Realm alliance... pathetic demonstration of weakness.

[old.Niljindil]

Re: um

Originally posted by Nol


I was the low level bard you were grouped with last night, untill you decided we were a little low and disbanded without warning, bad form, no explaination or anything. Other people in my group were Temperance and Karlo, maybe their names are more memorable.

I am not going to diss Eleasias but I have rezzed him on numerous occasions. My name is Nolerdraic, I am a bard of The Inner Circle, I am level 32 and I have 5000+ RP's and I also haven't lvl'd in weeks. There are many other people who will back up how much time I spend RvR.



I will not have a dig at your guild, because it is not in my nature to senselessly disrespect people because their opinion differs with mine. Why bring my guild into this? I was defending Harry from a personal stand point.

I defended Harry because people were talking rubbish, not because I or The Inner Circle are aligned with DDi. I never defended his actions or his attitude, I merely pointed out that lying to make him seem like an absolute arsehole does not give you better credability. If this is what happens when you stand up to baseless rubish, I would rather be teamed with DDi, who at the very least are honest. I have seen Harry in RvR and even if you dislike his attitude, you have to admire his balls and his honesty. Where most other guilds get steamrolled by larger guilds, Harry will stand up to them, regardless of the consequences. He doesn't feel the need to be liked or to follow anyone else just because everyone else is.

Go ahead and diss me some more for being honest, just keep it personal and don't bring my guild into it.

I did not dispand from the group, my computer rebooted. Same thing? I never dispand from a group without saying so either when i join it or when i dispand from it. If i did, then im sorry, i normally dont and consider it rude to leave any form of "gathering" without saying so.

About my opinion on Harrys guild, its not something i came up with when i last posted here, its a long series of different happenings that made me come to the opinion i stand for today.

Cya in emain.

 

[old.Vendetta]

Re: to Hatchet

Originally posted by darkelf
"Don't attack any mids in alb unless they attack u" don't means to ally with mid. Same thing,if u attack mids who r fighting with albs,can i say u r ally with alb?
We go to alb for the fort,not mids.We need keep mids there to make albs busy.If u just want to looking for other realm's ppl to kill,u can go to emain;if u want to kill mids.u can go to midgard.
Don't come to alb while we r taking the fort and kill the mids who r there.
Attacked mids in alb last Sunday......pathetic demonstration of s******



btw,sorry for my bad English,hope u can understand what i want to say

On that post you are a total disgrace to Hibernia !

Although I was not there personally, my guild despite initially following the herd did attack Mids and many in my guild are upset that there was any attempt at co-operation with our enemies.

Do not ever tell any of us where or when we can kill our enemies !

 

[old.darkelf]

I'm disgrace Hibernia?
DO u really think attack mids in alb and been send back to home by 2 times albs will make them think u r brave? will make hibernia honor?
U have 2 enemy ,one is same as u, the other is much more stronger than u,and they hate each other. What will u do?Kill the easy one first and w8 for the strong one to kill u? Do u think he will think how brave u r when he kill u with no problem?or he will think how stupid u r?
btw NO REALM CAN FIGHT 2 REALMS AT SAME TIME . Who try to do it is not brave,it's stupid,he has no brain.
I'm not try to ally with mids(and it's impossible to ally with other realm in this game),just leave them there and don't attack them unless they attack u,because we have a biggest enemy to fight now.

"Do not ever tell any of us where or when we can kill our enemies!"-------------I just want to let hatchet know what do i think about it ,maybe i'm wrong but i think i have right to say what i want to say. Can't understand why u reply it and say that........

 

[tilde]

Wait for albs vs mids battle to be over, and then attack

 

[old.darkelf]

Originally posted by tilde
Wait for albs vs mids battle to be over, and then attack

Then ppl will say" look! hib always take fort after 4:00 am....."

 

[Cuthervaen]

Big mouthes

Lots of big mouthes saying this and that and that's how it shoudl be done etc...

(I speak about Hibs only, I wouldn't be as foolish as to listen to our enemies advice about what we should do and not do).

To these I have only one answer, go on and bring us a relic back, I'll be having some ale in TNN tavern awaiting for the good news.

