lost NASA images found...

[Wij]

Well ignoring the fact that tarring people who dont believe in theory X as 'probably holocaust deniers' being incredibly offensive I shall answer your point as if it were serious.

Millions went through the camps and thousands survived them, the Nazis didnt really bother trying to hide them until the final weeks so the Allies had everything from the buildings, the inmates, the guards, the rotting heaps of corpses, the 'final solution' documents etc. etc.

Counter that with the moon landings - we have some signals beamed from the moon, some bits of film that could easily be reproduced on the earth and some moon rocks that could have been recovered by a robot - oh and 3 guys who say they went there - hopefully you can see the orders of magnitude difference in the amount of evidence for these events?

I never said Moon Landing Deniers were holocaust deniers. Just that the level of evidence was similar (loads) and therefore that our willingness to assert its truth should be similar. My point was precisely that our belief in something should entirely depend on the level of evidence rather than how denying it makes us look. e.g. Deny Holocaust = Look Racist. Deny Moon Landing = Look cool to 12 year olds on the internet.

 

[rynnor]

Deny Holocaust = Look Racist. Deny Moon Landing = Look cool to 12 year olds on the internet.

Less emotional charge - yet saying that I have seen a fair few crazies coming outta the woodwork to threaten those who question the moon landings - mostly from the states.

Seems theres a lot of people who feel threatened if they might have to re-assess anything in their world view.

 

[rynnor]

Sigh. Since you don't know—moondust is like silica dust, extremely fine. In an atmosphere it will cloud. Not in a vacuum though, it'll just maintain a set trajectory dependant upon the forces acting upon it. 1/6th gravity in other words.

I can read wiki too - as I said I didnt find it particularly convincing - the moon is not a vacuum - it has a small amount of atmosphere at ground level that is constantly leached out into space.

On the daylight side of the moon there are also many tiny dust particles rising up by electrostatic levitation - If I wished to be pedantic I could point out that the lunar pictures lack any haziness that would be expected from this process and do in fact far more resemble shots taken in a vacuum chamber

 

[Tom]

You're talking bollocks.

 

[rynnor]

You're talking bollocks.

Lol - you need to work on your reasoned arguement skills

 

[Tom]

I'll enter into a reasoned argument with someone who has full possession of the facts, rather than a tenuous grasp of reality.

 

[rynnor]

I'll enter into a reasoned argument with someone who has full possession of the facts, rather than a tenuous grasp of reality.

Thats better - however if you look up electrostatic levitation you'll see what I'm on about. Like charges repel and on the moon this effect can push particles of regolith up to kilometres above the lunar surface.

At ground level on the moon much larger particles can rise up during the lunar 'day' (such as when the film was shot).

 

[Tom]

And why would you expect such a process to produce any noticeable haze on images taken at distances of only a few feet? Orbit at the correct altitude with the sun in the correct position and it may be visible. On the surface? Never.

 

[Wij]

I can read wiki too - as I said I didnt find it particularly convincing - the moon is not a vacuum - it has a small amount of atmosphere at ground level that is constantly leached out into space.

On the daylight side of the moon there are also many tiny dust particles rising up by electrostatic levitation - If I wished to be pedantic I could point out that the lunar pictures lack any haziness that would be expected from this process and do in fact far more resemble shots taken in a vacuum chamber

wtf - so you've been to the moon and seen the haze ?

In that case I bow to your wisdom. You obviously will know better than the rest of mankind in that case.

If not maybe put it down to the fact it's too fine to see at any reasonable exposure.

And this is also the 10 mile wide vacuum chamber we discussed earlier right ?

 

[Rulke]

There is no appreciable atmosphere on the moon. Fact

The proof of this can be seen in the way the flag kept fluttering after the astronaut had let go - there was no atmosphere to still the motion

 

[00dave]

I'd have said the feather and the hammer was better proof of that.

 

[Rulke]

I'd have said the feather and the hammer was better proof of that.

Exactly

 

[rynnor]

wtf - so you've been to the moon and seen the haze ?

In that case I bow to your wisdom. You obviously will know better than the rest of mankind in that case.

Weird - your mind works in odd ways - we were all using second hand data quite happily so why go off on that tangent?

 

[rynnor]

And why would you expect such a process to produce any noticeable haze on images taken at distances of only a few feet? Orbit at the correct altitude with the sun in the correct position and it may be visible. On the surface? Never.

No on the short shots it would be silly - like looking for a heat haze in a portrait photo on a sunny day - but on the longer shots why not?

 

[ECA]

Because it's incredibly low density, less than 1 trillionth of earths atmosphere at sea level.

Your perception of an atmosphere is what is horribly incorrect.

The problem is non-scientists coming up with random half baked shit that sounds good to laymen but to anyone with a basic grasp of the facts makes you look like an imbecile.

