "ok".

big differance is:

warriors get more WS.

Armsmen get alot better styles (hider back AND side pos snare with stun follow up). (higher GR, better dmg table than if warrior wants to specc for "snares" -> hammer (also get the bugged back pos on warrior, wich makes 2250 ws seem like 1500ws cause it misses 24/7.

in old days, when bodyguard wasnt available, warrior outdid armsman, however now with bodyguard, plate is actacully VERY good as with multiple attackers on you, you dont parry/block for shit. Armsmen haveing passively more abs (plate), where as warriors have the 5% evade chance (ofcourse crappy testudo, wich is only really good vs retards who keep attacking the warrior(btw it cant be cancelled so you are crawling around being useless for 1min)) on timer.

then again both are crap now with nf.