Cuthervaen

 

[old.Vendetta]

Originally posted by darkelf
btw NO REALM CAN FIGHT 2 REALMS AT SAME TIME

Now I am really confused as that is the whole idea of the game

 

[old.Nol]

Niljindel

My apologies mate, I got you mixed up with someone else who spells their name very similar to you. You did not disband, rather we did group that night(ryo, brennik, darkelf, ice etc), and had a bunch of fun - retaking emain etc.

Just like Harry is entitled to his opinions, so are you entitiled to yours mate, I won't have a go at you about opinions. My point was that I have seen harry and ddi in emain and I am there regularly enough to have an opinion.

 

[old.Woodmansee]

Vendetta you dont fight two realms working together and making plans from irc/icq....Well that is what happned, so I guess you can.

 

[Eleasias]

Re: Re: Re: that's rubbish...

Originally posted by Pandora
And if people want to xp rather than rvr isnt that up to them?

Yes, you can exp while we're under attack, but please dont start telling people what they should have done or what they shouldnt have, when you did NOTHING! Personally I wasnt involved in the alliance stuff, but it makes sence to try helping Mids to make the *strongest* (?) realm on the server weaker, thus giving us more time to plan our own raids etc, when Albs are busy with Mids :>

 

[Thorarin]

Well, I don't know about you guys, but I refuse to accept an alliance with Hibernia. That Nolby Pride started one doesn't surprise me at all, but it makes me sick to my stomach.

If I see a hibernian I can kill, I won't hesitate a second. If anyone has a problem with that, I guess would have to find another guild/alliance that doesn't
I'm otherwise happy in my guild and alliance, so I hope the Nazgul alliance's views won't start to interfere with my own.

Granted, there aren't many around I can kill, but that'll come in time

 

[old.Pandora]

Re: Re: Re: Re: that's rubbish...

Originally posted by Eleasias
Yes, you can exp while we're under attack, but please dont start telling people what they should have done or what they shouldnt have, when you did NOTHING!

Err, possibly because noone knew we were under attack? People arent psychic, they actually have to be told about a raid before they can do anything about it.

Personally if I'd gone to help defend our realm and found a bunch of people helping the enemy I would have turned straight back round and gone back to xp'ing anyway.

 

[Eleasias]

I wasnt talking about last sunday?, but keep defences in general, Harry claims great things but hasnt done anything :>

 

[old.Vendetta]

Eleasias so what exactly do you do if say Crimm is under heavy Albion attack and you are playing with your NOLBY M8'S ?

 

[Eleasias]

Playing with Nolby m8's? I havent played my mid character in over two weeks, could be deleted as far I care (anymore) if and when Crim is under attack, I broadcast it in alliance chat (most of the time it's me telling it's under attack in the first place) then I do /who breifine and check if Lliad Draig are exping there, because they still are one of the more organized guilds in Hib, but are not part of our alliance I usually msg Brennik or some other member of theirs. By then there are usually more people from other alliances aswell, on one occasion I also messaged some CBH member/officer, Xyna/Asmo, cant really remember who, while we might have our disagreements we both still look out for the best of our realm, right?

 

[Eleasias]

Or if you were referring to the realm alliance, I didnt organize it and didnt take any big part in keeping it together, actually I had no idea of any planned alliances, we just had a go at Alb forts that afternoon with some people who were online. After we took the forts I get msg'd by one *cough* respectable lvl 50 hib that I've ruined the alliance? ;>

 

[old.darkelf]

Originally posted by Vendetta


Now I am really confused as that is the whole idea of the game

 

[old.Hatchet]

Originally posted by tilde
Wait for albs vs mids battle to be over, and then attack

Tactical? While albs n mids fight in alb, we should have been in midgard taking their relics. THAT would have been astute.

@ Darkelf, I kill albs and mids alike, if i see them fighting each other, well... i have AoE spells don't I.

About the XPing thing.. we all wanna max our chars to level 50, some folks get more time online than others, they get there first... does that give them the right to rag on others who are not yet 50? If there are lvl 50 folks who are not RvRing because they are busy levelling thier alts... then maybe there is room for critisism, but that is not the case in our alliance.

Cuth and Myrianda, this RTS thing... where are you going with it? What point is this reference trying to re-enforce? Are you suggesting i have no tactical skills, or that the folks who lead the "alliance" have none? or something else?

(please try n be specific rather than vague when u answer and stick to whichever line of argument you choose to allow others to respond, and include in your example an online multi plater RTS with stragegy similar to DAoC - UO perhaps?)

