Where is Midgard on Prydwen going ?

[Yma]

Hehehehe ... you're not far from the truth, so many of us here are just waiting for slightly better time, we've not given up but wisely accepted we can't compete on your own battle field atm and adapted to the situation - you will see far more hunters and far less organized groups, imo. Can be a patch or two, but we'll be back.

About our rvr guilds ... well, it's their choice, but I still see many of them around so nothing is lost. Sure, some moved to hib or alb realms, but that was expected, not everyone is willing to pay for a game to play in the underdog realm, especially when you make arpees and pwnage your reason of playing. A competitive spirit is a strong force.

 

[Foadon]

albs or hibs wont ever reroll mid cus its not possible to do MLs fast, no petspam means we need full numbers for every encounter, and thats also the reason why theres no ml raids consistently
might of been said already but cba reading whole thread ><

 

[Boggy]

ToA was out 6 months before NF, and during that time Midgard did extremely well in RvR. Were lengthy periods where Hibs and Albs both complained that Emain was not worth going to.

Also during that time Mids held Hib keeps a lot and did well taking back their own keeps if they were taken.

It's not that Mids suck at siege or MLs. It's more that you got knocked hard losing relics and underperforming and could not find a way to get back in the game. A big part of being knocked was the lack of support from your GGs. Maybe they've left now, but they were around earlier in NF and some of them posted here basically saying "who cares about keeps and zergs, we go get our RPs".

If you could marshal a good raid or two with everyone helping, including GGs, you might boost your morale enough for people to start RvRing again. You've still got more active chars than Hib, so if you can get your realm behind the idea and get 80-90% turn outs for your raids like Hib has had to do sometimes, you'd have enough people.

You've got at least one decent leader on Mid because he recently left Hib.

 

[TheBinarySurfer]

newbie, rvr guilds aint rly playing are they?~~


anyway, warlock seem to be a nice keep/range class type for mid, not a petspammer, but some intresting spells just for ze keeps..

1.71 can change alot aswell for relic status, now its just the realm with most ppl who wins~~

AND 1.71 should have been released with NF in europe, more mids(and other rvr guilds in other realms) would probably have played still.

1.71 balances it out a bit, and the reason the mids are struggling rvr wise might be due to that 2fg thats been camping bled dock area for about the last 3 days 24/7? Pisstake over - yeah i have a mate playing there and he said the /who 50 over the last few months has dropped by about a third consistently.

 

[Frozenheart]

Mids have had it rough this patch .... but here's my thought's ....

I don't think anyone will move to Mid due to the lvlling slog, the cost of toa stuff etc ....

Mythic have admitted the realms are uneven ( i am assuming they mean Mids ) and are sorting it out with 1.71 which is due out very soon.

I usually see a grp or 2 of Mids running around emain picking off albs while we are fighting Hibs ... which usually makes us ask in /bg, why aren't they also trying to take towers so they can try to get their relic back too? i guess they would rather farm than try anything good

 

[Yma]

Also during that time Mids held Hib keeps a lot and did well taking back their own keeps if they were taken.

It's not that Mids suck at siege or MLs.

That's a common mistake ... OF and NF keep sieges are two totally different beasts. OF sieges: mids were pretty good in taking down fast keep doors (lots of tanks = lots of FF that now it's sadly nerfed) before hibs and albs could organize a defense. When that happened, and we had scouts or animists defending, we were basically helpless - but that was a rare event as even a level 10 keep fell fast to our army of faultfinders and pbaoers. Today, it takes so long to take down even a middle level tower that we have no hopes to find one undefended for long.

A bit of tactics and roaming groups cutting reinforcements helped a lot. Now, postern doors and teleporting made that job quite less effective, you either spread your already limited man power to take down towers AND roam, or you've to end up guarding postern doors for hours (which removes our open fields advantages, that were based on speed and surprise).

In defense ... we always had some good pbaoe, that unfortunately was nerfed in NF, to help defending doors and lord tower stairs. We had amazing epic battles there, lasting hours ... not like now where it just takes a couple of high RR toons to drop fire and forget fields destroying zergs in seconds. Don't you ever find so wasted all those nice stairs and rooms in the inner keep ? They should be there meaning long fights, instead they're just decorative stuff you catch a glimpse of, while steam rolling the enemy force in seconds (or minutes, if you meet shrooms)...

So ... yes, in OF we were good in siege warfare. Right now, siege is a totally different game. You can't simply say 'you were good before, you have to be good now' ... all changed.

