SB rant again, thx buffbots.

[rure]

what is an soulblade? (newbie question)

 

[dath]

Don't worry about it, there will be only critblades in few months, most of em can be seen lying face down or crafting Soulblade will be a relic.


(sorry, couldn't resist)

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by Runolaz
First were does all this SZ Uberness come from?? About 80% of the SB's I know of are 5-Specs and latly I've seen a lot of SoulBlades as well. As far as dmg goes INF/NS using CS style outdmg any SB using the same style cuz of thrust weapons.

How does using Thrust weapons increase out damage? There is no difference in damage levels, just different resistances vs different armour types.

Originally posted by Runolaz
With all encounters I have had with INF, even with my SZ-spec they are doing nearly the same dmg as me. That includes you Pin hitting me for rougly 250+. A SZ gives up the ability to PA, thuse should have an edge against other assassins that focus more on CS for PA. After 1.62 the way of a SZ is a dead end...there is no point speccing it as an assassin killer if you don't have an edge.

As I said, you shouldn't be comparing the 2 assassin classes purely in fights against each other.

But any fights you had with me, yes I'll have done similar damage to you. Alb had 3 str relics, I had full buffs including spec AF and you were always hit with the top enervating poison. You shouldn't be looking at your damage in fights where you are debuffed.

btw, have you been hit with poisons from a NS with WA? Watch your 1900 HPs be reduced to 650 and your weaponskill drop to 500. Then try hitting their slash-resistant leather

Originally posted by Runolaz
I have both a CB and a SZ, but I find the SZ more fun to play. I still don't get the differnece between using back positional styles like BSII/Snowsqual and using PA, in fact they are even more difficult to land on running targets than a PA. As a SZ I suffer when it comes to taking out mages fast.

Why do you find the SZ more fun to play then? Is it because he is more successful than the other build? He has a better kill rate? Can kill virtually anything? Isn't that a sign that it's slightly unbalanced?

Originally posted by Runolaz
It is however fun to read Pin talking about bringing SZ into line with other assassin specs when he in other post clearly stats that he has no problems taking out SB.

Wrong tense. I _had_ no problems taking out SBs. I retired my Inf over 2 months ago. I was really only playing him for the month before that due to an addiction to RP-whoring, not because it was a whole lot of fun.

Yes, it was easy for me to kill SBs. And this was a combination of buffs, relics, debuffs, RR and experience. If I were to play him again with the current relic situation I would likely have a much tougher time against RR5+ SBs.

Originally posted by Runolaz
If it was up to me I would trade my SB skills with that of an INF any day of the week...would you want my SZ skill on you INF??

Sure. Take him if you want. I've swapped my leather for a whip anyway I'm playing to have fun, not to RP-whore.

Originally posted by Runolaz
And for the history of it ppl specced away from both 2H CS --> 5-Spec, it's cuz of Mytic gimping dmg on PA and the removal of "stay-hidden".

I don't agree with part of that. PA damage has not been gimped. It has been slowly degraded over time due to people's armour improving. PA damage is still high, it's just not going to 1-shot every caster target you can find.

But yes, losing stay-hidden hurt the spec somewhat meaning it's rare to pick off targets in a group and get away.

Originally posted by Runolaz
The CB is IMHO a very vialbe way to spec a SB if you have a buffbott, but unbuffed CB vs unbuffed INF/NS...they sadly don't stand a chance.

Again, I wish we didn't have to compare assassins in fights amongst themselves. Sucks that there are so damned many of them.

 

[Pin]

Re: ...

Originally posted by jox
"SZ is being brought into line." posted by Pin

Hm, brought into line, taste on the words.

I am a sz and I dont feel overpowered. Not a bit.

Me and Pin have been fighting from time to time. And he have even manage to kill me when he dosent use his cs line(he have cs 44 I belive), while I... who have spend ALL my points into axes (43/46) havent been able to outdamage him(we both have lifebane I think). Is that all? no, I have thrustresistant armor. But I still get killed from time to time. Can you even imagine what he would do with chainwearers?

Yes, I'm specced to 44CS. If I am in melee with you without PA it does not mean I am not using my CS line. It means I am not using my stealthed styles in the CS line. However, I am using the evade chain. Maybe this is something you don't realise, but Hamstring (and follow-ups) is the highest damaging melee styles I have.