 

[old.myrianda]

ok!

Hatchet,

Don't take it wrong, i'm not trying to accuse someone or something like that. I'm just trying to explain why crying after that mid alliance aint such a big deal and why temporary alliances (or should I say avoidances?) are part of strategy.

About the RTS, I didn't talk about any particular RTS as you could take most of them as examples.

Realtime strategy, or even strategy is all about managing ressources to achieve a goal.

- The first thing you have to do is define a goal.
In a RTS, the goal is to defeat your opponent(s). Defeating an opponent can be done through different ways. Let's assume that for DAOC, defeating your opponents is done by taking all their relics.

- The second thing are your ressources.
Ressources are the tools that will enable you to achieve your goal. In most RTS, you usually have "materials" that let you produce "units" under certain conditions. If you shift this to DAOC, the materials will be time, items and xp. The units will be players, characters, races, classes, the conditions will be time and general players' presence. (things are quite simplified but are easy to understand)

- The third thing is to know how to manage them.
This is where it is all about. Once you know what goal you have to achieve, and know the ressources you have, you'll have to decide HOW you'll achieve your goal.

This would have been quite easy if we weren't in a FFA of 3. In such situation, you have 2 opponents which are 2 potential ennemies. Notice the "potential" as this will be the core management of the situation. A little bit like crowd control, you'll have to manage 2 opponents. This means that each action will have to be analyzed by taking each possible situation in count.

For example, lets assume we have 3 opponents named A, B and C and all have only 1 even army and even ressources.

- If A attacks B, they might have a potential attack from C.
- If A attacks C, they might have a potential attack from B.
- If A doesnt attack, they might have a potential attack from B or/and C.

The "potential" is generated by the fact you don't know what the third opponent is going to do. So, it might be quite clever to seek what your opponents plan to do, in order to transform that "potential" into "will" or "will not", and adapt your objectives.

In our example,

If you know that B is attacking C, you know for sure that neither B or C will attack you. So, no need to defend as you can't have any attack from B or C. This brings you in a "free" situation, where you can freely decide to attack B or C.

You now have to make a choice, either attack B or attack C :

- If you attack C, you know that 2 are attacking C. In a even army situation, you are nearly sure to defeat C. A & B wouldn't necessary "ally", they would just "arrange" to defeat C.
- If you attack B, you know that nobody is defending, so you are nearly sure to defeat B.

In such situation, you are again, free to defeat any opponent, and get into a 1on1 situation. In a even-army situation, you could attack anyone, it would be the same. However, in reality, you never have such even situation. There is always a stronger and a weaker, depending on the situation and time.

Let's assume that in our example, between B and C, C is the strongest. You'll still have the same choice: attack C or attack B. However, the consequences won't be the same.

- If you attack C, you know or can hope that A & B are stronger than C and will defeat it, leaving the 1on1 between A & B. They wouldn't necessary "ally", they would just "arrange" to defeat C.
- If you attack B, you know that nobody is defending, so you are nearly sure to defeat B, leaving the 1on1 between A & C. Again, B might see an alliance between A & C as C would have no problem to defend against B and A would "finish" B by defeating them.

In fact, the choice is between a 1on1 against B or a 1on1 against C. As C is the strongest opponent, you'll surely want a 1on1 against B as you'll have more probability to defeat them.

Now, if C was attacking B, and C was the strongest, the situation being different, the choice would have been different:

- If you attack B, you know that A & C are stronger than B and will defeat it, leaving the 1on1 between A & C. They wouldn't necessary "ally", they would just "arrange" to defeat B.
- If you attack C, you know that nobody is defending, so you are nearly sure to defeat C, leaving the 1on1 between A & B.

In such situation, the easiest 1on1 would be A vs B, so you would attack C.

This simple explanation is to demonstrate that the choice that Hibernia did by attacking Alb might be seen as some sort of "alliance", but might also be seen as the best choice Hibernia had, without talking about "alliance". Notice that there are also alot of cases where one might see an alliance, when they are , in fact, simply worrying about their own interrest.

In fact, to consider there would be a real alliance, one should shift their interrest to another's. Hibernia should have to come help Mid, when Albion would be attacking them. It would then demonstrate that Hibernia either takes Mid's objective as more important as their own, or accept there is some common objective more important than their owns.

