Politics Coronavirus

[Yoni]

Did you check or is this another non factual statement from the person who is only interested in the facts oO again over 2k deaths is at least 8% higher than the highest number of deaths recorded in a day.... yay for exaggeration to suit your own rhetoric....

 

[Scouse]

Did you check or is this another non factual statement from the person who is only interested in the facts oO again over 2k deaths is at least 8% higher than the highest number of deaths recorded in a day.... yay for exaggeration to suit your own rhetoric....

Oh do piss off. I've had pages of well-evidenced, linked clear data in arguments with him. So I took a stab at around 2000 a day when I was getting fucked off.

If that's all you've got to moan about then you're wasting your time - because even if daily covid deaths were one fifth of that it would still massively outstrip his worst-case bullshit figures (which you're completely uncritical of).

I get it. I was critical of Sweden last June. And you've been like a dog with a bone ever since. But Bodhi is talking shit.

 

[Yoni]

No you need to get of your high horse and stop being such a sanctimonious cockbadger... I will continue to pull you up with every single error non factual piece of information or over exaggeration you post until you recognise what a dick you have become.

 

[Yoni]

96 percent of the 370 people who had antibodies in the spring of 2020 still have protection after nine months, according to the study Community from Danderyd Hospital and Karolinska Institutet. Two-thirds also had a measured T-cell memory specific for the covid-19 virus. - We can see that even mild symptoms give a long-lasting and broad immune system. There has been uncertainty about whether an individual with antibodies can carry the virus and transmit the infection without having any symptoms themselves, but that risk seems to be very small, says Charlotte Thålin, specialist doctor and responsible for the study in a press release. During a ten-week period, 340 participants were also tested with antibodies weekly and the virus could then only be detected in 3 people. 2% of those who did not have antibodies appear to have evidence of a T cell memory specific for the covid-19 virus. The community study began over three weeks in April and May when 2,149 employees at Danderyd Hospital were tested. 19.1 percent of these then had antibodies and have since continued to be tested and a partial result from the end of October showed that 82 percent then had measurable antibody levels left - now 40 percent have undergone the disease.

 

[Scouse]

No you need to get of your high horse and stop being such a sanctimonious cockbadger... I will continue to pull you up with every single error non factual piece of information or over exaggeration you post until you recognise what a dick you have become.

Do the same to Bodhi and I'd have a little respect for that, but he fits with your worldview that lockdowns are bad.

So I'll continue to watch you blindly worship Sweden, fail to pull people up on obvious bullshit and care less that you think I'm a dick because I stand my ground when I'm right.

If you have data to show I'm wrong then I'd happily apologise and shut the fuck up, go away and amend my position.

But until then I'll use Freddyshouse as I have done for 20+ years - a free exchange of ideas and an absolute calling people on their bullshit. Especially someone who's consistently been calling for the end of a life-saving lockdown just so he can go the pub.

All the time giving very few fucks what people think of me. Because I trust the majority to realise I only care about what's right.

 

[Bodhi]

1) no he hasn't. He changed his tune from mental health to non-covid excess death
2) it makes fuck all difference anyway

It's almost as if shutting down society creates more than one area of collateral damage! Who ever coulda thunk that eh?

 

[Gwadien]

@Yoni I do find it a bit odd that you told someone before not to lecture you about Sweden as you live there and they don't.

You seem to be able to lecture about other places outside Sweden though.

 

[Scouse]

It's almost as if shutting down society creates more than one area of collateral damage! Who ever coulda thunk that eh?

I think everyone thunk it. It's kinda obvious.

But the collateral damage is worth it, m'kay?