How many 5-specs or soulblades use Hamstring? None.
Why? Because Comeback hits for twice the damage. This is the disparity.


As for wondering what I do against chain. Well I hit Mid Chain wearers for similar damage as I hit Mid Leather wearers. Leather may be resistant to Thrust, but it's got 17% lower absorb.


The reasons you don't outdamage me in melee is because my first hit is _ALWAYS_ with an enervating poison on. If it resists, I switch to backup with another one. This removes your buffbot from the equation in terms of damage, whereas I am affected much less by the debuff.

Add to that that I have a spec AF buff on me, so you are losing 15% damage to that. Then add that I had 3 relics behind me then.


I fought you twice after we lost relics (in Odin's after the raid).

The first was straight up melee. You purged the enervating and stun, then 2-shot me (from ~70% hps)
The second I landed PA, CD, SS, you purged stun and enervating and 3-shot me (from 100% hps)

That's when I was fully buffed to 1750+ hps, with 635af, 1431 weaponskill, etc.


When I had relics behind me they were usually close fights between you and me, but I'd tend to come out ahead. With relics reversed it was a whole different story.

Originally posted by jox
So where are we? Pin, outdamage me from time to time even without using his 44 cs. So except from ripping shadowzerkers to pieces with Dragonfang he can dish out 700+ whit PA when he wants to.

Take a look at Osrim, Sst and this new one Xdi or something, they all have Thrust 50 and Dual Wield 50 and they all hit as hard as I do, hm even harder from time to time. And now they are going to nerf the only advantage we sbs have?

I can hardly deal out a 700+ PA when I want to. You really should know that it's from-stealth and front-positional. 2 pre-reqs. Too much skill needed, I guess (And Pin caps at 816, btw)

(Oh, Xdi is Aada btw)

Originally posted by jox
And the ras...I wont even start to talk about the ras...

Okay, so your RA sucks. I don't much like mine either. It's Nightshades who have the nice ones.

Originally posted by jox
So why did Mythic nerf us? because most people all over us plays albs...and Mythic rather pleases the wast majorty of whining loosers like Glottis than make a good game.

Shadowbane and SWG here I come...

Yeah. They nerfed LA because all of the US plays in Alb... No. They nerfed it because it does too much damage by a long way.


And Shadowbane completely sucks, SWG doesn't appeal to me at all. But even if there was a huge walk-out from the assassin population there would still be far too many around in my opinion.

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by rure
what is an soulblade? (newbie question)

good weapon, stealth, CS, LA. crap poison.

 

[jox]

Re: Re: ...

Originally posted by Pin
Yes, I'm specced to 44CS. If I am in melee with you without PA it does not mean I am not using my CS line. It means I am not using my stealthed styles in the CS line. However, I am using the evade chain. Maybe this is something you don't realise, but Hamstring (and follow-ups) is the highest damaging melee styles I have.

How many 5-specs or soulblades use Hamstring? None.
Why? Because Comeback hits for twice the damage. This is the disparity.


As for wondering what I do against chain. Well I hit Mid Chain wearers for similar damage as I hit Mid Leather wearers. Leather may be resistant to Thrust, but it's got 17% lower absorb.


The reasons you don't outdamage me in melee is because my first hit is _ALWAYS_ with an enervating poison on. If it resists, I switch to backup with another one. This removes your buffbot from the equation in terms of damage, whereas I am affected much less by the debuff.

Add to that that I have a spec AF buff on me, so you are losing 15% damage to that. Then add that I had 3 relics behind me then.


I fought you twice after we lost relics (in Odin's after the raid).

The first was straight up melee. You purged the enervating and stun, then 2-shot me (from ~70% hps)
The second I landed PA, CD, SS, you purged stun and enervating and 3-shot me (from 100% hps)

That's when I was fully buffed to 1750+ hps, with 635af, 1431 weaponskill, etc.


When I had relics behind me they were usually close fights between you and me, but I'd tend to come out ahead. With relics reversed it was a whole different story.




I can hardly deal out a 700+ PA when I want to. You really should know that it's from-stealth and front-positional. 2 pre-reqs. Too much skill needed, I guess (And Pin caps at 816, btw)

(Oh, Xdi is Aada btw)



Okay, so your RA sucks. I don't much like mine either. It's Nightshades who have the nice ones.




