Nerf what, boost what, why, and how?

[old.mattshanes]

Can drop 60-100 str from what i have been hit by which is like 300 weaponskill?

 

[faderullan]

yes but that cant be 30-50% damage drop?

 

[Jenna.]

Originally posted by faderullan
Jenna: Yes it is? Wish i could hit that hard and fast. 50% more dmg then my cap, 50% faster.

Ofcourse you can, since zerkers did 1600+ all the time etc...

 

[old.mattshanes]

Well imagine your merc with 100-130 str or so then see the difference.... your damage certainly does change.That's why thrust is good, would only effect a thrust user 50%, except pole armers of course.

What you could try i guess is get a cabalist to duel you and disease then see your damage after disease

 

[uma_thurman]

Imo nerf BUFFBOTS:

SB fight 1

SB fight 2

Marath didn't even PA or BS2...he just uncovered me and meleed me down. It was like facing a god-damn shadowzerker all again.

To add some details, we're both RR4, I have capped everything and use a Sidi BP. In that fight I didn't even come close.

So it proves that either:

(a). Marath runs with buffs and deserves the ridicule that ppl like to throw out to ppl like Rambo;

or

(b). SBs are overpowered still.

My guess is (a).

Much more of this and guess what, I'll have to get a buffbot just to compete.

Nerf buffbots!

 

[toxx]

He PA'd me for 890 in DF last night :/ i'd been str / con debuffed before, so the first stick of his dot killed me <sniffle>

 

[uma_thurman]

Originally posted by toxx
He PA'd me for 890 in DF last night :/ i'd been str / con debuffed before, so the first stick of his dot killed me <sniffle>

This wasn't even a PA

My PA caps at 777 with top equipment and 50+14 thrust, 44+14 CS Like I said, either he has a buffbot to do that kind of damage or SBs still rule the roost.

 

[pudzy]

Originally posted by uma_thurman
This wasn't even a PA

My PA caps at 777 with top equipment and 50+14 thrust, 44+14 CS Like I said, either he has a buffbot to do that kind of damage or SBs still rule the roost.

Will you stop changing your mind about sb's? one minute ure saying their wank and need love in a thread, now ure saying they 'rule the roost' your as thick as shit imo.

 

[Melachi-]

Honestly, you have to unbelievably ignorant, infact no its just plain denial, to think that SB's are better than Infiltrators, let alone equal.

Would you trade: 100hps and 2hand weapons ability

for

2.5x spec points, Vanish, STR/DEX based weapons, Dragonfang


Ohh and about mercs/bm's/zerkers. I think the zerker needs to be a tad brought up to speed. For example the abilities, Mercs DT is purely a Defensive ability, while berserkers is purely offensive, and Blademasters is a bit of both. However im told Berserkers going hamster mode get a high penalty to Armour Factor and they cannot Evade/Parry. I think these penaltys are a tad unfair. And yes if you wanted to further balance these chars, give Merc studded + Evade 3, although that makes all three chars very very similar

 

[uma_thurman]

Originally posted by Melachi[Mid]
Honestly, you have to unbelievably ignorant, infact no its just plain denial, to think that SB's are better than Infiltrators, let alone equal.

Would you trade: 100hps and 2hand weapons ability

for

2.5x spec points, Vanish, STR/DEX based weapons, Dragonfang


Ohh and about mercs/bm's/zerkers. I think the zerker needs to be a tad brought up to speed. For example the abilities, Mercs DT is purely a Defensive ability, while berserkers is purely offensive, and Blademasters is a bit of both. However im told Berserkers going hamster mode get a high penalty to Armour Factor and they cannot Evade/Parry. I think these penaltys are a tad unfair. And yes if you wanted to further balance these chars, give Merc studded + Evade 3, although that makes all three chars very very similar

<bangs head against brick wall>

I have said that SBs need help. I acknowledge infs > SBs unless SB is buffed. I have said that there should be dex/qui debuffing poisons, and possibly allow thrust weapons for SBs. Also I mentioned in Cylian's thread that there's a strong case for SBs getting more spec points, maybe 2.4.

I'm far from ignorant over these issues. In fact I'm quite open to some SB loving, as long as it's the RIGHT kind of loving to try and make it a FAIR fight. That's all I want. How many infs do you see with the same attitude?

