How many people are leaving after 1.62?

[Big-G-]

Originally posted by old.cHodAX
ROFL and Big-G- has a cave shammy too Made me chuckle

yea i knew i had a pbae insta (thx roo :>) but coz i r slow i had in my mind a ranged insta ae disease.. which i knew i didnt have ;p

guess i could have put that in my originla post to make me look less dumb ;/

 

[cHodAX]

Originally posted by Big-G-
yea i knew i had a pbae insta (thx roo :>) but coz i r slow i had in my mind a ranged insta ae disease.. which i knew i didnt have ;p

guess i could have put that in my originla post to make me look less dumb ;/

Compared to some of my blunders your mistake looked like pure genius

 

[Spinky]

Originally posted by Aarweenie
well... I concidered this once too... but I thought after a while that since the other debuff nukers all use debuff+DD and the cabbie use debuff+lifedrain... then I thought this wasn't really compareable...

I'll do a calculation here...

I'll take it as both casters hit cap on every nuke to make it easier to count... NOTE: this is not an calculation to show overpowerness... only to compare 2 classes of same realm to each other...

the cap is calculated by (delve*3)

our target is a Middie with 50% resist... not more not less...
our middie got 2000 hp...

Cabalist:

(dd140)*3 = 420


Debuff (-50%) (2 sec) (Middie at 2000hp (50%res) 2sec total cast time)

420 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 1580 hp (0%res) 4,5sec total cast time)

420 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 1160 hp (0%res) 7sec total cast time)

420 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 740 hp (0% res) 9,5 sec total cast time)

420 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 320 hp (0% res) 12 sec total cast time)

420 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at -100hp (0%res) 14,5 sec total cast time) (death nuke)

Ice Wizard:

single target:

debuff nuke: (dd171)*3 = 513
snare nuke: (dd179)*3= 537


debuff nuke 256 (-10%) (3 sec) (Middie at 1744 hp (40% res) 3 sec total cast time)

snare nuke 323 (3 sec) (Middie at 1421hp (40% res) 6 sec total cast time)

323 dmg (3 sec) (Middie at 1098 hp (40% res) 9 sec total cast time)

323 dmg (3 sec) (Middie at 775 hp (40% res) 12 sec total cast time)

323 dmg (3 sec) (Middie at 452 hp (40% res) 15 sec total cast time)

323 dmg (3 sec) (Middie at 129 hp (40% res) 18 sec total cast time)

268 dmg (3 sec) (Middie at -139 hp (50% res) 21 sec total cast time) (death strike)

Leaving out the pbae section (not invalid but I'll be going on about range), and also not supplying numbers or evidence as you've done (way too lazy for that ), it's worth remebering that Cabalists have pets to support them too, they could have a ruby simulacrum for nooks (haven't a clue what they hit for, can't back that one up) if they wanted some help in the ranged department, or (ice wizzy snare notwithstanding) an Amber Simulacrum which has the potential to proc a stun on its target increasing the Cabalists chance to get extra spells cast.

Just my opinion, yours weren't wrong i'm not arguing that, but i'd have said if someone were to compare the self debuff-nukers of each realm, it might be best to take the primary debuffers as examples and compare the respective pros and cons of those particular classes.

addendum, You considered comparing Cabalists but decided not to due to the low delve lifedrain in comparison, then compare the wizard whose debuff is only 10%, on that basis you could feasibly compare a body cabalist with the 15% debuff and 174 delve lifedrain, while not having a snare it does have the pets to add the damage to the Cabalists overall damage before the target reachs the caster

edit:


Cabalist:

(dd174)*3 = 522

Debuff (-15%) (2 sec) (Middie at 2000hp (35%res) 2sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 1661 hp (35%res) 4,5sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 1322 hp (35%res) 7sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 983 hp (35% res) 9,5 sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 644 hp (35% res) 12 sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 305 hp (35% res) 14.5 sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at -34hp (35%res) 17 sec total cast time) (death nuke)

Still slightly faster, and with the possibilty of pets to stun, or to nuker additionally, the numbers are probably off, but that was the reason I wasn't about to use them in the first place

 

[Damon_D]

Originally posted by Roo Stercogburn
Cave Shammies have insta pbae disease.

