Politics 2024/25 General Election Voting Intention (2022)

[Embattle]

There's another £17bn of tax rises or public cuts on the horizon for defence spending. Then Labour are fully back on this:

Downing Street ‘exploring plan for digital ID cards’

The ID card would be stored on a smartphone and linked to government records, according to think tank proposals

www.independent.co.uk

Militarized UK and "papers please"?

Facism has never been so cool I guess. Oswald Mosely was a Labour Party member in the end.

Give it

 

[Scouse]

Amazingly (and laughably) from the Guardian!

I really hate to say it, but I agree with JD Vance. Britain has a free speech problem | Arwa Mahdawi

Despite the ongoing crackdown on protesters in Los Angeles, the US constitution (for now) provides far more freedom of speech than there is in the UK, writes Guardian columnist Arwa Mahdawi

www.theguardian.com

 

[Scouse]

How do we feel about Labour fundamentally changing the UK's nuclear stance?

We're going from deployed-at-ses trident weapon-of-last-resort to stocking on-land (painting those areas as strategic targets) "tactical" nuclear warheads, designed to be dropped, dumb, from planes - used during a war.

It's a reversal of our longstanding disarmament agreements and not voted upon by parliament.

How and why is Britain obtaining access to nuclear gravity bombs?

UK purchase of F-35A squadron means US nuclear warheads are likely to be stored on British soil once again

www.theguardian.com

Starmer really is showing Labour's authoritarian teeth right across the policy board isn't he.

 

[Gwadien]

How do we feel about Labour fundamentally changing the UK's nuclear stance?

We're going from deployed-at-ses trident weapon-of-last-resort to stocking on-land (painting those areas as strategic targets) "tactical" nuclear warheads, designed to be dropped, dumb, from planes - used during a war.

It's a reversal of our longstanding disarmament agreements and not voted upon by parliament.

How and why is Britain obtaining access to nuclear gravity bombs?

UK purchase of F-35A squadron means US nuclear warheads are likely to be stored on British soil once again

www.theguardian.com

Starmer really is showing Labour's authoritarian teeth right across the policy board isn't he.

Loooooooooooooooooooool

 

[Scouse]

Loooooooooooooooooooool

I don't really understand what you mean by this. Do you not want to, you know, discuss things on a discussion forum?

When we've changed our nuclear stance previously, parliament have been involved. Even the recent SDR has recommended enhanced parliamentary scrutiny when changing UK nuclear stance. This lack of transparency and oversight has been raised across party lines.

When we renewed trident in 2016, that went to a full parliamentary vote.

But Labour are buying planes, and have agreed to host US nuclear weapons on British soil for the first time in two decades. Without parliamentary scrutiny. What about that makes you laugh?

 

[Deebs]

I don't really understand what you mean by this. Do you not want to, you know, discuss things on a discussion forum?

When we've changed our nuclear stance previously, parliament have been involved. Even the recent SDR has recommended enhanced parliamentary scrutiny when changing UK nuclear stance. This lack of transparency and oversight has been raised across party lines.

When we renewed trident in 2016, that went to a full parliamentary vote.

But Labour are buying planes, and have agreed to host US nuclear weapons on British soil for the first time in two decades. Without parliamentary scrutiny. What about that makes you laugh?

Gotta agree with @Scouse on this, totally wrong for a single party to make that kind of decision that could have long lasting implications which will outlive this current bunch.

 

[Jupitus]

Gotta agree with @Scouse on this, totally wrong for a single party to make that kind of decision that could have long lasting implications which will outlive this current bunch.

Me too - I feel durteh

 

[Embattle]

Seems silly to me.

 

[Scouse]

Next week it'll likely be a jailable offence to unknowingly wear the colours of Palestine Action - a non-violent UK protest group. It will certainly be a criminal offence to express support or sympathy for their non-violent protest action on Freddyshouse. (So watch yourselves).

Starmer's pro-genocide Labour party is the reason for this - the Tories have had ample time to abuse the Labour-written Terrorism legislation but they didn't choose to do so. Now Labour are back in power they're using the legislation they enacted in the exact ways they promised they wouldn't.

Meanwhile, Labour will keep using the planes that Palestine Action sprayed with pink paint to fuel the bombers slaughtering gazans and supplying weapons to a country chock-full of people who think like this:

We are coming. We are coming. We are coming to Gaza. We are coming to Lebanon. We will come to Iran. We will come to every place [...] We will annihilate the enemy. We will return the Middle East to a situation where Arabs are terrified of Jews [...] we will come to annihilate you. To a-n-n-i-h-i-l-a- t-e. Annihilate. Pass this on, share this video so all your friends can see what we are about to do to you,”

So I reiterate - in all seriousness - watch yourselves.

It's dangerous to have a conscience in the UK. Especially when your country is run by a Zionist human rights lawer who expresses support for collective punishment.

