Politics Coronavirus

Raven

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Really?

That might why we're talking about other countries not allowing their stocks to exported.

Jesus.
But. Why should we export to the EU over any other country? The EU have made it absolutely clear (and still do) that we are a third country, like any other. We are one of the largest donators to the fund set up to help poorer nations, not supposedly superior nations that would rather play fuck-about. Poorer nations are by far and away more deserving than the EU, the EU have every resource available and already have stockpiles that they simply aren't using, they don't need more.
 

Raven

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Strategically it would probably make sense to help the EU but I don't think anyone expected them to get it this wrong. I imagine when all this was getting moving we assumed they wouldn't be in this mess.
 

Gwadien

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But. Why should we export to the EU over any other country? The EU have made it absolutely clear (and still do) that we are a third country, like any other. We are one of the largest donators to the fund set up to help poorer nations, not supposedly superior nations that would rather play fuck-about.
I agree, the EU shouldn't have priority.

But let's face it, our negotiation position with the EU is 'They're ours, give them to us' not 'OK, let's sort something out and then prioritise helping out other countries too'.

Yeah, we are contributing quite a bit, and I'm definitely not down-playing the work our pharma boys have done and we're helping other countries also produce their own.

You may consider it bluster, but I do think having an international pandemic/vaccine organisation is a pretty excellent idea.

Let's look at it from a non philanthropic perspective; covid may actually encourage people from all over the world to build a bridge across the channel, let alone boats.
 

Raven

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Yes, but we actually need them because we are using them. The countries in the EU aren't. They already have more than enough for their needs.

Look at it this way, in a couple of months we will have vaccinated everyone. The EU will still be fucking about in the over 50s. We can advise them on how to be less shit and also supply them.
 

Gwadien

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Yes, but we actually need them because we are using them. The countries in the EU aren't. They already have more than enough for their needs.

Look at it this way, in a couple of months we will have vaccinated everyone. The EU will still be fucking about in the over 50s. We can advise them on how to be less shit and also supply them.
But vaccinating everyone whilst having very vulnerable people elsewhere = more death.

I think it's more of a case of the EU not having a clue what's happening on the ground and flailing to find a solution, I am not and never have absolved them of all blame.

But again, let's use Italy as an example, their last breakout literally triggered the world into lockdown so it's clear that they don't have the infrastructure to cope, does that mean we punish the people, because I'm sure we will see a pretty similar repeat fiasco if it happens again

Or is this about saving UK lives?
 

Scouse

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But vaccinating everyone whilst having very vulnerable people elsewhere = more death.
The point Raven is making is this:

The EU have a stack of vaccines that they've not used yet - and the rate that they're using them means they won't need more for a while. So why give them to the EU just to sit in a fridge?

We can use them
- and when we're done, we divert the rest to the EU.
 

Raven

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But vaccinating everyone whilst having very vulnerable people elsewhere = more death.

I think it's more of a case of the EU not having a clue what's happening on the ground and flailing to find a solution, I am not and never have absolved them of all blame.

But again, let's use Italy as an example, their last breakout literally triggered the world into lockdown so it's clear that they don't have the infrastructure to cope, does that mean we punish the people, because I'm sure we will see a pretty similar repeat fiasco if it happens again

Or is this about saving UK lives?
But. They are not using the vaccines they have, why send them more? The problem is not vaccine quantity, it is distribution and delivery into people's arms.

So while they are playing silly buggers we can just carry on getting ourselves sorted. We can then focus on further development and world distribution. Which is going to be a huge benefit for all and actually something we are very well positioned to do with all the Big Pharma around Cambridge and so on.
 

Raven

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Edit, here is one for the nutters.

The UK released the virus knowing we could cure it and build an entire vaccine development industry around to make up for Brexit.

I might tweet David Icke later
 

Gwadien

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But. They are not using the vaccines they have, why send them more? The problem is not vaccine quantity, it is distribution and delivery into people's arms.

