animst ninja nerf

Aiteal

Can't get enough of FH
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latest live US server patch

Animists

The number of Animist Turrets which can be cast within a 1500 unit radius has been reduced from 100 to a maximum of 30 turrets.

they kept that quiet till the last minute ;)
 

Groal

Fledgling Freddie
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Dec 22, 2003
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cos of all the fecking shrooms in laby laggin it up imo :p
 

eble@work

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Animists must be very popular in the US, you dont see many in RVR on English cluster infact, I'd say at most is 3-4 I've ever seen at once, the normal 2-3 trying to get MCL at crauch and the one high RR one :) Horlely


Eble
 

Phule_Gubben

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It's a start, just want em to adjust em some more, like. When ani dies, shrooms does too. That would be nice.
 

Andrilyn

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Phule_Gubben said:
It's a start, just want em to adjust em some more, like. When ani dies, shrooms does too. That would be nice.

Yeah apply that to theurg also then :p
 

Kagato

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Yup, cause 30 turrets wont kill anything :eek7:

On a more serious note, it should help the lag a fair bit during the bigger sieges.
 

charmangle

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Kagato said:
Yup, cause 30 turrets wont kill anything :eek7:

On a more serious note, it should help the lag a fair bit during the bigger sieges.

Ofc 30 turrents placed on the same spot is still dangerous, but thats not how it will work. 30 turrents = 2 anmists placing turrents, rest will get the message they cant in en entire keep.

So someone places turrents in the courtyard, that means you will have almost nill turrents inside at the lord or something like that...

In my opinion (and if you look back at my previous arguments about animists, im one of those that have argued most ferverly for this.) this nerf is way to harsh.

It will most certainly lower lag etc, but it will also make animists almost useless in defences.

Not sure how much would be a sufficiant nerf, but taking away 70% of the shrooms in an area is way to harsh!:/ (maybe 25%-40% would have been enough?)

/Charmangle
 

dex

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a way to get around that would be 30 ani´s with 30 main pets up
lol
 

Kagato

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charmangle said:
Ofc 30 turrents placed on the same spot is still dangerous, but thats not how it will work. 30 turrents = 2 anmists placing turrents, rest will get the message they cant in en entire keep.

So someone places turrents in the courtyard, that means you will have almost nill turrents inside at the lord or something like that...

In my opinion (and if you look back at my previous arguments about animists, im one of those that have argued most ferverly for this.) this nerf is way to harsh.

It will most certainly lower lag etc, but it will also make animists almost useless in defences.

Not sure how much would be a sufficiant nerf, but taking away 70% of the shrooms in an area is way to harsh!:/ (maybe 25%-40% would have been enough?)

/Charmangle

The thing is, your not taking the life duration of the turrets into account.

By the time the siege moves from the courtyard to the lord room you'd of gone through several life cycles of the turrets which is more then enough time to organise all new turrets in the lord room.

Im not saying the nerf isn't harsh, it is a heavy yet much needed nerf, however it will by no means make anamists useless either and in most common, small encounters the nerf wont even be felt at all.
 

Danord_durin

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Kagato said:
The thing is, your not taking the life duration of the turrets into account.

By the time the siege moves from the courtyard to the lord room you'd of gone through several life cycles of the turrets which is more then enough time to organise all new turrets in the lord room.

Im not saying the nerf isn't harsh, it is a heavy yet much needed nerf, however it will by no means make anamists useless either and in most common, small encounters the nerf wont even be felt at all.


Why is it so needed ? 1 zombie can kill all turrets easily then the mighty alb zeg can jus move in after. Isent that what u allways do anyhow.

But its a heavy pve nerf for the allready on most servers under populated realm.

And now we are at the pet nerf thing take away 70% of a life cyrcle on theug pets and make a limit to how many they can have out at the same time.

Have a nice day Kagato u retard
 

Danord_durin

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On a side note they could apply the fix only to work in pvp zones to make it slighty less damaging:)
 

Kagato

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Danord_durin said:
Why is it so needed ? 1 zombie can kill all turrets easily then the mighty alb zeg can jus move in after. Isent that what u allways do anyhow.

But its a heavy pve nerf for the allready on most servers under populated realm.

And now we are at the pet nerf thing take away 70% of a life cyrcle on theug pets and make a limit to how many they can have out at the same time.

Have a nice day Kagato u retard

lol, I disagree with you so that makes me a retard? grow up, silly child.

And if you make theurgist pets have same life span as an anamist turret i'll gladly except the same limitations on the numbers.
 

