No idea Creation....

[old.Tohtori]

Well that's just fucking stupid. If you're right you're right. You may also be an asshole but that doesn't stop you being right.

So if you're an asshole towards people then you're in the right? If i call your GF a slut it's fine with you?

Or did you misunderstand the meaning of the second wrong?

How do you know we can't do -far- better without religion? we've never been without it.

I absolutely don't, neither does anyone if we'll do far worse.

 

[DaGaffer]

So if you're an asshole towards people then you're in the right? If i call your GF a slut it's fine with you?

Or did you misunderstand the meaning of the second wrong?

I absolutely don't, neither does anyone if we'll do far worse.

No,being an asshole doesn't make you right, but its also besides the point.

If she's actually a slut, she's a slut. You could still get a punch in the mouth, but then I'd be in the wrong not you.

 

[old.Tohtori]

No,being an asshole doesn't make you right, but its also besides the point.

It's not besides the point at all and i'll keep it really simple;

Being right doesn't give you the right to act wrong. Agreed or not @DaGaffer ?

 

[Scouse]

We akready did, just fine with religion around.

Provably not.

Apart from the massive historical atrocities (and current Islam-inspired ones) - the neutering of religion in the west has led to massive improvements in life for people.

Notable things include the sexual liberation of women (no more being called a slag, or being cut off from your family for having children out of "wedlock", the banning of legal rape by your husband), equality, animal rights (yes, the subjugation of animals is intrinsically linked to the christian religion) and, of course, a massive decrease in sectarian violence...

And i'm, and possibly Olga, saying it shouldn't. No matter if you're right or wrong, you're always wrong if you're going to go about it like an ahole.

You're wrong. What makes someone an asshole is refusal to listen to reason and a blinkered belief system that can't be challenged through evidence.

Someone who complains about the way someone says something rather than people who murder, rape and kill. That's an arsehole...

 

[old.Tohtori]

Provably not.

We did.

You're wrong. What makes someone an asshole is refusal to listen to reason and a blinkered belief system that can't be challenged through evidence.

Someone who complains about the way someone says something rather than people who murder, rape and kill. That's an arsehole...

I wasn't talking about what makes someone an asshole, now was i? Same simplified question above applies to you;

Being right doesn't give you the right to act wrong. Agreed or not?

 

[DaGaffer]

It's not besides the point at all and i'll keep it really simple;

Being right doesn't give you the right to act wrong. Agreed or not @DaGaffer ?

There are degrees of wrong, and being an asshole is less wrong than most things. And like I said, you don't have a right not to be offended.

 

[Scouse]

We did.

If you count burning heretics, the subjugation and slavery of women, physical and intellectual violence against anyone who held a different view to that of the church.

We'd have done better without religion - and we are doing better in the west now that religion is becoming a thing of the past and evidence-based thinking is taking hold.

So, you're wrong.

Being right doesn't give you the right to act wrong.

I don't think I have acted wrong. I've been factual and evidence-based.

The worst I've called someone is an idiot for thinking that non-evidence based thinking is OK. Which they are.

You've called me a lot worse in this thread...

 

[old.Tohtori]

So, neither can give a direct answer to a very simple question then?

Or did you have trouble understanding it?

 

[Scouse]

So, neither can give a direct answer to a pointless and irrelevant question since people have by and large acted perfectly correctly in this thread, then?

Fixed m8.

Care to take on any of the multitude of relevant points that have been put your way (about, say, religious-backed legal rape of women and how since religion has died off in the west it's getting much better for them) or are you going to ignore everything that's been said with your standard blinkers on and just harp on about irrelevant shit, not really bothering with any discussion of the facts presented to you?

No? Thought so...

 

[old.Tohtori]

Well first off, i wasn't talking about how people acted on this thread. I asked a very simple question(which evidently is way too hard for some people).

Second, if you can't even do that, why should i even bother to point out other things you've misread, such as claiming i'm wrong in saying we got to space with religion around(which was the part i quoted)?

FYI; "fixed" doesn't really work when you lie or twist other peoples words to what they don't mean.

 

[DaGaffer]

So, neither can give a direct answer to a very simple question then?

Or did you have trouble understanding it?

The question isn't binary, even though you'd like to create the illusion it is to create opposition. Fairly child-like attempt.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Again with the assumptions and fear of a simple question. There's no strings attached, no agenda, i was simply clearing your standpoint on what Olga said about how you present a message.

Thing is though; You two taking it into some imaginary reasonings, thinkig it means something else, falsifying comments and all in all avoiding a question that any normal human being could answer(proven by any other member answering it right here) is a sign of something completely different.

I'll make the question even simpler if need be;

Scale of rudeness, from 1 to 10. 1 is a complete asshole, 10 a dictionary definition of civil.