So while they are playing silly buggers we can just carry on getting ourselves sorted. We can then focus on further development and world distribution. Which is going to be a huge benefit for all and actually something we are very well positioned to do with all the Big Pharma around Cambridge and so on.
You're absolutely right.

But the problem is that the EU is blocking them from leaving, and I don't think our Government's pretty smug approach is beneficial, how can we help out now to make things smoother?

Let's not kid ourselves, our success is good for us and pretty humiliating for the EU, politically speaking.
 

Moriath

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You're absolutely right.

But the problem is that the EU is blocking them from leaving, and I don't think our Government's pretty smug approach is beneficial, how can we help out now to make things smoother?

Let's not kid ourselves, our success is good for us and pretty humiliating for the EU, politically speaking.
whoch is good. If they havent used the ones we sent then we use them ourselves and once we done ship them over. We ordered way too many so i am sure they will be distributed once we have our population vaccinated.

giving everyone the same ratio’d number of vaccines would lead to the same number of infected / deaths all being equal.

and it costs more carbon to ship the, further than where they are being made anyway.
 

Embattle

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Didn't see too many people when I popped out today to give my motorcycle some road time, although there were plenty of Bradley Wiggins wannabes on the A396 :p
 

Bodhi

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In all honesty, as a healthy 40 year old who has already had the Rona, I would be far more comfortable if my shots went to someone vulnerable in another country who needed it. However, thanks to incoming vaccine passports to go to the pub and the fact the human immune system doesn't seem to be a thing any more, I guess I'll have to have the pointless monkey snot! Yay! Although I have seen rumoured antibody tests will work for that too, so hmmm.

Oh and as an aside, I have a message for whoever came up with the idea of domestic vaccine passports:

Fuck right off, as far as you can, then when you get there, fuck off even further. After you've done that you can come back, but only as long as you fuck off again as soon as you do. Oh and by the way - fuck off. Fucking fantastic way to create multiple privacy issues and create a two-tier society (bearing in mind it needs a smartphone, and 15% of adults don't have one of those). Temperature checks on entry to make sure I'm not ill? Absolutely fine, we're just coming out of a pandemic after all. Sharing medical history with random bouncers so I can have a pint? Get fucked.
 

Gwadien

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Aye.

The thing we don't think about is the effects after we're all vaccinated and happy.

People come to the UK to have a baby on the NHS? How about coming to the UK to try to get a vaccine.

I reckon we will see gun boats in the channel before the decade is out.
 

Raven

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So long as they have a portrait of the queen in their cabin then I am OK with that.
 

Yoni

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Aye.

The thing we don't think about is the effects after we're all vaccinated and happy.

People come to the UK to have a baby on the NHS? How about coming to the UK to try to get a vaccine.

I reckon we will see gun boats in the channel before the decade is out.
I think you will find for the right amount of cash there are already people going to the UK to get their vaccines....
 

Moriath

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I think you will find for the right amount of cash there are already people going to the UK to get their vaccines....
There was that labour councillor who got a private jab paid for by her daughter and it came out. She had to resign and the private doctors were investigated. Because its actually illegal for anyone but the nhs to give them. But rich will always buy a way.
 

Yoni

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There was that labour councillor who got a private jab paid for by her daughter and it came out. She had to resign and the private doctors were investigated. Because its actually illegal for anyone but the nhs to give them. But rich will always buy a way.
I have heard of several people now with either dual passports or resident status in the UK, but not currently living there due to CV19 who have now been vaccinated...
 

SilverHood

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Just got my vaccine appointment confirmed... May 14th. Second shot 21 days later. That seems like an eternity away. Ah well, I should have both shots in time for the summer :)
 

Moriath

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I have heard of several people now with either dual passports or resident status in the UK, but not currently living there due to CV19 who have now been vaccinated...
How did they get a vaccine from the uk if they are not living here atm?
 

Moriath

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Raven

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30 in 18 million. vs however many you would normally find in 18 million people.

Still, at least it's worth completely destroying any confidence in vaccination.
 

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