Would this solve any population problems?

[Smid]

Who the fuck said you need to have a tiptop ToA template? an SI template is just fine, no need for masterlevel 10 either. The ones who wants thiere uber templates etc. are those who play against equally equipted groups and want an huge advantage, its still possible to compete thought.

Myself and the majority of the palyerbase want to feel that they are competive, Daoc is a geardriven game.....need any more reasons ?


Do you really think that DAOC can attract new players ?

 

[Tallen]

Classic version of the game was incredibly buggy and the graphics were crap.

Everyone thinks back on how great classic daoc was, but if you ever try the client you'll see it was really nasty compared to the current version.

Lvl grind back then was a lot more difficult, mobs were a lot tougher (no RA's, no artis, no buffbots (as no one was lvl 50), only basic items, no SC, NO BG's etc). Todays player would try for 20 minutes and give up because they werent lvl 50 already

RvR was laggy and buggy, but RvR before any lvl 50's was a real hoot

I wonder how many players would want to RvR with no realm ranks or RA's now?

The appeal of classic daoc is that everything was new and unexplored, now its old-hat and to be honest it wouldnt be worth paying a subscription for.

 

[Tallen]

Who the fuck said you need to have a tiptop ToA template? an SI template is just fine, no need for masterlevel 10 either. The ones who wants thiere uber templates etc. are those who play against equally equipted groups and want an huge advantage, its still possible to compete thought.

SI template = No artifacts, no ML advantages and you would get stuffed by anyone in rvr...personally getting beaten by a player of half your skill because he has equipment 3 times better than you isnt my idea of fun.

SI items are crap compared to ToA with a few exceptions (actually, only Paidreans, the rest are /salvage).

Items and abilities do make a huge difference, started NF with my ranger in epic armour and EZ drop weapons with SI/Classic items (good ones), now with ToA template i hit twice as hard, faster and a lot more often, i can take 3x the damage (better armour, capped con, capped hits, capped resists plus ToA advantages) i could before and resist 1/3 more damage than previously...you cant tell me this makes no difference?

Everyone you come across in NF has these advantages, you cannot compete without them (which sucks, but ToA items just make too big a difference to ignore).

 

[Awarkle]

I think mythic got a lot of ground to make up with regards to both pve and rvr. at the moment people are probbly right rvr is basically tower humping until the enemy come out to defend.

And blizzard saying they arnt doing expansions is just rubbish if they dont do any expansions either free or payed then after a year of playing that game i would be bored and leave for a game with much more content. Doac at the moment isnt friendly to lower level people because goa just havnt got any form of marketting or advertisment out there. I only really heard about daoc from friends who were playing at the time.

as for would i go back to an SI and classic server, probbly if i did i would roll albion because ive played hibernia to death putting it simply. Killed all the epic mobs in SI all three epic dungeons the new island there really isnt much else for me to do in si, classic done most of them as well toa was fun up to a point and that point was midway bettween ml2 and ml3 both those dungeons just ruined the whole of toa way to long way to laggy and frankly i always thought they ruined the toa experience as the dungeons wernt that impressive, it was only when you got to monsters like chimera and phoenix that you go wow

lets face facts we all love toa but we hate the time sink

 

[LawBringer]

Another suggestion I have for helping the population is this.

DAoC allow you to pay to buy a lvl 50 char - proviso being that like the /lvl ability you must have a 50 on your account, you can then choose to buy a new char. This would generate revunue for Mythic and allow players to try either a new class/server. I suggest that the price is dependant on which server you want your new toon to be on, so $100 on a low population server - higher amounts on busy servers.

Sounds daft? go check out ebay, several ppl there offer tailor made chars for a price - PLd and unspecced - some throw a few plat in on the deal aswell.

 

[Awarkle]

i would never suggest buying a power leveled character on ebay, how on earth can you say its your character you may as well go out and play a different game.

i think daoc has its learning curve and it has its earning your character after your third or fourth level 50 your going to start realising pve is a bit dull.

