Fins List Must B Disbanded

[Novamir]

I think that the fins list should stay forever, even if its only purpose is to irritate eneq.

 

[Cloak_]

Engage was used as a Ghetto-Mezz on adds (used it 1 hell of alot b4 we knew about PBAOE grps) and taking 1 down at a time wasnt much of a hassle.

And no we didnt sit pulling fins,, it was just whatever we ran into whilst wandering through CF,

Other tanks that joined us there were Rafe, Seerkind and Abyss.

We knew each others gameplay inside out and managed to do a hell of alot more than you would expect.

 

[Noche]

And after 3 pulls from each part forest clean

 

[Armolas]

Eneq I was there - I can't swear to the exact line up or levels, but it was no druid, as we didn't have one in our regular exp group at that time, and it was before pbaoe groups were around really, and it was below lv 40.

This was when CF fins came in 2s mainly, with the odd 3, 4 or 5 pull, and one lag pull of far too many.

So the main thing is to mez / engage as many as poss, and take one at a time out, which is not too hard with 2 wardens in the group.

And mentalists can out-heal druids - if they are healing specced they can out heal them quite spectacularly, otherwise its about even, but the thing about mentalist healing is it eats power like no tomorrow, and it also creates a lot of aggro we can't deal with too easily, and of course we have no instas.

But the main point is that fins exp is OK, safe and steady, but nowhere near the best, nor do they give many drops, and the main thing - doing fins is as dull as ditchwater.

I got 7 or 8 bubbles maybe at the fins, but most of my last few levels were at siabra city and the EZ - much more fun, take 2 groups in and go mad slaughtering things, make sure each group has a pbaoer and the exp will be great for everyone, plus you get drops, including the odd siab queen uberdrop.

 

[Alrindel]

One last time: the fins list is not there to exclude people from getting the (dubious) benefit of exping at that spot, it's there to make sure that as many people as possible can use it each day, by helping to keep a full group there pulling all the time. Your attitude of "it's unfair and if I can't use it nobody should be able to" is the kind of thing I still get from my four year old nephew, although my six year old niece has outgrown it.

 

[old.Foldroll]

To those people who run the list, and decide who can xp at the prime spots for high level characters...

How much more do you pay to play the game than me?

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by Ch@meleon

I don't need to go to either spots thanks. The point is, the right to exclusively farm that spot only if you are on 16 hours a day and have the type of live that allows you to wait for a spot indefinately, is wrong. Yes I do think that if a group of players who are not able to be on for these lengths of time decided they wanted to go to fins, they should be able to.

So if I only play for 10 minutes each day that would give me the right to come and take over any pullsite in the game that i want then? After all, just because im not online for 20 minutes like you are, i should be able to pull at your exact location too!

you sir, are a tit.

G

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by Tyka
And oh, 1 more thing, i cant stand ppl going afk more than 10 minutes in groups especially in EZ, i enjoy the xping part if you do it right, and there is nothing i have not seen at finliaths, they are worthless in all kind of ways

Firebrands salvage for 150G. at the rate they drop and combined with the other loot thats pretty hard to beat unless you find someone who wants to buy diamondseals.

G

 

[old.giriam]

Re: hmm again

Originally posted by eneq
quote time again.

I read this like this. If i dont like the finslist no-one forces me to aklownedge it as a law. I can make my group and play whatever i like to play. I CAN go camp a spot already taken, i CAN grief players. There is no GOA rule against camping same spot as someone else.
The "noone are forcing them to paricipate" i read as if no-one can tell me NOT to camp fins with a 2 group. OR ?

Im sorry but I dont understand a word you are saying. Sorry, but I really dont :\

G

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by old.Foldroll
To those people who run the list, and decide who can xp at the prime spots for high level characters...

You dont get it do you? The fin's is *NO DIFFERENT* from any other spot, those who get there first sort of have claim to it, just like when you go to the bottom of the spraggon den to pull spragix and earth sprites and find another group allready there.. "dang, its camped - lets check the pit"

The fins however (and i will tell you why in a minute) is a very popular spot, so those who get there first are usually bombarded with tells, "lemme join", "you full?". "hi, any room?".. And as a result you get a list, "no room atm sorry but i'll tell you when someone leaves" .. voila. its just a larger scale than any other spot, and this is why:

people who cant be bothered to build their own groups or look for other nice xp spots see it as their only hope of reaching 50 without putting in any effort of their own.. and when its not as easy as they though it would be then they get-a-whining here.