 

[Brolundar]

Just my two cents: RvR more even now. Midgard does not win always any longer. Thats the reason, ppl left.

 

[Azathrim]

Equendil said it really - thuergists and bolt ranged mez counts for shit in the nitty gritty of storming a keep. Mid is loaded with ae instas galore - far more than alb. imo its alot easier for mids to defend a keep than it is for albs.

So, you are in all honestly saying that you think Mids have an easier time defending a keep than albs/hibs? I think you just lost all credibility you might have had.

For hibs, shrooms is a benefit. It's not the end of the world, but a nice benefit as they can get higher than 1500 range using the shroooms.

For albs, sorcs -is- the end of the world. Two sorcs standing at max range can easily keep down a tower or battlement in itself. Meanwhile the caster assist trains can stand in the 1500+10% range picking out any caster foolish enough to try and go out for a quick qc+bolt.

The bolt range mezz is less a problem for hibs as they can shroom up to push the albs back. Mids cannot do this.

Fact is mid 1 fg gank grps post nf have thrown their dummies out of the pram - where as alb rvr grps like AoD/PE/FL have reorganised, reformed and managed to get it right.

True, those guilds you mention do quite well. I often see AoD as part of the zerg. Certain gank groups in mids refuse to coordinate to squish the AoD fg's (24+ players) running around. The situation might improve if the mid attitude changed on that particular area.

alb right now has organised Banelord TWF reaver groups( for a few more weeks anway !) - but people forget all realms have access to these albilites, not just alb. Full credit to stalky for setting up these groups - the fact remains mid and hib could do exactly the same thing.

As has been discussed several times on this board previously, this is a lie. Mids and Hibs -cannot- do this on itself. Only reavers can drop Agony and instantly heal up again with Soul Quench (while doing even more damage). Once again, stop blindfolding yourself and spread your uninformed lies.

hibs come out to play cause they know, even if out numbered 4/1 summon mushie zerg will soon even it out - thats why they play. every alb knows even if 8 fg of albs are attacking a hib keep, if hibs have just say 4 animists, albs may as well give up - all the "honest" animists see to that - like hell they dont know all the out of LoS spots in a keep, but as i said all animists are "honest" and would never do such a thing working as intended

Yes, Animists are powerful in a keep siege, no doubt. Directly hinting that they cheat (as opposite of 'honest') just shows your own attitude and willingness to look at the bigger picture. Animists play the class as they are intented. Just like Reavers that intention will get slightly changed in the coming patch - we just have to cope until then.

mids - make new gank groups, albion did this and thats why its working. tonight we had a fg of stigmata/pe/rising force/AoD just roaming, and thats ignoring the zerg. none of the current alb 1 fg grps were running as they are now in OF - they are all reworked out of whats left from the WoW migration.

That is perhaps the only thing you posted that wasn't misinformed, ignorant or a direct lie.

Yes, Mids needs to reorganize. We can only hope it happens sooner than later. I do belive though, that many cannot be bothered until we get some of the changes in coming patches - patches that show Mythic acknowledge Albions current supremacy (population and class wise).

Until then, enjoy your christmas time and take pride in what you can accomplish while playing on favoured odds. Odds that gets slightly lowered in the coming patches.

Come Catacombs and Warlocks, mids might even be able to compete in the range warfare. At least until the 42% (as per Brites post) of the Dark Age of Camelot population whines that they are on more even odds when competing.

 

[Wholdar]

I usually see a grp or 2 of Mids running around emain picking off albs while we are fighting Hibs ... which usually makes us ask in /bg, why aren't they also trying to take towers so they can try to get their relic back too? i guess they would rather farm than try anything good

Well, yesterday we did move a few of our baf-toons to the norrsken-alliance-guild and went to alb to take a few towers, we did, and started banging on eras. Thanks to albs being on hib-keeps we even managed to get the tower to level 3..

We got roughly 25-30 mids to the tower after we announced in the /bg that we had it taken, we all cheered and tought "hey! this is quite a good turn-up! weee!!". Albs showed up in numbers about 55-60. And with volley all over the tower when they charged (20+ scouts?) and the mandatory reaver-bomb when they got to lord we where all dead. And before that we where wizzy-bolted, scout-shot from the keep and bolt-mezzed. Yeah, that was very fun. Why even bother taking towers anymore?

Since we cannot get the numbers, and albs show up in at least the double amounts... well. You can cry "reform! adapt!" (hi Requiel) all you like, but look at the situation. It´s not only on Prydwen this is happening. The case could be that mids all over the world is stupid and non-adaptable sure, but I´m not so certain.. cause it IS happening all over the world.