And i will say why pve is dull at the moment because everyones got at least 1 level 50 or high level alt on a multiple server, there are no new people coming into the game at all and its becoming stagnant. US upper high realm rank high level people dont visit the lowbie areas if we want to power level a char we can with buffbots or by dragging them on stick when we rvr.

The poor new player cant really do that just get goa to sell 100 new accounts for mid alb and hib and it would make the game a lot more fun and packed

even if they gave classic away on the front of a CD magazine you dont have to patch so you can install it set up an account and wee go off and play.

would be a lot more fun

 

[Abel]

The moment DAoC PvE is sooooo crap and the lvling sooooooooooooo boring that the only way to salvage the game is to offer instants lvl 50s they can as well scrap the game entirely.

Actually the whole PvE mechanisms in DAoC are already a trainwreck of big proportions with everyone being able to start straight on lvl 20 and PLing their way to 50 in no time.

No wonder no new players flow into the game anymore, at low lvl the game must seem as dead as a doornail. All the content untill the 40s seem wasted.

 

[Motowntheta]

Another suggestion I have for helping the population is this.

DAoC allow you to pay to buy a lvl 50 char - proviso being that like the /lvl ability you must have a 50 on your account, you can then choose to buy a new char. This would generate revunue for Mythic and allow players to try either a new class/server. I suggest that the price is dependant on which server you want your new toon to be on, so $100 on a low population server - higher amounts on busy servers.

Sounds daft? go check out ebay, several ppl there offer tailor made chars for a price - PLd and unspecced - some throw a few plat in on the deal aswell.

Whilst I can understand the reasoning behind this, having an Instant lvl 50 would kill most of this game. I wish they had never had /level at all just given bonus %xp to people with lvl 50's then there would have been people within the 1-20 range for people to group with but the whole levelling experience (1-50) would have been reduced.

In the next expansion catacombs quests and task instances means you can power-solo to 50 in a shorter period of time than ever. Completely removing the lowbie game would just create a poor version of a FPS. If you want instant action then just play Doom or HL2.

 

[Bloodaxe_Springskalle]

the problem with nostalgia is it doesn't stand up to close inspection

people would try the classic daoc/si and go "man these graphics are mince, eww ugly trees, bah stupid bugs" and give up after a week or two of being ganked by some overpowered gank groups...

And despite how much people whine about ToA a lot of them still wouldn't be playing were it not for it - it added a whole load of stuff to the high level game which just wasn't there before.

people still play Doom 1, Stunts and even prince of persia 1 dude, graphix doesent matter much for ppl above age of 16

 

[Tio McShire]

Why can't I buy a horse ffs? Ride it like a boat.

heh i was wondering about the lack of horse population in daoc.
Maybe a great plague has killed em all, or the french ate em

 

[Comos]

well lets face it
lvling in daoc always sucked, it was insanely boring, but at least you had something to look forward to pre toa and pre nf. You'd spent so much time trying to get lvl 50 and I think we can all agree that lvling up wasn't fun at all... at least not after the first 30 lvls of your first char. But at least it was over then once you hit 50. You could finally rvr after getting some SC done and that was it (even though there were some imbalances in rvr, but at least it was still fun).
Then mythic decides for us it's time to go pve again, only in a much more frustrating zone called toa. Well they killed the game and nothing can save it anymore and even though a server with daoc+SI is a nice idea, it's just too late as said before. people have left and they won't return because wow/EQ2 is not swg (well I wouldn't know about EQ2).
Daoc was a good game, we all enjoyed it, but it was sad to see it go downhill like that all because of its own creator.

 

[tigekala]

But then everyone would go play in the classic+SI server and noone would buy the stupid expansions

 

[Formash]

WoW/EQ2 folks will be back. Another myth. As mentioned above once people move on they move and for all intents and purposes that is it. Yes there will be exceptions and because of ToA EQ1 did indeed see an influx of old players last year returning last February when they brought out there Omens expansion pack. But, as a general statement, its a myth.