 

[Embattle]

You love to use non-violent protest as a get out of prosecution/jail free card, which doesn't generally exist, as there are always exceptions. I live fairly close to two RM bases, the main one has a military person at the entrance with a gun, should the warning signs on the wire fences with razor wire top, plus additional cameras, should that not convince you that trespassing on the base would be unwise and possibly lethal to those that do, all of which is common to the majority of UK military installations.

 

[Scouse]

Very interesting @Embattle.

I mean, utterly irrelevant and off-point, but interesting.

Down with the notorious pink paint terrorists eh! What a nuisence!

 

[Scouse]

...

Home Office staff concerned about ‘absurd’ Palestine Action ban, says senior civil servant

Anonymous source describes ‘tense atmosphere’ after Yvette Cooper announced plans to proscribe protest group

www.theguardian.com

Seems the home office staff disagree too.

 

[Deebs]

You love to use non-violent protest as a get out of prosecution/jail free card, which doesn't generally exist, as there are always exceptions. I live fairly close to two RM bases, the main one has a military person at the entrance with a gun, should the warning signs on the wire fences with razor wire top, plus additional cameras, should that not convince you that trespassing on the base would be unwise and possibly lethal to those that do, all of which is common to the majority of UK military installations.

Same here, all the Army areas are fenced off with razor wire coils at the top and armed soldiers man the entrances. Though much of the Army has now moved out of the garrison and housing has been built on the land but still very clearly defined with notices so yes, climb/cut through the fence and trespass where lethal force can be used - you get what you deserve. It is impossible to wander onto these areas by mistake.

 

[Scouse]

Same here, all the Army areas are fenced off with razor wire coils at the top and armed soldiers man the entrances. Though much of the Army has now moved out of the garrison and housing has been built on the land but still very clearly defined with notices so yes, climb/cut through the fence and trespass where lethal force can be used - you get what you deserve. It is impossible to wander onto these areas by mistake.

This is fuck all to do with it. These guys didn't "wander in by mistake" - they broke in, spray painted a few planes, in non-violent protest against the UK's complicity in genocide.

For the first time ever the UK government has decided to define this sort of non-violent protest terrorism.

If these guys had got shot breaking in my position would have been "how were the army supposed to know? - you take your risks". And they did take those risks.

But then they sprayed some pink paint on a plane, embarrased the UK, and then peacefully left. In a long time-honoured tradtion of non-violent protest.

This isn't terrorism. And those who would like to define it as such? Well, we know what those humans are like.

 

[Deebs]

This is fuck all to do with it. These guys didn't "wander in by mistake" - they broke in, spray painted a few planes, in non-violent protest against the UK's complicity in genocide.

For the first time ever the UK government has decided to define this sort of non-violent protest terrorism.

If these guys had got shot breaking in my position would have been "how were the army supposed to know? - you take your risks". And they did take those risks.

But then they sprayed some pink paint on a plane, embarrased the UK, and then peacefully left. In a long time-honoured tradtion of non-violent protest.

This isn't terrorism. And those who would like to define it as such? Well, we know what those humans are like.

Ok, so you would be happy for non-violent protesters to break into a nuclear power station and spray paint all over the electronics/consoles which could cause severe actions. They broke the law and entered a military complex, fuck em, protest outside the base. They have no reason to be on/inside military bases.

 

[Scouse]

Ok, so you would be happy for non-violent protesters to break into a nuclear power station and spray paint all over the electronics/consoles which could cause severe actions. They broke the law and entered a military complex, fuck em, protest outside the base. They have no reason to be on/inside military bases.

You can make up whatever scenario you like.

It's not fucking terrorism. It never has been.

Obviously, until now.

 

[Lamp]

We need Common Sense politics

Not political parties. You vote on the issues, on doing the right thing, on what real people need every day. Not on vague, out of date party lines.

Every MP is essentially independent. Constituencies are broken down into manageable sizes of 5 to 10 streets. Local representatives listen to the people who then escalate up to the parliamentarian (after collation and filtering)

Local representatives will be paid to listen. If they don't, they're replaced.

A system where stuff actually gets done, not kicked into the long grass. Experts are listened to. Their advice taken. We might look to other nations for inspiration. As long as the right decisions are taken who cares if we nick an idea from Sweden ?

We bring in finance experts who actually know what needs to be done with the nation's balance sheet.

We look to help the weakest and most vulnerable members of society (the elderly, homeless, veterans, the sick) and prioritise them.

We reorganise the NHS and abandon the Trusts and Primary Care infrastructure. Hospitals need doctors, surgeons, nurses, security, guys who change lightbulbs. Not a department of 30 diversity managers in every hospital. We end the contracts where the hospital is paying £200 for a box of photocopy paper. We off-load the bloat, hire the people that matter, build more hospitals, put the GP surgeries back to how they used to be.

We stop giving aid to India. We stop buying guns from Saudi. We rejoin Europe. The country has gone to the dogs since we left the EU.

Re-open police stations. They need to be open 24=7, just like they used to be. Bad people are locked up for their full sentence. Fuck 'em. You give a burglar a 14 year sentence he does 14 years not 7

I could go on.

