Grow tired of anti-smokes...

[Calaen]

Actually it is and no i'm not.

By asking those kind of questions, the people who don't have a reason not to drink(other then don't want to), tend to drink just to avoid people riding them on the subject.

"Are you sick? Are you driving? What's wrong?"

Nothing!

"Then why?"

Why would anyone just have a drink, just because they are asked why they are not drinking.

Maybe if your a little fucking sheep who follows what everyone else does, fiar enough, but then you should probably be put down.

And comparing this to passive smoking is just lol.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Why would anyone just have a drink, just because they are asked why they are not drinking.

Maybe if your a little fucking sheep who follows what everyone else does, fiar enough, but then you should probably be put down.

And comparing this to passive smoking is just lol.

Then lol at yourself, i wasn't the one comparing.

You might not act that way, i might not act that wy, but a lot of people DO collapse under pper pressure. It's no "Lolrofl", it's a fact.

But nice to know you're still a non-understanding fanatic asshole who only sees his life as fact

The people i listen to the most in this situation are the ones who did smoke and no longer, they have been on both sides

I've been on both sides too, i was a non smoker and then started. Just like everyone else

 

[chipper]

Even if i never claimed antyhing about health issues od smoking and all this bullsh*t on this thread, have to say to upper quote; MIGHT be harmful. Key point.

toht you gotta be shittin me carbon monoxide MIGHT be harmful?
* Arsenic (rat poison)
* Hydrogen Cyanide (gas chamber poison)
seriously i had to do a double take on what you just posted.

Harmful Chemicals In Cigarettes previous info from this site

 

[old.Tohtori]

Yes there's harmful chemicals etc etc, but there is no 100% assurance that "You smoke, you die of it(or related".

Youi might, it's a risk, etc.

So yes, it might be harmful to your health.

You ARE breathing in toxins, but it's not necessary going to cause you anything.

 

[georgie]

What I don't understand about the whole thing is the vitriol directed at smokers by non-smokers. Sometimes I feel the reaction would be less extreme towards a kiddy fiddler (well, maybe not, but it's not far off).

I'm not suggesting that anyone in their right mind would think that second hand smoke to a non-smoker is a yummy experience or that they should be forced to endure it in enclosed spaces or around food, etc... , but there are times on the street walking around when you just have to suck it up. Unfortunately, that's life. You can't like everything that everyone else does.

When I did used to smoke there would be times when I'd be waiting for a bus/train, and the proper thing (imo) was to move 10-15 yards away when having a fag, that's just being more considerate to those around you. Yet the number of dirty looks I'd sometimes get from people was just plain weird.

I wonder how many of those people would run up to a 4x4 stopped in a traffic jam and bang on the window demanding that the driver sell it and buy something with a smaller engine because I'm honestly not seeing a difference. One accepts a measure of crap being belched out from cars because, let's be honest we need them, despite what the greenies say. But why a 5 litre 4x4? What's wrong with something which has double the mpg and (presuming my maths is good) half the shit spewing out?

I'm sure there's some thing I've not explained very well or not managed to get across, but there we go.


P.S. I still dispute the claim that there is *no* safe level of smoke that the body can handle. It might not be pleasant or nice (that's a personal thing) but if you're trying to say to me that one single molecule of second hand smoke can have a permanent, lasting, irreparable effect on the body then presumably that would make it the most toxic thing on earth. As to what a safe level might be, I've no idea. But sweeping, blanket claims like that annoy me.

P.P.S. As I'm writing this I'm getting more and more irritated by the errant pixels left over by this smilie during its animation.
OCD much?

 

[Thorwyn]

Touching high voltage wires *might* be harmful too.
There´s no 100% assurance that you die from it though. You might survive it. Still, it´s a pretty good idea not to do it.

 

[chipper]

lol just lol

i know ill risk my life and ill pay for the pleasure hahahah smokers you gotta love the pig headedness

for your sake toht i hope you never do develop problems ive seen what lung cancer does to people its a horrible thing to witness and i certainly wouldnt want to be affected by it. hopefully one day you (smokers) will see sense and finally rid your self of those evil little sticks the world will be a better place without them.

 

[georgie]

Touching high voltage wires *might* be harmful too.
There´s no 100% assurance that you die from it though. You might survive it. Still, it´s a pretty good idea not to do it.

Where's your sense of fun, Thor?

 

[chipper]

it left him when he touched those wires

 

[old.Tohtori]

lol just lol

i know ill risk my life and ill pay for the pleasure hahahah smokers you gotta love the pig headedness

for your sake toht i hope you never do develop problems ive seen what lung cancer does to people its a horrible thing to witness and i certainly wouldnt want to be affected by it. hopefully one day you (smokers) will see sense and finally rid your self of those evil little sticks the world will be a better place without them.

