Ooops albs did it again...

[Arathan]

what raids? haven't seen one

My point exactly

 

[Darzil]

My point exactly

If I was going to view that I had to have been online for it to have happened, I could say there were no AC raids !

Darzil

 

[Andrilyn]

Surely people must be happy as some balance is restored? Funny seeing some hypocrits crying about relics when they preach the "fair fight" words, how in gods name do relics fit into the "fair fight" concept?
But I guess we can all be hypocrits when it suits us

 

[pjuppe]

well the mids sure shows that personally when we make midgard red.

i'd like to see you try. seriously, i would. defending can be quite fun

 

[Dard]

bring it on!

it will hurt your "Realm" in the end

No you dipshit, it hurts the game, but i guess you are to dumb to understand.

 

[Malcolm]

What a bunch of whining hypocrites. There have been several occasions when another realm's relics were in alb's possession that were AC'd with the justification that it's ok to do this if "they're our relics".

 

[Nate]

i'd like to see you try. seriously, i would. defending can be quite fun

it'll be at 5am, so we're gonna get power owned in our sleep ;( oh noes! i can't sleep im so scared!!! must defend!

 

[Aran Thule]

I don't know how we can Alb get back to a stronger position. Anyone who tries to lead is pretty much doomed to failure against the current opposition. As a result, many won't follow them. It's hard to build a reputation on serial failure.
Any suggestions ? How can Alb get stronger ?

Noone said it would be easy, when i started doing the MARR's Hib was at a real low, i think it was MARR 7 when we finally got a relic home.
But even the Failures helped as we learnt to work together and have fun, people enjoyed themselves and so were happy to try again the next time it happened.
Main advice i can give is try to do a large frontier raid, organise it a week in advance so it doesnt clash with anything.
Find people that know what they are doing and start it from there.
You probably will not succed the first time but you will learn from it, and if people enjoyed it then they will come back next time and be more likely to follow you.
One thing, if your planning it then make it a special event, maybe once a month or something so its something differant and people might want to experiance it.
If you get people interested in primetime raids then there will be less need for 4am ones, the point is to do something that everyone can get involved in, not a select few.

 

[TheBinarySurfer]

Sorry, disagree with you on this. It can take time to throw off a bad reputation, but it can be done. Its actions that have persisted albion's bad reputation, these actions continue today, and judging by the attitudes of the few are going to continue. Anyway, i should heed my own advice and not give those people who besmerch the reputations of the majority of alb players the attention they crave.

To bastardise Spock, 'The actions of the few fuckup the reputations of the many.'

Crom - on a personal level i like you and most of the stuff you say - we think alike on a number of subjects so please don't take this badly mate, but youre plain wrong - the motivations behind the "blame alb" culture aren't as innocent as you think. Explenation inc below:

Firstly let me say the sun does NOT shine out of albions collective ass. Yes we have some bad apples. As does mid/hib. Yes we do late-night keep takes. Mid/Hib do too (granted not with albions frequency though). We have faults as a realm and part of this is due to game design - to believe its the players intelligence / charisma / leadership ability is a fallacy. I see a lot of very stupid play from mids and hibs, just like i do from albs.

So - why does albion get blamed constantly? Is it the keep raids? Is it our numbers? Is it the fact we (direct quote from old thread) are "a bunch of noobish children who should be in school?". Hmm. No allow me to draw a parallel with the real world today and what you do when youre struggling to unite a bunch of very disorganised, mostly disinterested people under one banner (proverbially speaking).

Lets turn our attention to the current "war on terror" as a good parallel. Bush knew he was flagging badly as a leader, knew his country was divided and starting to self-destruct with 1001 different policies and priorities - basically trying to pull him in 5 directions all at once. What he needed was a common foe, someone everyone could hate and turn the aggression / dissatisfaction that previously was being vented towards his administration away. He found that in Afghanistan and more recently Iraq. All of a sudden bang - you have a motivated, patriotic, focused country that is working together to a common goal.

Now, remove the specifics and look at the overall picture, but lets rewind to pre-NF and look at that first. Mid/Hib struggled badly in times past to unite (perhaps due to numbers, perhaps due to raid leaders - the reasons are unimportant - the fact remains Hib/Mid raids were rare in the past - and having played hib during that past i can tell you it was because the majority of people were not sufficiently motivated to go through the rigmarole of a long raiding process).