G

 

[old.Demerzel]

mom i dont wanna wait! i want candy now!

 

[old.Foldroll]

Claiming that you have more right to an area because you are there first is a player imposed rule. Not a GOA or Mythic imposed rule.

What is NOT harassment?
First we should point out that anything considered a valid play style in DAoC is not considered harassment. In other words, player killing of your realm's enemies, including gravestone camping, is not considered harassment. By valid, we mean that there are game mechanics created around these play styles in DAoC. Because DAoC is a RvR (PvP) game, players should seek ways of protecting themselves against these play styles through game mechanics rather than calling on customer support staff for help in these cases.

If this is considered a valid play style, then sharing a camp, so that groups other than the first to arrive can get xp from mobs should also be allowed. No one is saying that if you are inundated with requests to join your group, you should not start a list for that group. And no one is questioning any players right to determine who he or she groups with. But no one has the right to stop another player from choosing to gain experience in any area or from exploring any area.

Excluding people from experiencing any area of the game, simply because some people are able to spend more time on-line is inherently wrong.

I can clearly see that the people advocating keeping the lists, and telling people to go elsewhere because they were there first are the ones gaining from the exclusivity that they have created.

 

[Chameleon]

Originally posted by old.giriam
So if I only play for 10 minutes each day that would give me the right to come and take over any pullsite in the game that i want then? After all, just because im not online for 20 minutes like you are, i should be able to pull at your exact location too!

you sir, are a tit.G

If you wanna solo somewhere for 10 minutes, even stand on my head while you do it, be my guest. I was referring of course (well I thought it was obvious) to spending maybe upto an hour getting a group of 8 together and finding that is absolutely no way whatsoever that you can xp at fins if u wanted to, cos there's a whole list of people who have spent the whole day waiting for someone to decide to leave the list group and step outside the front door.
Your examples are weak, making no point whatsoever. Or is it just an argument you are after? I can't work it out.

Why resort to insults, rather than an ordinary discussion like the rest? Sorry if I hit a raw nerve ...... I'm not saying it's necessarily wrong to spend 16 hours a day in a game, if that's what you found offensive.

You tit, are a tit.

 

[VidX]

High level XP spots that we use on Prydwen (less populated, not as much need for lists:

1) CF for fins groups (4 seperate pulling spots within CF pulling from different spawns: 1 is by the west wall, about 50k 27k. One is by the Faerie Queen spawn point, up to 4 fins per pull from a tree East by North East from the Queen spawn. One is by a fallen tree log north of the Granny Hill. And one is on the West side of the river, about 15k 30k I think

2) Fins in Briefine, just South of Crim in the second set of trees from Crim.

3) Guardians in BoC, few different spots. One by the Tower/village at around 25k 25k, and one down on the South West side of the lake by AB. Also Banshees at this second spot to let the Guardian camp bonus take a rest.

4) Umbral Hulks in DF. As said before, cap's lvl 50's XP, and a good group of 8 can do well there, or a full main group and a leech group of AoE Eldies, Mentalists and rangers.

5) Sheeroe. Not alot of people XP here, but the area around the dragons lair, especially the North East side of the lair, is great for pulling from the Geists/Knights. Careful of scouts though.

So, it is possible to have 8 full groups going, not counting the 4 or 5 you can get in Sheeroe.

 

[Noche]

Originally posted by old.Foldroll
Claiming that you have more right to an area because you are there first is a player imposed rule. Not a GOA or Mythic imposed rule.



If this is considered a valid play style, then sharing a camp, so that groups other than the first to arrive can get xp from mobs should also be allowed. No one is saying that if you are inundated with requests to join your group, you should not start a list for that group. And no one is questioning any players right to determine who he or she groups with. But no one has the right to stop another player from choosing to gain experience in any area or from exploring any area.

Excluding people from experiencing any area of the game, simply because some people are able to spend more time on-line is inherently wrong.

I can clearly see that the people advocating keeping the lists, and telling people to go elsewhere because they were there first are the ones gaining from the exclusivity that they have created.

