New info about the assassin balance...

[jox]

Some words about the assassin balance during the visit to Mytix;

Obviously the Left Axe change was targetted to Berzerkers. They know that the LA changes made a much bigger change to SB's than to Zerkers. Mackey doesnt' want to make broad (increase damage by x%) type solutions, but targetted solutions that address the heart of the matter.

Short answer about Stealthers: It's on the list.

I asked about balancing assassin classes. He said he would love to take a week to balancing them and help shadowblades...but thats not gonna happen.

He said he wants to make changes to classes in small steps...so I asked about the 40% reduction to left axe damage. He said that was done poorly...the intent was to nerf berzerkers mainly...shadowblades just got screwed. Oh...and that he wasn't responsible for it. He made sure to point that out. He did seem to acklowdge that shadowblades are weak now, he said something along the lines of wanting to find that one thing that shadowblades really need to make them on the same playing field as infils and NS's.

You can read more about it here;

http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=58249949&page=1

 

[jox]

Ops, sorry.

Didnt notice that Hroft already posted a thread about this;

http://forums.barrysworld.com/showthread.php?threadid=88631

 

[BidAccount]

Interesting - on both threads. And nice to see something positive.

Can I ask the question then - what is the one thing that shadowblades would ask for (given that a blanket damage increase is not on the table).

 

[-RG-Jaond]

Originally posted by donttouchpoopy
what is the one thing that shadowblades would ask for (given that a blanket damage increase is not on the table).

hmmm guess

 

[BidAccount]

No Jaond - thats not an addition to SBs, which is what was being said here.

What change or addition to SBs is the one thing they'd look for.

 

[jox]

Originally posted by donttouchpoopy
Interesting - on both threads. And nice to see something positive.

Can I ask the question then - what is the one thing that shadowblades would ask for (given that a blanket damage increase is not on the table).

There have been much talk about dex/str-based weapons(so sbs also have a debuff-resistant weapon line, and to make kobolds a serious option again). But I dont like that idea(I am a norse with +15 in strength).

Me wants crush! Nothing would beat a massive pa with a sledge hammer

 

[envenom]

a 9 second stun off evade would be nice thats all id need

 

[Flimgoblin]

edit: locking the other one since this one's more active instead

 

[belth]

What stealthers need is the "PLAY" button removed

 

[Gordonax]

Originally posted by envenom
a 9 second stun off evade would be nice thats all id need

A 9 sec stun off an evade? Nooo... there's no way they'd give that to a class that evades as often as most stealthers do.. would they?

To be honest, I think it would be better to remove DF from the thrust line than to add it to SBs. But the problem isn't DF as such - it's the combination of having "backup" styles plus high evade plus DF.

On the other stuff in that IGN post:

Battlegroups - Interesting. Indicates that Mythic believes that 1fg vs 1fg ISN'T the best way to experience RvR in the game. Will make keep takes much easier to co-ordinate.

 

[Maghica]

Give Hammers 2h hammer pa 4tehwin

 

[Whisperess]

I would prefer something that would benefit both norse and kobbies equally - or be given a chance for race respec otherwise

Since a sweeping increase in damage isn't on the subject here, let's focus on tiny things.

SB's are supposed to get more HP than the other two classes. If you look beyond race starting stats ( since kobolds don't benefit from that ) it's roughly 50 hp.

50 hp - that's basically nothing. Maybe boost that value a bit? ( not by insane numbers )

Also, we have the ability to use 2 handed weapons - but extremely few do this - why? Because it in short - sucks.

http://pete.waterman.net/daoc/2H-vs-LA.html

The way for instance Perforate Artery work is that the unstyled damage is additive instead of multiplicative - to allow high damage even with faster weapons - which in no way make a 2hander beneficial against tougher targets than cloth casters that you will have a slightly larger chance to drop in one hit.

Then we have Shadowrun... where to begin?

Don't recall the actual numbers, but around 99% of all SB's do not have this - and none I know would consider taking it up in its current state.
Whereas Vanish has its uses, and Viper is very good - Shadowrun is worthless - maybe make it useful?

As for stylechanges and stuff, I for one don't want 9 sec directly after evade - where would they put that?
Suggested changes about making sword str/dex would benefit some, but screw over for instance troll sword warriors - so I wouldn't recommend that.
Only thing I could think of is maybe add a short/medium stun on leaper? (for all realms) Or would that be a bad idea?

Maybe introduce some SB only poisons? New debuffpoisons like Str/Dex, Dex/Qui and Dex/Con would help quite a bit.

Thus - to summarize, my suggested solutions:

Boost the increased HP's ( make it 100 instead of 50? )
Look at all the issues with 2handed weapons for SB's.
Shadowrun - either make it more useful, less costly or remove it alltogether and make a new one.
New Midgard only poisons.

 

[behatch]

new envenoms would be sweet,but i reckon ns/infils would wajn about it,

str/con debuff and dex/quick on both weps would own

thrust specc line would be fantastic-something new far better than a new class,nice change

shadowrun will never be good tbh

 

[salamurhaaja]

I'd like to see my kobold benefit from 367 dex [buffed] somehow.

 

[Gordonax]

If damage was multiplacavite (is that a word? ) wouldn't it end up as insane?