HEHEHEHE yeah right..ohhh you meen our insta-fart..yeah it hardly ever get's resisted and the snare effect rock's HAHAHAHA..and the..10str..or so it takes away is an awesome feature HIHIHIHI..ok..I better lay off the shroom's HAHAHAHA..but serious its a shit spell and it should be baseline...and it is shit ..did I mention that ???

FFS Big-G you should know this..you been at my shrooms too ???
HEHEHEHE...HAHAHAHA

 

[Aarweenie]

Originally posted by Spinky
Leaving out the pbae section (not invalid but I'll be going on about range), and also not supplying numbers or evidence as you've done (way too lazy for that ), it's worth remebering that Cabalists have pets to support them too, they could have a ruby simulacrum for nooks (haven't a clue what they hit for, can't back that one up) if they wanted some help in the ranged department, or (ice wizzy snare notwithstanding) an Amber Simulacrum which has the potential to proc a stun on its target increasing the Cabalists chance to get extra spells cast.

Just my opinion, yours weren't wrong i'm not arguing that, but i'd have said if someone were to compare the self debuff-nukers of each realm, it might be best to take the primary debuffers as examples and compare the respective pros and cons of those particular classes.

addendum, You considered comparing Cabalists but decided not to due to the low delve lifedrain in comparison, then compare the wizard whose debuff is only 10%, on that basis you could feasibly compare a body cabalist with the 15% debuff and 174 delve lifedrain, while not having a snare it does have the pets to add the damage to the Cabalists overall damage before the target reachs the caster

edit:


Cabalist:

(dd174)*3 = 522

Debuff (-15%) (2 sec) (Middie at 2000hp (35%res) 2sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 1661 hp (35%res) 4,5sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 1322 hp (35%res) 7sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 983 hp (35% res) 9,5 sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 644 hp (35% res) 12 sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at 305 hp (35% res) 14.5 sec total cast time)

339 dmg (2,5 sec) (Middie at -34hp (35%res) 17 sec total cast time) (death nuke)

Still slightly faster, and with the possibilty of pets to stun, or to nuker additionally, the numbers are probably off, but that was the reason I wasn't about to use them in the first place

if we leave out the pbaoe section I must admit that cabalist is the debuffnuker of Albion... but I still can't say that it's the alb version of Runemaster or Enchanter...

simply because Enchanter and Runemaster both do pure dmg nukes... the Cabalist uses lifedrain...

I know this is a reaaaally bad to compare... but since Bonedancer is the only class I can think of that use lifedrain... (maybe Animist too... but I haven't met many of those so I don't know ;p)

if you take a Bonedancer and a Minstrel... both have instand DD... but the DD of the bonedancer is lifedrain too... there is really large diffrence between the two sorts of DD

I know it's silly to compare Minstrel instants with Bonedancers instants... since they do a lot of diffrent dmg... and I do myself Bonedancers should have a reconstruction...

anyhow... what I like to point out is that I don't think Cabalist could be compared to Enchanter and Runemaster in the same way...

Don't calling on a nerf for spirit cabbies because they have lifedrain either... since from what I've seen on their spells and what I've heard from others is that they aren't "grp friendly" in the same way other casters might be...

I still think Ice Wizzard is a debuffnuker due to it's ability to debuff it's own pbaoe

Originally posted by Damon Doombring
HEHEHEHE yeah right..ohhh you meen our insta-fart..yeah it hardly ever get's resisted and the snare effect rock's HAHAHAHA..and the..10str..or so it takes away is an awesome feature HIHIHIHI..ok..I better lay off the shroom's HAHAHAHA..but serious its a shit spell and it should be baseline...and it is shit ..did I mention that ???

FFS Big-G you should know this..you been at my shrooms too ???
HEHEHEHE...HAHAHAHA

I don't think you should laugh at something annother realm don't got and only say it's bad... it do make diffrence... maybe it's not that usefull... but it's far better then not having it at all...

the snare effects it's really nice if a tank catch you healing... then you cast the disease and he get a snare effect... then you hit the sprint... due to your class as a shammy you have end regenerate so you can sprint for long if not forever depending on how much your aug spec is... the tank chasing you prevents you from from healing... but when you have a snare effect on him and sprint you're preventing him from hitting you... and then the healer in the grp don't need to heal you... if it's the pally you can allways run away from the grp so they lose his chants or something....

it's not bad to have something the others don't have... and I don't think there is any spell that can't be used in a usefull way in RvR...

