1.60b

[Jiggs]

hmm as an albion player, i'd rather have a healer doing my CC then a sorcerer if such a thing were possible

healer has alot more CC options and also healer's CC are on several diff immunity tables

besides insta > cast in any situation

 

[mavericky]

Originally posted by Jiggs


besides insta > cast in any situation

True, but once those instants on long timers are used, for the next battle there is nothing else. Also in larger battle an instant wont cover everything, the sorc's general faster casting time and greater range will again prove superior. In addition if a healer is spec'd high Pac (CC) then they have poorer heals, and wont get the opportunity to heal anyway as be too busy trying to CC. Albion and Hib have their CC and healing in different classes.

 

[Apathy]

Originally posted by mavericky
Albion and Hib have their CC and healing in different classes.

Hib's CC class can heal too, though.

Using "Albion has CC and healing on different classes" as a point of showing how "uber" Alb is is entirely weak since that exact fact is the reason why Albion has crap healing and crap CC in general RvR; it takes two classes to do the job of one from the other realm.

1875 range is nothing. Giving Sorcerers heals, buffs, instas, chain and CON as a stat that raises with lvl...THAT would be going too far. THAT would be giving us what Hib and Mid have.

a.
*

 

[Flimgoblin]

Originally posted by mavericky

Albion and Hib have their CC and healing in different classes.

Because as we all know if you have 5 pacification healers in midgard you're not allowed to roll any mending ones.

This is an utterly pointless argument people that want to heal roll mend healers, people that want to CC roll pac healers.

 

[granny]

Originally posted by old.Iunliten
Something that makes me wonder though, Buffbot loving?
Ability to make a buffbot with only one computer?

Seems fair to me. No way they'll ever stop people using buffbots, nor would they want to (2 paying accounts from one person? Fantastic \o/ ) - so why not make them accessible to people other than just those with 2 computers? Encourage even more people to voluntarily pay double the monthly fees

 

[Tumult]

nooooooooooo i cant see new hats

 

[old.Trine Aquavit]

A couple of other factors in the mez debate...

You need to spec to 48 Pac for those decent AE instas. The 38 Pac ones are very gimped in comparison. With Healers speccing so high in Pac the realm loses out significantly on:

1. Primary Healing. Clerics and Druid tend to spec significantly higher in their primary healing spec, giving them wider access to, in particular, the new spread heal (which is uber). A 48 Pac specced Healer cannot get the spread heal.

2. Resists. In particular mez resists. Body, Spirit & Energy resists are in Healer Aug line, the least specced Healer line by far. This puts Midgard at a disadvantage, wrt Mez resists compared to Albion (commonly specced Cleric rejuv line) and, especially, Hibernia (very commonly specced Warden nurture line - i.e. pbt line).

To do the job that Midgard wants us to do (as primary CC) we do have to gimp ourselves on the other fronts.

However, we do need to see how it plays out. I think the change is a nice one for the (very) few Mind Sorcs out there, and probably will help game balance.

 

[mavericky]

Originally posted by Flimgoblin


Because as we all know if you have 5 pacification healers in midgard you're not allowed to roll any mending ones.

This is an utterly pointless argument people that want to heal roll mend healers, people that want to CC roll pac healers.

My point was, and I agree I did not make it clear, we do not have many healers in the first place, and the few we have therefore have to try and fullfil a dual role of both being primary healer and primary CC. Take out the healer in the group (if they are lucky enough to have one, as more often that not we wont have one as there arent that many) and you take away not one, but two vital RVR functions

 

[Solid]

Doh double post (dont ask )

 

[old.Ayam Ganbatte]

Originally posted by Jiggs
healer has alot more CC options and also healer's CC are on several diff immunity tables

Stun, root and mesmerise from healers are all body resists if my memory serves me like any self-respecting waiter.

edit: Ah, immunity timers, never mind then.

 

[Solid]

I stand by my point that QC on a short ass 1min (or whatever) timer is FAR more valuable than a once every 20 min Insta thats obtained at the top end of a spec line on the realms primary healing class

Put things into perspective sure:

Albs regularly have ONE line of resists (cleric) up and running in majority of RvR groups at the 16% value usually. Very few friars out there tho and so that second line is not as commonplace

Hibs predominantly have ONE line at 24% (Warden) and ONE at 16-24% (Druid) on 2 very popular classes in the majority of RvR groups

MOST RvR shamans are CAVE spec and so usually have the 8% resists, MOST healers are high Pac/Mend (here is our dual CC/Healing role) LOW Aug and so dont usually have ANY resists tho in RARE cases have 8% ones.