I'm pig headed?

I give you a cold hard fact and you make fun of me?

Please.

I risk my life taking a car, plane, train, walking, drinking, eating red meat, f*cking some chick i met at a bar etc etc the list goes on forever.

I like to smoke, yes there's a risk, but so is with any vice. What's the problem? It's a RISK. Risk does not equal certainty.

Touching high voltage wires *might* be harmful too.
There´s no 100% assurance that you die from it though. You might survive it. Still, it´s a pretty good idea not to do it.

Diffference in getting hurt by electrical wires(which you will) and the risk of smoking harming you(which you might).

Show me one study that shows without any doubt that smoking WILL harm you, 100% of the time, on every person, and i'll listen.

Other then that, it's not pig headed to know the risks and do something, it's a choice, i choose it, every single time. I even quit for two weeks a good 7 years ago and started again, just because i wanted to.

No different from drinking and all the other crap i listed above.

 

[Calaen]

Then lol at yourself, i wasn't the one comparing.

You might not act that way, i might not act that wy, but a lot of people DO collapse under pper pressure. It's no "Lolrofl", it's a fact.

But nice to know you're still a non-understanding fanatic asshole who only sees his life as fact



I've been on both sides too, i was a non smoker and then started. Just like everyone else

Yes peopl edo but yuor suggestion was for people to conentrate on people that bow to peer pressure.

How can you possibly monitor that you spaz. Your effectively saying no one can ask anyone why they are not doing something, just incase they cave in and do it.

 

[Calaen]

I like to smoke, yes there's a risk, but so is with any vice. What's the problem? It's a RISK. Risk does not equal certainty.

Didn't you post a help me quit thread once?

 

[georgie]

I'm pig headed?

I risk my life taking a car, plane, train, walking, drinking, eating red meat, f*cking some chick i met at a bar etc etc the list goes on forever.

I've seen the chicks he picks up in bars... he's not lying you know.

 

[old.Tohtori]

you spaz.

And with that, i'm done with you.

 

[Thorwyn]

But doesn´t this:

Yes there's harmful chemicals etc etc, but there is no 100% assurance that "You smoke, you die of it(or related".

Youi might, it's a risk, etc.

So yes, it might be harmful to your health.

You ARE breathing in toxins, but it's not necessary going to cause you anything.

answer your initial question:

Could someone link me proof that second hand smoke, beyond living with and inside smoker for 50 years, kills or harms you?

If you accept the fact that smokers and secondary smokers are inhaling the same substances, the consequence of your statement is, that the smoker knowingly increases the risk for the non-smoker.

q.e.d.

 

[Calaen]

Toh answering his own question on FH shocker!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[old.Tohtori]

Yes ofcourse, that's surely proof that someone smoking outside is harming a non-smoker

No Thorwyn, it does not. Even if talking about inside smoking, again it might, but we're not even talking about inside smoking.

Anyway i'm done with this thread regarding a few upper posters, the trolls have taken over with inane babble again(which has nothing to do with it) and no one seems to actually discuss the matter.

 

[CorNokZ]

No, but the getting killed by smoking is bigger than being killed in a plane crash or a car accident

 

[old.Tohtori]

No, but the getting killed by smoking is bigger than being killed in a plane crash or a car accident

And how is that exactly?

And how is my smoking, take me personally as an example, killing someone?

What reason do any of the anti-smokers have to tell me i can't smoke?

Except ofcourse to control others, which is funny because that's the kind of people(sheep) Calaen said should be shot.

So if you listen to Calaen and stop smoking, you should be shot by Calaen.

 

[Thorwyn]

No Thorwyn, it does not. Even if talking about inside smoking, again it might, but we're not even talking about inside smoking.

Your initial question was not about inside or outside smoking, but generally about smoking being harmful or not. And if you accept that smoking *might* be harmful for you, you also accept that it *might* be harmful for others. You may think it´s your choice (which of yourse it is) and that smoking does not automatically mean harm. Others may think: ok, I´m not going to die from secondary smoking, but it *might* affect my health and I don´t want to take that risk and I don´t want OTHER people make that decision FOR ME.

I think we all agree that smoking outside is completely ok as long as it´s in the open where everyone can just avoid the smoke. Inside smoking is a different matter. I´m an ex smoker and quit a couple of years ago. I don´t mind people smoking in pubs and bars. Sure, the smell in the clothes is awful, but then.. that´s what washing machines are made for. If I don´t want to smell smoke, I can go to a non-smokers pub. The only (public) place where I don´t want smokers are restaurants. When I`m eating my steak, I want to taste it and not the cheap Lucky Strike fag from the guy at the next table.

And how is my smoking, take me personally as an example, killing someone?

You´re not killing someone, you´re increasing the risk of killing someone.

