Fed's guide to Albion RvR

[Delania]

Originally posted by - Fedaykin -


Theurgist – Either spec for 6/8 sec pbt or forget it altogether imo and spec higher wind/ice. 10 sec pbt just doesn’t cut it in todays assisting RvR. Pet spam ffs, every support class in sight should have a pet on him, theurgists moan at me “it uses all my power” what use is power if u are dead? They have 2000 range so you can cast them from a safe distance – they are a theurgists best asset so use them well. Try to hide as much as you can in battles, as a cloth caster you need to be away from the action.

Fedaykin

I think you will find out that the theurgist really mean if i spam pets i end up faced down and lose most of the rp's the group gets because i am not worth having someone look after me. If I spam pets and not in a good group I will end up faced down, I would rather be eating dirt and get rezed than the whole of my group dies. I am a caster I expect to die quicker than the tanks. If i spam a lot of pets i move about so its more difficult for the ememy to find out where the pets are coming from, it works about 70% of the time.

I dont find that pets use too much mana i can get 8-10 air pets off maybe more b4 i run out. I have 8 sec pbt too with serenity 2. Yes i can get more nukes off than pets.

As for cc control my mezz will last about 10 secs in rvr which gives me a chance to root 2 before it runs out. If the group is a good one then I can cast more roots if needed then either assist main MA with nuke or send pets in depending on the situation.

If i am in a mostly caster group which i have been of late i will watch the other casters, and root any tank on them so they can mez, nuke or dot.

I am a support class so thats what i do supoort my group to the best of my ability.

It is hard to get a perfect set up group at apk as mincers now solo alot, there is not enough clerics or sorcs about. Most pick up groups so there best to get a good group to rvr in. When I first started rvr'ing this wasnt the case of late it seems to be. Yes you do have the odd person who only has an hour to play and they generally let you know, so its up to the group wether they go out as they are and hope for the best or stay and wait.

I am not the best player in the game so there is bound to be mistakes in the way I play, so dont take this as a guide. I only consider myself average as I only play to have fun and nothing more.

 

[whuzzy]

Never leave atk without a balanced group, yes this means 2 clerics (3 clerics is pretty damn uber imo – but most think this doesn’t work) minstrel, paladin and Sorc

My vision of a perfect group would be Mincer, Cleric, Sorc, Friar, Pally, S/S Arms, Thurg, Merc / Wiz (depening on who is available)
Well ... i'd defintely add a Friar to that must have in group list, sorry, but a groupfriendly specced friar is surely a boost, many friars have 49 ench spec and therefore also the resist buffs ... that means +2x% resis to Fire / Cold / Matter damage, as a friar, aye ... i often stand there while being mezzed, but that doesn't last for long in case there is a nice group and people know who to demezz, i usually do some heals (Ok, 18 rejuve isn't exactly much, but it's better then nothing, i have a specheal of 215 and since i have 18+14 rejuve, the nonspec heal does around 200-280), until 50% of mana left and then join the fight. As a friar i do attract alot of people to attack me, but in that case just run run and hope that u get away with it, while your tanks are busy with ganking their casters / healers and it is also always nice to have your own bodyguard that just slams the tanks who are behindyou. In case the cleric or somebody else dies it is very simple just to stop your fight for 5 seconds and do a Battlerezz on whoever needs it. (And then u are really OOP) since the battlerezz uses about exactly 50% of my manabar.
And for the final point, friars can also do a shitload of damage ^^

Totally agree. I think we all know what the ideal set up is, but given the time constraints many of us have when playing the ideal set up isn't always an option - so some sensible tweaking can still give you a decent group that will perform ok if everyone knows their role.

That is another problem that i have already faced very oftenly ... if being a groupleader and trying to setup a halfway decent group then oftenly it fades due to the lack of patience ... i mean ... it can sometimes take 4 or 5 ports of waiting to setup the group u want ... and about after the 2nd port if u have some unpatient people in your group they start whining "Let's go make a round, and we'll pickup the guys we still need @ next port" ... that is rather sensless imo, just let's run out of apk, let's get ganked (cuz we don't have a decent group, Give them RP's) and then port back.