Now fast forward to the current day - Albion has been painted as the common enemy inside of both Hibernia and Midguard - why? Because it unites people behind a common motivation (in this case "lets screw the albs by doing xyz"). Credit where credit is due - as much as a number of the trolls here on FH irritate me with a lot of their comments on a personal level - some of them are quite clever to have realised this. Of course it's not just them - some of the raid leaders and guild leaders know this too.

No, i don't think theres a hib/mid mass-conspiracy behind the scenes - what i do think is that a number of individuals that are quite influential in the communities have been clever enough to steer public opinion in their desired direction over a few months and hey presto - here we are.

Why do i know this? Because i'm trained in motivating and managing personell firstly on a company level - quite simply put this analogy transfers to the business world also - your company is struggling in motivation levels amongst staff - you try the carrot, you try the stick, if that doesnt work you paint a common enemy - a threat to their jobs in the form of another company. Suddenly everyones motivated and trying the hardest they can to poach staff from said company and generally take their clients etc etc. Bang instant motivation with some careful behind the scenes work and comments.

Wheres the proof? There is none, look at the current rhetoric from Mid/Hib, and wonder what it matches in the current world, then make up your own mind. You can lead a horse to water...

PS Yes im smart enough to realise not everybody in rvr is there because they were manipulated to - i'm saying people are motivated to do difficult things by a common enemy - real or imagined.

Flame away. Its an opinion - not something written on a clay tablet and handed to Moses...

 

[Gazon]

Not really, since we actually have fun doing our primetime raids.. What are you enjoying?

We are enjoying the whine

 

[Littles]

been retired from DAoC for a few months now, rly funny to read this shit from outside the addiction

u have my sympathies, and my pitty

I find it funny that people who claim to have quit a game months ago continue to post on the forums about it....u have my sympathies

 

[TheBinarySurfer]

I find it funny that people who claim to have quit a game months ago continue to post on the forums about it....u have my sympathies

Now i remember why i love littles

 

[Gazon]

Not really having 20 peeps forcing 160 Hibs to stop doing whatever they want to raze down alb frontier, can be fun once in a while. But this shit happening every other week is more of an annoyance than anything.

No "fun" anymore Gahn? I thought it was "always" for the fun. I'm confused.

 

[Cromcruaich]

...long post...

Aye, feelings mutual, dont worry, wont take offence

Cant match that length of post. But purely at an emotional level, these alb ac raids just really irritate everyone, its a sickening feeling in the gut. It's because they involve a tiny handful of people undoing the work of the majority of the hibernian population - the prime time raids take a lot of organisation and a lot of dedication from a lot of people, these things are difficult to put together and even more difficult to see through on the day, but they bring large open field warfare and siege to everyone, for everyone in this community to enjoy. Thats why there is a lot of anti albion feeling, though the vast majority of mid and hib players realise that its just a few people who are responsible. It's a genuine feeling, that may or may not be being exploited, but it's definately there, and not simply because of some PR put about by infuential FH trolls (whoever they maybe).

As an aside, regards hibs and raids, yea we went through a low point after cluster, previous to that, the feeling was that prydwen/hibernia punched way above its weight for raids and keep takes because of strong leaders, good organisation and a dedication and love for hibernia by the majority of its members. Was a time when we held 6 relics for a good length of time even though we were significantly under populated, think it then went down to four which we held on to for ages as well. Happy days

 

[elbeek]

That guild should be removed from the alliance for bringing shame to albion,and if that guild does not get moved you all in that alliance should suffer from there actions in game,if the albs can't do nothing about em i'm sure hibs/mids can't Mythic should do something about these ass holes imo strip there realm points any thing that unbalances this game is not good for no 1

Almost comical coming from the only player I can really liken to be as fucking annoying as an itchy scrotum.

 

[Muylaetrix]

Some people fail to see some of the CORE concepts of this game.

on pvp level,

This is a game about conflict. it puts people against people.

The game has no single claim about fairness. it`s not CS, it`s not team quake.

it`s not about me vs you or us 4 agianst you 4, it`s US against THEM.

Us and them have no fixed numbers, and don`t fight with equal weapons.

This is a game about STRIFE and HATE. You can admire or respect your enemie, but most of all, you want him dead.

It`s a dog eat dog game, not a walk in the park.

