Your thoughts!?

[Olgaline]

so latly I've been watching the Pen and teller "bullshit" show, it's on a couple times a week here in DK atm, usually the show is good time passer, but the show yesterday really got to me,

In some school districts, in some states in the Usa they actually teach creationism as real alternative to evolution!? and it's required by law! that all bioligy books come with a sticker disclaimer informing that evolution is not a prooven fact but mearly a theory!


your thoughts ?

 

[old.Tohtori]

Well, around 75%(i think) of the USA is christian, so i guess it's only natural for a highly religious nation to teach that evolution is a theory and creationism is the real deal.

My personal opinion on the matter is rather different, regarding my own views and beliefs, so this whole evolution vs creationism doesn't involve my mind in a serious way.

But, i think i could say it's a tad of both.

Sort of, evolution with a lil nudge from a higher being.

 

[Mojo]

so latly I've been watching the Pen and teller "bullshit" show, it's on a couple times a week here in DK atm, usually the show is good time passer, but the show yesterday really got to me,

In some school districts, in some states in the Usa they actually teach creationism as real alternative to evolution!? and it's required by law! that all bioligy books come with a sticker disclaimer informing that evolution is not a prooven fact but mearly a theory!


your thoughts ?

It's fucking Insane

There are a couple these "Academy" things in the UK that teach creationism and they are partly government funded. Its complete bullshit, I don't know quite how they get away with it. The US is really bad mind, the worst western country by far.

Religion is a joke that really needs a good hard slap.

 

[Olgaline]

tbh i do not mind poeple beliving in creationism, but denying evolution as a fact/real science..thats a different story all together, but i guess that nessersary since they basicly cannot co exist

it's blows my mind that someone can actually hold evolution as mearly a optional theory and deny it as a factual science.

 

[Mojo]

That's a different story all together, but i guess that nessersary since they basicly cannot co exist

Yeah that's true, I have some respect for the hardcore in that regard and I can better under stand extremism than I can the moderates because the extremists actually do really believe the shit they speak.

 

[old.Tohtori]

But one can't, by any means, say that it's a 100% certain that there was NO higher being/creature who pushed evolution in a certain direction.

What was it, 50 million years that nothing happened on this planet, just bacteria and stuff hanging about, doing nothing, then suddenly things just -start- to grow? Hardly.

So saying that creationism is TOTAL crock, is a bit close-minded and as "unreasonable" as the 100% creationism people.

 

[Overdriven]

If people were to invest in a time machine, all these questions would be solved...

 

[Congax]

Family Guy did an awesome sketch on Creatonism once. That was just ace.

 

[CorNokZ]

Family Guy did an awesome sketch on Creatonism once. That was just ace.

What season and what was it called?

Got the first 4 seasons, but haven't seen em all

 

[Mojo]

But one can't, by any means, say that it's a 100% certain that there was NO higher being/creature who pushed evolution in a certain direction.

And why like many other do you afford religion a special place when it comes to this argument? There are a many thing I could mention that you could not disprove 100% and yet you would give no of them any credibility but yet religion is afforded a special place.

What was it, 50 million years that nothing happened on this planet, just bacteria and stuff hanging about, doing nothing, then suddenly things just -start- to grow? Hardly.

And because there is a "Hardly" will fill it with a "God" because higher beings are the only other explanation people can come up with. They use to attribute sun rise and weather to gods.

So saying that creationism is TOTAL crock, is a bit close-minded and as "unreasonable" as the 100% creationism people.

No its isn't because most the people who do not believe in Gods would most likely start to believe if evidence was produced, calling people closed minded because they will not entertain a myth without evidence is a pretty dumb thing to say.

As it stands right now Creationism is TOTAL crock, just like UF0's Ghosts and Teapots orbiting Saturn.

 

[Gorbachioo]

But one can't, by any means, say that it's a 100% certain that there was NO higher being/creature who pushed evolution in a certain direction.

What was it, 50 million years that nothing happened on this planet, just bacteria and stuff hanging about, doing nothing, then suddenly things just -start- to grow? Hardly.