We couldnt even get enough people to do Erinys charm right this tuesday, we had just about 20 showing up, a steady decline of numbers. The dragon hasnt been beaten in the last 2 raids..

Longtime-mids are trying out alb-chars and hib-chars just to get some variance, and the comment I get when I ask how it was I get "Very fun to play a real class!" (he also tried the Erinys-encounter with 1 fg albs btw, and managed fine). I can´t blame them, why stay in a realm and be bored when you can have fun in another? Although he did complain about it not being many mids out.. I wonder why.. for each one that leaves midgard for another realm, the difference for midgard is 2. One left, and one got added to the enemy. Really makes you want to go outthere!

We saw this happening in the US before we got NF, I honestly thought EU would be different, that we would prove them wrong. But I guess I was wrong, mid is slowly dieing. Catacombs? Perhaps, I hope we can raise the numbers then. After holidays? Yes, I hope the majority of the midgardians has been away over the holidays, and it´s only albs thats been home by the computer. Could be too late though.

Just my two cents: RvR more even now. Midgard does not win always any longer. Thats the reason, ppl left.

Yeah, thats probably it. All over the world, mids are all the same.
Please, try to see whats happening, even though I´m not so sure we can´t do anything about it. People will use the tools that they´re given, and they should.

I´ll keep my fingers crossed.
Bah, confused post, but ahwell. See you outthere. =)

 

[Stunned]

What changes with 1.71 would bring more mids back to rvr ? The eased ML encounters ?

 

[Puppet]

What changes with 1.71 would bring more mids back to rvr ? The eased ML encounters ?

Fact they can take relics by taking 1 keep ?

 

[Wholdar]

Fact they can take relics by taking 1 keep ?

Take their own relic, yes, wont do much about the whole NF-situation. Ohyeah, TWF don´t stack. Yay.

 

[Foadon]

alb gg's do well because they have other ggs and the randoms to back em up in terms of meeting enemies themselves
mid has 1gg and maybe 1other group out ever, and a small random zerg who just camps keeps, its simple logic, more of your own realm roaming = easier to win, as your enemies need to use RAs, instas and whatever else more and u can just sweep em off when u meet em
@reaverbombs itll be over next patch or hopefully it will be, sq nerfed, twf stacks nerfed, and ppl will adjust to it
@ppl saying mid has a disadvantage in keep = true, insta means shit if u are defending, u cant insta each and every one that comes in range AND not be mezzed/stunned meanwhile, boltrange mez = instawin both defence and offense wise, shrooms i wont even comment on
@ppl say gg dont care about keeps and just rp: its not rp, its the fact that we rather play by roaming then by sitting inside a keep or outside sieging with a roleplaying trebuchet all night, once in a week fine, but every night for 3+ hours? go figure

 

[Skrad]

Well, here's my two cents worth.

When I started all those years ago playing on an american server just after release, I rolled a troll thane because I was impressed by the mix of range and melee. I got the dude to about level 30 before I started playing on Prydwen and rolled Skrad. The thane was a great, fun class to PvE and I was so chuffed to get 50.

Not long after that though, I realised that my uber PvE char wasn't really all that hot in RvR but I stuck with it for a while and got to RR4L1. Round about then, opted groups become fotm and my poor thane, which by then I'd learned to play pretty damned well, was just about redundant.

I'd been playing a SB in thid for a while and had left him on my account so thought wtf, time to get the dude to 50. So after a while, Skradoblade was 50 and I was having fun in RvR again. I found a few good places to camp... almost always solo or duo. I could pick my fights and avoid the zergs most of the time. Woohoo... I had an effective character again! Then came ToA. OK, time to throw away my old suit, spend loads of plat, spend loads of time farming for artis, xping them etc etc to get my new suit. OK, so I did that... cool, I was able to win fights again.

Oh great, I've just finished my suit, I'm having fun again. Wow, noob frontiers comes along. I try my SB a few times, solo again. There aren't any regularly run routes like there were in OF, so nowhere that I can set up camp wandering along that line and striking then moving to another spot. The only place close to this that I've managed to find is near bridges and docks, but they're pretty much camped by stealth groups so soloing as a SB is a waste of time.... 2 kills on a good night. Oh and for anyone thinking "shit man, you must really suck!" I made it to RR4L3 solo and duo in OF.