 

[Scouse]

Palestine Action documentary makers fear being criminalised under anti-terror laws

Exclusive: Directors of To Kill a War Machine take legal advice as Home Office plans to proscribe protest group

www.theguardian.com

 

[Scouse]

Here you go @Embattle - like it was written for you:

Palestine Action spraying paint is not terrorism. As ministers abuse their powers, I feel a duty to speak out | Juliet Stevenson

We have laws to deal with crimes linked to protest. What this is really about is ministers complicit in the Gaza atrocities seeking to silence dissent, says actor Juliet Stevenson

www.theguardian.com

Love to get @Gwadien's take on the current government's actions, but I fear that's too much to hope for.

 

[Gwadien]

I thought I already did, it's ridiculous

 

[Embattle]

Here you go @Embattle - like it was written for you:

Palestine Action spraying paint is not terrorism. As ministers abuse their powers, I feel a duty to speak out | Juliet Stevenson

We have laws to deal with crimes linked to protest. What this is really about is ministers complicit in the Gaza atrocities seeking to silence dissent, says actor Juliet Stevenson

www.theguardian.com

Love to get @Gwadien's take on the current government's actions, but I fear that's too much to hope for.

Nice to see you twist the subject, I never said it was terrorism whereas as you claimed it was non violent protest thus not illegal whereas I said it was.

 

[Scouse]

You said it was what? I never said direct action wasn't illegal - it's criminal damage. But it's not terrorism.

If you want things not to get "twisted" tgen you need to communicate much more clearly - nobody can tell what's going on in your head, so if you don't bother to write things down explicitly then you do yourself, and everyone else, a disservice.

 

[Embattle]

You said it was what? I never said direct action wasn't illegal - it's criminal damage. But it's not terrorism.

If you want things not to get "twisted" tgen you need to communicate much more clearly - nobody can tell what's going on in your head, so if you don't bother to write things down explicitly then you do yourself, and everyone else, a disservice.

You implied it many times with the whingefest you keep serving up about free speech every time some bunch of dipshits block a road, spray paint a multi million pound aircraft and end up getting arrested.

I'm not going to spell out what I don't mean just to please a champagne socialist since it seems highly wasteful use of time, no matter how many times he replies.

 

[Scouse]

That's (one of) your problem - you read implication, not the statement.

 

[BloodOmen]

Quite frankly, any political "Group" who are incapable of protesting in a civil manner should be classified as Terrorist, without exception.

Seeing a lot of utter mental leftist propaganda atm regarding Israel/Gaza/Iran shit atm

The most abhorrent of which i've noticed i people going "There was no murder or rape it was all made up" very much an echo to "The holocaust was fake"

Fucking unhinged people. Hasan Piker (AKA Hasan Abi - Also someone who has publicly gone on record in support of Hamas, not Palestine but Hamas) is a key spewing of this shit and he has what the internet has deemed "Orbiters" AKA braindead fucks who can't think for themselves that have a social media following who push his utter drivel.


The three most braindead fucks who follow this absolute intellectual failure atm are:

Denims
Frogans
KacyTron


My Own Personal View:


Hamas = Scum, they use civilians as human shields because they know it garners media attention - aka "the jews have killed a child!" etc etc
IDF that are killing civilians knowingly = scum, they're just on a warpath atm, indiscriminately killing anyone who aren't Jewish as far as the world news is concerned atm

Palestine in general = innocent
Israel in general = innocent

Fuck them, fuck their politics and fuck their generalizing.

 

[georgie]

Israel in general = innocent

I assume you're not including the Israeli Government there

 

[BloodOmen]

I assume you're not including the Israeli Government there

Nope, pretty much put them in the same camp as the IDF tbh

 

[Scouse]

Funny, according to a poll of Israeli Jews carried out by Pensylvania State University, published in Haaretz - 82% of Israeli's support the forcible and complete explusion of all Palestinians from the Gaza strip.

And:

47 percent of Israeli Jews answered yes to the question: "Do you support the claim that the [Israeli army] in conquering an enemy city, should act in a manner similar to the way the Israelites did when they conquered Jericho under the leadership of Joshua, ie to kill all its inhabitants?"

So, almost all Israelis support 'crimes against humanity', whilst just under half full-throatedly support genocide. With a religious bent, no less.

YMMV.

 

[BloodOmen]

Funny, according to a poll of Israeli Jews carried out by Pensylvania State University, published in Haaretz - 82% of Israeli's support the forcible and complete explusion of all Palestinians from the Gaza strip.

And:



So, almost all Israelis support 'crimes against humanity', whilst just under half full-throatedly support genocide. With a religious bent, no less.

YMMV.

fs :/ warped minds

 

[Scouse]

fs :/ warped minds

Same animal as us. We're just warped in different ways.

We should move this to the Israel/Palestine thread if this continues to be the topic rather than Labour's complicit assistance.