Yeah. They nerfed LA because all of the US plays in Alb... No. They nerfed it because it does too much damage by a long way.


And Shadowbane completely sucks, SWG doesn't appeal to me at all. But even if there was a huge walk-out from the assassin population there would still be far too many around in my opinion.

Hm, you have a point(as always). But the tragic fact is that mercitrators do about the same damage as shadowzerkers today..beside the 9 sec.

 

[Gekul]

The assassins are compared against each other, not only because they do the same job, but because they use virtually the same lines. Because of this, when there is an imbalance between the classes it is very obvious.
When you look over at a class that is designed to do the same job as your own, yet has better tools to do it, can you blame shadowblades for complaining?
I didn't design my shadowblade for stealther battles, the fact that I am almost always unbuffed mean I avoid them most of the time. I have 39LA, so that I can compare to stealthers out of stealth.

Take a infil and give him 44CS, 44slash (and only slash), 35stlth, 35 env, 5DW. That's a typical critblade spec.

What's different?

The infil has 456 points left to spend.
The infil has the choice of thrust, which not only takes advantage of a rogues higher dex, it includes a 9sec stun at 50 spec. Thrust also means you are not affected as much by the str/con debuff.

The shadowblade has more hits.
The shadowblade can use a 2h. <- with resists as they are the delay on CD hurts more than it helps.

Without LA, I don't think you can honestly say a shadowblade performs as well as an infiltrator.

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by Gekul
The shadowblade can use a 2h. <- with resists as they are the delay on CD hurts more than it helps.

Use Backstab II if the target will immobalize you before CD. With a 2h, BSII should cap around the same damage as my PA.


Old CBs like Creep and Eeny always knew when best to use PA or BS. Hell, I even saw Creep using 1h and shield, smacking people about for high CS damage, low delay, and base blocking rates (with naturally high dex).

 

[Runolaz]

Re: Re: ...

Originally posted by Pin

How many 5-specs or soulblades use Hamstring? None.
Why? Because Comeback hits for twice the damage. This is the disparity.

Well 39LA > 34CS, but the main reason is not dmg. Sb use Comeback instead of Hamstring, because of Frosty Gaze and the 6 sec stun. Why else do you think all 5-specs go for 39 LA. This only shows how little you know on speccing and using a SB.

I will go through the rest of your posts ASAP, but this one I had to do rigth away

 

[Pin]

Re: Re: Re: ...

Originally posted by Runolaz
Well 39LA > 34CS, but the main reason is not dmg. Sb use Comeback instead of Hamstring, because of Frosty Gaze and the 6 sec stun. Why else do you think all 5-specs go for 39 LA. This only shows how little you know on speccing and using a SB.

I will go through the rest of your posts ASAP, but this one I had to do rigth away

5 spec points does not double the damage. Even if there wasn't a stun on Frosty (which you claim is virtually impossible to land anyway) or if the target was immune to the stun and you had 39CS (hell, even 50CS) with your 39LA you wouldn't touch Hamstring with a 10ft pole. The reason being Hamstring would hit for 200, when Comeback hits for 400.

 

[Gekul]

Originally posted by Pin
Use Backstab II if the target will immobalize you before CD. With a 2h, BSII should cap around the same damage as my PA.


Old CBs like Creep and Eeny always knew when best to use PA or BS. Hell, I even saw Creep using 1h and shield, smacking people about for high CS damage, low delay, and base blocking rates (with naturally high dex).

You're giving some interesting opinions, but this doesn't change the fact that infiltrators have more going for them. Creep was using a 1h + shield because LA can be a disadvantage when not specced. The stun on BSII is shorter than the delay on the 2h weapon hehe.
Without LA, tell me how you consider shadowblades balanced?

 

[froler-mid]

soo much wajn


after the nerf, LA still gonna be better then DW. LA hits EVERY time. DW like 60% chance too hit...yay


about LA styles doing poo dmg...live with it, DW styles are FRIKKIN useless.


Havoc etc.