Keep takes? waste of time. As a thane, I get blasted to shit as soon as I stick my head above the BM to try and mjollnir. As a SB well, I stand somewhere waiting for a target and get bored shitless waiting.

So what next? Do I carry on with my SM (level 42) only to find that it's not viable by the time I hit 50? Do I carry on with my hunter? Dinged level 25 last night after being capped in thid for a while. Whatever I do, it's going to mean loads of pain doing ML's farming for plats for suits etc. All this to find that some new patch nerfs my character yet again.

All the time, I see my friends leaving as they are pissed off with the same issues I have. Less friends means it's harder to do anything. So yeah, motivation suffers. Flame me all you want but that's the way I see it. That's the way a lot of people I speak to see it. Give it some thought people.

 

[Dorin]

its not mucho fun to adapt in midgard, doing artis and mls in mid then watching as 6 animist bots + fg does the same 20x times faster takes the piss rly.

toa sucks alot, but with a decent pet spammer (animist, theurg) its bareable, in mid it is not. You have to invest alot more time into ml/arti encounters,,, some are not rly doable without a zerg, if you lack that you are busted etc, can understand why ppl leave for WoW / look m8s jacina died in 30seconds / omg took out erinys mob with 6

Frankly it stops ppl to roll on mid, who the fuck wants to spend month(s) on toa instead of a few weeks?

Keep takes are also boring, but i do agree about

alb casters, scout, reaverb0mbs >> hib nukers + animist >>>>> rm, sm, bd.

 

[Chimaira]

Lol dont diss RM Bd and SM

its top notch casters. RvR wise

 

[Azathrim]

Lol dont diss RM Bd and SM

its top notch casters. RvR wise

Yes, Mystics are good in open field. In keep fights they bring nothing to the table that their counterparts doesn't do just as well. Problem is, that the counterparts also have something more to give them the edge (sorcs/theurgists/animists).

I fail to see your point though Chimaira. A spiritmaster still can't cast when perma interrupted by a sorceror he cannot reach himself.

 

[leviathane]

how many of these new "fotm" sorcs actually have amnesia on 1 of their qbar's tho, there qbar probably looks like, 1-qc 2-aemezz 3-lt 4-aeroot 5-pet or soem crap.

 

[Etzel]

Damn Skrad that I get deja vue reading that post, my first char was a Skald, solo fun, group fun, PvE useful. As all around him improved but he stagnated (yay for getting those resist chants) I I looked at my 25 SB sat in a corner, another bout of PvE later I was having fun in DF, Odins, Hadrians and very occasionally even Emain. One nerfbat later I rolled a Healer with my GG, played him til I left a year back and yes he still has a very viable roll to play but trying to keep alive a good group is tough, the same on a disorganised pick up group is just plain painful and always ends in a forced logoff.

Now i'm in the exact same boat as you, do I level the 42 RM slowly (horrible power problems) or do I forget that and concentrate on my 24 BG Hunter that actually seems fun, or maybe I just accept 90% of the people I know have left and move to WoW for a (permanent?) break.....

 

[Azathrim]

how many of these new "fotm" sorcs actually have amnesia on 1 of their qbar's tho, there qbar probably looks like, 1-qc 2-aemezz 3-lt 4-aeroot 5-pet or soem crap.

Who cares? Soccer field, Bolt range AE mezz interrupts just as well - and still out of range of the normal DD caster.

 

[leviathane]

not like there are many mid casters anyway, all are hunters nowadays, go into range an get used as a pin cushion. Same with all realm's i s'pose archers are the darkside

 

[Yma]

It's natural selection ... there is just one mid caster that can compete in sieges and that's the runemaster, specced high in RC. Two bolts and if he has enough suppression even a nearsight (nerfed since ToA and Perfectors). All remaining casters and specs are DD range - yeah, they can have their lucky moments in keeps, but most of the time they will be aoemezz spammed and two shotted.

Of course, we all know the problems of bolts - cc would help here but our cc strong point is insta, not range ... and this leaves to the only remaining ranged class, hunters - which explains why Aegirhamn this afternoon is just hunters everywhere. I was really amused by the vision, till I realized I was playing my hunter too.

 

[Boggy]

That's a common mistake ... OF and NF keep sieges are two totally different beasts. OF sieges: mids were pretty good in taking down fast keep doors (lots of tanks = lots of FF that now it's sadly nerfed) before hibs and albs could organize a defense. When that happened, and we had scouts or animists defending, we were basically helpless - but that was a rare event as even a level 10 keep fell fast to our army of faultfinders and pbaoers. Today, it takes so long to take down even a middle level tower that we have no hopes to find one undefended for long.