What reason do any of the anti-smokers have to tell me i can't smoke?

None. You can do whatever you want as long as you don´t affect other people.

 

[Calaen]

And how is that exactly?

And how is my smoking, take me personally as an example, killing someone?

What reason do any of the anti-smokers have to tell me i can't smoke?

Except ofcourse to control others, which is funny because that's the kind of people(sheep) Calaen said should be shot.

So if you listen to Calaen and stop smoking, you should be shot by Calaen.

I never told yuo to stop smoking.

 

[Chronictank]

What reason do any of the anti-smokers have to tell me i can't smoke?

There is no reason other than them trying to force their opinion/lifestyle on you

Just read through the thread, not one of them (the blanket ban anti-smoking lobby) gave a good reason why drinking in a sensible settings is better than smoking in a sensible settings

All there has been is:
Smoking is bad for you - i know so what?, so is drinking
but smoking is bad for you, look i have proofs - i have proof drinking is bad for you, why do you do it?
<insert inane examples and misdirection attempts>

 

[old.Tohtori]

but generally about smoking being harmful or not.

No it wasn't. There's your problem, this thread TURNED to some kind fo "smokking is bad for you" thing, but initially it wasn't. It had nothing to do with bars, smoking inside houses or even cars.

Like i said, me as an example personally;

I don't smoke inside, i don't smoke in bars, i don't even ask to smoke in a car, i move away from people to have a smoke etc. I don't do one ounce of harm towards others, yet still...well...see thread.

To the rest;

You're telling me to stop smoking by saying things like "morons smoke" or "you have to be an idiot to smoke" etc.

It's as bad as straight out sayign "You should quit". It's actually worse.

BUT...

Even if you're not saying "stop smoking", then why are you so anti-smoking?

Why are you against something that you're not asking people to stop?

 

[Sparx]

Sigh Chron the point is me having a drink standing next to you will have 0% effect on your health. Me puffing a fag does

Of course alcohol is bad for you any drug is, coffee included but my drinking isnt going to change the health of a tee-totaller beside me, you smoking can effect the health of a non-smoker beside you

Simple as that

EDIT: on top of that its plain annoying having smoke blown at you, we used all joke that everyone smoking the smoke always seemed to blow towards the non-smoker which it felt like it did, it then made me cough and get sore eyes. So i may not get lung cancer but im left to feel uncomfortable and red/sore eyes for none of the benefits

 

[old.Tohtori]

you smoking can effect the health of a non-smoker beside you

Simple as that

Some moron drinking and causing a fight -can- effect the health of me too

And these days, since smoking is banned in bars, outside smoking is the only place where you don't choose to be in a smoking persons vicinity(even then you can move), so there's 0% harm you don't choose to partake in

 

[Sparx]

No it wasn't. There's your problem, this thread TURNED to some kind fo "smokking is bad for you" thing, but initially it wasn't. It had nothing to do with bars, smoking inside houses or even cars.

Like i said, me as an example personally;

I don't smoke inside, i don't smoke in bars, i don't even ask to smoke in a car, i move away from people to have a smoke etc. I don't do one ounce of harm towards others, yet still...well...see thread.

To the rest;

You're telling me to stop smoking by saying things like "morons smoke" or "you have to be an idiot to smoke" etc.

It's as bad as straight out sayign "You should quit". It's actually worse.

BUT...

Even if you're not saying "stop smoking", then why are you so anti-smoking?

Why are you against something that you're not asking people to stop?

I personally havent said once you should quit, its totally up to you, do whatever you want to your body. What is annoying is the forcing it on others.

Try changing smoke to sound, we're all been completely pissed off by the little shits on buses who play their music blaring through their phones, sure play music all you want but please do it controlled where its not annoying other people

 

[Sparx]

Some moron drinking and causing a fight -can- effect the health of me too

And these days, since smoking is banned in bars, outside smoking is the only place where you don't choose to be in a smoking persons vicinity(even then you can move), so there's 0% harm you don't choose to partake in

Ahh but you dont have to be drunk to have a drink remember. Theres nothing nicer than a nice cold beer in the sun

 

[georgie]

There's nothing nicer than a nice cold beer in the sun

Except maybe a nice cigarette after a great meal.

 

[Sparx]

Except maybe a nice cigarette after a great meal.

Id love to start smoking just so i could have one after sex

 

[Chronictank]

Sigh Chron the point is me having a drink standing next to you will have 0% effect on your health. Me puffing a fag does

And if you put yourself in the situation where you are breathing it in (i.e. a smoking bar like i, and most smokers here proposed as is practiced in the rest of the world), then you cannot use that excuse

Drinking provides more than enough issues for people around them, even if they are not a result of the act of drinking itself.
I think you will be pretty hard pressed to find someone not negatively affected in some way as a result of people drinking