Picture Row

[Trem]

Heres something profound coming from a spastic like me -

Terrorism is born out of poverty.

There was bloody good money in the IRA, Bin Laden is a millionaire if not a billionaire(but he was before he started iirc). It seems that the most poverty stricken countries are the breeding grounds for terrorists. Most of the IRA were poor lads and lasses who had nothing better to do, the cause for the bombings faded away quite quickly until it just became a highly paid job.

Oh and Chilly, I don't often post anything of any sense chum so don't worry about it

I didn't say the above things to justify terrorism, muslims are a major problem at the minute but only the stupid and poor ones with no future. I bet if every muslim terrorist had a 40k a year job they wouldn't explode themselves.

 

[ECA]

Heres something profound coming from a spastic like me -

Terrorism is born out of poverty.

There was bloody good money in the IRA, Bin Laden is a millionaire if not a billionaire(but he was before he started iirc). It seems that the most poverty stricken countries are the breeding grounds for terrorists. Most of the IRA were poor lads and lasses who had nothing better to do, the cause for the bombings faded away quite quickly until it just became a highly paid job.

Oh and Chilly, I don't often post anything of any sense chum so don't worry about it

I didn't say the above things to justify terrorism, muslims are a major problem at the minute but only the stupid and poor ones with no future. I bet if every muslim terrorist had a 40k a year job they wouldn't explode themselves.

A) You have 40k/yr, 2.2 children, two cars, who cares about that piece of land someone used to own?

B) You have 0-10k/yr, you're oppressed daily, restricted movement and you're regularly harassed by security forces.

Oh well done trem, that was a tough one

 

[Trem]

A) You have 40k/yr, 2.2 children, two cars, who cares about that piece of land someone used to own?

B) You have 0-10k/yr, you're oppressed daily, restricted movement and you're regularly harassed by security forces.

Oh well done trem, that was a tough one

Thats bollocks I'm afraid.

I wasn't talking about just Israel, I mentioned the IRA as well. If I'm wrong why wasn't Bin Laden flying one of the planes? Too much to lose you see, he sent the poor, stupid ones to do it.

They are opressed daily because they tend to suicide bomb people, I would want to oppress them tbfh. That is also why their movement is restricted. You know my thoughts on this ECA but you only ever give the one side.

Its a case of 6 of one and half a dozen of the other with Israel.

Chavs with an ASBO fit all the criteria for your point B, you don't see them exploding their local Maccy D's do you? Why is that? Because they know at some stage they will have a decent life in this country if they want it, and if they have half a brain.

I aren't making my point well but I think you know what I mean....if you want to

 

[ECA]

They are opressed daily because they tend to suicide bomb people, I would want to oppress them tbfh. That is also why their movement is restricted. You know my thoughts on this ECA but you only ever give the one side.

Its a case of 6 of one and half a dozen of the other with Israel.

Chavs with an ASBO fit all the criteria for your point B, you don't see them exploding their local Maccy D's do you? Why is that? Because they know at some stage they will have a decent life in this country if they want it.

Give chavs easy access to high explosives and guns and you would see a big increase

Its too hard for a chav to get hold of some C4 or some AKs, throw some oppressed chemists with degrees into the mix though and boom now we're talking.

Not worth talking about Israel in this discussion though.
I view the Isreali oppression as criminal and you think its justified.
Lets leave it there.

 

[ECA]

I wasn't talking about just Israel, I mentioned the IRA as well. If I'm wrong why wasn't Bin Laden flying one of the planes? Too much to lose you see, he sent the poor, stupid ones to do it.

Why isn't george bush flying fighter planes in Iraq?

Leadership/hierarchy, nothing to do with moollah.

 

[Trem]

I wish he fucking was tbh.

 

[GDW]

Only a fraction of what the IRA ( and other similar paramilitary groups ) did ever reached the UK news and much of that was carefully controlled by the government.

Mongoose, saying you agree with some of the IRA sentiments is not something I would boast about, unless you clearly state what you mean.

They are a terrorist organisation who have killed hundreds and maimed thousands of UK citizens and cost your country billions of pounds that could have been reinvested elsewhere.

 

[DaGaffer]

Thats bollocks I'm afraid.

I wasn't talking about just Israel, I mentioned the IRA as well. If I'm wrong why wasn't Bin Laden flying one of the planes? Too much to lose you see, he sent the poor, stupid ones to do it.

They are opressed daily because they tend to suicide bomb people, I would want to oppress them tbfh. That is also why their movement is restricted. You know my thoughts on this ECA but you only ever give the one side.

Its a case of 6 of one and half a dozen of the other with Israel.

Chavs with an ASBO fit all the criteria for your point B, you don't see them exploding their local Maccy D's do you? Why is that? Because they know at some stage they will have a decent life in this country if they want it, and if they have half a brain.