The make up of the classes with resists and the need for the lines other than the resist lines means as far as castable resist buffs go in RvR:

Hib>>>Alb>>>>Mid.

Ask most Mids and unless they have a BuffBot in their group they will tell you they will usually have only 8% resists and more often than not only from ONE of the Seer classes.

I raised this as follow up cos it is directly related to Mez and Durations and plays a major factor.

 

[old.Iunliten]

Originally posted by Solid
I stand by my point that QC on a short ass 1min (or whatever) timer is FAR more valuable than a once every 20 min Insta thats obtained at the top end of a spec line on the realms primary healing class

Put things into perspective sure:

Albs regularly have ONE line of resists (cleric) up and running in majority of RvR groups at the 16% value usually. Very few friars out there tho and so that second line is not as commonplace

Hibs predominantly have ONE line at 24% (Warden) and ONE at 16-24% (Druid) on 2 very popular classes in the majority of RvR groups

MOST RvR shamans are CAVE spec and so usually have the 8% resists, MOST healers are high Pac/Mend (here is our dual CC/Healing role) LOW Aug and so dont usually have ANY resists tho in RARE cases have 8% ones.

The make up of the classes with resists and the need for the lines other than the resist lines means as far as castable resist buffs go in RvR:

Hib>>>Alb>>>>Mid.

Ask most Mids and unless they have a BuffBot in their group they will tell you they will usually have only 8% resists and more often than not only from ONE of the Seer classes.

I raised this as follow up cos it is directly related to Mez and Durations and plays a major factor.

uuum no.

Druids are not running around with 16+ resists more then Shammies or Clerics.

Hib = Alb > Mid in resist department.

And most RvR shammies are buffbots and you know it!

 

[Solid]

Actually no Iunliten most RvR shammies stop at 32 Aug thats end regen 4 and the 3rd best Spec buffs. They also go 41 Cave usually and 14 Mend. When I say RvR shammies I mean thoae that DONT sit in the bloody PK's, I should know my guild has 5+ RvR shammies and ALL are 41+ cave spec no more than 32 Aug

 

[old.Iunliten]

Yes and Why would clerics/druids specc higher?

Most druids get 30:ish nature too.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Good things: Corpse Summoner modifications, hats nice touch, nice things for sorcs. Despite what I'm about to say, I'm actually pleased for you guys since some peeps have explained to me the problems sorcs have had.

1.59 +1.60 = death of dark spec SM. The cloth armour mezzer at the front already dies pretty bloody fast, now we can't even close to attack range if we are attempting to act as main mez for team.

SMs for RvR are now reduced to mana chanters without speed buffs and a ranged pet. We now have 2 lines out of 3 that are not RvR viable instead of just 1.

Way to go you idiots at Mythic. And these twits wonder why there are so few casters from Midgard hitting the frontier these days??? If I wanted to be a mana chanter I'd have rolled a Hib mana chanter. Yay, I've spent a year carefully speccing and building my character (couple of hiccups at start) and its all going to be wiped in 2 patches. Again. Anyone remember me going ballistic at 1.50? 1.52 pretty much fixed it but the great Mythic rollercoaster is off and running again. Only consolation this time is that SMs that have specced or respecced to suppression will not notice much difference.

My character, however, is fucked.

Anyone who's seen me RvR knows I play at the front, attempting to neutralise the enemy rather than going for damage: mez, debuffs and roots. Seems Mythic have decided that I must play at the back and wait til its nice and safe so I can go and pbae the enemy at the appropriate time.

Guess what? I don't have pbae, don't want pbae and have no intention even if I had a respec to change to pbae.

Can anyone spot the unhappy Spirit Master in the crowd?

Everything that was asked for to fix SM summoning line has been put into Bonedancers, Animists(arguably the most imaginative of the new classes) and Necromancers. Now the dark line needs to be fixed as well.

So annoyed, I daren't even attempt this week's subverted Friday News.

Hmm, think I'll go get some cheese to go with this Rioja quality post.