If you really doubt the moon landings rather than trolling you'd go educate yourself with the bajongo of resources out there available to do so rather than coming up with BUT TEH SHADOWWWWSSSSSSSSSSS!

 

[rynnor]

Because it's incredibly low density, less than 1 trillionth of earths atmosphere at sea level.

Your perception of an atmosphere is what is horribly incorrect.

The problem is non-scientists coming up with random half baked shit that sounds good to laymen but to anyone with a basic grasp of the facts makes you look like an imbecile.

Lol - the haze isnt from atmosphere but from charged particles of regolith as explained above - physician heal thyself - I suggest you read up before posting in future - makes you look an idiot

 

[Wij]

Weird - your mind works in odd ways - we were all using second hand data quite happily so why go off on that tangent?

Because you have no actual proof that you can see the haze on a photo. Just a theory. One which is contradicted by the ACTUAL PHOTOS from the moon. I simply assumed that to know better than ACTUAL PHOTOS you must have been there.

Also you ignored the rest of my post.

 

[rynnor]

Because you have no actual proof that you can see the haze on a photo. Just a theory. One which is contradicted by the ACTUAL PHOTOS from the moon. I simply assumed that to know better than ACTUAL PHOTOS you must have been there.

Thats very circular reasoning though - you cant use the disputed photos to validate themselves - its like saying all cars are blue because my car is blue

 

[Wij]

Thats very circular reasoning though - you cant use the disputed photos to validate themselves - its like saying all cars are blue because my car is blue

Of course it's circular. However at least it's some evidence. You only have an untested theory.

 

[rynnor]

Of course it's circular. However at least it's some evidence. You only have an untested theory.

How can it be evidence? Evidence supports something - it cannot support itself?

There have been a number of observations of dust particles rising from the lunar surface/blurring the horizon from different sources - thats what we call 'evidence'.

 

[MYstIC G]

It is a bit annoying though. If someone came on here spouting this about the holocaust we'd all go mad.

I'm sorry, obviously you missed the FH guide to "threads on the forums" here's the short version:

1. someone says something
2. someone else disagrees
3. people choose sides
4. people spout shit
5. people agree to have their own opinions and get on with their life
6. toht stirs shit up for another 300 posts by "quoting"

Hope that help

 

[ECA]

Rynnor - the new seel.

 

[rynnor]

Rynnor - the new seel.

Lol - not really - as I said earlier I was just playing devils advocate to attempt to show that doubt could exist but then people took it that I actually did believe that the moon landings were fake

It was an interesting demonstration of peoples wish to jump in and insult people they perceive to have an opinion they dont agree with - it even had Nazis

 

[Tom]

So what you're saying is, you posted that to stir up trouble. You didn't for one minute believe anything you were typing.

Which makes you a rather suspect mod, or a liar, or perhaps a person with a sense of inadequacy.

 

[rynnor]

So what you're saying is, you posted that to stir up trouble.

Well no actually - its called a discussion - if we all agree its fairly pointless and I do think that a little doubt about things is reasonable - that was pretty much it.

Your own emotional reactions to such a stance are more indicative about yourself than of others tbh.

 

[Tom]

Yes, they're indicative of the fact that generally I like to educate myself on both sides of an argument before I embarrass myself by publishing nonsense. I do not enjoy watching people belittle one of mankind's greatest achievements for their own petty little games.

On a few occasions over the years on BW and FH I've been shown to be completely wrong, and I've always apologised. The last thing I'd do is string together a garbled word-salad of scientific nonsense in a vain attempt to do nothing but bolster my own sense of vanity, as you have done here.

 

[MYstIC G]

Wikipedia is still shit though

 

[rynnor]

Yes, they're indicative of the fact that generally I like to educate myself on both sides of an argument before I embarrass myself by publishing nonsense.

Glad to see you read up before typing your nonsense

I do not enjoy watching people belittle one of mankind's greatest achievements for their own petty little games.

The importance of it is debatable but one you seem ill-equipped to pursue due to some inherent emotional attachment you have to this image.

The last thing I'd do is string together a garbled word-salad of scientific nonsense in a vain attempt to do nothing but bolster my own sense of vanity, as you have done here.

I'm pretty sure you cant have vain and vanity in the same sentence since they are from the same word but a big improvement over your mono-syllabic phase

 

[Marc]

So the thousands of people involved in the cover up have kept quiet for 40 years? Not one single one, who might be on the bones of his arse has come out and told it was faked for $$$$$$?

Conspiracy theorists dont half do my nut in.

 

[Marc]

The importance of it is debatable but one you seem ill-equipped to pursue due to some inherent emotional attachment you have to this image.

How the f*** is it debatable???? Its the first step to us getting off a planet that will not be here for ever.