Well ... enuff said ... hmm ... <thinks> "i think i wrote loads of bollocks here" ....

Whuzz

 

[Flimgoblin]

Re: Re: Fed's guide to Albion RvR

Originally posted by bracken_woodman
Personally I think it's a toss up between IP and determ 4. I would certainly say det 3 is a must, but if the choice is using the extra 6 points for det 4 or getting IP I would say go IP. Why? Well it can basically mean the difference between taking down that healer/caster and dropping face down because in effect you are doubling the hit points on a fully buffed armsman - and if you have 3 IP tanks in your group this adds up to a lot of extra damage the group can take. This is not to underestimate the usefulness of the extra 15% mezz reduction, it's just I think overall IP will swing a fight more often.

I'd agree if IP was only 6 points it's 17 ... so you can get Det 5 or det 3+IP...

 

[ghaladriel]

...is very easy talk

 

[Galoma]

About necros...

Necros are not the best in RvR i admit that... well... atleast not when it coms to 1 fg Vs 1 fg
But for keep takes we can do some nice works on the guards ect... Scouting the lords room... and so on...
We are a classe like all others... pherhabs not as important to have in grp as a Cleric... but we can nuke for 120-200 damage all the time... never (95%) run out of manna like other casters... and we can power transfere to others...

Ofc it's crap when our pet gets mezzed... but normaly i just run behind our own lines and release the pet, make a new 1 and im baq in bizz again...

I HATE PPL WHO SAYS "NO ROOM FOR NECROS IN ANY RVR GRP" that is BS to say!!!

 

[Belomar]

Re: About necros...

Originally posted by Galoma
I HATE PPL WHO SAYS "NO ROOM FOR NECROS IN ANY RVR GRP" that is BS to say!!!

Not a single point in your rant about the benefits of using the necro AF debuff which actually is quite handy. Shall I take that to mean that you don't know to use this in RvR and that perhaps you need to wisen up on the strengths and weaknesses of your class? (Nuking for 150-200 is not a strength. )

 

[gunner440]

Re: About necros...

Originally posted by Galoma
I HATE PPL WHO SAYS "NO ROOM FOR NECROS IN ANY RVR GRP" that is BS to say!!!

any serious rvr group wouldnt invite a necro often.


not that it's a crap/gimp class but its just to bugged to use in high-end rvr where u dont have control over the surroundings.

 

[Asha]

Originally posted by leorin
Sorc>Theurg any day.

Theurg can not be usen well as CC these days since their mezz last like 1 sec. Wouldnt even give enuff time to set a pb pair up.
And tbh i d prefer a sorc as mezzer since theurgs mezz are in no way reliable.

It doesn't last long, true, but it does work I've seen it work. Depends on the player. I would rather have a good thergist than an average sorcerer.

I never saw 3 healers and a shaman in a mid grp. Maybe I didn't look right, but I never saw that!

It's pretty standard for mids. 1 pac, 2 mend, shamie. They can afford this with the dmg output of savages/pre-nerf zerkers.

When people will only make those uber balanced grp i'll never make any rps again. While I personaly think I'm a very good RvR player/class.

It would be interesting to try it. Disease really screws our tanks, would be fun to use it back on mids. Guess you would drop a tank so mincer, clericx2, sorc, pala, caba, tankx2.

 

[Jiggs]

no, u drop the sorcerer and use the level 48 spec ae snare on cabalist

wild arcana to a decent level and pwn with a 2minute snare (even with det 5 no mid has top spirit buff, so its like 1min of being snared)

ofc with unmezzed support its a bitch, and a cabalist that specs for ae snare and disease wont have a decent nearsight..

 

[Kagato.]

Necromancers are under appreciated in RvR, I admit the bugs are a real pain, but the Absorb buffs are sweet and the debuffs are extremely nasty, im sure all tanks have seen how much more damage they do against someone thats been debuffed by a necro, for killing those healers fast or even enemy tanks it can speed things up alot.

there far from great in rvr, but they can serve a purpose and be effective.