So saying that creationism is TOTAL crock, is a bit close-minded and as "unreasonable" as the 100% creationism people.

And where did this higher being come from? ;O


Also, just because something cant be proven false doesnt mean that its right. The one who makes a claim has to proove it aswell, not the other way around.

Religion is for stupid people.

 

[Olgaline]

thing is, teaching creationism is all fine by me, as long as it's done with in the confinds of religion, however teaching is an ulternative to evolution and as a science, then yes i have a very big problem with that.

it's like arguing that, you should consider both sides of the story to weather or not concentration camps and geneside took place during the second worldwar. yet no one in thier right mind would do that now would they ?

 

[old.Tohtori]

1: And why like many other do you afford religion a special place when it comes to this argument? There are a many thing I could mention that you could not disprove 100% and yet you would give no of them any credibility but yet religion is afforded a special place.

2: And because there is a "Hardly" will fill it with a "God" because higher beings are the only other explanation people can come up with. They use to attribute sun rise and weather to gods.

3: No its isn't because most the people who do not believe in Gods would most likely start to believe if evidence was produced, calling people closed minded because they will not entertain a myth without evidence is a pretty dumb thing to say.

4: As it stands right now Creationism is TOTAL crock, just like UF0's Ghosts and Teapots orbiting Saturn.

1: Assuming i wouldn't give some other issue the same opinion, is not cool. Don't assume you know how i would feel on other matters. As it is, you're making no counterpoint to what i said.

2: I'm not saying a "god" fills the cap, i'm saying it's not impossible for a higher being to do so. Be it aliens, gods, whatnot.

3: Again, not saying it's dumb to believe in evolution instead of creationism, i'm saying it's dumb to say it's 100% proof, no doubt proven ABSOLUTELY fact that there is no such thing as creationism/god.

4: Yet you've offered no proof that it is TOTAL crock. My point up there. Just like UFOs, ghosts, or teapots around saturn arn't proven as total crock. Prove it and i'll believe you a 100%, can't? Ofcourse you can't. Just like UFO's, ghosts and teapots around saturn can't be proven a 100% true.

Stop assuming and reading the simple fact i'm saying "It's possible" as "Oh no! Evolution is wrong! Creationism is the only way!!"

Also, on saying religion is stupid, well, don't have to fight on that matter as i don't need to call other peoples opinions/beliefs stupid to discuss a matter.

People who oppose religion always say it's dumb/ignorant/whatnot, yet most often, those who believe let those who don't wish to believe, believe in that in all peace.

 

[Congax]

What season and what was it called?

Got the first 4 seasons, but haven't seen em all

Can't search for it at work, but just searh Youtube for Family Guy Evolution or something ;>

 

[DocWolfe]

I beleive in Satan... he plays me like a rusty trombone every day.

 

[Mey]

 

[fl3a]

4: Yet you've offered no proof that it is TOTAL crock. My point up there. Just like UFOs, ghosts, or teapots around saturn arn't proven as total crock. Prove it and i'll believe you a 100%, can't? Ofcourse you can't. Just like UFO's, ghosts and teapots around saturn can't be proven a 100% true.

look up a term called burden of proof.
edit: now that i come to think of it, it might not have been that, but basically scientifically proof that something exists is required for something to be considered reasonable and/or possible, not lack of proof of not existing.

 

[old.Tohtori]

look up a term called burden of proof.
edit: now that i come to think of it, it might not have been that, but basically scientifically proof that something exists is required for something to be considered reasonable and/or possible, not lack of proof of not existing.

Yes, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist either.

Thinking if something is considered reasonable and/or possible is in the eye of the beholder, and like we all know, opinions are like...well, you know.

There are "scientific" things that don't have proof, but scientists still say they exist.

I don't believe that just 'cause scientists say "you need proof of existance, not lack of it", means that it's the absolute truth.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Also i remember some "problem of science" thing that scientists "live" by, something about nothing can be proven a 100% right.

It's really a subject, gods and science, that can't be said one way or the other. One day scientists believed that earth was flat, one day tehy might say "Yeah the beardy bloke the Christians believe in does exist."