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by Gekul
You're giving some interesting opinions, but this doesn't change the fact that infiltrators have more going for them. Creep was using a 1h + shield because LA can be a disadvantage when not specced. The stun on BS is shorter than the delay on the 2h weapon hehe.
Without LA, tell me how you consider shadowblades balanced?

unspecced LA is equal to unspecced DW when using equal-speed weapons.

unspecced LA is greater than unspecced DW when using a slow mainhand and fast offhand.


The stun on BS2 is only 3 seconds true, but you'll land the second hit before a QC. (Won't beat insta except if you have very high QUI).

 

[Carlos Bananos]

unspecced....1h+shield outdamages 2 axes by far.

Nearly double ;x

 

[Zordo]

Dw styles may be useless but i wonder why infils still do as much or more dmg per hit than me, not to mention dragon fang which is so fucking overpowered.

 

[Gekul]

so

Originally posted by froler-mid
o much wajn


after the nerf, LA still gonna be better then DW. LA hits EVERY time. DW like 60% chance too hit...yay


about LA styles doing poo dmg...live with it, DW styles are FRIKKIN useless.


Havoc etc.

Each axe doesn't hit for 100% like DW does, not taking the styles in to consideration, DW is equal to LA. The off hand hitting everytime makes up for the fact that the main hand doesn't hit for 100%.

Originally posted by Pin

unspecced LA is equal to unspecced DW when using equal-speed weapons.

unspecced LA is greater than unspecced DW when using a slow mainhand and fast offhand.

Yes, this is true, the reliable haste on LA is a + point for the SB. I personally don't think it is enough to balance the classes though.

Spec    LAMain   LAOff   LADPS     DWMain   DWOff     DWDPS

------- ------   ------- --------- ------   --------- -----

5       92.04  + 42.372  43.36     135    + 18.744    38.25

10      109.08 + 43.494  49.22     150    + 20.988    43.12

[b][u]15      126.12 + 44.616  55.08[/u][/b]     165    + 23.232    48.10

20      143.16 + 45.738  60.93     180    + 25.476    53.22

25      160.2  + 46.86   66.79     195    + 27.72     58.45

30      177.24 + 47.982  72.65     210    + 29.964    63.81

35      194.28 + 49.104  78.51     225    + 32.208    69.29

40      211.32 + 50.226  84.37     [b][u]240    + 34.452    74.89[/u][/b]

45      228.36 + 51.348  90.23     255    + 36.696    80.62

50      245.4  + 52.47   96.09     270    + 38.94     86.47

55      262.44 + 53.592  101.95    285    + 41.184    92.45

60      279.48 + 54.714  107.80    300    + 43.428    98.55

65      296.52 + 55.836  113.66    315    + 45.672    104.77

70      313.56 + 56.958  119.52    330    + 47.916    111.11

Remember those extra points I didn't use above? If you put them in to DW you would have 30+11 DW, compared to 5+11 LA on the SB.
This would out perform a critblade spec for dps.

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by Carlos Bananos
unspecced....1h+shield outdamages 2 axes by far.

Nearly double ;x

Only if you look at mainhand damage per hit.

Instead, look at mainhand + offhand over time.

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by Gekul

Remember those extra points I didn't use above? If you put them in to DW you would have 30+11 DW, compared to 5+11 LA on the SB.
This would out perform a critblade spec for dps.

Yeah, remember those extra points.... We already used most of those to raise weapon spec to 50, get the 5% extra weaponskill to cancel out your 5% extra hitpoints.

We are actually looking at 18 + 11 DW which is 2 rungs higher in the table.


Of course, it's an example biased towards your viewpoint.

If you were to drop stealth and envenom to 34 or 33 and put the rest into LA/DW it would narrow the spec difference, etc.

 

[Runolaz]

Originally posted by Pin
How does using Thrust weapons increase out damage? There is no difference in damage levels, just different resistances vs different armour types.

Thrust = dex/str = higer weaponskill = more dmg on styles used by all assassin classes like the CS-line.

Originally posted by Pin

But any fights you had with me, yes I'll have done similar damage to you. Alb had 3 str relics, I had full buffs including spec AF and you were always hit with the top enervating poison. You shouldn't be looking at your damage in fights where you are debuffed.