 

[old.Zeikerd]

Originally posted by Jiggs
no, u drop the sorcerer and use the level 48 spec ae snare on cabalist

wild arcana to a decent level and pwn with a 2minute snare (even with det 5 no mid has top spirit buff, so its like 1min of being snared)

ofc with unmezzed support its a bitch, and a cabalist that specs for ae snare and disease wont have a decent nearsight..

And he'll be the first to die every encounter

 

[gunner440]

Originally posted by Kagato.
there far from great in rvr, but they can serve a purpose and be effective.

yes they can serve a purpose but as long as the pet is untouched ;z which is never btw

 

[Asha]

Originally posted by old.Zeikerd
And he'll be the first to die every encounter

so? it's a caster

rez rez faaast

 

[Hedek]

Not bad Fed ;-)

But like any human-made stuff, it ain't perfect
So I'll try to help a bit

If you REALLY want to do a balanced/effective group then kick the paladin out, paladins are not designed for RvR, period, just like necromancers. They're only grouped as end bots and eventually for FH. Since your intend is to help people doing as good as possible rvr groups, then I'm everyone would agree having lots of end pots and grouping an additional cleric of friar would be much better. A friar can do most things better than paladins if people have end pots : better rez, better heals, better dmg, better resists, etc.

However I do agree Friars are unfortunately not wanted classes for effective RvR groups either. They don't heal well, they don't have determination so can't melee well and the resists they provide are useless (heat cold and matter are single target dds, aoe ranged dds and dots, in other words not the resists that will save your in RvR). The only resists that are useful and that will save you are Clerics' resists : energy (hib pbaoe) body (mid and hib mez) and spirit (mid pbaoe).

So instead of grouping a friar you'd better group another cleric or another merc (if you already have 2 clerics).

I disagree with you advicing 3 clerics :
a) 2 well played clerics are more than enough to keep a group alive if the other group members know what they have to do it... and do what they're supposed to do.
b) You're freeing a spot for an additional merc or other dmg dealer (wiz ?). While you need good defense, not enough offense gimps the group. (3 clerics + 1 sorc + 1 paladin + 1 mincer that's 2 spots left for dmg dealers !!)
c) This is a very selfish behaviour since we all know how hard to find active clerics can be sometimes. How many times have I heard "group lf cleric PLEASE pm me" having 3 clerics might help your group or so you think but it definitely doesn't help Albion!

To sum up, you need 2 clerics (at least one with BoF and both with Purge), 1 mincer with Purge and SoS, 1 sorc with Purge and if possible MoC, 1 s/s arms, 3 mercs or 2 mercs and 1 reaver if the group is sure to be always able to demezz him. It is sad to say but if your goal is to set up the "perfect" rvr (rp farming) group ANY other classes are useless.

There are of course exceptions : heavy casters group can be VERY effective but only if the members are very good players as proved by Zoyster/Lac/Outlaw. You can't set up a caster group with the randomly grouped wizard and atk and hope as good efficiency as Zoy/Lac/Out's group.

Remember that classes however aren't the only ingredients to do an effective group : Quicksilver, Jiggs and Benedectine, eventhough they're friars (=gimped for group RvR) are much more effective than any random merc (RR5 or less) because they're skilled/experienced enough and have enough RP to buy all the RAs they need.

And last but not least, group members need to know eachother well, need to have played together often, etc... a guild group with unperfect classes will alwys be better than a random group but sporting the "perfect" classes set up. RR does the same, an unperfect yet all RR5+ group will be better than a RR5- less "perfect" group.

Just some thoughts ;-)

Hedek

RR5 Friar Exca
RR7 Healer Ys
RR4 Thane Ys
RR5 Zerk Ys
RR3 Priest of Bogdar Ys
RR5 Enchanter Broc

 

[Tilda]

Originally posted by Hedek
Not bad Fed ;-)

If you REALLY want to do a balanced/effective group then kick the paladin out, paladins are not designed for RvR, period, just like necromancers. They're only grouped as buff bots and eventually for FH. Since your intend is to help people doing as good as possible rvr groups, then I'm everyone would agree having lots of end pots and grouping an additional cleric of friar would be much better. A friar can do most things better than paladins if people have end pots : better rez, better heals, better dmg, better resists, etc.

ahahaahah

you want to drop a pally from a tank group?!!11
get a clue.