People will be back when they have completed there free month. As above a myth. In addition many, many people had access to the free beta and then choose to buy the game. I think if they were going to quit they would have done so before.

After the hype .... another myth.
EQ2. The development and even the launch of EQ2 was incredibly low key. The concensus is that SOE wanted to protect EQ1. Still going and it had 2 expansions last year; as mentioned above the first was very sucessful. I played EQ prior to DAoC and I suspect that if you are still playing EQ1 or have switched to EQ2 then that, as far as you are concerned, is the game for you.
WoW: again no 'hype' from Blizzard. A few trailers and a steady stream of we are only going to release this game when its satisfied our high standards and QA folks. Any 'hype' came from the playerbase, people who tried WoW, were impressed and felt the urge to share. Stop for one moment and think: hype might get you to try the free beta but, I strongly suggest, that if you try the beta and don't like it no amount of hype will convert you.

Anyway the reality is that after the 'hype' and the opening sales of 250,000 copies Blizzard have now sold over 600,000 and had over 200,000 on - at once - over Christmas.

Expansion packs: this was the EQ model of the time. Reading the Blizzard boards it doesn't look like it will be there's - and with the size of the subscriber model they have they can easily afford to develop and release new content periodically. No distribution, no advertising needed, no expansion registration problems. This option may not be open to Mythic.

Well, i beg to differ here, but i played EQ2 well beyond the free month. Got bored with it and once 1.71 had been impletemented in DAOC, i came back. <pee's on your bonfire.>

I bet there's others like me too. Myth, my arse.

The fact i still have 2 accounts in DAOC, 1 in COH, 1 in SWG and 1 in EQ2 doesn't mean i have moved to another game. It means i earn too much money. Even moreso when ive stopped playing EQ2 and SWG for the time being.

 

[SirDystic]

An early comment that people won't come back from WoW is false. I have. I decided to join WoW on the US servers, but after 9 weeks, it really isn't very good. In fact after the initial 'Wow, gosh and general newness' it's pretty shallow actually.

 

[Lamp]

Mythic / GOA are in the business to make money first and foremost. They will continue to release expansions until their Sales / Marketing team report to their CEO that supporting DAOC is no longer financially viable.

Yes, they have to appear to care about their new and existing customer base, but please don't be naive in thinking that there are entire teams at Camelot devoted to rectifying every aspect of the game that people don't like.

They release what they consider to be the most broadly acceptable product that will sell well. And it has. Take a look at their stock price compared to initial release and the third quarter of 2004. They've made lots of money.

And while u ppl continue to bitch and moan about this and that, you're still paying your subscription and still buying the expansions !

If you really don't like it, don't play. Simple.

Of course, discuss about what you'd like to see, but please don't be naive to expect any of it to come into fruition. Why SHOULD Mythic / GOA have to reward long term players or give into to every players minutely detailed request ? They don't and won't. Get real.

One day, when sales and marketing report to the CEO that sales are crap, the product will get pulled. Accept it.

Thanks

 

[GrafenburgMerc]

Who the fuck said you need to have a tiptop ToA template? an SI template is just fine, no need for masterlevel 10 either. The ones who wants thiere uber templates etc. are those who play against equally equipted groups and want an huge advantage, its still possible to compete thought.

This has to be the stupidest statement I have heard in a long time.

An example,

I ran my lvl 50 skald (not toa'd much, ML2 souj) out of Svasud to fens and got jumped by a mincer. I did not get said mincer to 50% before I died and I even used IP2.