Even without the 3 str INF's still do a lot of dmg on me. Pll say Sb use DF and do like 400+ on an INF an that is pure bollox. Fully buffed with 46Axe/44LA 3 str I do 250-270 dmg with Snowblind on an INF, with DF its 270-290. Now unbuffed, like the Mins I bashed away at amg earlier today I do Snowblind for 150-170. Unbuffed vs INF are arround 170-190. I would not call that over powered vs a INF hitting me for 140-160 at faster spd and have both Dragonfang and can PA. I have many SS of my dmg both unbuffed and buffed and ist 10-15% more dmg than what I recive from a INF. If you also take into account that we have no stun after evade and LA using more END the picture is IMHO different.

Originally posted by Pin

btw, have you been hit with poisons from a NS with WA? Watch your 1900 HPs be reduced to 650 and your weaponskill drop to 500. Then try hitting their slash-resistant leather

I have and I don't stand a chance against those even as a SZ. The most powerful assassin in this game at higher RR is a NS and that whay I don' understand nerfing LA with 30% on a SB.

Originally posted by Pin

Why do you find the SZ more fun to play then? Is it because he is more successful than the other build? He has a better kill rate? Can kill virtually anything? Isn't that a sign that it's slightly unbalanced?

My CB is by far more powerful killing casters than my SZ. Nothing gives me more pleasure than to smack a caster down in 1-2 blows, but there are so few to choose from. Casters running solo isnt actually growing on treas you know. I play my SZ more, cuz I wanted an assassin killer and Runolas is after all my first Char. I have a buffbott and I would say this...a buffed CB is better at killing solo casters/tanks than a SZ. Tanks, because of kiting. SZ is the best for killing other assassins, and for beeing part of a regulare RvR grp. Since figting other assassin have become a larger part of beeing an assassin in the game a SZ/5-Spec/SoulBlade is more versatile than a CB. By fare the most populare spec amoung SB are not SZ, but 5-specs.

Originally posted by Pin

Wrong tense. I _had_ no problems taking out SBs. I retired my Inf over 2 months ago. I was really only playing him for the month before that due to an addiction to RP-whoring, not because it was a whole lot of fun.

Yes, it was easy for me to kill SBs. And this was a combination of buffs, relics, debuffs, RR and experience. If I were to play him again with the current relic situation I would likely have a much tougher time against RR5+ SBs.

Well still with Midgard having 3 stk relics both INF and NS hit just as hard as a SB if you take away the Relic bounus. I'm Still getting hitt for 220+ from a buffed INF and If I hit them back at 270 with no CS/+3str i find it hard to see where the imbalance is wit hregards to SZ and LA. Unlike Zerkers a SB rely a high dex/qui we cannot manipulate qui for encreasing dmg-output, that is why I feel that SB are getting nerfed unrigthfully because of issues on LA on a Zerker. I do think LA is overpowered in a Zerker, but that is IMHO cuz of the combimation of qui/hamster/crit and end.

Originally posted by Pin

Sure. Take him if you want. I've swapped my leather for a whip anyway I'm playing to have fun, not to RP-whore.

I never played for beeing uber...that is not why I took a SB. I like beeing a SZ, but with 30-40% less dmg it's no point beeing one. CB is nice too, and I will respec to one, but I think its sad having an assassin that doesn't hold it's ground agains INF/NS on a 50/50 basis. Unbuffed CB vs Unbuffed INF = /rel for the SB 80%+ of the time.

Originally posted by Pin

I don't agree with part of that. PA damage has not been gimped. It has been slowly degraded over time due to people's armour improving. PA damage is still high, it's just not going to 1-shot every caster target you can find.

Well it has specially, when using a 2H for PA. The problem is again that you cannot compare buffed vs unbuffed. Part of the problem is that after Mytihc decreasing dmg on PA I have found out that unbuffed it is better and faster to kill a caster using a 1H in stead of a 2H, cuz of the time involved to land CD.

But yes, losing stay-hidden hurt the spec somewhat meaning it's rare to pick off targets in a group and get away.

Originally posted by Pin

Again, I wish we didn't have to compare assassins in fights amongst themselves. Sucks that there are so damned many of them.