Mids weren't only good at getting doors down in OF. As an animist in OF, I I preferred defending against Albs than Mids. The disease spam and GT damage from Mids made it much harder to cast shrooms.

In NF I would think the large numbers of PBAoE, still a very powerful tool for defense, coupled with the interrupts would give you very nice defensive options where it counts.

In terms of attacking, no realm really has it easy. If you're facing Hibs you face rangers, PBAoE and shrooms. If you're facing Albs you face scouts, hard hitting range casters and reavers. If you face Mids you're facing hunters, PBAoE and intterupts. In all cases you're facing TWF.

Mids do look at a disadvantage on the whole, but not in a big way. If Mid/Pryd had a zerg being supported by GGs the way Hib and Alb do, you'd be just as effective.

 

[Garok]

Who cares? Soccer field, Bolt range AE mezz interrupts just as well - and still out of range of the normal DD caster.

Nearsight ? or Healers get baseline AoE amnesia same as Sorcs so with 2300 range.

Still if you look into the horizen you can just about catch a glimpse of a little Kobby with Strange Cambers above its head ... Then the QQ will be from the other side..

 

[Dumle]

Mids weren't only good at getting doors down in OF. As an animist in OF, I I preferred defending against Albs than Mids. The disease spam and GT damage from Mids made it much harder to cast shrooms.

In NF I would think the large numbers of PBAoE, still a very powerful tool for defense, coupled with the interrupts would give you very nice defensive options where it counts.

In terms of attacking, no realm really has it easy. If you're facing Hibs you face rangers, PBAoE and shrooms. If you're facing Albs you face scouts, hard hitting range casters and reavers. If you face Mids you're facing hunters, PBAoE and intterupts. In all cases you're facing TWF.

Mids do look at a disadvantage on the whole, but not in a big way. If Mid/Pryd had a zerg being supported by GGs the way Hib and Alb do, you'd be just as effective.

Where did you see a PBAE specced SM?
Think there are like 2 active RvRing?

 

[leviathane]

well mebbe theres your problem, adjust or be doomed.

 

[Dumle]

well mebbe theres your problem, adjust or be doomed.

In your infinite wisdom tell us all worldwide midgardplayers just how we should adapt to compete.
I guess everyone in the world who plays mid just refuses to use their brains and "adapt" because we are all retarded and cant play our classes that we have succesfully played for the entire existence of the game all of a sudden?

Teach us please oh exalted one.


(PS sorry if I come off harsh at you m8, but it is just very very very hard to get the point across to ppl that there just are no ways to adapt atm, we just have to wait out the shitstorm. My (and others) main concern is that when it blows over there wont be many mids left, as shown in the US.)

 

[Derric]

In your infinite wisdom tell us all worldwide midgardplayers just how we should adapt to compete.
I guess everyone in the world who plays mid just refuses to use their brains and "adapt" because we are all retarded and cant play our classes that we have succesfully played for the entire existence of the game all of a sudden?

Teach us please oh exalted one.


(PS sorry if I come off harsh at you m8, but it is just very very very hard to get the point across to ppl that there just are no ways to adapt atm, we just have to wait out the shitstorm. My (and others) main concern is that when it blows over there wont be many mids left, as shown in the US.)

Look at the BO mixed group running around, and do like them, they don't seem to have too many problems to rock n' roll. ;o

 

[Dumle]

Look at the BO mixed group running around, and do like them, they don't seem to have too many problems to rock n' roll. ;o

Yeah we can do like them.

A couple of problems with that tho.

1. We need to instantly develop the skill acquired over years of daily RvR.
2. We need artis that are not easy to do in mid and takes bloody long time.
3. We need MLs that is impossible to do in Mid atm due to population
4. We need the high RR that comes with point #1

Anyways, Im confident that things will change whenever and I will probably still be here when it does
Im not one to quit when things get a bit rough, I just find other ways to amuse myself, hehe

 

[Etzel]

Nearsight ? or Healers get baseline AoE amnesia same as Sorcs so with 2300 range.

Nearsight is in the RM Supp line, the only people who spec that over 20 are Dragon raid bots. Yes my Healer has AE amnesia but unfortunately i'm also expected to heal, add that amnesia has no in combat timer it has to be spammed mercilessly and i've had instances where a sorc with much much higher dex than mine (i'm +16 cap) has managed to cast inbetween my casts it becomes a pointless excercise except in limited situations.