I aren't making my point well but I think you know what I mean....if you want to

Generally I think you're spot on; poverty and boredom is the ideal breeding ground for terrorists, always has been, and its certainly where most of the Palestinian groups get their recruits from. But, Al-Qeada is something new; a lot of those guys on 911 weren't poor disaffected youth at all, they were middle class (or the nearest Saudi equivalent); and their breeding ground wasn't some slum or refugee camp, it was their local Madrassa, where Wahabi Imams have been allowed to 'teach' their fascist (and it is fascist) bile to a whole generation unchecked. Its like the equivalent of Nick Griffen and his cronies running your local Comp and no-one noticing.

Its also one of the dangers we face, the Islamists have managed to make us all lump 'arab terrorists' together as one big group, which is absolutely not the case. A lot of liberals in the West look at Israel and think that this is what its all about so they think "hey, maybe they have a point", but Al-Qeada doesn't give a fuck about Israel, except as a means to an end and another wedge he can drive between Islam and the West. These guys really are religious versions of the Nazis, they have similar views, just religiously rather than racially motivated (look at Bin-Laden's commentaries, especially the stuff about Hindus; makes Mein Kampf look like Mrs. Tiggywinkle.)

 

[Tom]

Erm... what about all the pub bombings?

A warning saying we've planted a bomb in London isn't much use when they don't tell you which pub had the bomb in...

Don't get me wrong - I know why the IRA started and agreed with some of their sentiments but they were no cute and fluffy bunnies. They shot civilians as well as 'military' targets. Never mind the number of shot policemen and women - hardly a military target imo.

M

I think you should read what I posted again.

 

[old.user4556]

But, Al-Qeada is something new; a lot of those guys on 911 weren't poor disaffected youth at all, they were middle class (or the nearest Saudi equivalent); and their breeding ground wasn't some slum or refugee camp, it was their local Madrassa, where Wahabi Imams have been allowed to 'teach' their fascist (and it is fascist) bile to a whole generation unchecked. Its like the equivalent of Nick Griffen and his cronies running your local Comp and no-one noticing.

Exactly, was going to post this.

Apparently some (all?) of the 911 hijackers were intelligent, very well educated, with girlfriends and no doubt would have had a very bright and successful future.

 

[`mongoose]

Only a fraction of what the IRA ( and other similar paramilitary groups ) did ever reached the UK news and much of that was carefully controlled by the government.

Mongoose, saying you agree with some of the IRA sentiments is not something I would boast about, unless you clearly state what you mean.

They are a terrorist organisation who have killed hundreds and maimed thousands of UK citizens and cost your country billions of pounds that could have been reinvested elsewhere.

GDW

I fail to see where I 'boasted' of agreeing with their sentiments. I said I think some of their points were vaild. These would be the points that when they were formed it was in response to some fairly harsh victimisation and opression, just like I agree with some of the sentiments of the PLO. Does it mean I think they should be free to intimidate, kneecap, brutalise, bully, murder or maim their way to political power?

No it does not, and I think I made my thoughts of their so-called 'military targets' only policy perfectly clear. Saying that I think both Britain and Israel have made some tragic mistakes in dealing with dissillusioned and opressed peoples is not saying I think bombing anyone is a legitimate way to make a protest against oppression.

As regards Tom's post, I read it, I don't agree with it. Making a distinction between terrorists as regards whether one of them blows themself up or not doesn't really hold much sway with me (rightly or wrongly)

There is very little difference between terrorist groups imo. The majority of Catholics and Muslims would probably deplore the tactics used by terrorists professing to belong to their faith, or at least I hope they would.

To reiterate my response to your post Tom, yes towards the end of the bombing campaigns by the IRA there were warnings, towards the end. At the beginning there was feck all warning. Secondly, I wonder how much comfort it is to those who have lost someone to terrorism it is, that the bomber has died along with them. I'd imagine it's very little comfort at all once the initial rage at the injustice of the loss has gone, I'd imagine because I don't know and I hope I never personally find out.

M

 

[Trem]

Well then I would point towards the other reason I stated, they were stupid.

That doesn't mean they were not intelligent.....just stupid.

Its like when I hear what teenagers want played at their funeral, it doesn't matter you spotty spazmong you are dead. Thats what all these so called martyrs(terrorists) remind me of. There isn't no shiny after life you dozy fucking prats, theres just you all blown up.

Edited to say - My reply was to G(sexface) and DaGaffer(big balls), not to fiend(massive length).

 

[Furr]

Seems now that question are being raised about whether this is an extremly well though out attempt and consiracy but radical islamic clerics and immans to further the sense of alienation amonst the muslim people and thus create a further feeling of attack on their faith by the rest of the world.