The reasons =

1. My damage sucked cos of SoM proc (u hit for 277, a magical barrier absorbs 200 damage).

2. Malice proced reducing my damage further.

3. I got Zyphered, 10 secs + of free hits.

4. His DD's hurt like hell (a RR thing).

5 His ablative bocked a further 70 damage per round (a 50 instruments thing).

Pre ToA only 4 and 5 would be an issue, and one I could overcome. With ToA i'm simply screwed as a non ToA player. I just dont have time for the timesink.

Quite simply, stuff Mythic for ToA...

 

[Kelio]

This has to be the stupidest statement I have heard in a long time.

An example,

I ran my lvl 50 skald (not toa'd much, ML2 souj) out of Svasud to fens and got jumped by a mincer. I did not get said mincer to 50% before I died and I even used IP2.

The reasons =

1. My damage sucked cos of SoM proc (u hit for 277, a magical barrier absorbs 200 damage).

2. Malice proced reducing my damage further.

3. I got Zyphered, 10 secs + of free hits.

4. His DD's hurt like hell (a RR thing).

5 His ablative bocked a further 70 damage per round (a 50 instruments thing).

Pre ToA only 4 and 5 would be an issue, and one I could overcome. With ToA i'm simply screwed as a non ToA player. I just dont have time for the timesink.

Quite simply, stuff Mythic for ToA...

hmm sounds like you met Alpha, he prolly wouldnt need any armor at all to beat you. but then again he is rr11+ :worthy:

 

[Aonmeamna]

And while u ppl continue to bitch and moan about this and that, you're still paying your subscription and still buying the expansions !

If you really don't like it, don't play. Simple.

Well now you see, this is the problem. Because many people aren't, and the populations are dwindling and some realms are now getting critically low. And the people that bitch and moan about this and that, are tehn next batch of people who won't be playing.

 

[Lamp]

So is DAOC dwindling away innexorably..?

 

[Aonmeamna]

I think so, without a new injection of people, it's inevitable. The question is how long.

The game is now impossibly hard (ie boring) for a new person. All the low level areas are uninhabited, the techno-babble that any new player has to confront is staggering, the time sinks in the game are vast and RvR is so broken to anyone who doesn't have ToA that it may well as be a different game that you are not allowed to play. Catacombs maybe a step back in the right direction. But ToA is a steaming pile of crud. NF seems equally steaming.

And they won't do the only thing that will address the realm imbalances. ie, lock Alb until the other realms catch up. It would also help if they put more in the other realms to try to attract players. But everythign seems to be Alb Alb Alb, hardly suprising that is where most people play.

 

[Lamp]

Any thoughts on how to address the ToA time-sink ?

 

[Soulbow]

Problem with Toa is the Time.

People just dont have time to do 5-6 Hr ML's I know you can do a few then wait for another ML to do others but ML dont run day by day sometimes takes Weeks for 1 ML to be run.

The Toa Time is to consuming for I'd say 60% of Daoc Population on all 3 Servers,especially Spawn time on these Uber Arti's and then there is the Time consuming farming of Scrolls for these Arti's I know People have Scrolls on they CM to sell which makes it easier to activate and get around the Time Consumation of Farming but People who do have Scrolls Put it out Price reach of a more Casual Player who do not have Funds as that = Time to get.

Toa Dwindled the Daoc Population as it makes it a lot Harder for the Casual Player to compete with serious gamers Shame Great game pity Mythic never looked at the more casual gamer in doing some these Encounters.

Soulbow

 

[raid]

Any thoughts on how to address the ToA time-sink ?

Easy

All artis 100% drop with reasonable repop timer, if you need an arti you can gather a group and go get it, if it's down just wait for pop.

Same with scrolls; if they have to drop from high lvl mobs, make them drop regularly so that a group gets one before people get bored ie. again you can gather a group and go get one in a reasonable time. 20 mins from a 5ppl group should be more than enough for any scroll imo Ofc there always has to be some randomness but still.

Decrease monster levels on master level encounters so that a balanced fg can do all of them / make all steps give credit for whole bg, remove the requirement of having .1 - .9 completed to get credit for .10 and remove the ML requirements for entering dungeons.