 

[Yoni]

I’m not lecturing Scouse on the UK I am correcting his facts about the numbers he presented and also his ignorance re non cv19 deaths

 

[Bodhi]

View attachment 43817


96 percent of the 370 people who had antibodies in the spring of 2020 still have protection after nine months, according to the study Community from Danderyd Hospital and Karolinska Institutet. Two-thirds also had a measured T-cell memory specific for the covid-19 virus. - We can see that even mild symptoms give a long-lasting and broad immune system. There has been uncertainty about whether an individual with antibodies can carry the virus and transmit the infection without having any symptoms themselves, but that risk seems to be very small, says Charlotte Thålin, specialist doctor and responsible for the study in a press release. During a ten-week period, 340 participants were also tested with antibodies weekly and the virus could then only be detected in 3 people. 2% of those who did not have antibodies appear to have evidence of a T cell memory specific for the covid-19 virus. The community study began over three weeks in April and May when 2,149 employees at Danderyd Hospital were tested. 19.1 percent of these then had antibodies and have since continued to be tested and a partial result from the end of October showed that 82 percent then had measurable antibody levels left - now 40 percent have undergone the disease.

That is incredibly positive news, but unfortunately requires an understanding of the human immune system so might get lost in all the statistical terrorism sadly. Patients who recovered from SARS 1 have been shown to have good T-Cell response 17 years after infection, so if we get even half of that protection - through vaccines or infection - we are going to be in an incredibly good place.

Even better news is that the vaccine effect is starting to show up in the UK Antibody surveys. It's a shame we don't look deeper on these and evaluate T-Cell prevalence also, as that's where the real magic happens, but this is a great first step.


View: https://twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1361617005971914752?s=20


Not sure what's going on in Wales mind. They're probably still trying to figure out what that big frozen crate that's been sitting in Cardiff for 3 months is for.

 

[Scouse]

I’m not lecturing Scouse on the UK I am correcting his facts about the numbers he presented and also his ignorance re non cv19 deaths

There's no ignorance. I'm aware of non-covid deaths (although I'd advise you to be as fastidious with everyone elses 'figures').

My clear and obvious point is that non-covid deaths are a fraction of covid death and those saved by lockdown.

Show me I'm wrong...

 

[Bodhi]

I think everyone thunk it. It's kinda obvious.

But the collateral damage is worth it, m'kay?

Well if it's quite obvious that will probably explain why I'm raising different issues then isn't it. Duh.

Oh and on your last point, in fact most of your points, that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

So I'm just going to say, no it isn't - and frankly I think it's bordering on the inhumane to suggest that it is.

 

[Yoni]

It is good news about vaccine in UK mum has had her 1st and her 2nd is next week. My two brothers and eldest sister are due soon also
either for risk or age. I will not have mine until
June which is ok - I am not planning on leaving Stockholm until August and then it will be to a cabin by a lake in Sweden...

 

[Bodhi]

Good read on the Beeb this morning:

Covid: Why goal is to live with the virus - not fight it

Ministers want to turn Covid-19 into a manageable illness like flu. Why? And is this possible?

www.bbc.co.uk

Probably the most notable part of it, is just how little the Public Health wonk who appear on the TV all the time actually know about viruses. Prime example is Devi, the poster child for the Zero COVID movement, who can't figure out the difference between small pox and measles (stable viruses with obvious symptoms) and a respiratory illness (mutates, albeit slower than flu, can be asymptomatic).

 

[Gwadien]

Anyone that advocates for lockdown = idiot ammirite?

 

[Scouse]

Not sure what's going on in Wales mind. They're probably still trying to figure out what that big frozen crate that's been sitting in Cardiff for 3 months is for.

Neither am I - Wales is ahead of the rest of the UK in rollout.

Well if it's quite obvious that will probably explain why I'm raising different issues then isn't it.

And they make no material difference.

You keep changing your tack, but absolutely nothing you've brought to the table shows that lockdowns should be stopped.

 

[Yoni]

No one is saying that - more consideration however needs to be given to growing mental issues, which although were already there, are now growing at a higher rate due to the restrictions set by governments.

Self-harm among young children in UK doubles in six years

Finding comes as experts highlight huge impact of Covid-19 pandemic on young people’s mental health

www.google.se

I do not have kids so I can not imagine how terrible it must be to be a parent to find out they have with a kid / kids who resort to self-harm.... I can imagine that the pressure can mean that families end up in a perpetual viscous circle eventually ending up with the kids feeling even worse and god forbid taking their own lives....