Reasons for this thought

3 "extra" much more graphic cartoons were added to the original cartoons that were spread across the muslim world, seems the orignals weren't offensive enough.

a glut of danish flags suddenly appreared across the muslim world, why would many muslim countries have so many dannish flags?? Can't imagine many danish nationals taking up residence in the gaza strip requiring a flag to hang outside their window.

The immans and the clerics were the one's who put the iotus on the various european newspapers to never publish the images with insults and threats, subsequently the usally reaction to this from europeans is to retaliate against people telling them what to do.

The mass and spontaneous outburst occus just after Hamas is elected to power and Iran is reffered to the security council, but occurs months and months after these cartoon first appear... hmmmm... this then cements muslims feeling against the west.

All in all, the more you look at it the more and more question are raised. Seems that Radical Islam is more insidious and rather cleverer than first thought.

 

[old.user4556]

A jihad is coming; the modern day crusades are also coming. Maybe not in our lifetimes, but it's coming - driven by oil.

As soon as the oil flow stops, or something threatens it - just watch the west walk in and take it.

THE END IS NIGH.

 

[Chilly]

A jihad is coming; the modern day crusades are also coming. Maybe not in our lifetimes, but it's coming - driven by oil.

As soon as the oil flow stops, or something threatens it - just watch the west walk in and take it.

THE END IS NIGH.

The scary thing is that the US could very well just waltz in and take the oil and there is sweet fuck all we can do about it unless we want to start a stupidly costly and large war.

 

[Furr]

The scary thing is that the US could very well just waltz in and take the oil and there is sweet fuck all we can do about it unless we want to start a stupidly costly and large war.

and lose... in a conventional war.
In a nuclear war everyone loses..




apart from the cockroaches

 

[Wij]

The scary thing is that the US could very well just waltz in and take the oil and there is sweet fuck all we can do about it unless we want to start a stupidly costly and large war.

This has been the case for many years. The fact they haven't must surely lead you to conclude that maybe the US isn't THAT interested in world domination.

 

[Tom]

The scary thing is that the US could very well just waltz in and take the oil and there is sweet fuck all we can do about it unless we want to start a stupidly costly and large war.

Well I wish they'd hurry up and do it because I'm sick of 90p a litre at the pump tbh!

 

[Skyler]

 

[Dukat]

I agree with alot of what's been said here, especially the comments that Furr and Big G have made.

Escape, I have to say that i disagree with alot of what you've said, it seems to me that alot of the points you've made are either pedantic or irrelevant.

for example:

"Calling for foriegners to leave England is feedom of speech. But an Arab calling for westerners to leave the MIddle East is a terrorist!"

Correct me if i'm wrong but we've had plenty of protest's here in the UK over the occupation of iraq, and these have been allowed. However, the leader of the BNP is being put on (re)trial because of his attitudes towards muslims.

I am not saying that this is the beginning and end of the issue, as I know that things are not this simple.

Anyways, I'm currently finishing my last year at college, and I fully intend to join the armed forces when I leave. As you can imagine, because of this, I am watching alot of the news and some of this is cause for concern.

One comment which really does alarm me is that "this is how hitler came to power", I have to ask myself what that would mean for me - being in the army - if an extremist party came to power here in the UK.

I see myself as a patriot, perhaps even slightly 'jingoistic'(sp?). I hate what seems to be happening, I feel as though the morally 'right' path is slowly becomming harder and harder to find. I think that the whole islam issue is becomming more trouble than it's worth. Why are we bending our society so that we can accomodate others, when it should be them adapting to our society to accomodate us.

The talk of muslim women being allowed to have a masked drivers license photo, and of the muslim worker being allowed 15 minutes for prayer 5 times a day seems rather pathetic to me. I remember reading about our troops going over to fight in the first gulf war, and being told that alcohol was strictly forbidden in iran/saudi arabia/whereever. We had to adapt to thier rules then, so why are they not adapting to ours?

The violence is the worst part though. The bombs, the riots and the increasing amounts of "racially aggrovated" assaults I hear about just seem to indicate that we're headed for major trouble in a few more years. This recent cartoon issue seems to be the thing alot of the extremists - on both sides of the fence - have been waiting for, the burning of the embassies in syria and the death threats seem to me to be an escalation from what has happened before.

Up to now I've heard little of outright, sustained defiance of the west in the middle east, this talk of arabs firebombing embassies is something new (atleast its new to me), before it was guerrilla tactics through and through - drive by shootings and car bombins in iraq and afghanistan, and suicide attacks here in the uk and america - and now things seem to be escalating, and it worries me to see it.

Could this be a move to a more overt form of conflict? very probably (and hopefully) not, but it would be rather ironic if 'WW3' was triggered because of a cartoon. After bombings, shootings and kidnappings have made minor ripples, a picture in a newpaper (in denmark of all places ) has gone and created the big splash that could trigger something truely horrific.