Well I agree that both Midgard and Albion getting too many assassins is a problem for the RvR aspect of the game as a hole. I don't think ppl make SB to be uber...at least that is not how they are made in FoM. Most of then are made, cuz of RvR in general beeing very complexed, and without the rigth classes like Skald/Healer many ppl start making a SB to make it possible to RvR easier. In addition stealthers are extreamly fun to play in RvR

 

[Runolaz]

Re: Re: Re: Re: ...

Originally posted by Pin
5 spec points does not double the damage. Even if there wasn't a stun on Frosty (which you claim is virtually impossible to land anyway) or if the target was immune to the stun and you had 39CS (hell, even 50CS) with your 39LA you wouldn't touch Hamstring with a 10ft pole. The reason being Hamstring would hit for 200, when Comeback hits for 400.

Again you don't get it rigth. Yes...agains a INF/NS landing Frosty gaze is hard, but against other classes they do tend to land a lot...at least I rely on Frosty Gaze as mush as you rely on Dragonfang. Comback hitting for 400...bollox. I do comback for about 40 more dmg than Snowblind. Unbuffed vs an Inf that would be 210-230 and buffed 290 - 310. That is numbers from a SZ with no Hamstring. A 5-spec has lower dmg-output and probably land Comback for 250 or so.

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by Runolaz
Thrust = dex/str = higer weaponskill = more dmg on styles used by all assassin classes like the CS-line.

Well, that's true unbuffed. A buffed Norse (with +10 at creation and aug str 1) will be over 300str.




Anyway, the whole assassin (and stealther in general) part of this game has been shagged since 1.50 as I said before.

 

[salamurhaaja]

My current spec is:
37axe, 39 la, 35 stealth, 34 cs, 34 envenom


After patch [1]:
50 axe, 35 stealth, 40cs, 34 envenom

Problems:
1. Not enough points to critic chain rib separation [edited]
2. No stun attack.
3. Criticblades do more damage than me.


After patch [2]:
46 axe, 35 stealth, 44cs, 34 envenom

Problems:
1. No stun attack.
2. Still not high weapon skills as infils
3. I prolly will loose all infils/NSs.


If i'd get Full respec id go:
50 axe, 32 stealth, 50cs, 22 envenom

Could be best spec for me IMO, but we are only given single line respec -> SCREWED!

 

[Runolaz]

Originally posted by Pin
Only if you look at mainhand damage per hit.

Instead, look at mainhand + offhand over time.

I have tested out this a lot with Lesbos, and the only reason for going 2 axes instead of 1 axe + shiels is landing two poison. Again you need to try this out b4 stating something that is not true.

As it is now all the 2 assassin classess are balanced. The only one that is a bit out of line is the high RR NS, but I don't mind. With SB doing 30-40% less dmg on LA the SB will be a gimp. There has alredy been som tests on Pendragon vs Infs and even some INF's realize that this nerf hit the SB too hard.

 

[Runolaz]

Originally posted by Pin
Well, that's true unbuffed. A buffed Norse (with +10 at creation and aug str 1) will be over 300str.

Anyway, the whole assassin (and stealther in general) part of this game has been shagged since 1.50 as I said before.

And what about Kobolds...

 

[Pin]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: ...

Originally posted by Runolaz
Again you don't get it rigth. Yes...agains a INF/NS landing Frosty gaze is hard, but against other classes they do tend to land a lot...at least I rely on Frosty Gaze as mush as you rely on Dragonfang. Comback hitting for 400...bollox. I do comback for about 40 more dmg than Snowblind. Unbuffed vs an Inf that would be 210-230 and buffed 290 - 310. That is numbers from a SZ with no Hamtring. A 5-spec has lower dmg-output and probably land Comback for 250 or so.

No. I do get it... And forget actual resultant damage numbers, those depend on far too many things.

Instead, look here: http://home.nc.rr.com/obsidianguard/wyrd/Styles.htm

Hamstring has a growth factor of 1.17, Comeback has 1.76 - 50% higher damage. This is my point... If Frosty didn't have a stun on it, you still wouldn't touch the Hamstring chain because the LA versions hit 50% harder. And the Hamstring chain is my highest damage melee chain by a long way.


Go down the rest of the styles. You use Snowblind as an anytime? Well, that's got the same growth factor as Hamstring.