 

[Freia]

Originally posted by Solid
Healers : Chain Armour, Hybrid HP, Pie/Con/Str with Levels

Insta AE Mez (47 Spec Pac)
Range: 1500
Radius: 150
Duration: 31 seconds
Cast Time: Insta
Timer: 20 Min

Make the radius 300. The 150 radius one is at 38 spec and has duration 26 sec. And the timer is 10 minutes =)

Anyway, I am still praying for mid/hib changes to compensate all this stuff....

... right! yeah i forgot the skald will be able to use his uber dd much more now

Edit: PS. Gimme 1.5x spec points for best instamez and sum resistbufs (maybe need to lower lower mend some then, yeah).. then i will be happy anyways

 

[Solid]

Originally posted by old.Iunliten
Yes and Why would clerics/druids specc higher?

Most druids get 30:ish nature too.

In case of Clerics they all bang on about how Smite Sux, hell the servers #1 Cleric (yer Blaen we luv ya still ) specced COMPLETEY out of smite and went high Aug/Mend

as it stands Albs consider Smite as a lame spec line and most of their clerics are very low Smite spec. Most Shamans are HIGH cave spec and so their Aug/Mend spec suffers.

I admit I dont know enuff about Druids and so take ur word that they run round with 8% resists most of the time.

24%+8% on 2 popular classes in Hib still gives you a mjor advantage on the resist dept.

And freia aye I originally took that quote off Gewn who had her 38 Pac details on it, forgot to amend the radius when I changed the details to the top end 47 Pac one. Oops

 

[rynnor]

Woot - the Spiritmaster gets the same changes to life transfer spells as the cabalist...

Oh but wait - thats that spell that I never use in RvR because the spell that makes it usefull (life drain) is in another spec line and the penalties for being mixed spec have recently become crippling...

Oh well

I expect that there will be a Mid patch with an extended range area of effect healer instant stun soon eh??? or not...

 

[Sigurd]

Ah, it'll be good to be a minstrel after 1.60 - so in at least 3 months

 

[shilak]

Think its time midgard got some counter CC loving. Come to think of it Midgard miss out on a lot of damage reduction stuff: -

Albs - Get good magic resists (8-16% on Body/Spirit/Energy from common Cleric spec, 16-24% on Heat/Cold/Matter from common Friar spec), Purge and mezz resistance from Sorc Mind spec. Also get Plate for tanks, Bunker of Faith and new Mincer ablative shield song for reducing melee damage.

Hibs - Get good magic resists (8-16% on Heat/Cold/Matter from common Druid spec, 24% on Body/Spirit/Energy from common Warden spec), Purge, Group Purge and Brilliant Aura of Deflection.

Mids - Get poor magic resists (8-16% on Heat/Cold/Matter from common Shaman specs, 0-8% on Body/Spirit/Energy from common Healer specs) and Purge.

Also, as they are now starting to balance the classes more, when are they going to take actions to balance realm populations. Maybe they should prevent new people from joining the most populous realm on each server Or is Excal going to become Hib+Mids vs Albs once 1.60 arrives?

Also, nice stealth nerf to aug healers in there, knocking 40% off of the celerity, as if there wasnt little enough incentive for speccing aug over mend or pac as it was.

 

[Brevis]

What annoys me the most is the Con change.

As an archer I stay in the back of a fight and pick the weakest target. As an archer this weak target, weak because of Con or armor type is about the only thing I can take down.

Well, no point in clicking around to find a nice tasty green/blue, now its caster targets all the way.

No chance of finding out if that armsman/hero is a green con that I should be able to take down solo, or if he is a Yellow con that will and should spank my kobie ass.

This annoys me greatly. Really hopes this change hits the trashcan before the patch goes live.

 

[Jiggs]

Originally posted by Flimgoblin

Friars will hit for over 200 yes - with a 5.5 speed weapon, not with a 4.2 speed axe hitting every 3.5 second (before any hastes etc. are applied)

200?? i am upset if its below 300

http://www.roguishness.com/daoc/uploads/Jiggs/blazor.jpg

its a snip of a sort of impropmtu duel i won, after i hit haste my damage drops to 250-280 ish but obviously then i hit 3 times to the zerks once and dead zerk...

 

[klavrynd]

Originally posted by Flimgoblin
http://pub79.ezboard.com/flighttanksofdaocfrm1.showMessage?topicID=55.topic

there's some others on the guardian board...

basically Jelinar (the BM team lead) took almost identically specced BM and Zerker and compared damage...

nice comparison ... but not really

hib studded is vulnerable to crush whereas mid is allover neutral to crush and there is no info about relics.