Here's more interesting bits on bigger battles:

Faeyr asked about the desire for 8v8 fights. Apparently the character of RvR on various servers changes from server to server. Some are highly zergy, others are far less so. "The goal of DAoC is to be an army on army game. That doesn't mean it's always 100 on 100. But we do want it to be multi-groups vs multi-groups. And there's going to be a lot of changes coming up with what we' doing with MLA's and Frontiers expansion that will address exactly that." They're trying to make it so that it's not just biggest zerg wins or most uber 8v8 group win.

 

[Gordonax]

Originally posted by behatch

shadowrun will never be good tbh

They also say (further down) that they are considering wipeing the RA's slate clean and redoing them entirely for Frontiers - and admit that they had been poorly done.

There's so much good stuff in there - recognising problems with determination for one.

 

[Whisperess]

Originally posted by Gordonax
If damage was multiplacavite (is that a word? ) wouldn't it end up as insane?

In it's current state - yes, and changing how it works would screw ( if specced for it ofc ) Infils and NS's over - so we don't want that.


"They're trying to make it so that it's not just biggest zerg wins or most uber 8v8 group win."
:great:

 

[BidAccount]

Look at what he's saying.

He's saying what is the one thing that would aid SBs - not everything you'd like changed but the main issue (given that an across the board damage increase isn't going to happen).

So if new poisons are the thing, then so be it. But ask for balance - not 'uberl33t' overpowering advantage, because you'll just get it taken off you again.

My view - ask for a str/dex thrust/pierce weapon line to replace either sword or axe. Solves your debuff issue and gives a new damage type.

 

[adari]

Nerf DF.

BRING IT ON!

 

[BidAccount]

Originally posted by adari
Nerf DF.

BRING IT ON!

Grow up adari.

And look at whats said in the full interview. Looking at what SBs need as a quick fix (nothing about removal from another class), with TOA and RvR taking up the next two patches after 1.66.

Plus with Mackey on the team no major sweaping changes, just small gradual ones.

So find something else to whin about for the next two-three months.

 

[envenom]

like i said give me a 9 second stun maybe boost frosty to 9 seconds and id be happy then id love to the see the infs whine when i strip them of 80% hps down to nothing which was done me today

 

[adari]

Originally posted by donttouchpoopy
Grow up adari.

And look at whats said in the full interview. Looking at what SBs need as a quick fix (nothing about removal from another class), with TOA and RvR taking up the next two patches after 1.66.

Plus with Mackey on the team no major sweaping changes, just small gradual ones.

So find something else to whin about for the next two-three months.

Whatever makes you sleep at night boyo

besides this thread is called "New info about the assassin balance... "

 

[Silenzio]

Originally posted by donttouchpoopy
Grow up adari.

he can't

 

[envenom]

heres another idea seeing as we are the suppoesd mele realm give sbs access to crush weapons

 

[Glottis_Xanadu]

Originally posted by envenom
like i said give me a 9 second stun maybe boost frosty to 9 seconds and id be happy then id love to the see the infs whine when i strip them of 80% hps down to nothing which was done me today

Lets make this game all the same, with 3 indentical stealth classes.
So lets give SB's their so much loved DF, but then offcourse... only makes sense... increase thrust damage by 100% so it equals SB damage output more or less.
Oh wait, you noob sb's don't want that either... How typical. All you want is to farm infs/scouts nonstop again, instead of losing some fight like is the case now...
Regards, Glottis

 

[BidAccount]

Originally posted by envenom
like i said give me a 9 second stun maybe boost frosty to 9 seconds and id be happy then id love to the see the infs whine when i strip them of 80% hps down to nothing which was done me today

Haldar did some numbers, which were challenged, but I'll take at face value for now. They cam out at an 18% chance to land df vs 14% chance to land FG.

Now if that 4% difference for 400 plus more spec points balances you then I'll support that - but I don't think it addresses the majority of the communities concerns.

(80% of Hps in 9 secs - it would be unkind here if I called that bs)

 

[infernalwrath]

Originally posted by jox

Me wants crush! Nothing would beat a massive pa with a sledge hammer

 

[belth]

Originally posted by envenom
heres another idea seeing as we are the suppoesd mele realm give sbs access to crush weapons

Mid is melee realm because Mid is more melee-oriented. Not because you had zerkers 2-shotting people, SBs spamming DF and killing everyone and now Savages (soon to be nerfed more).

 

[infernalwrath]

Originally posted by envenom
a 9 second stun off evade would be nice thats all id need

once again
all assasin should not be the same!!111111111
a infil could answer u that alb should get cons based haste
let me ask u something... if u have purge up u lose to a infil ?

 

[envenom]

(80% of Hps in 9 secs - it would be unkind here if I called that bs) [/B][/QUOTE]


was an rr3 infil i got him to 5% hps then he lands df strips me of 80%ish hps and wins go ask him urself if u want

his name was lanky btw.

no i rarely loose to an infil or any class with purge up but should i only be able to win a fight every 30 mins? i think not Infernal you have no idea how annoying a 9 second stun and not able to do fuck all about it roll a mid get dfd time and time again you might just have some idea of what its like.

ive played stealthers since beginning of daoc and dragonfang has ALWAYS been a problem its just not a problem thats cropped up since the LA nerf