For my anytime style I can choose between Garotte (which again, no 5-spec or soulblade would touch over DF/Snowblind/anything else in LA), a taunt with a 0.56 factor or a bloody 0.00 factor detaunt.

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by salamurhaaja
My current spec is:
37axe, 39 la, 35 stealth, 34 cs, 34 envenom


After patch [1]:
50 axe, 35 stealth, 40cs, 34 envenom

Problems:
1. Not enough points to critic chain leaper
2. No stun attack.
3. Criticblades do more damage than me.

1) You have Leaper. It's Rib Separation at 44.
2) You have CD. Also, you could hold a shield and have stuns of block.
3) Depends on definition and situation.

Originally posted by salamurhaaja
After patch [2]:
46 axe, 35 stealth, 44cs, 34 envenom

Problems:
1. No stun attack.
2. Still not high weapon skills as infils
3. I prolly will loose all infils/NSs.

1) You have CD and again stuns after block
2) True
3) No, you won't lose against all by any means.

Originally posted by salamurhaaja
If i'd get Full respec id go:
50 axe, 32 stealth, 50cs, 22 envenom

Could be best spec for me IMO, but we are only given single line respec -> SCREWED!

single line respec > no respecs given to the previously changed classes. "Kill the dragon" was the usual response to that whine I believe.

 

[Runolaz]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: ...

Originally posted by Pin
No. I do get it... And forget actual resultant damage numbers, those depend on far too many things.

Instead, look here: http://home.nc.rr.com/obsidianguard/wyrd/Styles.htm

Hamstring has a growth factor of 1.17, Comeback has 1.76 - 50% higher damage. This is my point... If Frosty didn't have a stun on it, you still wouldn't touch the Hamstring chain because the LA versions hit 50% harder. And the Hamstring chain is my highest damage melee chain by a long way.


Go down the rest of the styles. You use Snowblind as an anytime? Well, that's got the same growth factor as Hamstring.

For my anytime style I can choose between Garotte (which again, no 5-spec or soulblade would touch over DF/Snowblind/anything else in LA), a taunt with a 0.56 factor or a bloody 0.00 factor detaunt.

First that documenet is as reliable as the one produced by scientiest working for Coca Cola stating sugar is not bad for your health.

your Hamstring hits way harder than that of a 34CS specced SB in addition almost every INF i now spam Drangonfang first and Hamstring later. Even if Dragonfang did like 100 you would pick it over a Hamstring hitting for 250 cuz of the 9 sec stun.

Your comparison of Hamstring and Comback on a 5-Spec is so silly even you should understand it. A 5-spec garotte is again outdmg by your CS44/High weaponspec. garrote. My Snowblind as a fullspec SZ still only does 10-15% more than your garrote, and I gave of CS to get that edge. According to that documnet that many seem to like showing off the dmg difference should be much more.

If you really wanna find out. meet me in the frontier and with your buff and we can try it all out...but then again you know the answer and that is not good for you, cuz it doesn't make up...

 

[Runolaz]

Pin - problem with Axe/sw + Cs on Sb is that we have no stun like NS and INF. In addition the CS-Style line is out-dmg by INF/NS cuz og weaponskill produced by Thrust weapon. Only stun other than CD on a Sb is Comback and with 30-40% less dmg a SB with 39 LA is a gimp vs INF/NS even more than a CB without stun.

 

[Vasconcelos]

Theres a couple of things we must consider:

1- We dont have logs of sbs LA damages (at least not enuff)

2- Its a test patch yet.

3- If it becomes live as it is now, we should w8 for yankees sbs experiences after the nerf.



And, about the infil/ns hitting as harder as LA over time, well, its bollocks, i cant remember ever outdamage a RR5+ sb w/o DF involved in the battle, on low RRs ones, it might be posible due to passives RAs, but on high RRs its as rare as a flying pig. And about the mercfiltrators, they have always been accused of being sbs wanabees coz their damage, despite being harder than common infils, cant compare with shadowzerker´s n they must rely on DF to defeat assasins (ask some mercflitrators w/o a buffbot how much r offering for a respecc stone)

 

[Pin]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: ...

Originally posted by Runolaz
If you really wanna find out. meet me in the frontier and with your buff and we can try it all out...but then again you know the answer and that is not good for you, cuz it doesn't make up...

PM'd you