 

[whuzzy]

ahahaahah

you want to drop a pally from a tank group?!!11
get a clue.

Hedek made a fairly good point imo, why to drop the pally, and how to compensate for him.

Whuzz

 

[Jiggs]

lol thanks for the complement but even with 16%body resist from cleric +capped resists +AoM2 a red mezz puts my friar out of the fight.

hence the [retired] in my sig o_o

 

[darbey]

LOl drop pally.

Dont forget to collect your end pots from the vendor in sauvage.

Its all been covered in the previous threads and yes once u have it u will be very effective , but jesus , taking an hour and a half over making a perfect group is a little extreme and not much fun either. Especially in the current climate where the zerg is prevalent its a bit academic when u get rolled over by a multiple group enemy force.

 

[Draylor]

Originally posted by - Fedaykin -
Soldiers barricade is another great GROUP ra however many Armsmen prefer to keep themselves alive than their group.

Ah come on selfishness is far from the reason most dont have this.

Draw up a list of RAs you think an armsman should have. See where youd fit SB into the order theyd be bought in. Sure its very nice if you happen to be grouped with someone that has it, but its not something I could justify the points for before around RR7.

Theres just too many near-essential RAs, many of which have to come first.

 

[schinkaar]

If you mezz a mid grp and start ganking on any support 1 healer will purge, singleinsta and cure the pac, then cast a SH (and most likely interrupt whatever is casting). if you somehow manage to take down 2x support, PR->Pr target cast ress. Mid groups dont wait for RA:s, you usually dont need to use any against FG:s, 2 Clerics is very easy to interrupt with a mid group, aslong as healers/shammies are free. Going for the shammie isnt very smart imo shammie does not mean drop buffs (new end requires a bb to buff grp). Savages will still have close to cap evade without dex/qui (the only buff that MIGHT be from the shammie), your only chance to ever beat a mid gank group is if you can leave mincer on harass and change to newly ressed/PR:ed healers then go back to main target. going for shammie first is just a waste against the fotm mid groups, you basicly start the fight with disease on all your tanks if you do this, since most people wont charge you for longer than 50-60% end anyway, if they dont catch you but then its Pf and sprint on them so end doesnt mean much. And since shammie is low on the cure list (3rd) anyway his mezz is the one that is most likely to last the longest, your best target to start with is the pachealer (the one leading grps) this is the best target for 2 reasons 1) a pachealer is the one most likely to have most power for ress 2) if you let a pachealer purge or get cured you will get mezzed. also since you know the sorc will die, dont waste instas on him, instead be rdy to ress him fast, i whould have the paly do it the main reasons for this is that his HP shouldnt matter (its alot better to use slam on savage grp healers than any defensive duties) and power isnt the main concern since the most important thing to do after ress should be AE root on the savages, and thats QC or you will get interrupted (all healers have insta interrupt on a 5 sec timer, and if a paly ress you are likely to be hit by disease or ae root if the shammie is free, if possible get speed up. One of the many advantages as a mid is that 2 of the healers usually have speed, this means that you will pop with speed up after ress. the sorcs only concern after this should be interrupting healers, usually they will either PR 1 healer while healing, or insta heal while ressing no matter what the mincer and sorc should focus on interrupting, even the paly taunt can interrupt a crucial ress/spreadheal. If you dont interrupt the mid group will soon be back at 8, some fights a mid FG ress 6-7 times. The most damaging thing you can do to this is kill newly ressed ppl as fast as possible (besides interrupts), even if you been bashing another healer for 20 sec, kill the newly ressed healer instead and leave mincer on the old one. And always try to have atleast 1 pf tank.
if you fight a good alb group like BF they will take down 1-2 healers very fast but rarely swap to newly ressed healers, most alb groups (aswell as mid groups) are very lazy when it comes to ress, mid have it alot easier due to 4 supportclasses able to ress, but often you have to use a moc just to make a ress.