Believe what you will, other people can do the same and try to live your life not by judging, but by trying to understand. Makes for a better place really.

 

[Olgaline]

it's still a FAR! cry from your pov up to reasoning it to be taught "in schools" as a sound/real/accepteble ulternative to evolution, wich was the point of this tread.

if you actually read what creationism is and what it suggest, you'll also find that it's not just a matter of some devine being helping things along, infact it's more amied at denying that evolution has ever taken place, thats it's all the work of god as stated in the bible.

heres an example for you:

the grand canyon! this geological place was not created by millions of years of erotion due to the missisipy, nono, this was created by a great flood! "you know the one" so hard rock and granit was cut by an enormous flood that lasted 6 days, ...for this to even be remotely possible you have to disregard all knolege of modern physics to reach that conclusion as plausible.

 

[Olgaline]

here's the show if you cba to watch it

Penn & Teller: Bullshit -- Intelligent Design VideoSift

 

[old.Tohtori]

it's still a FAR! cry from your pov up to reasoning it to be taught "in schools" as a sound/real/accepteble ulternative to evolution, wich was the point of this tread.

Yes well, i never said "creationism is the only true way!!", or anything other that extreme POV.

I think i summed up my view on the topic in the first post i made, it's a combination of two really, and also that in a HIGHLY Christian society, it's not at all uncommon or special that it would be considered a "real" way of explaining things.

 

[kirennia]

Should put that sticker on the front of every religious book ever in existance, including the bible should they be made to read that. Then I'd agree it'd need to be put on an evolution book.

Most of science is in fact all theory. So is everything about history as well. As is religion as it cannot be actually proven.


To be put on an evolution book and no other is propaganda in trying to breed more of a religious nation, nothing more, nothing less. People can read into that what they will but in my eyes, it's a complete bastardised way to try and get people to follow a cult.....sorry, I mean religion. Whats the difference again?

 

[echome]

I don't care.

People can belive what ever they want, as long as they don't try to make me belive the same.

Though I must admid I feel sad for people that have to belive in a greater power to live their life.

I have said it before and will say it again:
"Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people." - Karl Marx.

 

[Huntingtons]

What was it, 50 million years that nothing happened on this planet, just bacteria and stuff hanging about, doing nothing, then suddenly things just -start- to grow? Hardly.

i have no problem in believing that bacteria could evolve into higher lifeforms. what dazzles me is how "things" became alive. its obvious that life in any form isnt standard material in the universe and is a quite unique happening. so how it evolved from dead matter to living matter is the tricky part to answer.

 

[old.Tohtori]

i have no problem in believing that bacteria could evolve into higher lifeforms. what dazzles me is how "things" became alive. its obvious that life in any form isnt standard material in the universe and is a quite unique happening. so how it evolved from dead matter to living matter is the tricky part to answer.

Well the point there was that for around 50 million years absolutely nothing changed and then mhmhmhmmh(according to scientists) happened and LIFE!

They don't know what the f*ck happenened, but for 50 million years or so, nothing nothing nothing and then...poof!

 

[Congax]

YouTube - Family Guy Evolution Clip
[youtubevid]Z7Z82lm5oGQ[/youtubevid]

 

[kirennia]

Well the point there was that for around 50 million years absolutely nothing changed and then mhmhmhmmh(according to scientists) happened and LIFE!

They don't know what the f*ck happenened, but for 50 million years or so, nothing nothing nothing and then...poof!

More beleiveable then a magical guy watching from the sky who created the world all in 7 days? And then fucked off to let the people he 'loves' to suffer? God moves in mysterous ways, yada yada; people don't. Some people like to have something to believe in to feel secure and religion offers an answer in that respect. For the same reason people plan ahead in life etc, security.

 

[Glacier]

"400.000 years ago, they came from outer space, and gave us life here"


Flying whales guys, they are the overlords.

 

[Gamah]

YouTube - Family Guy Evolution Clip
[youtubevid]Z7Z82lm5oGQ[/youtubevid]

FG Rocks