 

[Trem]

Good post Dukat.

 

[Calaen]

very good post Dukat.

 

[Damini]

The guy that dressed as a suicide bomber at the protest in the UK has only just been released from jail for selling heroin and cocaine. Yes, I'm sure you're entirely the right person to tell us what offends your religion, and comment on the moral corruption of the West. Please, come to my greenhouse and demonstrate your stone throwing technique.

 

[Trem]

I see myself as a patriot, perhaps even slightly 'jingoistic'(sp?). I hate what seems to be happening, I feel as though the morally 'right' path is slowly becomming harder and harder to find. I think that the whole islam issue is becomming more trouble than it's worth. Why are we bending our society so that we can accomodate others, when it should be them adapting to our society to accomodate us.

Well we can thank the pussy that is our PM for this. I never remember it being this bad under the tories, but then again, we all knew this would happen when Labour got in power. This isn't an anti Labour statement....no fuck it, yes it is.

The Labour voters on here will disagree with me(of course) but if you look at the facts then you will see that Labour are bending us all over and arse fucking each and every one of us.

Funny how the elections in Brum were found to be fixed by a Labour candidate isn't it? Hmmmm wonder why it happened in Birmingham....hmmmmm.

Erk, sorry I turned this into an anti Labour thread.

 

[ECA]

Erk, sorry I turned this into an anti Labour thread.

Don't worry, labour are the new tories.

 

[Trem]

Not even close I'm afraid.

Can't imagine Maggie taking this shit.

While I think about it Denmark won't take much shit either. Danish scare me

 

[Tom]

Mate of mine lived in Denmark for years. Regarding racism over there, he told me 'Denmark is for the Danes'.

Hes got mates who came over here and were astonished to see 'Pakis' driving expensive cars He also told me of an incident where illegal immigrants had arrived on a ferry from Sweden. Without any thought, the Danish police put them back on the ferry, turned it around, and sent it straight back.

Not that I agree with any of the above, but it happens.

 

[Furr]

The guy that dressed as a suicide bomber at the protest in the UK has only just been released from jail for selling heroin and cocaine. Yes, I'm sure you're entirely the right person to tell us what offends your religion, and comment on the moral corruption of the West. Please, come to my greenhouse and demonstrate your stone throwing technique.

That blokes been sent back to prison, was in violation of his parol. Complete retard.

It does seem that we are now continuing the theme of our human history of war and conflict on ideologies.

In the last hundred years its been Facism, Communism and now the new term being applied espeically to countires like Iran is Islamofacism. We in the West now seem to hold our freedom and liberal way of life to the same degree of reverence that we once held Christianity, and we all know of the history of Christianty versus Islam over the last severeal hundred years. Problem is that many people follow a strict interpretation of Islam and you do hear that they do not believe in freedom or democracy. Its not even a White person versus the newcommers, Many immigrants that have come over have integrated well. Sikhs and Hindus for example have a lower crime rate that the national average and generally are succesfull in School and in proffesional life. There has been the odd problem, but its not widespread across the board.

We keep hearing from "moderate" muslims that Islam is a religion of peace, and we are expected to respect that and to seperate it from the fanatic version that we constantly hear and see eminating from the muslim world and indeed from the muslims that now reside in the west. What are we meant to do, we see innocent people being blow up, and seething mass of hate against the jews (which is such a mess that we can't now blame either for who started it), a traumatic display of planes being hijacked and flown into building that is firmly engraved into peoples mindsets.

Yes Islam may have not been able to intergrate into the 21st century, we are expected to wait and let them have their pains we are told, but what if its incapable of intergration? I dont want me, my children or my childrens children to come into the world where there is a possibility that they may have to conform to a lifestyle that has muslim attributes that I thorougly disagree with.

Another point seems to be that the Islamic religion seems to be in conflict with every other religion in the world, Christians, Hindus, Buddists and so on.

And it is a scary thought that this is how wars start, even though it is a horrendous thought, lets make no mistake. It might happen.

 

[yaruar]

Another point seems to be that the Islamic religion seems to be in conflict with every other religion in the world, Christians, Hindus, Buddists and so on.

And it is a scary thought that this is how wars start, even though it is a horrendous thought, lets make no mistake. It might happen.

I think the problem isn't religion. The problem is people. On the whole any group of people who get together will have some issue with another group of people and the usual response seems to be to smash them over the heads with big rocks. I say get rid of all the people, it's the only solution.

 

[Calaen]

I think the problem isn't religion. The problem is people. On the whole any group of people who get together will have some issue with another group of people and the usual response seems to be to smash them over the heads with big rocks. I say get rid of all the people, it's the only solution.

thats a shit idea I have no interest in being buried or burned just yet.

I dont have any issues with anyone, apart from my wife but thats solvable with presents and gifts.