Shike

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silly nerf imo, the 2nd loscheck woulda been enough, that 2nd loscheck is what have been asked for for ages and that nerf was 100% justified. Now if its 5 anis in a keep they will be able to cast 6 pets each which is ridicilous.

for pve its not particularly nice at all to nerf this, especially since hibb is underpopulated here and there. I do hope they put in a cap on theurgpets aswell in the very same manner for the fairness of things.
 

Tesla Monkor

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Missy has already commented on the case and said that it is part of a larger collection of changes to Animists in 1.88, and that this wasn't meant to go live just yet, but they couldn't be bothered to rollback. Some developer was apparantly already working on the class when his code ended up in 1.87J.

There's more changes up in 1.88 for Animists. No doubt they'll get the same level of fixing that the bonedancers got (for good or bad!).
 

Gahn

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Wondering what they will get in exchange ... oh wait nothing as usual.
So they are stuck to have no form of reliable cc, only fucking lt caster without a level 50 lifetap, bugged bombers and now they are useless in siege also. gg Mythic!
 

censi

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make me think of Coj the animist in the VGN group. 1 FG of hibbies fighting like 50 albs at amg and holding their own. (mainly cuz the albs were a bit thick)
 

Danord_durin

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Kagato said:
lol, I disagree with you so that makes me a retard? grow up, silly child.

And if you make theurgist pets have same life span as an anamist turret i'll gladly except the same limitations on the numbers.

What makes u a retard i can tell u quite fast, it has nothing to do with u disagreeing with me. It's just ur general attitude here on the forums wich makes u that. :twak:

And u never answered my question regarding how easy it is to counter turrets in sieges did u?
 

Tuppe

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Gahn said:
Wondering what they will get in exchange ... oh wait nothing as usual.
So they are stuck to have no form of reliable cc, only fucking lt caster without a level 50 lifetap, bugged bombers and now they are useless in siege also. gg Mythic!


hmm Bone dont have lvl 50 LT.
 

Cromcruaich

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If that ends up in it's to big a nerf. Sincerely hope its for rvr only if it does get in, as a lot of people have rolled animists just for pve.

Shrooms are easier to deal with than monster rez, but if it makes sieges less laggy then its worth it, also stop people just spamming bridges with em and killing all the solo and skirmish rvr in the area as enemy too shit scared to get close. Nothing irritates me more than an animist running up and shitting dd turrets all over the place where ive been soloing.
 

Gahn

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Tuppe said:
hmm Bone dont have lvl 50 LT.

Correct it's level 47 and returns 80% life against a level 45 that returns 50% tho.
 

Nate

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Haha you silly other realmers are so jealous of our COTS now aren't you ! AREN'T YOU!!!! What will you do smelly hibbies without 1milliongajillion turrets to our so overpowered COTS! <uses cots and ends this thread>


SS of a couple of thanes and a valk using COTS!
 

cmr

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1000 range would have made more sense seeing as though thats the range the turrets can nuke, but when have mythic ever made sense and thought things through. BDs are fixed now imo, hope they dont give them more love for the stupid people that play them now because they dont deserve it.

Animists however, need a 50 delve lifetap, and the damage should be kept energy.... i can see mythicly slightly changing it when they realise how much animists will nuke for on all these gimps with low energy resists, also somthing needs to be done with the bombers, i think just speed up how fast they get to the target and the good old pathing issues. Also it would be an idea to change there damage to energy to be consistant ;) Animists are decent, but as with bainshee and mentalist there downfall is that there are two spots for casters in a hib group mainly and those are taken by eld/chanter.

As for the nerf, another albion whine when they are clueless to deal with the shrooms, ae mezz, couple of ae DDs or monster ress easily deals with them compared to the actual time effort and power it will take to put up a shroom field. Problem is usualy people just busy bolting/lifetapping shit for the rps to actually do what they are supposed to be doing.

Like my animist anyway, camping bridges can be a laugh but gets old..... but always piss funny when kagato runs into the shroom field trying to kill you using rage and getting pwned by strafe powers of doom and Zo use2 xD. Aswell in open field yesterday in 4 man group me and netcode him on bain bombed a fg of albs and when they kept coming back with 1.5fg+ was kiting them in open field with 4 man group because they were to lazy to kill tanglers. Was some nice fun until the 2fg with CM on stick came out on stick..... they disappeared after they wiped on there 1pm relic raid.... mainly because they couldnt see all the casters stood inside there ram while they were using it who was shrooming and using F8 skills!
 

Cromcruaich

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Harping on, but on the pve side, it will seriously penalise hibs and make it very difficult to get pve stuff done on what is an almost critically underpopulated realm. Obviously its completely irrelevant to mythic and duvet hibernia won't be even on their radar.
 