Thats the thing that whould hurt most as a mid fotm grp just being mezzed by a alb group at medium/long range atleast, you should also take into consideration that a good mid group dont need anything against most hib groups and will have most things up in 90% of the encounters with good alb groups, so if you wanna win youll need to use RA:s just as us. And as someone mentioned if you go out with anything less than optimal expect to be cannonfodder FG vs FG.

 

[bracken_woodman]

Re: Re: Re: Fed's guide to Albion RvR

Originally posted by Flimgoblin
I'd agree if IP was only 6 points it's 17 ... so you can get Det 5 or det 3+IP...

What I was meaning was (for the reasons I stated) you get det 3 first, then IP, then det 4 later...imho ofc

 

[bracken_woodman]

Originally posted by Hedek
If you REALLY want to do a balanced/effective group then kick the paladin out, paladins are not designed for RvR, period.......................................you need...1 s/s arms,

Why take an s/s arms when you can have a paladin with endless endurance? Sure you can fiddle around with pots for endurance...but if you want a defensive tank why not just take the one that gives you the endurance, the fh and the back up rez? Overall utility is much higher on a paladin (I know because I used to be s/s)

 

[Puppetmistress]

Originally posted by Jiggs
lol thanks for the complement but even with 16%body resist from cleric +capped resists +AoM2 a red mezz puts my friar out of the fight.

hence the [retired] in my sig o_o

Which is exactly the same for the paladin. Or about 80% of Albion classes.

Which is why CURE MEZZ is an important spell. But VERY few players of classes who have access to it use it properly.

 

[gunner440]

Originally posted by bracken_woodman
Why take an s/s arms when you can have a paladin with endless endurance? Sure you can fiddle around with pots for endurance...but if you want a defensive tank why not just take the one that gives you the endurance, the fh and the back up rez? Overall utility is much higher on a paladin (I know because I used to be s/s)

s/s arms > paladin by a mile defensively

 

[Hedek]

Well don't get me wrongm I just thought a paladin would be useless in the "most perfect possible group". I've never played a paladin tbh (well actually I /leveled one and deleted him 1 hour later). I came from the very common idea that paladins are only grouped as end bots in other word, if they didn't had it would you group him (ok, that's a silly question : it's like asking if skalds didn't have speed would you group em ). My point was, in a hypothetic situation, if you were able to have provide your group members with as many end pots as you wished wouldn't the paladin be -in that case- better replaced by an armsman with 42 shield ?

Again I don't have much experience either with end pots : Hedek, thanks to his self end buff never uses em and Rekounet and Ghekko (my zerk and thane) never use any either except when soloing, in other word never. So I don't even know how easy they are to use in the heat of a battle other than duels.

Don't read my post as "drop the paladins !!! they're sh**" but rather if you really were to set up THE perfect group wouldn't you drop the paladin if you had as many end pots as you need ?

Edit : Tildai are you SURE to read a post to the end before criticizing ? There are better ways to explain your point of view than "hahhaha drop the paladin? get a clue!". Tbh discussing with people like you isn't interesting at all, however I would have so much welcomed you explaining to me why end pots aren't convenient even if you could have as many as you want and thus demonstrating that my point about paladins is wrong, really I'm always opened to learning something new, especially when it comes from someone so smart and who "has a clue", like you ;-)

 

[gunner440]

Originally posted by Hedek
better replaced by an armsman with 42 shield ?

that is fcking gimped as a s/s armsman

 

[Jiggs]

50 shield!

no paladin can guard u as well as a 50shield arms: more shield spec, *alot* more weaponskill and determination 5

 

[gunner440]

chuffy is beautiful

 

[Hedek]

Originally posted by gunner440
that is fcking gimped as a s/s armsman

Of course Gunnerr, you know much more about armsmen than me, when I say "with 42 shields" I actually meant "with enough shield to slam and guard". But I'm sure you'll be much better at saying what's the best defensive arms spec ;-)

 

[gunner440]

as defensive armsmen u go 50 shield or no shield at all imo

palas 42 is kinda standard due to having to spend points in chants but thats not really a problem, they still guard fine.