 

[Solid]

if you do a comparison with the MAJOR objecive is to rate PRIMARY DEBUFFING classes, how can you pick the Ice Wizard over the Spirit Cabalist?

If your doing comparisins, compare like to like.

If you were comparing Primary NUKERS then it would be wiz vs eld vs rm

if you were comparing Primary pet classes then its caba vs chanter vs SM

if you were comparing Primary self debuffers then its CABALIST vs ENCHANTER vs RUNEMASTER

the 10% Cold debuffing Ice Wizard is better compared to the Darkness Runemaster and the Hib Equivalent (i dont have a clue wot that is)

 

[Spinky]

Primary nukers of Hib could be put as light eld/chanter/mentalist since they all have the same delve dd (209).

 

[zapzap]

Try play a hib caster and fell the damage of a berserker and then come back and say that the nerf will be wrong when u have to remeber that weapskill will pass 2000 also.

Getting hit with 700 + now means they would 1 hit kill u or close to it. Fine with me if a caster could 2 hit kill them also.


First hit no delay second hit 3.3 sec delay and caster dead.


To bad mythic didnt fix things in time nerfing after so long makes people that have played a class so long fell bad.


Mid group with 4 berserkers and 3 seers is just to damm silly

 

[Damon_D]

Originally posted by Aarweenie

I don't think you should laugh at something annother realm don't got and only say it's bad... it do make diffrence... maybe it's not that usefull... but it's far better then not having it at all...

the snare effects it's really nice if a tank catch you healing... then you cast the disease and he get a snare effect... then you hit the sprint... due to your class as a shammy you have end regenerate so you can sprint for long if not forever depending on how much your aug spec is... the tank chasing you prevents you from from healing... but when you have a snare effect on him and sprint you're preventing him from hitting you... and then the healer in the grp don't need to heal you... if it's the pally you can allways run away from the grp so they lose his chants or something....

it's not bad to have something the others don't have... and I don't think there is any spell that can't be used in a usefull way in RvR...

I did not say it was not semi usefull sometimes..just that it stinks..The snare effect is shit at best and the disease effect, apart from halving heals , is a joke at best

 

[Qte Eth]

Originally posted by Solid

the 10% Cold debuffing Ice Wizard is better compared to the Darkness Runemaster and the Hib Equivalent (i dont have a clue wot that is)

nor do i coz it doesnt exist Oo

and with ur very strange compare methods lets for example compare main ae dot classes -mentalist shammy and cabby ,to what will u come after that comparing?

 

[Big-G-]

Originally posted by Damon Doombring
HEHEHEHE yeah right..ohhh you meen our insta-fart..yeah it hardly ever get's resisted and the snare effect rock's HAHAHAHA..and the..10str..or so it takes away is an awesome feature HIHIHIHI..ok..I better lay off the shroom's HAHAHAHA..but serious its a shit spell and it should be baseline...and it is shit ..did I mention that ???

FFS Big-G you should know this..you been at my shrooms too ???
HEHEHEHE...HAHAHAHA

how many times damon.. stay away from the hippie animists :|

 

[Damon_D]

FFS but they got those GIANT shroom's, how am I surpossed to resist that ????..hard as hell to harvest thou..some of em even got a nasty sting..but they make an ass-kicking tea thou MUUUHHAAAA

 

[Solid]

Q Teeth whats so strange about my comparisons?

Main objective has been comparison of realms primary Self Debuffers and Caba/Chanter/RM fit that bill.

I just think its wrong of Aarween to compare an Icewizard to a Manachanter based on DEBUFFING

her post was based around the Debuffs and how much time it takes to kill opponent using it yet she decided to omit the Caba cos it has a Lifedrain DD instead of a reg DD.

 

[old.Greggor]

Originally posted by Aarweenie
about the last DD on runemasters that's something Albion and Hibernia have got for a while... a lvl 50 baseline nuke... then we might get it on a dwarf with 80 base con... but then again we don't have any class with more then 60 base acuity

Avalonians start with 60 dex and 80 int

Elfs start with 75 dex and 70 int

Dwarfs start with 50 dex and 60 piety


so saying they are better because of their con... that I find quite silly... since I guess that's the thing you're pointing at when you say you can put this things on a "dorf"

con is a big plus for casters

both norse and dwarf start with 30 or 40 more con

the dwarf con id double an elf's.