Manisch Depressiv

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Danord_durin said:
And now we are at the pet nerf thing take away 70% of a life cyrcle on theug pets and make a limit to how many they can have out at the same time.

Yeah, Albs need Theurgs so much for PvE... :touch:
 

Andrilyn

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Kagato said:
And if you make theurgist pets have same life span as an anamist turret i'll gladly except the same limitations on the numbers.

Sure make Theurg pets 2 min duration, remove the CC immunity also then (shrooms don't have that) and now their mezzed for 1:10-1:30 min now that 2 min duration doesn't look all that good now does it?
Combine that with the removal of Snare and Stun (once again shrooms don't have those abilities) and make Theurg pets castable from 1500 range and give them a cap of 30 per zone and 15 per Theurg.
I think if they would make Theurg pets exactly the same as Shrooms that it will make alot of Theurgs cry.

Shrooms and LT is the only thing an Animist has in Siege, Bombers are useless as they spaz up and don't go through doors and a siege normally consist of 30+ people even on low pop servers and therefor even 100+ shrooms wouldn't "insta" kill anything as once the zerg storms in they all target a different person and hardly target the same person with multiple shrooms unless the person is going in solo (and then you deserve to die anyway).

Also in open fights (8v8) DD shrooms are generally pointless (low damage 80-125(on capped resists) combined with 3 sec cast speed) so you got to have alot up to even do some minor damage and even then any decent Sorc/Healer will have them mezzed or any decent Runie/Wiz or any DoT class or other AoE caster will have them killed long before they become of any real danger.
Tanglers were nice though in 8v8 but it seems like they bugged those up aswell according to some US reports so they will never ever cast even when kiting a FG through an entire field..

I personally hope they give Animists some major open field love, like Brite already said making the bombers Energy would be a good step in the right direction but making them faster would be a nerf in some point so I'd rather see their range increased and their duration.
Make the Animist root the same as any other caster root (no bombers just a normal root) and make their LT level 50 for less resists and then you would probably be on the right track to somewhat fixing Animists without making them OP in any way.
 

Danord_durin

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Manisch Depressiv said:
Yeah, Albs need Theurgs so much for PvE... :touch:

And where did u read that on there? im just wondering cause i don't think i posted anything regarding theugs in pve did i?
 

charmangle

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Kagato said:
The thing is, your not taking the life duration of the turrets into account.

By the time the siege moves from the courtyard to the lord room you'd of gone through several life cycles of the turrets which is more then enough time to organise all new turrets in the lord room.

Im not saying the nerf isn't harsh, it is a heavy yet much needed nerf, however it will by no means make anamists useless either and in most common, small encounters the nerf wont even be felt at all.

Actually I had already taken that into account, I just didnt think it was worth mentioning...

Putting up turrents takes ALOT of time, getting all 15 placed well and strategically takes way longer than it takes for a zerg to rush the lord...that means that the enemy Zerg will just be facing 5-10 turrents at the lord when they arrive there. (In my opinion that is) The way you normally do it, is you start placing your turrents in an area (lord room for example), and when you get to nr 15 the first ones has already died, so you just keep going, so to keep the 15 turrents maxed you basically need to stand and have them spam summoned from the time you start with your first ones. (this is a give or take a little on the time here depending on duration in template)

So back to my first argument still stands, its not going to be possible to have a zerg face 30 turrents in lord room (or any significant amount) if you first try to make them busy in the courtyard. It might have been a good nerf if they significantly made the areas smaller at the same time, so that you would still have shrooms up on other places just not in the same place...but as it stands, the areas are huge, meaning they basically kill off Animists as defenders...

It is a way to harsh nerf imo, as I said lower it to maybe 60 turrents, but over 50% nerf, thats like making tic monster ress dot based on tic pie/RAs at the same time as removing the interrupt on it. (which would be a good nerf imo)

For PvE, im not sure the Ani nerf makes any real difference, usually 2 anis are enough too lower af on most targets, and for once maybe Hib tanks gets to do something in PvE also...(I know it will be a surprice for them when they halfsleep their way through the raids, but hey its good practice for rvr!:)

For those arguing that its a heavy nerf in PvE, I do think you should have a look at how Mids have to deal with PvE and have had to do it, focus shield takes care of most situations, its just a matter of learning how to use them. And Hib is still superior to mid in this category, since they get focus shield in the same spec as they rvr and dont have to respec to a usless PvE spec for it.

/Charmangle

ps.
Kagato said:
And if you make theurgist pets have same life span as an anamist turret i'll gladly except the same limitations on the numbers.
Does this mean you argue that ani turrents should have stun and 2300 range ?;) ds.
 

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