Politics Coronavirus

[~Yuckfou~]

You still haven't answered any of my questions.

 

[caLLous]

Here is a Hint...Boris was elected when exactly?

Is that your argument? Johnson was only elected in July so how could the Tories possibly have done anything to prepare better? The Tories who had been in power for the preceding 9 years, including when they oversaw the NHS stress test which specifically revealed a lack of PPE, among many other shortfalls which made the report "too terrifying to reveal"? That's your argument?

 

[~Yuckfou~]

Isn't it cute...you think you can trust a government of any colour, blind Tory hater.

I wouldn't vote at all if I picked on trust alone.

I'm really not a blind Tory hater. I've voted conservative all my life until recently. They changed, I saw the change and didn't like it. You are allowed to change your mind based on new evidence you know?

 

[Scouse]

Isn't it cute...you think you can trust a government of any colour, blind Tory hater.

What's blind about it?

The Tories (not just "boris") are accountable. Successive tory governments are to blame for systemic underfunding and ignoring repeated warnings.

That's not blind - those are reasons.

The only blindness here is the blind eye you're turning to successive Tory failures that have led directly to the deaths of front line staff and thousands of the public.

Anything but labour tho eh? They're "mad" on spending, after all...

 

[~Yuckfou~]

@Embattle you are going to wear that button out.
You've not watched the program have you, go do it, educate yourself.
I'll facepalm this post to save you the bother.

Edit. Can't, won't let me, go for it.

 

[Job]

Every country is attacking their leaders for not being prepared, even in Germany.

Its just the standard 'its...insert present government....fault.'

We are doing OK by comparison, there is a global shortage of PPE and masks.

 

[~Yuckfou~]

Every country is attacking their leaders for not being prepared, even in Germany.

Its just the standard 'its...insert present government....fault.'

We are doing OK by comparison, there is a global shortage of PPE and masks.

Sweet Jesus
Have you watched the program?
Simple question, you can answer it yes or no.

 

[Scouse]

He doesn't understand the concepts of "planning" and "negligence" yuck old bean.

 

[Embattle]

He doesn't understand the concepts of "planning" and "negligence" yuck old bean.

Well if he watched Labour at the last election he does

 

[~Yuckfou~]

He doesn't understand the concepts of "planning" and "negligence" yuck old bean.

I just want to know if he's watched it. If he has and still has the same views then..
If he hasn't then he's not qualified to comment tbh.

 

[~Yuckfou~]

Thought Corona was bad? Wait until we get Carlsberg.

 

[Bodhi]

German doctors pose naked in protest at PPE shortages

BLOODY TOAIRESDS!"!"!"!"!!"

 

[~Yuckfou~]

German doctors pose naked in protest at PPE shortages

BLOODY TOAIRESDS!"!"!"!"!!"

You didn't watch it either did you?

I know other countries have fucked up. Not all the other countries lied to the public though. Nor are other countries fuck ups an apology for the UKs. It's not a "Yo mama" situation.

 

[Bodhi]

You didn't watch it either did you?

I know other countries have fucked up. Not all the other countries lied to the public though. Nor are other countries fuck ups an apology for the UKs. It's not a "Yo mama" situation.

I didn't no - I tend not to spend my time watching short films directly by family members of Labour MP's - did they speak to the Army at all? As they seem fairly unequivocal in where the supply issues lie:

Coronavirus: Army 'appalled' at NHS planning amid PPE shortage | Metro News

The fact that most NHS Trusts seems to be doing absolutely fine does suggest it is a localised Trust issue, but then you wouldn't expect the BBC to look into that much detail - we might even find out the NHS isn't perfect.

 

[Talivar]

I really do think people here and elsewhere have turned this into a childish tribal tit for tat and the actual people dieing seem to be almost an after thought.

 

[~Yuckfou~]

You are trying to write a review of a book you haven't read.
Your opinion is null and void.
Watch it and we can talk.

 

[~Yuckfou~]

My last post was for @Bodhi, you ninjad me.

I really do think people here and elsewhere have turned this into a childish tribal tit for tat and the actual people dieing seem to be almost an after thought.

The program points out "why" peeps in the NHS have been dieing. The tory supporters just seem to be putting their fingers in their ears and going LaLaLa.
It's almost as if they are frightened they could be wrong.

 

[Talivar]

I work with NHS services as my own role is within Childrens Mental Health and something needed to change funding wise before Covid even hit. Now it will need to change even more and it is something all parties will need to agree to as i think the after effects of this outbreak are going to last for many years to come. Even more so if the rumblings are true and the virus has possibly adapted and is now hitting children harder.

 

[Bodhi]

My last post was for @Bodhi, you ninjad me.



The program points out "why" peeps in the NHS have been dieing. The tory supporters just seem to be putting their fingers in their ears and going LaLaLa.
It's almost as if they are frightened they could be wrong.

I'll assume you missed the report I posted a few pages ago which looked into why people who work for the NHS had been sadly passing away. Based on some actual scientific research, it suggested that NHS staff were not dying at a higher rate than the general population - if they were being sent into a war zone with dodgy equipment this would not be the case.