If you go through the gate of sauvage, drumm, or whatever other portal keep, you enter hostile teritory.

ANYTHING GOES THAT IS WITHIN THE RULES once you pass the portal keeps gates.

this is the most vulgar and aggresive game i know BY DESIGN and I LOVE IT. In few other games you can hurt the opposition as hard as in this game tbh.

out there it is TOTAL WAR.

War is not about being nice to the enemy (ingame).


it gets sad though when people can`t draw the difference between ingame and outgame reactions towards eachother though.

 

[Tuthmes]

Some people fail to see some of the CORE concepts of this game.

on pvp level,

This is a game about conflict. it puts people against people.

The game has no single claim about fairness. it`s not CS, it`s not team quake.

it`s not about me vs you or us 4 agianst you 4, it`s US against THEM.

Us and them have no fixed numbers, and don`t fight with equal weapons.

This is a game about STRIFE and HATE. You can admire or respect your enemie, but most of all, you want him dead.

It`s a dog eat dog game, not a walk in the park.

If you go through the gate of sauvage, drumm, or whatever other portal keep, you enter hostile teritory.

ANYTHING GOES THAT IS WITHIN THE RULES once you pass the portal keeps gates.

this is the most vulgar and aggresive game i know BY DESIGN and I LOVE IT. In few other games you can hurt the opposition as hard as in this game tbh.

out there it is TOTAL WAR.

War is not about being nice to the enemy (ingame).


it gets sad though when people can`t draw the difference between ingame and outgame reactions towards eachother though.

And above all its a game and a game should be fun.

 

[Gazon]

out there it is TOTAL WAR.

War is not about being nice to the enemy (ingame).


it gets sad though when people can`t draw the difference between ingame and outgame reactions towards eachother though.

Exactly.

And like in any war, real or game, propaganda (FH) is a part of it. The funny thing is though that the FH propaganda part isn't a game anymore for some: real condescension, real insults, real hypocracy, real bigotry, real hate are displayed here daily.

 

[TheBinarySurfer]

Exactly.

And like in any war, real or game, propaganda (FH) is a part of it. The funny thing is though that the FH propaganda part isn't a game anymore for some: real condescension, real insults, real hypocracy, real bigotry, real hate are displayed here daily.

Precisely - its the story of the ages - people pretend to hate something, then they forget they were pretending and its all real - go back in history 61 years you can see an example on a completely different scale in history of what happens when propoganda gets out of hand.

Different setting, different result. Same story.

 

[Sharkith]

it gets sad though when people can`t draw the difference between ingame and outgame reactions towards eachother though.

what I don't get is that in your post you move from saying its a game that puts "person versus person" then you say its us verus them and by the end of it you say that its sad when people cannot draw the line between in game and out of game.

It all seems slightly incoherent if you don't mind me saying so.

It might be because the notion of game here is paradoxical - on the one hand its war on the other it also involves people. Some place more value on the people and others prefer to emphasise the game play side. Then you get so many disagreements?

Gazon 's reply captures it very well - for some this is really insulting whereas opthers laugh at the thought of seeing it as a 'real' thing.

I suspect we would all be better if we were able to understand that the distinction between in game and out of game is the only 'real' thing and to know when either side of that distinction is shaping what people are saying.

 

[pip]

Folk don't wont to win fights with 10% bonus more or lose to someone with 10% more, folk want fair fights so relics throw the balance away what is so hard about leaving em as they was? all fair and stuff, folk that say they don't care about relics are pve whores or just not hardcore players

 

[Shike]

Folk don't wont to win fights with 10% bonus more or lose to someone with 10% more, folk want fair fights so relics throw the balance away what is so hard about leaving em as they was? all fair and stuff, folk that say they don't care about relics are pve whores or just not hardcore players

:eek2:

 

[Coldbeard]

Congratulations on hitting rock bottom once again.

DAoC community starting to disgust me to some extent I didn't think was possible.

 

[Shadster]

Just raid Prime Time m8's more fun for all people not just 1 fg

 

[Muylaetrix]

what I don't get is that in your post you move from saying its a game that puts "person versus person" then you say its us verus them and by the end of it you say that its sad when people cannot draw the line between in game and out of game.

It all seems slightly incoherent if you don't mind me saying so.

the game puts muylaetrix vs sharkith, it places albs vs hibs vs mids. we are destined to be enemies IN game by the simple fact we clicked on a different symbol at the start (or moved to another realm, shrug).