Honestly, I haven't yet seen this and I dont think it'll ever happen.

I've tried to explain some general point of view. Of course, in the actual situation on Excalibur, it is much more complicated and there are alot of additional factors to take in count.

I just wanted to point out that we may quickly shout for alliances when, in fact, there are more "alliance" situations than "neutral"..

My 2 cents

Myrianda

 

[Marcus75]

Hatchet:

I think you need to do something other than playing this game if you get so upset over a game and involve words such as honor and pride in it. This is a game and not the end of the world.

As for tactics...if the Albs have taken control on a server then one would have to break it in some way. Winning takes work and IRL-history has shown us that alliances when proparly executed can turn things around. Break the Albion domination by getting wins and showing the rest of the server that Midgard and Hibernia are better and smarter.

When in RvR I always wanna win no matter what the cost. If this means playing with one enemy against another to get the oppurtunity to clean out the house then I will.

If you find pride in bashing your head against a brick wall then fine, do that. I will do it through wins and breaking tincans!

:whip:

 

[old.Woodmansee]

Marcus75 - thanks for the offer but Midgard dosnt want or need you or any alliance...

 

[Cuthervaen]

Tactics

Well Vandetta, UO is not a great exemple of strategy, though small scale PvP involved lots of skill in UO (moslty skill was in making ur char template too), large scale PvP was inexistant cause of awful lag.

Most PvP in UO was of the 5 guys gank 1 guy type.

So far I'm happy enough when I manage to get in a group of 8 that are team players in RvR and don't loose their head as soon as they're not xping and forget everything about teamwork. This being more the rule now (maybe cause peeps I group with don't xp anymore too) skirmishes in emain can be quite allright.

However to go beyond daily rp farming in emain and ffs get a relic as it's

 

[old.Vendetta]

*scratches head*

hmm when did I mention UO ?

*scratches head, grabs a beer starts thinking*

 

[Cuthervaen]

Tactics

Well Vandetta, UO is not a great exemple of strategy, though small scale PvP involved lots of skill in UO (moslty skill was in making ur char template too), large scale PvP was inexistant cause of awful lag.

Most PvP in UO was of the 5 guys gank 1 guy type.

So far I'm happy enough when I manage to get in a group of 8 that are team players in RvR and don't loose their head as soon as they're not xping and forget everything about teamwork. This being more the rule now (maybe cause peeps I group with don't xp anymore too) skirmishes in emain can be quite allright.

However to go beyond daily rp farming in emain and ffs get a relic we need more than that. It's a real shame this realm wasn't able to get his head out of his ass and get together and go for one yet.

Thanks to many people in albion, liek Finster, the alb force has made a move towards organised action. It's just a fact we haven't yet.

To make definition clearer, tactics is what u use for small scale battles, strategies is for long term goals and large scale battles.

Fact is, albion army when it's there full force outnumbers us. I'm not saying they're 2 to 1 or whining but it's a fact. Meeting the main albion force (not parts of it in emain) usually brings most computers to full stop before framerate starts to raise again, in Mbeo.

Let's say not to fuel the contreverse that alb force is equivalent to hib force (hehe) even then meeting it straight on for confrontation hoping we'll win and the surviving peeps can gather their bits and raise and take a relic keep is a bit of an illusion imo.

So, to get a chance at relics we can't just gather all our force and go straight on to meet albion force hoping will come out victorious, especially when u know that you can defend a keep up to 1/4 odds if u're inside.

Well I certainly won't discuss

But well I'd love to be proven wrong cause large scale battles are nice. The simple fact of seeing all hibernia force gather and have a try will be a pleasure. Some last point out of my mind, I'd rather follow ONE guy than 3/4 smart minds battling over decisions.

So after we tried one and failed last weekend, and got mainly harsh talking for it, now please some of the big mouths hanging around set up one this weekend if u're not just full of hot air. I'll gladly help and follow any leader provided there is only one appointed.

Cuthervaen

 

[Cuthervaen]

To myr

Hum and as a reply to Myr post,

Though I basically agree, some facts about the game make that if you want to help B against C as u put it, you'd better go to attack some C objective than try to go where B makes a stand and help.

This because of :

- lag

- AOE spells will affect both B and C

- u'll end up with people fighting anyone caught with F8 anyway

So best way to help B against C if u thing it serves urt interests in the long run, is to be where B isn't, attacking some of the assets of C hoping it will split it's force to face the threat.