But then I have a couple of family members working in the NHS - both suggest they are fine for PPE as their Trust has been on the ball in making sure they have what they need. Other trusts, not so much.

 

[~Yuckfou~]

I'll assume you missed the report I posted a few pages ago which looked into why people who work for the NHS had been sadly passing away. Based on some actual scientific research, it suggested that NHS staff were not dying at a higher rate than the general population - if they were being sent into a war zone with dodgy equipment this would not be the case.

But then I have a couple of family members working in the NHS - both suggest they are fine for PPE as their Trust has been on the ball in making sure they have what they need. Other trusts, not so much.

Lalalalalala

 

[~Yuckfou~]

Facepalm, awesome arguement.

 

[Talivar]

The report is flawed though as the statistics used are for all deaths in Hospitals so it stands to reason the rates should be the same for staff and general population as they all dieing in the same place and it is hard to tell if staff infected patients or other way around or did they catch it elsewhere. An example is how some ill staff have been sent home to recover and then died at home and will not be part of the statistics. For all reports on both sides of the argument i think the truth is going to take years and many many research projects

 

[~Yuckfou~]

The report is flawed though as the statistics used are for all deaths in Hospitals so it stands to reason the rates should be the same for staff and general population as they all dieing in the same place and it is hard to tell if staff infected patients or other way around or did they catch it elsewhere. An example is how some ill staff have been sent home to recover and then died at home and will not be part of the statistics. For all reports on both sides of the argument i think the truth is going to take years and many many research projects

Jeez dude don't go making sensible arguments, you'll confuse them.

 

[Bodhi]

Facepalm, awesome arguement.

I tailor my arguments to those I receive, lalalalala boy.

 

[Bodhi]

The report is flawed though as the statistics used are for all deaths in Hospitals so it stands to reason the rates should be the same for staff and general population as they all dieing in the same place and it is hard to tell if staff infected patients or other way around or did they catch it elsewhere. An example is how some ill staff have been sent home to recover and then died at home and will not be part of the statistics. For all reports on both sides of the argument i think the truth is going to take years and many many research projects

The report I was referring to discussed all deaths of Health Care workers, and did not differentiate between where they died.

Exclusive: deaths of NHS staff from covid-19 analysed

You can read it again if you're struggling.

 

[Talivar]

Table 1. The characteristics of 106 cases of deaths of UK health and social care workers from coronavirus-19 as reported in the media up to 22 April 2020
The black dots represent cumulative daily deaths as reported by Public Health England and equivalent agencies of devolved nations and the red dots represent cumulative deaths of health and social care workers reported in the media.
I bolded the important parts for you as i doubt you have actually bothered to read the report yourself. The ONS statistics as of today have only reached upto April 17th and they are the most upto date stats and unlike the PHE stats they are the only ones to include deaths outside of the Hospital. So they did not have all the available data, maybe it is you that is struggling.

 

[~Yuckfou~]

I tailor my arguments to those I receive, lalalalala boy.

Lalalalalalala

 

[Bodhi]

Table 1. The characteristics of 106 cases of deaths of UK health and social care workers from coronavirus-19 as reported in the media up to 22 April 2020
The black dots represent cumulative daily deaths as reported by Public Health England and equivalent agencies of devolved nations and the red dots represent cumulative deaths of health and social care workers reported in the media.
I bolded the important parts for you as i doubt you have actually bothered to read the report yourself. The ONS statistics as of today have only reached upto April 17th and they are the most upto date stats and unlike the PHE stats they are the only ones to include deaths outside of the Hospital. So they did not have all the available data, maybe it is you that is struggling.

I read the part of the report which said:

Tim Cook and Simon Lennane were, until 12 April, separately collating this data, independent of each other. On discovering this, the two data sets, which were very similar, were combined. Over subsequent days the data was verified and added to. A case was considered fully confirmed when a minimum of three separate news outlets and one social media outlet had confirmed details.

So the numbers they are using to classify a health care worker death are nothing to do with ONS, or PHE figures - neither of which offer a breakdown by profession anyway as far as I'm aware - and if a death of a health care professional is reported in the media, then it is added to the report. No mention of hospital deaths only for the red line you mention, just that there had been more than one news story on it.

You can compare healthcare deaths to the ONS number if you like, but that just makes it look even more favourable for those on the frontline.

 

[Talivar]

So basically they are using news channels and social media as their information source, i.e it is flawed as that is not a comprehensive or reliable source of all the staff worker deaths. It does not take into account the families who do not want that information made public ect. The fact you are trying really hard to play down the deaths of these people makes you come across as a bit of a prat tbh.

 

[~Yuckfou~]

So basically they are using news channels and social media as their information source, i.e it is flawed as that is not a comprehensive or reliable source of all the staff worker deaths. It does not take into account the families who do not want that information made public ect. The fact you are trying really hard to play down the deaths of these people makes you come across as a bit of a prat tbh.

Branding a BBC Panorama report as fake news without knowing it's content or even watching it has already showed him to be "a bit of a prat" tbh.