I posted the screenies because I knew that SB owned me because of buffs. I said so in the message. I was playing when I suggested that he owned me because SBs are overpowered. For goodness sake I even start by saying nerf buffbots, so it's not rocket science to see what my view is.

I'm not trying to rub it in with SBs. I just get frustrated when some SBs whine like their class can kill nothing now, which is far from the truth. I'd like to encourage positive debate, not mindless immature ranting displayed by Pudz (who is now on ignore).

Oh and remove buffbots.

 

[-phusion-]

Originally posted by umilard


ALB:


Friar - Very very good in 1on1 due to the selfbuffs but tend to go down pretty fast in groupcombat.. Maybe lower the absorbbuff abit making them abit less "tanky". Removal of IP as RA might be an option aswell.

uhm well, removing IP would be the worsed things what could happen to a friar

the friar has no USEFULL special ra's

all crap, you get purge/ip dodger and uhm....ehm.....zzzz....ehm...uhm..... ?????? reflex attack ?! right....

imo friars should get a ra boost, determination would be nice.

or prevent flight since a friar has NO CC AT ALL, while other hybrids have... ( ok ok, a 15 sec root on counter evade wich you will never get in in RvR ), and no you can't call that aggro shout cc.

boost friars instead of nerfing them

phusion,

 

[Melachi-]

Originally posted by uma_thurman
I acknowledge infs > SBs unless SB is buffed.

Im sorry but i fail to understand this, are you saying...

Buffed Shadowblade is better or equal to an unbuffed Infiltrator?

or

Buffed Shadowblade is better or equal to a buffed infiltrator?

The first case is pretty obvious, almost all chars once buffed are far superiour to any other unbuffed class, so this is hardly specifically a Shadowblade issue, its a game issue.

If you mean that a buffed shadowblade is better than a buffed infiltrator you are sadly mistaken, its the same situation as both being unbuffed.

 

[Aarweenie]

some people are playing stupid to save their class from nerfs... this is nothing that I effects me much... what do scares me is that it works

 

[Hyuga Hinata]

Boost friars? Thanks, but no thanks. That is one class that is fine as it is or too good, you whined about the zerkers damage yet you have an acolyte class that hits as hard, faster and gets hit less.

 

[uma_thurman]

Originally posted by Melachi[Mid]
Im sorry but i fail to understand this, are you saying...

Buffed Shadowblade is better or equal to an unbuffed Infiltrator?

or

Buffed Shadowblade is better or equal to a buffed infiltrator?

The first case is pretty obvious, almost all chars once buffed are far superiour to any other unbuffed class, so this is hardly specifically a Shadowblade issue, its a game issue.

If you mean that a buffed shadowblade is better than a buffed infiltrator you are sadly mistaken, its the same situation as both being unbuffed.

To clarify:

unbuffed inf > unbuffed SB

buffed SB > unbuffed inf

I don't know about buffed infs as I don't have a bb.

 

[haarewin]

to clarify
buffed infil > all

and back on topic,
hib:

bard: need end as an instant chant that doesnt eat power or uninterruptable song, advanced evade (might be worth getting dodger then :/ ), perhaps access to some pbaoe snare for survivability (only ~15%, like disease perhaps - wouldnt mind getting this as an RA) and emp as raising stat sorted out (ie - replaced with dex).
mentalist: perhaps power transfer in mentalism specline
valewalker: not too shabby IF fully drood buffed
animist: make them better somehow? very awkward to play at least

mid:

healers: should have INSTANT AoE stun removed, AoE stun is evil enough. they would still have INSTANT AoE mez though, just because healer/bard dont have QC and make it worth them speccing aug.
shadowblade's: need the option of thrust weaps.
shaman: need end regen to be non-conc based, but still so it cant be used out of 1500 range (perhaps cast like celerity or resist chants? not thought this through yet.)
bonedancers: should have instant lifetap on longer recast timer, 8 seconds should do it.
savages: shouldnt have det / cheap ra's. they are hybrids (imo - they have spell-like abilities at least), and their self buff things should use HP when cast, not when they fade.
thane: need loving somehow, higher weapon damage would be useful
spiritmaster: perhaps moving focus shield to darkness line?

alb:

necromancers: crappy pet pathing needs fixing
minstrel: remove climb walls etc - i dont see how a minstrel needs this

all :

caster survivability needs to be looked at, spell resists need to be sorted and ra's need some looking through

er, nothing else i can think of atm.