Two people are in a discussion, both at a solid 5. No words have been exchanged, they are strangers to eachother, the discussion is about to begin.

Now one person is religious, the other is not. Does this automatically allow either side to move on the scale in either direction just based on the viewpoints they hold?

 

[caLLous]

Being an asshole or not has no bearing on whether the person is right or not though. Sure it affects how they deliver the point but if they're right, they're right.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Being an asshole or not has no bearing on whether the person is right or not though. Sure it affects how they deliver the point but if they're right, they're right.

Never claimed otherwise.

 

[caLLous]

Never claimed otherwise.

Erm, you very much did...

No matter if you're right or wrong, you're always wrong if you're going to go about it like an ahole.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Err, no i very much didn't. The second wrong has nothing to do with facts, but about behaviour.

Just like the saying "it doesn't matter in a war who's right, but who's left."

 

[DaGaffer]

Again with the assumptions and fear of a simple question. There's no strings attached, no agenda, i was simply clearing your standpoint on what Olga said about how you present a message.

Thing is though; You two taking it into some imaginary reasonings, thinkig it means something else, falsifying comments and all in all avoiding a question that any normal human being could answer(proven by any other member answering it right here) is a sign of something completely different.

I'll make the question even simpler if need be;

Scale of rudeness, from 1 to 10. 1 is a complete asshole, 10 a dictionary definition of civil.

Two people are in a discussion, both at a solid 5. No words have been exchanged, they are strangers to eachother, the discussion is about to begin.

Now one person is religious, the other is not. Does this automatically allow either side to move on the scale in either direction just based on the viewpoints they hold?

If no words have been exchanged, they're not in a discussion. There's no "solid 5" because you can't tell anything until someone speaks. It doesn't work as an example.

 

[Scouse]

It doesn't fucking matter Toht. By your own admission you're "not talking about how people acted on this thread" - so it's pointless and irrelevant - so stop harping on about it and enter the discussion by offering an argument to the many *relevant* points made, or admit your wrong, or just shut the fuck up!

 

[old.Tohtori]

It doesn't fucking matter Toht. By your own admission you're "not talking about how people acted on this thread" - so it's pointless and irrelevant

If it doesn't matter then why have you two been talking about it with me, and Olga, for two pages?

And wrong in what? You haven't even answered the question and only thing you think i'm wrong at is something i didn't say

If no words have been exchanged, they're not in a discussion. There's no "solid 5" because you can't tell anything until someone speaks. It doesn't work as an example.

Again avoiding the question.

F*cks sake i don't even have to troll you two to make you look foolish, you do it all on your own.

 

[Scouse]

Other than to say "It doesn't matter, care to answer any of the relevant points raised" I haven't.

So, no, you don't want to answer any of the relevant items. You're probably avoiding that becayse you are demonstrably wrong and are pathalogically unable to accept it.

Is this where you pull out the "lulz troll" card, or have you figured out being a troll makes you a bigger asshole than being "rude" does?

 

[old.Tohtori]

I asked you again a very simple question; where am i wrong?

Or is this where you pull another strawman argument out?

 

[Krazeh]

No, being right doesn't give you some special entitlement to be an asshole. But being an asshole doesn't stop you being right. And pointing out why a ridiculous belief is ridiculous doesn't make you an asshole.

Happy now?

 

[Raven]

Err, no i very much didn't. The second wrong has nothing to do with facts, but about behaviour.

Just like the saying "it doesn't matter in a war who's right, but who's left."

 

[old.Tohtori]

@Raven facepalm all you want, it's english and if you don't understand it then it's your problem.

No, being right doesn't give you some special entitlement to be an asshole. But being an asshole doesn't stop you being right. And pointing out why a ridiculous belief is ridiculous doesn't make you an asshole.

See? Easy to answer.

No, pointing out why ridicilous thing is ridicilous isn't being an asshole. Calling people retards, morons, idiots and other stuff like that is. Being an asshole is wrong.

These two were saying it's ok to act that way as long as someone has facts behind them.

By the by, no need for some snarky "happy now" comments.

 

[caLLous]

You're trying to employ clever word-play (I think?) but if a bunch of native English speakers pull you up on it, the chances are it hasn't worked.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Again with the hidden agenda, there's no conspiracies here.

Wrong and wrong, the meaning is clear. Unless you actually think someone would say that facts change if you're acting like an ahole

Thinking someone would say that, instead of the other clear meaning of the word, is the silly thing to do.

 

[TdC]

No, we got here through alien insemination of monkeys. True facts.

that's heretic lies! we all popped in to existence last week!

 

[DaGaffer]

Again avoiding the question.

Again pointing out the question makes no sense.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Then i can't have a discussion with you if you don't understand -that- much. Glad we sorted that out.

 

[Gwadien]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXiDyedpXHk