what should mythic do to sort out gimp classes?

[Herbal]

shamans arnt meant to solo theyre a support char how many solo clerics bards druids wardens healers do u see?

They rock in groups have huge util and dont need a boost if anything they need a nerf on the insta disease shout

now give cleric pet or cure mezz imho

 

[Ensceptificamuralya]

shamans arnt meant to solo theyre a support char how many solo clerics bards druids wardens healers do u see?

They rock in groups have huge util and dont need a boost if anything they need a nerf on the insta disease shout

now give cleric pet or cure mezz imho

Ehmm well actually some druids are quite good at soloing ( :

 

[Belomar]

Herjulf! For Heaven's sake, this is not a game for soloers! Stop comparing every class to a stealther and realize you actually need a group to compete.

 

[Lethul]

shamans arnt meant to solo theyre a support char how many solo clerics bards druids wardens healers do u see?

They rock in groups have huge util and dont need a boost if anything they need a nerf on the insta disease shout

now give cleric pet or cure mezz imho

<[GoL]Herbal> disease isnt worth shit against good groups

 

[Ensceptificamuralya]

Wouldn't by chance be because you haven't been in any of the >good< FOTM groups the last year or so, due to your own spec? There's a reason why the FOTM groups arise, usually because the better players find out that it's the best setup, however that doesn't mean that all the shitty n00bs who copies their style becomes good player all of sudden ;p

I've had quite a few good groups the past years, both fotm and totally not-fotm.

Some fanatic daoc players try out something and find it works, so they stick with it for a while. That's fine. Some people shout as loud as they can that that is the BEST setup, and anything else is gimped. That's mostly people who copied it and can't think of anything else that works. Those people are stupid, and unfortunately like everywhere else in the world: stupid people are loud and many.

Personally I like being in a fotm group, but I also enjoy trying a different approach. Often that gets me killed before long, sometimes it works like a charm. Only stuff that really spoils the fun in any group is shortsighted people, impatient people, people who don't pay attention, pessimistic people and 1337 people.

To keep it a bit on topic: I think we don't need to look at Mythic so much for ungimping classes, and more at the people we play with who call classes gimped.

 

[Herbal]

lethul 1st i said it wasnt worth it vs a decent cleric 2nd u play a savage wtf would u know about skill :kissit:

 

[Lethul]

lol this is even better that that r9 chanter that didnt know about volley

you do know he is quite high rr on prydwen to?
and probably in the best playing alb group around?

 

[Lethul]

lethul 1st i said it wasnt worth it vs a decent cleric 2nd u play a savage wtf would u know about skill :kissit:

i play more than savage you know

 

[Big Ugly]

herbal
shamans arnt meant to solo theyre a support char how many solo clerics bards druids wardens healers do u see?

conviniently forgot about Friars.... :touch:

 

[Herbal]

friars are hybrid tanks to be honest no one would ever group them for there heals ^^ they dont have det or bring much util to the grp, hell most friars solo because they wouldnt even get a grp invite

 

[Ensceptificamuralya]

Btw the reason I compared a warden to a paladin is because they're both hybrids; both are part tank, part group support with buffs, ressing, resists. I agree a friar is more like a warden. If I was to roll an alb, I'd definitely make either a friar or a paladin. I don't know what improvements the paladins have had, but a warden-paladin duel used to be quite an even match. Now they outtank a warden easily. Hence my reply.

 

[Big Ugly]

and yet friars are support classes.... that aren't meant to solo, but do quite succesfully

 

[Herbal]

friars cant support for shit heals are a joke and the only thing they bring to a group is base buffs and resists they dont have det so cant tank anywhere near as well as a merc or a arms have weaker armour and little to non group util, yes mythic describe them as a support char but this is how mythic describes a friar....

Their healing abilities make them very helpful to groups, but their offensive abilities make them wonderful fighting companions both in monster hunts and realm wars.

such lol ^^

 

[Thanatlos]

Quite amusing that friar heals are considered more crap than warden heals all the time

But then again you HAVE to spec weapon as a friar, don't you? ow wait, that's just perceptions of the masses...

Friar heals can be quite decent, just as warden/shaman heals can be quite decent.. Just that people are stubborn to give up their nice damage for average support...

PS: Warden isn't gimp, everyone else just got better tricks to get around our main feature (pbt) so as long as you look at pve we're uber

 

[Ensceptificamuralya]

But then again you HAVE to spec weapon as a friar, don't you? ow wait, that's just perceptions of the masses...

 

[Pin]

Quite amusing that friar heals are considered more crap than warden heals all the time

But then again you HAVE to spec weapon as a friar, don't you? ow wait, that's just perceptions of the masses...

Friar heals can be quite decent, just as warden/shaman heals can be quite decent.. Just that people are stubborn to give up their nice damage for average support...

PS: Warden isn't gimp, everyone else just got better tricks to get around our main feature (pbt) so as long as you look at pve we're uber

If a Friar specs rejuv up and drops staff, he heals for (roughly) the same as a Warden.
But the healing is still nothing compared to a Cleric, only bringing resist buffs to the group.

The Warden brings resist buffs, bubble, damage add.

If a Warden gives 'average support', a Friar gives less.

 

[Ola]

Ehmm well actually some druids are quite good at soloing ( :

Well not that easy to solo anymore with druids.. with BBs the biggest advantage is gone

Shaman being more then a support class, how do you see a shaman managing solo in RvR?.
The only thing shamans contribute to grps are End regen and most often sub standard resist buffs.
And pbaoe disease well lol try pbaoe diseasing a fotm hib grp ^^.

Interupting with bolts? and roots?
I surely wish i ever got to interupt with any of those.

AE root i have gotten to use, indeed but the long cast time gives several seconds for insert every know class ingame here alot of time to interupt.

Shaman dmg shields breaks root/snare.

I can go on and on, the fact remains.
it is surely gimp and i listed what shaman needs and it is a fact.

Shamans only contributors are at keep defence/takes.
And as end regen to melee grps.

Soon TOA comes, and melee grps are almost dead there.
Then it is buffbot time again, the only thing a shaman will give to those grps is permasprint and possibly just possibly a CC incase they cant get a 3rd healer.

A common mid grp setup atm are: Skald , anytank (very well another skald for interupting) sm, sm , sm healer healer healer. (poss shaman at last spot )

get shamans a TL NOW!!

Shammy can solo fine, ichor, end regen, pbaoe disease (kiting) then dotting and DDing (or whatever it is).. problem is stealthers with snare, but you solo better than many other classes.
Sub standard resist buffs? same as druids/clerics if they spec buffline?
Pbaoe disease is very annoying for hib mage grp, run in and pb disease --> all mages interrupted. Ofc it might be dangerous w/o purge up, but you can do this every 8sec..

Long cast time on aoe root? 3sec aint long as a kobby shammy with good dex buffs and mota... Also it aint that far from 2.5sec which is baseline DD for mages..

Shammy is a very good class, you must have grouped with very bad shammys to write all this...


Btw the warden dmg add is even worth running? (and u will miss some seconds with pbt if you do it?) never played a tank, so dont know..

 

[Auriel]

Rogues need their group utility! Something taken for granted in RPG's normally is that rogues bring an indispensible bag of tricks with them, but that's not the case in DAoC.

I think this is the first RPG I've played that rogues didn't do anything indispensible... they have no trap skills (until a ToA bolt-on), no thievery skills (until ToA, the extra coin thing), no wilderness skills (movement speed went to musicians, go figure), no aoe cc tricks (calthrops could aoe snare for example), and worst of all... thieves/assassins fight like a tanks, taking opponents head-on instead of assisting someone else with devastating flank or rear attacks.

There's some bolt-ons coming in ToA for all classes, but some of these 'Master Abilities' should have been integrated as standard abilities. A class review to really re-design some classes from scratch would be ok if it sorted them out, but I have a feeling *that* patch might be years away, and called 'DAoC2'

 

[Asha]

Shaman being more then a support class, how do you see a shaman managing solo in RvR?.
The only thing shamans contribute to grps are End regen and most often sub standard resist buffs.
And pbaoe disease well lol try pbaoe diseasing a fotm hib grp ^^.
Interupting with bolts? and roots?
I surely wish i ever got to interupt with any of those.

You surely need help. Shaman is one of the best, most balanced support classes. If you can’t figure out how to pbaoe disease on a hib group or get off a bolt range interrupt…. no wonder ppl get a second skald in front of you.

I love playing my shammie. You get loads of defence, aoe and single target. You get disease for which there is no timer. You get a dot plus end regen and a bolt so you can insta disease, run some, dot, run a lot, bolt, dot again etc. You get icor!

It seriously reminds me of how my cleric used to feel before smite nerfs. If you aren’t happy with this class then you don’t know how to play it. End regen to melee groups? If Excali Mid suddenly switches to caster groups, I am sure a shammie would still fit. And I would say a shamie can solo better than any other healing support.

A common mid grp setup atm are: Skald , anytank (very well another skald for interupting) sm, sm , sm healer healer healer. (poss shaman at last spot )

lol

 

[Hotrats]

Yep, a shaman will always be needed, even for caster groups as although the end regen would be less useful the resist buffs would be essential vs other caster groups (especially heat) and disease is also very nice vs other tank groups who run into the pbae (a insta pbae disease is perfect here).

Your quite right a friar could spec healing and enhance similar to a warden, but the reason they don't do it is very similar to the reason a shammy doesn't spec high for healing, they have a better alternative line. A warden is never gonna melee very hard even with full melee spec, compared to a friar who does actually hit hard with high melee spec.
A friar who specs high in enhance and rejuv is basically a warden without pbt, what a friar needs is a way to spec less damage and more utility (more than just heals, something like pbt or disease). Albion just seems cursed with almost all its classes being able to do damage (including clerics!) when what we really need is more classes like healers and bards who are pure support (or at least have 3 decent support lines). Heck even druids/shamans have damage lines but the damage is in the form of a DoT or 20 sec recast so mythic decided to bung a load of sweet utility in their as well. Remove the cleric spec smite nuke, spec smite pbae insta nuke and the ae smite nuke and put some decent utility spell in their instead

Finally I would say a rejuv/enhance friar might just make it into a group if albs had the luxury of a free group spot (heat resists are very useful vs hibs), but we all know albs rarely have that luxury
Perhaps: 2 caba 2 sorc 2 cleric 1 mins 1 friar. Would be a great option if friar end regen was group instead of self only (not as powerful as pala end regen!).