Rant Fucking unions

[Raven]

Most union leaders are only interested in their own political gain and massive salaries/expense accounts. To think they give a shit about people on the shop floor it pretty funny though.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Most union leaders are only interested in their own political gain and massive salaries/expense accounts. To think they give a shit about people on the shop floor it pretty funny though.

Most people are only interested in themselves an don't give a f*ck about other people outside those who might actually affect their life, again, in complete selfish f*cknuttery

 

[Scouse]

Most union leaders are only interested in their own political gain and massive salaries/expense accounts. To think they give a shit about people on the shop floor it pretty funny though.

I think union leaders are absolutley interested in their own salaries and expense accounts - they're human after all.

However, it's their job to be interested in the people on the shop floor. Unions were set up as a balance to counter business interests - which are to have everyone working like slaves for free, sacking people at will and not providing for pensions or holidays whilst paying the owners as much of the profit that they can get away with.


It is human to want as much as you can get away with. Union leaders are human. They also work for the shop floor...

 

[DaGaffer]

The unions can fuck off and stop playing politics. Maggie Thatcher fucked them up in the '80s, shame Cameron can't finish them off now. Bob Crow in particular, what a CUNT he is

LOL. That's their job Throd. No arguments about Bob Crow though.

Cunts. If what you do adversely affects people other than your employers you are a cunt. And timing it like that just to fuck up as many civilians as possible is a scummy way of going about it. And if this turns out to be about pay or massively over inflated pensions then they will not got any public support at the moment.

The right to withdraw one's labour (and it is a right, and a hard-won one) will always adversely affect people other than your employer, otherwise there'd be no point in doing it. What a ridiculously naive thing to say. Now, while I don't personally agree with going on strike during the Olympics, and I don't have any particular sympathies for public sector workers, the logic of what this guy is saying, from his perspective, is perfectly reasonable. "Fuck our members over and we'll do it back to you in the way that embarrasses you the most", is what this guy is saying to his members' ultimate employer. Now, I think he's wrong because it would wreck public sympathy, but if the guy didn't even countenance the idea of industrial action during the Olympics, he wouldn't be doing his job, frankly.

I love jealousy between elements of the "Labour". Shame it seems to be a crime to direct it at the "Capital".

Get back to 1975 Scouse, and take your copy of Das Kapital with you. Capital and Labour aren't so easily pigeon-holed anymore now we're all worried about our pension schemes.

 

[soze]

The right to withdraw one's labour (and it is a right, and a hard-won one) will always adversely affect people other than your employer, otherwise there'd be no point in doing it. What a ridiculously naive thing to say. Now, while I don't personally agree with going on strike during the Olympics, and I don't have any particular sympathies for public sector workers, the logic of what this guy is saying, from his perspective, is perfectly reasonable. "Fuck our members over and we'll do it back to you in the way that embarrasses you the most", is what this guy is saying to his members' ultimate employer. Now, I think he's wrong because it would wreck public sympathy, but if the guy didn't even countenance the idea of industrial action during the Olympics, he wouldn't be doing his job, frankly.

Firemen go on strike you can end up dead in a fire, a Ford factory go on strike and your new car is a week late. They are no where near the same league.

*Again I accept my view is selfish and simplistic.

 

[DaGaffer]

Firemen go on strike you can end up dead in a fire, a Ford factory go on strike and your new car is a week late. They are no where near the same league.

*Again I accept my view is selfish and simplistic.

A Ford factory goes on strike and you work for their brake pad supplier; as the strike goes on you get put on short time, then you're laid off, you miss your mortgage payments, the missus leaves you and you end up drinking meths under a bridge and get beaten to death by two drunk city boys drunk on their bonuses after short-selling Ford stock.

There's a human cost to everything, but only one of them brings out your inner Daily Mail reader.

 

[Scouse]

Get back to 1975 Scouse, and take your copy of Das Kapital with you. Capital and Labour aren't so easily pigeon-holed anymore now we're all worried about our pension schemes.

Never read it

However, I disagree with your assertion that Capital and Labour aren't easily pigeon holed. Capital doesn't give a fuck about their pension schemes - they're minted anyway. Pension schemes for them are just tax-free ways of getting their cash...

 

[DaGaffer]

Never read it

However, I disagree with your assertion that Capital and Labour aren't easily pigeon holed. Capital doesn't give a fuck about their pension schemes - they're minted anyway. Pension schemes for them are just tax-free ways of getting their cash...

No but Labour does care, which makes have a vested interest in Capital. I didn't say it was a symmetrical relationship (its absolutely not), but by moving pensions away from the state and into company/personal schemes over the last 30 years, every fucker is now beholden to the stock market as much as every trader angling for his bonus.

 

[Jeros]

"Either join or the union or have a plan to get another job if they shaft you, don't talk to me about your fucking contract, did not help any of the other poor buggers".

Unions should not exist, they should not have a REASON to exist.

 

[Deebs]

Nobody fancy answering either of the questions I posed?

1) Nobody should strike
2) Nobody should strike

Before you take a job in the public sector you research, like you do before taking any job, and understand the possible issues with being employed by that employer. Unions are fucking scum. Rights? The EU gives employees rights above our own government for which I am, personally, happy with. What I do fucking hate is some cunt being paid a lot of money saying we should strike or disrupt the Olympics just so he can get a better package for himself. Absolute fucking farce. If you don't like working in the public sector then fuckoff to the private sector.

Makes me feel ashamed especially as I have to lump in our Emergency and Military services into the same pot (being public servants). Shame on you.

 

[Scouse]

1) Nobody should strike
2) Nobody should strike

Frankly, I think that's ridiculous Deebs.

 

[Deebs]

Frankly, I think that's ridiculous Deebs.

Why? We who chose to work in the private sector don't have the ability to strike, we chose that sector to work in. God forbid if our Military decided to strike. They put their lives on risk every day and yet they still carry on. Strikers are just fucking scum as are the Union leaders.

 

[Scouse]

We who chose to work in the private sector don't have the ability to strike

Not true. Know several people who work in the private sector (power companies) who have unions and the ability to strike.

Withdrawal of labour is the only thing some companies understand. Unions are a necessary evil. The why is - without them who represents our interests?

 

[Embattle]

Not true. Know several people who work in the private sector (power companies) who have unions and the ability to strike.

Generally such companies are ones that got privatised.

 

[Himse]

Nicely timed to have most effect tbfh.

What's the point in striking if it's ineffective and does no damage?

Plus, Olympics = pointless

Sorry but if you believe the olympics are pointless you're a nutjob.

 

[old.user4556]

Tell me why they're not pointless?

 

[ileks]

Winning them annoyed the French a bit?

 

[Wazzerphuk]

Tell me why they're not pointless?

Forced investment into poor areas of London. Has increased money invested into transport and housing and sports facilities which were badly needed. Also, if run well (which they probably won't be), it's possible to turn a profit when holding the Olympics. It's also provided a huge amount of jobs - which simply wouldn't exist in the current market in London during a recession.

 

[russell]

No. Making yourself unemployed is NOT an option. People have lives, mortgages, children. In many cases they've been to university for these jobs, trained for years, they've taken a big leap of faith and committed themselves. Time, money, sweat and toil. Significantly changing their terms and conditions on them is a fucking awful thing to do..

This.
You expect a little change, then another comes, then another comes.... then you just realise that it is starting to really take the biscuit with your entire life.

 

[russell]

1) Nobody should strike
2) Nobody should strike

Before you take a job in the public sector you research, like you do before taking any job, and understand the possible issues with being employed by that employer. Unions are fucking scum. Rights? The EU gives employees rights above our own government for which I am, personally, happy with. What I do fucking hate is some cunt being paid a lot of money saying we should strike or disrupt the Olympics just so he can get a better package for himself. Absolute fucking farce. If you don't like working in the public sector then fuckoff to the private sector.

Makes me feel ashamed especially as I have to lump in our Emergency and Military services into the same pot (being public servants). Shame on you.

Wow -this is some opinion. I'm really quite shocked.

I trained for years, did my research -my terms and conditions have changed beyond belief -how could I have possibly predicted the economic crisis/ government idiocy?
My right to strike is the only thing I can do that has an impact. I have only done it once -as I hate it, but, believe me things were getting drastic.

 

[russell]

The government, sorry 'media' would have us believe that the November strike had no impact. Yet already the pension package is far less drastic. Striking is a last resort, and it does have an impact.

 

[Himse]

Tell me why they're not pointless?

Basically what Wazzer said, how can you doubt what it brings to the economy? Alright it's a small 'burst' but it kick starts a trend. It's not just ticket sales for the events, it benefits transport, retail, tourism etc etc.

Why do you think they are pointless?

 

[russell]

Deebs are you saying we should move towards a more "Marxist-Leninist" regime, such as the former USSR or the People's Republic of China, where striking is illegal?
Historically many major events have been shaped and changed by workers striking - the Berlin Wall falling springs to mind... Im not saying it is always a good thing -merely trying to add another perspective

 

[russell]

Olympics -lets hope you are right Waz - 20 billion is a shocking amount for us to spend in the midst of this current climate.

 

[Scouse]

Forced investment into poor areas of London. Has increased money invested into transport and housing and sports facilities which were badly needed. Also, if run well (which they probably won't be), it's possible to turn a profit when holding the Olympics. It's also provided a huge amount of jobs - which simply wouldn't exist in the current market in London during a recession.

Yay, even more shit for London, where most of us don't live...

 

[Himse]

Yay, even more shit for London, where most of us don't live...

'Middelsborough 2012 Olympics' doen't have the same ring to it ;D

 

[Himse]

'Middelsborough 2012 Olympics' doen't have the same ring to it ;D

Middlesbrough* christ that was appaling.

 

[old.user4556]

Why do you think they are pointless?

In this thread, I never said they were; I like to see the distinction between opinion and fact.

 

[Wazzerphuk]

Yay, even more shit for London, where most of us don't live...

But it is the economic hub of the country and one of the most powerful cities on Earth. If London suffers, the rest of the country will suffer knock-on consequences.

It's up to you whether you like that or not, but it is a fact.

All they need to do now is pave all over severn sisters and Tottenham and neighbouring areas and start all over again. No bias, but it is an area that's been left to degrade for decades.

 

[throdgrain]

Middlesbrough* christ that was appaling.

*Appalling