All that would be only simple configuration changes which could be done REALLY fast and easy if they were willing to...

 

[[NO]Subedai]

daoc numbers are rising atm in the EU. Catacombs is a good expansion that doesnt require more pve for lvl50's but makes it easier for new people to get a good well equipped char.

 

[Soulbow]

daoc numbers are rising atm in the EU. Catacombs is a good expansion that doesnt require more pve for lvl50's but makes it easier for new people to get a good well equipped char.

I Agree Daoc numbers are Rising which is great for the game the problem I think that what a lot of casual players face is Toa ML,Arti & Scroll farming that is an issue Mythic will make easier for Casual Gamer then numbers would rise more if that that problem was addressed.

Soulbow

 

[Aonmeamna]

There is no cure for ToA, its bad by design, as a casual gamer you are totally cut off from it, and as such, all but cut off from RvR. They had a real brain fart when they thought of that.

Plus, wtf is it all about really? Has anyone here ever done it without following a walkthrough they got off the net? The levels are for brain-dead recipe gimps with loads of time and no other life! So anyone else takes one look, goes "fek that for a silly game of soldiers" and buggers off back to PvE where they eventually get bored and leave the game.

 

[Aonmeamna]

Says me, currently bored shitless, hacking my way through Werewolves in corusc and sitting down for 5 mins to heal!!! Tabbing out to these forums to relieve the tedium!

What the hell am I doing? I'm paying for this fun!!!!!!!!!


Arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

 

[Lamp]

I am tending to agree with Raid's comments above. If implemented, the whole ToA experience would be a lot more pleasant to endure. I'm not too fussed about the ML requirements for dungeons, providing getting (say) ML3 to enter DV is not such a slog.

Definitely sort the pop timers out.

Would be great if someone from GOA / Mythic picked up on this.

 

[Korosu]

cant bothered reading all replys, but truthfully noone would play these servers if it hasnt been said already.

daoc was good back then because it was new, without toa what honestly would you be doing half the time now? it's not going to happen whether it'd work or not anyway.

 

[Lamp]

Like a lot of old timers who have been playing since the game was released, I loved the classic environment (I'm talking pre-DF, pre-SI, pre-Spellcasting, pre-RR/RA days), and although nostalgia trips are nice to chat about, I tend to agree that a return to a really old patch would involve intollerable lag spikes, putting up with basic graphics, and the loss of quite a lot of game tweaks and functionality whose absence I think would be very noticeably felt. Probably more so than we realise.

Now I know that every player could probably list 1001 things that is wrong with the game, or that need changing, deleting, adding, whatever. In this list I personally would include the ToA time-sink, but in fairness to Mythic / GOA, they've had to come up with an environment that challenges level 50's, but on the other hand, it shouldn't be to the extent of frustrating and infuriating them. A proper balance is required. Whether we get it or not is another story.

The thing that keeps me coming back, however, is the chat / dialogue with fellow players. And if I am being perfectly honest, I regard DAOC as an elaborate chat-room rather than a superlatively crafted and perfectly engineered MMORPG. When I'm in a full group of ppl who are up for a laugh, I'm not generally thinking about the quality of the graphics, or the fact that pbaoe needs tweaking, or this or that. I'm there to have a laugh.

The more serious player will probably hinge more on having the perfect game system perhaps. But to those players I simply say that if you're not enjoying yourself, don't play. If you wanna carry on playing fine, but all the moaning and complaining in the world may not at the end of the day bring any changes to the game.

For me DAOC is all about having a right laugh in guild and group chat, making friends, LMAO at all the silly things you see people do and say. DAOC is never going to be perfect. It's never going to be right for everyone. I just go with the flow. My characters are secondary to me. Having a laugh is number one. But each to their own.

If it ever gets to a point when I can no longer have a laugh anymore, I'll stop playing, and look for another game.