 

[Neural Network]

As always I’m looking forward to any out-building of the game, and this patch doesn’t look bad at all. I really like the ideas involving the battlegrounds, and that you can get a medal of valor. I can’t decide if the change of con colours is for the better or worse.
Also, what is granny doing in here?

 

[old.Iunliten]

Originally posted by klavrynd


nice comparison ... but not really

hib studded is vulnerable to crush whereas mid is allover neutral to crush and there is no info about relics.

Both were using crush weapons.

Hurricane 189 vs 241 for doublefrost 28% up for the zerker if no relic bonuses for none.
10 bonus to mids gives 219 and 16% up for the zerker
20 bonus to mids gives 201 and 6% up for the zerker
10 bonus to hibs gives 172 and 40% up for the zerker.
20 bonus to hibs gives 158 and 53% up for the zerker.

Hib/Back chain 217 vs 308 versus Mid/Back chain 41% up for the zerker if no relic bonuses for none
20 bonus to mids gives 257 and 18% up for the zerker.

That is with the hib having higher STR, Weaponskill, Weapondamage and lower qui.

Ask him about the relics though and then you know what number we are having.

 

[old.Atrox]

Originally posted by old.Iunliten
Yes and Why would clerics/druids specc higher?

Most druids get 30:ish nature too.

To get the Haste buff etc.


The sorc change were nice, but not gonna change much, the real changes were in 1.59, those changes were enough to get most sorcs to go high mind, this is just another halfhearted way to counter the Instants.
Nerfed Instant CC would be much better, lower range or someting, Sorcs would still lose the mezzwar cuz it's the first seconds that really counts.

If you want something thats really overpowerd look at the bard, instant lull with bugged timer, now thats something that really screws you, thou that affects Albs more then Mids since you got instant AE stun/mezz.

only good about these changes are that it -might- bring out more Mind sorcs, and less of us gimped CCwizzys

 

[old.LandShark]

Originally posted by Purefun
New minstrelsong is some kind of pulsing ablative aura, absorbs 100points at 50instr and needs drum equipped. Stun raised to 9sec.
Not too happy about rvr con changes though.

If i thought for a second any of the minstrel changes were goign to make it live, apart from the power cost reduction....
hah. =)

 

[Jiggs]

the extended stunn will go in i imagine

but the ablative thing needs to be reworked its way to powerful

 

[Nightchill]

Originally posted by Jiggs
the extended stunn will go in i imagine

but the ablative thing needs to be reworked its way to powerful

a group needs some reason to take a minst over a sorc after 1.59 tho heh.

 

[Tigerius]

Salute Jelinar for stepping down as Cleric TL so we could finally get these "overpowering" changes greenlighten, or can we? :/
As for the other Cleric changes, puzzle me. So basically you give us a speccable dmg add in Smite line, and a speccable melee dmg increaser in Enhance line? mmmkay.. and with this I do what.. combine them and become a Friar? Or have we officially declared Smite line dead even at Mythic HQ and are moving its useful spells to Enhance?

Sorc range change is nice, won't work in standard scenarios but gives Sorc bit more grounds for being the cloth caster (most effective) mezzer.

Minstrel/Skald loving feels due, simply to compensate for increased resistances and IP greatly increasing duration of 1on1 and FGvsFG engagements.

As an Alb I have to whine at something at that something will be.. drumroll..

Hats, by all means lovely but couldnt you spend 15 more mins to make them USEFUL? Give crafters a recipy to combine 1 helmet of any/every kind with 1 hat and get... drumroll.. a hat with AF of the helmet. Yay... but no. Lets all just camp be forced to wear the limited number of hooded cloaks, or camp the limited number of non-graphic crowns.

Corpse Summoner, WTF Mythic, can you stop nerfing your own ill-thought changes to the point of making em useless? No RP for 30mins? Ok, seems a bit excessive but you dont want it to be a tool to get back to emain with.. fine.. 10mins would do that, trust me. Now it's 30, definately relic raids only and barely then but ok so thats what you wanted then. Then the 2nd change, why hey lets also give the Hibs a permanent RP increase if someone does decide to use it? Sure that sounds real clever.