 

[gudrex]

Originally posted by uma_thurman
To clarify:

unbuffed inf > unbuffed SB

buffed SB > unbuffed inf

I don't know about buffed infs as I don't have a bb.

Are you on drugs?
A shadowblade isn't better than an infiltrator in any aspect at all...not a single one....there is not one thing a shadowblade can do that an infiltrator can't do better.

 

[klavrynd]

need a way to automate this reply

"zzz,QQ,TT, go whine on vnboards if you want to make a difference"

 

[AzuratMinimus]

Originally posted by haarewin

mid:

healers: should have INSTANT AoE stun removed, AoE stun is evil enough. they would still have INSTANT AoE mez though, just because healer/bard dont have QC and make it worth them speccing aug.

The instant AoE mezz i almost never use? cause with determination it´s just speedbumping tanks and giving em cc imunity. It´s prolly the most useless spell in pac line, except when you need to perhaps ward of a bunch of tanks hitting you. Instant aoe stunn + ordinary CC is atm the only thing thát makes the healer able to mezz before a good bard or sorc if they wanna keep mezzing time to more then speedbumping.

 

[Coffeus]

Originally posted by gudrex
Are you on drugs?
A shadowblade isn't better than an infiltrator in any aspect at all...not a single one....there is not one thing a shadowblade can do that an infiltrator can't do better.

yeah go go infs pulling off 2h PA all the time

 

[faderullan]

Originally posted by AzuratMinimus
The instant AoE mezz i almost never use? cause with determination it´s just speedbumping tanks and giving em cc imunity. It´s prolly the most useless spell in pac line, except when you need to perhaps ward of a bunch of tanks hitting you. Instant aoe stunn + ordinary CC is atm the only thing thát makes the healer able to mezz before a good bard or sorc if they wanna keep mezzing time to more then speedbumping.

How come every time we meet a BO group you insta mez us when you come within range?

 

[Freia]

Originally posted by faderullan
How come every time we meet a BO group you insta mez us when you come within range?

Cause you are too slow to mez them first

 

[Xeanor]

Originally posted by Freia
Cause you are too slow to mez them first

It's impossible to mezz a group that has instamezz and running at speed 6.

 

[AzuratMinimus]

Originally posted by faderullan
How come every time we meet a BO group you insta mez us when you come within range?

Well i almost never use it, only times i use that thing is when we got a pbaoe group or if i got tanks hitting me. I do use insta aoe stunn a lot or single insta mezz on your sorc though. Guess it´s just some that have hard time seeing the diffrence between aoe stunn and mezz.

Might be some newbie healer that use insta aoe mezz although everytime in a group i can guarantee you havn´t been insta aoe mezzed. It´s just stupid people that use it to mezz if you don´t have pbaoe that can kill them quick.

Sometimes when you have a lousy sorc i don´t even have to use instas, eventhough a sorc caster faster then me and have longer range =)

 

[uma_thurman]

Originally posted by gudrex
Are you on drugs?
A shadowblade isn't better than an infiltrator in any aspect at all...not a single one....there is not one thing a shadowblade can do that an infiltrator can't do better.

FFS read the whole thread. I posted these screenies earlier:

SB fight 1

SB fight 2

Proof that buffed SBS >> unbuffed infils.

I also said that without buffs infils > SBs. I even proposed some solutions.

Wake up and smell the coffee. Stop flaming and read the whole thread before piling in.

 

[faderullan]

Originally posted by Freia
Cause you are too slow to mez them first

Ofc we are to slow cuz it isnt possible if both come in mach6...

But quite often we backstab them so we get the mez anyway

 

[faderullan]

Azurat: I do know the difference between ae mez and ae stun...

 

[AzuratMinimus]

Well since you know, you should see that you get stunned mostly and then mezzed

 

[kr0n]

Remake Celtic Dual styles
(overall style remake, make them more balanced, force people to use more than just 2-3 styles)

5000 unit range on buffs.

Put endsong on bard as chant.

Put Savage on Hybrid RA/Damage/Hitpoint table.
(Really, which pure tank has selfbuffs?)

Buff Thane up a bit to par other Hybrids.

Umm. Fix casterdamage somehow.

 

[inqy]

Uma your pictures are worthless. Everyone knows buffed char > unbuffed char.

Buffed infil > buffed sb

Unbuffed infil > unbuffed sb.

These are what we are talking about...