 

[Scouse]

No one is saying that

Bodhi is.

If you're going to weigh into an argument and start criticizing someone it's usually common courtesy to figure out what the argument is actually about first and then pay attention to what people are actually saying rather than what you feel about them.

 

[Bodhi]

Neither am I - Wales is ahead of the rest of the UK in rollout.

And they make no material difference.

You keep changing your tack, but absolutely nothing you've brought to the table shows that lockdowns should be stopped.

Glad you think suicides, business failures, self-harming kids, missed cancer and other diagnoses and all the other factors currently tearing people's lives apart make "no material difference". Some of us are a little more compassionate than that, strangely enough.

Anyway lockdowns are a blunt and not particularly effective tool to try to stop transmission of a disease, that cause a shitload more problems than they solve. That's why, for a period of almost 100 years up until February 2020, they weren't even considered as a public health response.

Sweden, Florida, South Dakota and Japan all show that it is possible to get through this without incarcerating healthy people. They should be the examples held up here in how to manage a pandemic, not a couple of islands in the Pacific and an authoritarian one party communist state that likes putting people in concentration camps because they follow the wrong sky fairy.

 

[Scouse]

Glad you think suicides, business failures, self-harming kids, missed cancer and other diagnoses and all the other factors currently tearing people's lives apart make "no material difference". Some of us are a little more compassionate than that, strangely enough.

No. I know you like to do your best to paint me as a massive cunt, but to repeat myself one last time - that is all horrible.

But less bad than actual death. So suck it up.

 

[Scouse]

Oh. And lol. Sweden.

The only reason you like them as a model is that they didn't lock down.

 

[Bodhi]

No. I know you like to do your best to paint me as a massive cunt, but to repeat myself one last time - that is all horrible.

But less bad than actual death. So suck it up.

Suicides less bad than actual death? You what mate?

The rest are all awful as well, mostly as they tend to lead to "actual" deaths too.

 

[Ormorof]

Isnt the Florida data notoriously unreliable? The governor has been doing everything in his power to prevent scientists from publishing the real numbers. Or was that another dystopian state in US?

 

[Ormorof]

And South Dakota is 6th for per capita deaths in US not exactly a shining example

 

[Bodhi]

Oh. And lol. Sweden.

The only reason you like them as a model is that they didn't lock down.

I'd probably rather have spent the last year in Sweden rather than the UK if that's what you mean - although right now Florida is probably looking even more attractive (no offence @Yoni but their weather is nicer )

 

[Bodhi]

Isnt the Florida data notoriously unreliable? The governor has been doing everything in his power to prevent scientists from publishing the real numbers. Or was that another dystopian state in US?

Citation needed.

The only cover up in the US I am aware of is NYC Governer Cuomo and his attempt to sweep nursing home deaths under the carpet, he might have to return his Emmy at this rate....

 

[Ormorof]

Also considering you have spent the last decade of discussion about mental health support being cut in UK with the attitude of "im alright jack" i find this Bodhi Champion of mental health a bit hard to take seems a bit rich but hey that stance supports your argument so go for it

It was Florida

Armed police raid home of Florida scientist fired over Covid-19 data

Rebekah Jones claims Governor Ron DeSantis, with whom she has clashed repeatedly since her dismissal in May, was involved

www.theguardian.com

 

[Scouse]

Suicides less bad than actual death? You what mate?

The rest are all awful as well, mostly as they tend to lead to "actual" deaths too.

There hasn't been a massive uptick in suicide. Say the experts.

Try again.

 

[Ormorof]

And Sweden in Jan had more daily deaths from Corona than most of its neighbours had daily infections, so again hardly a shining example

 

[Scouse]

And Sweden in Jan had more daily deaths from Corona than most of its neighbours had daily infections, so again hardly a shining example

Yep.

And:

hey that stance supports your argument so go for it

Funny thing though - that stance undermines his argument because non-existent suicides shouldn't take priority over loads of actual deaths