 

[old.Vendetta]

Re: Tactics

Originally posted by Cuthervaen
Well Vandetta, UO is not a great exemple of strategy, though small scale PvP involved lots of skill in UO (moslty skill was in making ur char template too), large scale PvP was inexistant cause of awful lag.

Ok wake up listen what the hell has talking about UO got to do with me in this thread ?

You are the CF guy last weekend who rambled on and on failing to listen 3 times when I toold you I was not a Bearhawk officer contact Xyna ?

Originally posted by Cuthervaen
To make definition clearer, tactics is what u use for small scale battles, strategies is for long term goals and large scale battles

Do not patronise people, many of us are well aware of the difference. But sadly most the realm and it's guilds are not.
Do not see anything strategic coming to this realm unless civil war was introduced allowing strong guilds to smash wimp ones and people to PK rp queens

Originally posted by Cuthervaen So after we tried one and failed last weekend, and got mainly harsh talking for it, now please some of the big mouths hanging around set up one this weekend if u're not just full of hot air. I'll gladly help and follow any leader provided there is only one appointed.[/B]

This is not the first large scale failure, unfortunately there is a massive vacuum in the realm where it's brain should be. The leader thing, team works best in planning strategies also, there is also no strong enough team yet just ego's.

 

[Eleasias]

so far i've only met one CBH officer who was smart enough to ask for help :> And we certainly could take an undefended relic if we got everything sorted, but first of all i doubt there's a leader in the realm who feels like doing anything for hibernia (seeing this thread), those who try are flamed to death (ok now gaya couldnt get us out of HW, there was a reason ;>) And I still havent seen DDi/CBH try do anything *major*, now taking benowyc with your alliance is useless, when you actually try sorting something like a relic raid people would listen instead of flaming cause now it's just CBH guy: omfg CF alliance sucks they failed a relic raid, when CBH didnt even try organizing it themself :> and tbh i would rather follow a leader from CBH or DDi than from CF

 

[Marcus75]

Woodmansee:

I´m not offering any aliance. I´m only saying that wins are what counts to me. Honor and pride are a lower priority and if the odds are terrible then it´s better to destroy the threat with superior firepower. AFTER that then one can start to battle other enemies and aim for the top realm in the game. As I said...bashing your head against a wall serves little or no purpose.

 

[old.Ailelun]

Ailelun <Nolby Pride> Lvl 34 Thane
LMFAO you must be one helluva crap player to be 34 in Midguard

Nicly Said Vendetta, but you musnt remember me being in CBH Then? And TBH I dont see lvl 34 in 5 days playing time as that bad? Or is it? So maybe you should know the facts before saying things....

 

[old.Vendetta]

Originally posted by Eleasias
so far i've only met one CBH officer who was smart enough to ask for help :> And we certainly could take an undefended relic if we got everything sorted, but first of all i doubt there's a leader in the realm who feels like doing anything for hibernia (seeing this thread), those who try are flamed to death (ok now gaya couldnt get us out of HW, there was a reason ;>) And I still havent seen DDi/CBH try do anything *major*, now taking benowyc with your alliance is useless, when you actually try sorting something like a relic raid people would listen instead of flaming cause now it's just CBH guy: omfg CF alliance sucks they failed a relic raid, when CBH didnt even try organizing it themself :> and tbh i would rather follow a leader from CBH or DDi than from CF

Now you have really pissed me you dual account rp farming jerk, I damn well wish you and the other guy could read a bit before spouting off !

firstly I stated I was not a CBH officer and my views were my own not my guilds or alliances and infact were probably opposite to my guilds current thinking. Hell can you not understand individuality I annoy you and you knock a guild and alliance for it and that is just stupid.

I am not part of DDI and CBH has nothing at all to do with DDI in any way what so ever, just so happens Hatchet and I speak as we find and annoy the same arseholes that is purely coincidental.

I have left CBH so leave them and there alliance out of it crettin and next time anything important happens count the number of CF alliance on it, there are some excellent CF i am thinking mainly the ones from beta but a helluva lot of guild jumping ego junkies have gone there now and your guild well it has a lame ass rp farmer like you in it so that smashes it's credibility totally.

You may want the whole realm kissing you ass but it aint gonna happen get used to it !

I for one hope GOA wake up and ban you lamer