 

[Big-G-]

im a dorf runie, wish i was kobold for the dex
never been in a situation where hps counted towards my survival, its either debuff and a few nukes or a slam
not much i can do in those situations ;p
sufficed to say the 30con difference is how little hps difference?

 

[Qte Eth]

dorfs are uber as rms and hps are much more vital for a mage then dex ,the more hp u have the more often ull get healed while having tanks on u,and if ur dead then ur dex doesnt help at all,and since rms are also bubble carriers hps matter even more,and 30con is above 100hp with toughness

 

[old.Nedowiz]

patch loving goes in circles ..................

Would there be one single Hib at euro release of game if people did not realize that.......

 

[old.Greggor]

Originally posted by old.Nedowiz
patch loving goes in circles ..................

Would there be one single Hib at euro release of game if people did not realize that.......

been a year and a half and still no hib love patch?

 

[cHodAX]

Con is everything for a caster, don't be fooled by people saying otherwise. Brition/Innocu casters have a much higher chance of surviving a medium sized battle than an Avalonian. The extra dex/int counts for shit if you can't cast because you are being hit but that extra 3 seconds worth of HP will save your ass on many occasions. With buffs and 1.62 you won't be missing hardly anything on casting speed compared to an Avalonian but you will live a hell of alot more.

 

[Big-G-]

well ill probably whine if i was a kobbie rm too
but my dorf has an eye patch ;/

 

[old.Nedowiz]

Originally posted by old.Greggor
been a year and a half and still no hib love patch?

Grass is allways greener on other side Gregg. And "love" is allways a matter of definition, noone is totally neutral in this who play the game.

 

[Loveless]

PPl that canceled were prolly all the FOTM Sbs.

I know a few of my m8s cant wait for 1.62 just to get rid of that aspect.

And before u start saying anything...stfu its my opinian

 

[scarffs]

Originally posted by old.Greggor
been a year and a half and still no hib love patch?

Hibs now > Hibs at start of game

Must have been love somewhere, or nerf somewhere else,

OR BOTH !

Hibs are best realm, simple.

 

[old.Greggor]

Originally posted by scarffs
Hibs now > Hibs at start of game

Must have been love somewhere, or nerf somewhere else,

OR BOTH !

Hibs are best realm, simple.

hibs now >= Hibs at start of game

Mids now >>> Mids at start of game

Albs now >>>>>>>>>> Albs at start of game


Only things have change are RA

And albs and mids getting hiberians Unique

Pbaoe, end regen etc.

where is hiberians main CC class with 2 or more forms of CC


where is our mez resist ?

Bard are a joke empathy raising stat that does nothing for bard?

And in 1.62 all bards got was the song radius increase what a laugh.

u think that only mids quit?

i bet alot of hib quit too over this patch

1.62 that heberain love patch not wait fuck them

Was really hoping for some love like albion had?

 

[old.Greggor]

Originally posted by old.Nedowiz
Grass is allways greener on other side Gregg. And "love" is allways a matter of definition, noone is totally neutral in this who play the game.

played on other side too but would love to see hiberian fixed than to see more crapy add ons

 

[old.mattshanes]

Well greggor look at nolby pride and eclipse full groups they do very well......

 

[scarffs]

That means nothing really, look at Sotl or your own gankgroup, or MM in Mid, they all chaingank because they are high rr, play well together, know what they are doing ( go for healer etc ), and have good group composition.

For the moment I think all will agree that no realm is truly gimped, but in all realms there are some points that need adressing, minor or bigger stuff, but stuff that if you play the realm or class, gets you very annoyed in the end when al they do is add some fluff...

 

[Kahland]

who cares about who's leaving, there's more ppl buying the game than there's ppl selling, and yes there is

 

[old.Greggor]

Originally posted by old.mattshanes
Well greggor look at nolby pride and eclipse full groups they do very well......

i am not talking about ownage in rvr but major flawed designed charaters which mithic has admitted they fucked up and have yet to fix ?

All the new content means shit, if everyone leave because they dont do the fixes the bug/design flawes that matter to the players.

 

[old.Iunliten]

I think what greggor was meaning was that certain classes (not gonna name anyone) that should have gotten love this patch in 1.62 didn't much like the necro problems and earth theurgist problems wasn't adressed in the alb love patch.

The realms are fairly balanced in major but there are huge differances within the realm itself, tons of speccs aren't RvR viable for gank groups.