So wot will u feel if somebody comes and start to pull the camp ur grp was pulling end up with camp empty is good then? If there r enough mobs then it´s a np, but if there r not enough? It´s well known if a grp camp certain mobs (f.i. a Named one), then another grp SHOULD (of course they can still pull it and start an argue) wait till this grp leaves or find another spot.

If u were that unfortunate grp wot will u tnk dude? This is a mmorpg, and sadly it´s not a casual player friendly one (lvl 50 required, epic armor required, load of RAs required to being able to have fun w/o eating dirt that many times), accept it as is mate.

U have no right to cut queue if there r ppl doing the queue a couple of hours ago already.

 

[Chameleon]

Originally posted by Noche
This is a mmorpg, and sadly it´s not a casual player friendly one (lvl 50 required, epic armor required, load of RAs required to being able to have fun w/o eating dirt that many times), accept it as is mate.

You can actually get to 50 and have a blast in rvr AND have a real life

 

[PJS]

This is a difficult one this, because both sides are right in their own ways.
Technically any mob in the game that noone is currently fighting is fair game for you to hit and get exp off, which is the sort of Mythic/GOA/ultra-fair-to-all stance.
However, if you have found a good free spot for yourself, have been using it for a while nicely, it is bad form for someone to turn up and reduce the benifit for you. (first come first served)
Conversely, if someone has been looking round for a nice spot, cant find one, then comes to share yours, it is also bad form for you to be selfish and want to keep it all to yourself. (share the wealth)
Theres usually a built in equilibrium to this, too many people, too few spawns, some leave to find greener pastures (better exp/time), those that stay get more spawns each, more turn up, more leave, and so on. The game also has built in mechanics to discourage staying in one spot, the poorly named camp bonus which should really be 'roam' bonus.
IMO, there should not be mobs in the game that give more exp with 0 camp bonus than others with max. But I dont think that finlaiths actually do, however I am not yet of a level to find out personally. I think someone one day in the past arbitrarily said "wow, fins are best lvl 40+ exp in the realm" and enough believed them to create the situation that currently exists.

 

[Noche]

Originally posted by Ch@meleon


You can actually get to 50 and have a blast in rvr AND have a real life

Hard when all ppl running with rr4+ and have IP

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by Ch@meleon

If you wanna solo somewhere for 10 minutes, even stand on my head while you do it, be my guest. I was referring of course (well I thought it was obvious) to spending maybe upto an hour getting a group of 8 together and finding that is absolutely no way whatsoever that you can xp at fins if u wanted to

what i was trying to explain to you was that just because you are in a hurry that does not give you any special importance compared to to the rest. The common rule (although player imposed you will be frozen out if you break this) is that first comes gets first served. If a spot is camped then you wait until it is free, you dont start to pull there and ruin the xp for both groups. its exactly the same at the fins. why should you get to jump in line there just because you are in a hurry?

Your examples are weak, making no point whatsoever.

i beg to differ but ive tried to make them clearer for you now, maybe that helps.

G

 

[Ensceptifica]

k Giriam wins the discussion, now let's all eat pie. First come first served, and if you can't come in time, then you'll just have to get pie somewhere else.

(;

 

[noob_pride]

You guys are really going with this fins list

 

[Chameleon]

Originally posted by old.giriam
what i was trying to explain to you was that just because you are in a hurry that does not give you any special importance compared to to the rest. The common rule (although player imposed you will be frozen out if you break this) is that first comes gets first served. If a spot is camped then you wait until it is free, you dont start to pull there and ruin the xp for both groups. its exactly the same at the fins. why should you get to jump in line there just because you are in a hurry?



i beg to differ but ive tried to make them clearer for you now, maybe that helps.

G

No, you've missed the point again. The list restricts access to this group for only those with too much time on their hands. The rest are refused access to xp at this spot, ever. This is not right. Do you understand me now?

 

[Alrindel]

The list restricts access to this group for only those with too much time on their hands. The rest are refused access to xp at this spot, ever. This is not right. Do you understand me now?

Having actually been in a couple of fins groups, and having actually held and run the list for a day, I know from personal experience that what you are saying does not correspond to reality. How many times do you need to be told?

 

[eneq]

at last

Qoute time !!!