I would like to have a friendly chat over a few beers in the pub with you though, just like with so many other people i know from this game as ingame friend or foe and that i`ll never see irl. I am all for comunication, not throwing dirt at eachother on the boards.

I`m sure i could sit with mastade and bradlex at a bar and I would imagine we would laugh till we fell from our chairs.

But ingame, you are the enemy and MUST die.

I suspect we would all be better if we were able to understand that the distinction between in game and out of game is the only 'real' thing and to know when either side of that distinction is shaping what people are saying.

true

 

[Shike]

Exactly.

And like in any war, real or game, propaganda (FH) is a part of it. The funny thing is though that the FH propaganda part isn't a game anymore for some: real condescension, real insults, real hypocracy, real bigotry, real hate are displayed here daily.

heh, I dont really think its real anything I think alot of people do like I do, post when bored at work, I read when bored at work. Getting so worked up that real hate shows would be pretty darn sick actually and anyone feeling that way really really need a big fat realitycheck. I use FH as entertainment more than anything, just as I use DAoC. FH and DAoC is quite linked for me with one huge difference, I never throw around insults and stuff ingame since its on a more "personal" level there and I try my best to just show some respect then so I dont hurt someone with bad wording, there are also kids ingame and that is another reason to behave, kids have the right to play the game, kids posting here otoh are as we have seen many times just that, kids and I just tend to ignore them after a while since they normally have very little to say.

I think you overestimate the value of FH for alot of people when you state what you did. Sure if some get really worked up and frustrated and vent here it may look as something serious but to tell you the truth, I honestly dont think it is. 1h later same person can post another post and be totally chilled, he/she just needed to vent alittle. Im happy mods lets us do this these days.

 

[Shike]

But ingame, you are the enemy and MUST die.

you know what, I think you take this realm vs realm thingy a tad too.. serious Ingame is about having fun first and foremost, since it is a game. I can enjoy /dancing with someone ingame that is an enemy just as I can enjoy having a good fight, I can also enjoy chatting to friends just as I can enjoy chatting to enemys on iRC or FH.

Having that attitude that ALL ENEMYS MUST DIE! (FOR ARTHUR!!) is just ridicilous and a sign that you should chill out abit and try to see the multitude of enjoyment DAoC actually have to offer, EVEN with enemys. Hell some of the people I "respect" the most are actually in other realms and I have some irlfriends playing other realms aswell, I dont just switch on my roleplayer-KILLERMODE whenever I go RvR and just do everything I possibly can to ensure the death of my IRLfriends toon, that would be laughable and completely silly. DAoC is a social game, not only a realm vs realm game fgs.

As someone said; Ahh! Lechillax and lay back alil, enjoy the game and pay respect to as many as possible, including your enemys and I think you can have even more fun than you currently do. Each to their own ofc and I guess you just will go on doing your thing blindfolded without bothering with what anyone else actually say

 

[Dard]

And above all its a game and a game should be fun.

And that seems to be the hardest concept of all for some people to see ......

Now lets carry on with the ITS WAR .. WE HATE YOU .. you dont pay my subs .. the servers are open 24/7 .. you died in a rvr zone .. well lets compare this to real life ... now i'm just gonna tell you about George Bush (bet he dont play daoc tho) .. baseline stun .. animist's .. yada yada yada yawn .....

Shame more people cant see daoc for what it really is

 

[elbeek]

Congratulations on hitting rock bottom once again.

DAoC community starting to disgust me to some extent I didn't think was possible.

Well go dive in a fjord, let's face it, you are THE most miserable wanker currently posting here.

 

[TheBinarySurfer]

And that seems to be the hardest concept of all for some people to see ......

Now lets carry on with the ITS WAR .. WE HATE YOU .. you dont pay my subs .. the servers are open 24/7 .. you died in a rvr zone .. well lets compare this to real life ... now i'm just gonna tell you about George Bush (bet he dont play daoc tho) .. baseline stun .. animist's .. yada yada yada yawn .....

Shame more people cant see daoc for what it really is

Youre missing the point - part of the game is politics and propaganda, and motivating your people. Anyone who thinks you can just try organising a mass rvr event without some politicking and other similar mlarkey go ahead, i'll be here to say "told you so" when you fail.