"No, you've missed the point again. The list restricts access to this group for only those with too much time on their hands. The rest are refused access to xp at this spot, ever. This is not right. Do you understand me now? "

WAs waiting for someone to sum it up !!!!

Strangelly many that have replied to my post have been bugged about XP is bad at fins. Missed the whole point with the post from start.

To Novamir.
Well u abonded Hib for mids so u can annoy me whenever u want !!! ;p
Just kill me and then dance. I really get annoyed when males try to dance with me and dances badly....

BTW whats your middy char name ? So i can show u how real men dance.
That assuming u went to mid and joined the xp killing NP at fins crim ?

BTW i think NP is really good RvR group but hate that they must b lowlifes and XP kill. Especially being 3 fg attacking a group of 8 battling fins.
On the other hand we all in hib must say thanx to them for taking the old Envenom from hib and take him to mid. ;p

 

[Ensceptifica]

Originally posted by Ch@meleon


No, you've missed the point again. The list restricts access to this group for only those with too much time on their hands. The rest are refused access to xp at this spot, ever. This is not right. Do you understand me now?

Yes, you're expressing your grief over the fact that people who have a lot of time to play have an advantage over those who don't, which results in short-time players such as yourself missing most of the action. Welcome to MMORPGs.

Fins lists are actually an attempt of some people to stay in line with the 'first come, first served' idea, all with good intentions. If you need to get in an xp group quick coz you don't have a lot of time to play, then forget about Fins. Go find other camp spots. Also realise Mythic designed this game to be a lasting addiction even for people who play 24/7, that's just the way MMORPG's work.

 

[Chameleon]

Originally posted by Alrindel
Having actually been in a couple of fins groups, and having actually held and run the list for a day, I know from personal experience that what you are saying does not correspond to reality. How many times do you need to be told?

All those I know who have done, or currently do add themselves to the list, spend A LOT of time waiting to get their go. Many people cant do this, and so they cant xp there. That's the point. I'm not sure how many different ways I can say it. Personally I dont want to xp there, but i do disagree with the idea of the list.

Ah well, we're all going around in circles here. I guess this one will go on for eternity.

 

[eneq]

well how many times

"Having actually been in a couple of fins groups, and having actually held and run the list for a day, I know from personal experience that what you are saying does not correspond to reality. How many times do you need to be told?"

And how many times u need to b told.

Good for u that u can play all day. Good for u that u been on list.
Bad for the peeps that have send to finslist and got msg no u number 12 on list.

I know there is no good solution to the problem. BUT as u yourself said ITS EVIL !! (u did say that didnt u ?)

There is even a life idea ( not right word i know) thats say all thats evil CANT DO GOOD.

So using EVIL (well u said it was evil) for good cant b done.

I know its a long shoot idea/theory but hell i can make them with my ranger so why not....

 

[Lessurl]

I don't know what you are moaning about. Only reason fins is best xp spot for 40+ is because of the list. If you have a whole day free, you can get up join the fins and stay there all day as group is constantly refreshed. Also from point where you do get in group (if you can't get up early enough for first group) you can virtually xp for as long as you want. (of course there is a limit when it starts getting late and less and less people to refresh group with). But if you went to fins with a regular xp group with no list to refresh from then it would be just like a regular innis grp. 9 times out of 10 someone would have to leave within 2 hours of starting and group would fall apart.
For low 40's the xp at banshees/bw's etc. is better, mid 40's shades etc. in EZ and for high 40's Siab city and knights in ez are far superior to fins. Plus you get decent drops instead of the infamous firebrand.

So i sum up, remove the fins list and you remove the fins as a good way for people to get those last few levels to 50. That imo is a bad thing as we need more lvl 50's to strengthen our realm.

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by old.Foldroll
I can clearly see that the people advocating keeping the lists, and telling people to go elsewhere because they were there first are the ones gaining from the exclusivity that they have created.

Wow can you get a bit more sweeping with the generalisations. That one was only completly false, we need one that really makes people just laugh out loud at how ridiculous it is...

 

[PJS]

True, if you cant play for hours on end you cant do fins. However, its going to take you a lot longer to get to the stage where you can being as you dont play much. So maybe everyone will be 50 by then and you can have them to yourself